Insecure women get great guys. Confident women get the clingers?

[alphamale]

4 hours ago, Foxhall said:

Im not sure "confident secure woman" is necessarily at the top of a guy's requirements,

foxhall i can assure you that it is not

[Woggle]

Women who actually are confident, strong and secure are very attractive but self proclaimed strong and independent women or similar to self proclaimed nice guys.

[Blind-Sided]

5 hours ago, Hopeful30 said:

Is a woman like this doomed to be single forever?

Depends on how "Independent" they are.  I've known a couple girls that had to be independent because of situation, and need.  They are just fine with finding men.  But I've known a couple that were "Woman Power" types, and drum the independent thing into everyone who will listen to them.  And yes... that type will be single, or have to find a man who is a total doormat.

Edited April 10, 2020 by Blind-Sided

[Woggle]

Who wants to be with somebody who makes a point of telling you how not needed you are? Nobody should need another person to survive but somebody who constantly feels the need to drive that point home must have some hostility towards the opposite sex and who needs that in their life?

[Malin889]

4 hours ago, DKT3 said:

I once heard a quote most women get exactly what they deserve in a relationship.  

What they deserve? What does that mean exactly? Do you mean, what they think they deserve? 

[Malin889]

18 minutes ago, alphamale said:

if she doesn't lower her standards, yes

I don't think anyone should ever lower their standards. 

[Emilie Jolie]

4 hours ago, Hopeful30 said:

Is a woman like this doomed to be single forever?

No, but the older you get, the more social you need to be in order to find yourself a good RL partner. Tell everyone you know you are single and looking, enlist colleagues with similar professional backgrounds to get their connections working, if you want to be with an 'accomplished' guy too - though 'accomplishment' is a relative concept, right?  

For me, being 'independent' hasn't always been a gift, in honesty. I've never been single very long but my RLs (with a couple of exceptions) never really lasted because moving in together was always an issue (very bad experience with an ex, badly handled, long story). 

I actually broke up with my SO (absolutely not a clinger) after a trial period under the same roof a couple of years back because I really had huge troubles adapting to sharing daily life with him (and his kids). We let a few months pass, we gave it another try and we found a rhythm that suited us all, ie I was given a lot of time to be comfortable gradually blending our lives together. One reason we got it to work is because he is very secure and confident in himself. He knew that his patience would pay off; he wasn't put off by my independent streak, he never doubted that the feelings were there so he let me go at my pace. The other reason it has worked, to put it bluntly, is that while we work in the same field, he is at the top of his game professionally. We met organically, I nearly always have had RLs with men in my professional or social circle, which probably removes a lot of obstacles.

I imagine using OLD  would yield similar results if you were to use the selection criteria to your advantage.

[alphamale]

1 hour ago, Blind-Sided said:

Depends on how "Independent" they are.  I've known a couple girls that had to be independent because of situation, and need.  They are just fine with finding men.  But I've known a couple that were "Woman Power" types, and drum the independent thing into everyone who will listen to them.  And yes... that type will be single, or have to find a man who is a total doormat.

so true B-S

[alphamale]

1 hour ago, Malin889 said:

I don't think anyone should ever lower their standards. 

one can live in fantasy or in reality...your choice

[simpycurious]

I am not sure I agree with the OP on this one.  I see PLENTY of HIGHLY attractive, brilliant, confident women with much the same male partners.  In my circles, I have never seen a woman (not matter how gorgeous and accomplished she is) intimidate a guy.  

This is just a personal observation not site related sorry should have clarified that

Edited April 11, 2020 by simpycurious

[Cookiesandough]

This site is riddled with insecure people with dating probs, so not seeing what you’re seeing. 

[FMW]

The problem with some confident and independent women, and I count myself among them, is that we aren't good at "needing" people.  Meaning we have a hard time accepting help with things that we are capable of and used to doing for ourselves, which is most things.  

My mother is 73 and doesn't like to accept offers of help because she doesn't want to be seen as "old".  I told her she should sometimes let people help her with certain things (mowing her lawn, basic household repairs) because it makes them feel good to be of service and reminded her how she enjoyed doing things for others.  I've realized I need to take the same advice, particularly with men in whom I have a romantic interest.  It shows the vulnerability necessary to connect with someone, lowering the walls.   

 

[alphamale]

2 minutes ago, FMW said:

The problem with some confident and independent women, and I count myself among them, is that we aren't good at "needing" people.  Meaning we have a hard time accepting help with things that we are capable of and used to doing for ourselves, which is most things.  

My mother is 73 and doesn't like to accept offers of help because she doesn't want to be seen as "old".  I told her she should sometimes let people help her with certain things (mowing her lawn, basic household repairs) because it makes them feel good to be of service and reminded her how she enjoyed doing things for others.  I've realized I need to take the same advice, particularly with men in whom I have a romantic interest.  It shows the vulnerability necessary to connect with someone, lowering the walls.   

