Tips how to avoid deniers during covid 19

[Tamfana]

Maybe the blue areas are testing more so their official numbers are higher.  For instance, in AZ testing is just ramping up.  

[NuevoYorko]

1 hour ago, gaius said:

No, I'm a republican originally from Massachusetts but that doesn't mean when you see a Massachusetts license plate it's not safe to assume it's a liberal. 

The bottom line is the majority of super spreading so far has come from liberal areas. And will probably continue that way for the near future. It's not the evangelicals that have been the main problem.

I would put money on you being wrong, with the exception of NYC.  You can't put that genie back in its bottle.

"Liberal areas" generally are populated by people who believe in science and understand why social distancing and TESTING will be the ways to approach a more normal life.  You will see much better statistics from states that have stronger restrictions and high compliance than those that don't.    Countries as well.  

The socialist leanings of us libtards predisposes us to a willingness to put some personal freedoms second to the best interests of the good of the whole. You won't be seeing many of us raging about our individual rights being eroded by what is required to reduce the spread, like you had in Lansing on Tuesday.  

[Woggle]

If these were black lives matter rallies the right would be wanting to crack heads. They have no problem cracking down on freedom and civil liberties except when they are the ones being called to make some sacrifices to make sure society isn't damaged in a way that can't be reversed. If we don't get this under control then there truly is no going back to the old ways.

[SumGuy]

14 minutes ago, NuevoYorko said:

"Liberal areas" generally are populated by people who believe in science and understand why social distancing and TESTING will be the ways to approach a more normal life.   

It I think it is more a function that cities are generally more "liberal" (which I think means vote Democratic from context of the posts) than rural areas, and overall stat population.  Cities have higher population density than rural areas so of course it could spread more there, also "liberal" states also are more populous (so more absolute numbers to spread). 

It's hard to adjust for population density, easy to adjust the numbers to per capita, and if you need a comparison on how well the "liberal" versus "conservative" approach works just look at Kentucky vs. Tennessee.  Even adjusting for population, the Tennessee approach didn't work as well as what they did in Kentucky.

[gaius]

3 hours ago, NuevoYorko said:

I would put money on you being wrong, with the exception of NYC.  You can't put that genie back in its bottle.

"Liberal areas" generally are populated by people who believe in science and understand why social distancing and TESTING will be the ways to approach a more normal life.  You will see much better statistics from states that have stronger restrictions and high compliance than those that don't.    Countries as well.  

The socialist leanings of us libtards predisposes us to a willingness to put some personal freedoms second to the best interests of the good of the whole. You won't be seeing many of us raging about our individual rights being eroded by what is required to reduce the spread, like you had in Lansing on Tuesday.  

No, you certainly talk a better game. With liberals it's more like post on social media for everyone to stay home then drive down to Florida or go out and do whatever in your personal life. Like Ivanka Trump did. Who was a registered New York Democrat all her life until 2018. Two years after her father became a republican president. A evangelical she certainly is not.

And it's not that you believe in science. It's that you treat doctors and scientists like the Catholics used to treat the priests back in the day. You listen to Dr Fauci like he's spreading the gospel while forgetting just weeks ago he was telling people not to wear masks. And ignore the fact that US doctors and intellectuals (mostly liberal) fierce opposition to travel bans and restrictions might be the single biggest cause why we're in this mess to begin with.

All while harping on the evangelicals of course. At least they're honest about who and what they are, and what they want.

[Ellener]

7 hours ago, gaius said:

we are drowning in stupid, lazy and entitled. Way more so than other first world countries.

I don't know which other first world countries you live(d) in but it's very difficult usually to get benefits here, 80% are turned down and have to be appealed. People work two and three jobs here. Who are all these lazy stupid people? You're out of touch with ordinary life here I think.

 

[Ellener]

On 4/15/2020 at 3:14 PM, NuevoYorko said:

There are a lot of "evangelical" types around here and I keep seeing signs and references to "choose faith not fear."  That's annoying.  A person can conceivably have faith and simultaneously prefer not to catch or spread a virulent bug.