 

these women need to "play dumb" and coy if they want to snag a decent man. defer to him, at least at the beginning

[FMW]

Well, I don't know about playing dumb or coy Alpha, but I'm learning to accept offers to do things for me!

[Cookiesandough]

7 hours ago, preraph said:

Just being strong and independent is enough to make you want to stay single.  Speaking as someone who is that way.  Not to say if the magic combination had come along, but that is rare.  

I agree completely. It makes sense that these kinds of women would be less likely to be in a relationship, because they don’t need to be in one like someone who is insecure might need to be,  and their threshold for what they will tolerate is much lower than an insecure/needy person. And you never know what a person has to tolerate as an outsider  just looking at a relationship between 2 people, no matter how nice things seem from afar. 
 

But I really have not even seen this play out though. So many insecure chicks I know are with guys I would not consider ‘great’ . 😕 I’m independent, but not at all what I’d call confident or ‘strong’ ,  I’m a little insecure in a lot of ways and I attract clingers a lot. Haven’t seen a correlation either way, really 

Edited April 11, 2020 by Cookiesandough

[alphamale]

2 hours ago, Woggle said:

Women who actually are confident, strong and secure are very attractive....

they need to be physically attractive too woggle

[Malin889]

33 minutes ago, alphamale said:

these women need to "play dumb" and coy if they want to snag a decent man. defer to him, at least at the beginning

"Play dumb"? 

[basil67]

I'm generally self confident and so is my partner.  I think you've probably looked at a handful of couples and are imagining patterns which don't broadly exist.  

[simpycurious]

40 minutes ago, Cookiesandough said:

I agree completely. It makes sense that these kinds of women would be less likely to be in a relationship, because they don’t need to be in one like someone who is insecure might need to be,  and their threshold for what they will tolerate is much lower than an insecure/needy person. And you never know what a person has to tolerate as an outsider  just looking at a relationship between 2 people, no matter how nice things seem from afar. 
 

But I really have not even seen this play out though. So many insecure chicks I know are with guys I would not consider ‘great’ . 😕 I’m independent, but not at all what I’d call confident or ‘strong’ ,  I’m a little insecure in a lot of ways and I attract clingers a lot. Haven’t seen a correlation either way, really 

You SHOULD be ultra confident and not have to deal with CLINGERS at ALL. 

AND YOU SHOULD HAVE ZERO insecurities 

Edited April 11, 2020 by simpycurious

[preraph]

1 hour ago, Cookiesandough said:

I agree completely. It makes sense that these kinds of women would be less likely to be in a relationship, because they don’t need to be in one like someone who is insecure might need to be,  and their threshold for what they will tolerate is much lower than an insecure/needy person.

Very true. 

[Emilie Jolie]

8 hours ago, alphamale said:

if she doesn't lower her standards, yes

Nope. It's about lowering expectations (not having an unrealistic checklist of demands in the first place) and having a good mental attitude, ie be flexible. For all the accomplishments, confidence and independence in the world, jadedness, feelings of superiority, bitterness at being single for long can be seen a mile off. That can attract insecure people initially, because they read those as signs of desperation so they pounce on what they hope to be an easy prey.

 

[chillii]

14 hours ago, Hopeful30 said:

Is a woman like this doomed to be single forever?

The femininity thing is much much bigger than you might think but another female usually isn't the best judge of things like that, most of it they can't see from a guys point of view . But l'd probably say l wouldn't be attracted to most so called really strong independent types either. And no before it's jumped all over it's nothing to do with feeling threatened or outdone , just based on qualities l love which a lot of those types lose along the way , a lot of them have chip on their shoulder too or often have hardness about them too. l couldn't givafk what she's achieved that's nothing to do with a relationship or the woman l'd love, it's about her and who she is and the partner she is in that way. 

Not to say many a guy wouldn't like the achiever or whatever you'd call it type l know many do but vulnerability and femininity often make great partners and have a real attraction about them, and they're often a lot of fun too,not because your stronger or better off that's usually nothing to do with what a guy might love. The opposite to masculinity is naturally femininity and guys love the stuff just like women love masculinity.

 

Edited April 11, 2020 by chillii

[Emilie Jolie]

^^ So out of all the 'high achieving' women you know, you haven't even met one who is also 'feminine' and 'vulnerable'? Are you sure you got to know them at all?🤔

[elaine567]

7 hours ago, alphamale said:

these women need to "play dumb" and coy if they want to snag a decent man. defer to him, at least at the beginning

 

[chillii]

l usually don't even bother wading into this one it's usually a lost cause but anyway. You often don't even have to know someone well it's often noticeable at a glance. But nope matter of fact l even have 6 sisters that are very high achievers , and actually quite feminine too, met a lot of their friends over the years too as well as others. One of my best friends is very very high up in her profession and very wealthy and she's beautifully feminine , and gorgeous to boot

Not saying it's a given but it is common.