This is what one of my favourite ministers passed on:

I Trust God… and I wear my seat belt.

I Trust God… and I use oven mitts with really hot dishes.

I Trust God… and I have smoke detectors.

I Trust God… and I take my prescribed medications.

I Trust God… and I will follow the best guidelines to protect my health and the health of others.

I Trust God… Amen

[littleblackheart]

There aren't so many 'deniers' where I am; police patrols are a regular thing and generally people are quite considerate. Whenever we go on our daily exercise walk with the kids, I try to decide who is likely to be a  'denier'. You can actually see them coming from a mile off. They all seem to carry a sort of entitled, superior smirk on their face, they walk right in the middle of the pavement and won't shift an inch (they're the same who speak really loudly on their phone too). Rebels without a cause or a clue, I guess.

Edited April 16, 2020 by littleblackheart

[Timshel]

I don't think that this is a liberal/conservative, republican/democrat, religious/agnostic/atheistic difference...I think that people of all cultural, religious, political and socioeconomic circumstances will simply do themselves.  People will people, of course...some will group together but to say that all people in any self identified group do the same is simple.  Some libs will travel, some conservatives will stay at home, some fundamentalist religious folk won't go to church on Sunday and some democrats will have a party of 100 on Saturday night. 

Individuals are choosing their own path during this pandemic. There isn't any good way around that.  I personally do not want the national guard going toe to toe with gun toting citizens.  If there are people who insist on doing their own thing, let them, I say.  People who choose to stay at home and be protective when out will continue to do so. 

If there are volunteer canary's, ok.

[basil67]

6 hours ago, Woggle said:

If these were black lives matter rallies the right would be wanting to crack heads. They have no problem cracking down on freedom and civil liberties except when they are the ones being called to make some sacrifices to make sure society isn't damaged in a way that can't be reversed. If we don't get this under control then there truly is no going back to the old ways.

What are these 'old ways' of which you speak?   I'm curious about the changes you're seeing.

[NuevoYorko]

2 hours ago, gaius said:

No, you certainly talk a better game. With liberals it's more like post on social media for everyone to stay home then drive down to Florida or go out and do whatever in your personal life. Like Ivanka Trump did. Who was a registered New York Democrat all her life until 2018. Two years after her father became a republican president. A evangelical she certainly is not.

And it's not that you believe in science. It's that you treat doctors and scientists like the Catholics used to treat the priests back in the day. You listen to Dr Fauci like he's spreading the gospel while forgetting just weeks ago he was telling people not to wear masks. And ignore the fact that US doctors and intellectuals (mostly liberal) fierce opposition to travel bans and restrictions might be the single biggest cause why we're in this mess to begin with.

All while harping on the evangelicals of course. At least they're honest about who and what they are, and what they want.

 

Certain rich people with the option to do so, and little social conscience,  are the ones who are leaving cities to go to their vacation homes.  It's not a "liberal vs. conservative" thing.  And a trump as an example of a "liberal" person?  Please.  

Yes, we libtards do believe in science.  I'm not thinking about Dr. Fauci,  though now that you mention him I will say that I sure do respect him and his knowledge, and if we are going to listen to anyone the administration puts in front of us, he'd be it.  That's why you have the impression that liberals "love" him.  It's a supposed to be a coronavirus briefing, for god's sake.  Why not let the science / medical people have the podium?  We will take the word of a scientist in a situation like this over that of a minister, our neighbor, Rush Limbaugh or any politician, even if said scientist has been wrong in some instances. 

Have you checked out the thread in this topic called "science dictatorship" or whatever?  It illustrates my points nicely.

I can guarantee you that you won't see any gangs of liberals mounting protests against social distancing protocols all over the place.  

 

 

 

 

 

 

[Woggle]

10 minutes ago, basil67 said:

What are these 'old ways' of which you speak?   I'm curious about the changes you're seeing.

Being able to go out to eat or go to a game or a concert or just be around people. We will never return to that if everybody doesn't make some sacrifices now.

[NuevoYorko]

2 hours ago, littleblackheart said:

I try to decide who is likely to be a  'denier'. You can actually see them coming from a mile off. They all seem to carry a sort of entitled, superior smirk on their face, they walk right in the middle of the pavement and won't shift an inch (they're the same who speak really loudly on their phone too). Rebels without a cause or a clue, I guess.

I live in a rural "red" town in a blue state.  Here in town, I get serious stink eye because I wear a mask to the store.  Stores here are now literally crowded.  People have become sick of staying inside, it's not enforced, they did their time and they are going to do what they please.  Inside stores, they proudly handle whatever.  Zero concessions to social distancing here, and it's generally looked on with scorn - like mask wearers / distance havers are brainwashed.  We have given up our personal freedoms and the government will never give them back!  

We're expecting some lovely protests in our state in the next few days.  

Go a few miles north to a very liberal university town.  People without masks are not admitted to stores.  Stores are not crowded because people are required to wait in lines (6 feet apart) and only a certain number are allowed in at a time.  Everyone is super polite and hyperconscious of maintaining space.   

I've limited my store-going to once every 10-14 days, but I make sure to drive the extra miles to the north.  That's how I avoid deniers.

 

[amaysngrace]

Here it’s mandatory that we wear a mask and keep our distance.  Now the only way NOT to avoid them is to go knock on their doors. 

[FMW]

I live in a liberal large city in a mostly conservative state.  Our local paper is frequently attacked in the comments for being too liberal (by readers living outside of the urban area). 

I found it interesting today that the the paper's own editorial board posted an editorial comparing Trump's "total authority" comment and attitude with the local leaders, all Democrats, issuing indefinite lock down orders that arguably overstep their authority. 

I think that demonstrates that the rumblings are going to start spreading beyond conservative/Republican confines.

I'm a liberal, but the conflicting and ever changing information, including that from medical professionals, gives me pause.  Right now it's not clear where this is going to lead and my trust in the validity of what I'm hearing from ANY source has weakened. 

In the meantime I will continue social distancing, and wearing a mask and using hand sanitizer when I have to go to the grocery store.      

[SincereOnlineGuy]

18 hours ago, Ellener said:

Hmm, I was but a young 'un then but I remember in the early 80s scientists talking about viruses mutating and jumping species and stuff, and there was a lot of panic, then Princess Diana did a famous photo shoot in 1987 same year as AZT antiretroviral was first marketed...

Not sure how to interpret your writing ( denial? )  but it's been a global pandemic since, @ 37 000 new infections a year in the US according to CDC. 

 

Um, that's 1 in every 8800 people in the U.S.

 

In 50 years, that will be 50 in 8800 people.

 

Covid has reached 1 in every 3476 world-wide in 5 months.

 

When AIDS was first recognized, and soon understood, science threatened that it would run rampant through the heterosexual population, and got everybody in the media stirred-up in the 1980's as only 2020 media knows as the norm.

But they grossly misinterpreted one thing:

Some people love to wax poetic about how it is a zillion times easier for a(n infected) man to give HIV to a woman during heterosexual sex than it is for a(n infected) woman to give HIV to a man during heterosexual sex.  While that IS true in a one-to-one encounter, it is NOT true or accurate when considering the entire heterosexual, non-drug-using population as a whole...  because the only way a heterosexual, non-IV-drug-using male could first acquire HIV  (once they started testing the blood {transfusion} supply) from an HIV-positive female was to buck those long odds.

So where it concerns the heterosexual, non-IV-drug-using population, the chances of HIV getting from one male to another are the approximately the same as it getting from a woman to a man during heterosexual sex.

Sure there are still rogue men out there spreading HIV to their female partners...  but AIDS just cannot spread like wildfire through the heterosexual, non-IV-drug-using population as science once threatened it would.

[Timshel]

1 hour ago, Woggle said:

Being able to go out to eat or go to a game or a concert or just be around people. We will never return to that if everybody doesn't make some sacrifices now.

Yes, brilliant of course...now without martial law, make it so.

[Ellener]

2 hours ago, FMW said:

n the meantime I will continue social distancing, and wearing a mask and using hand sanitizer when I have to go to the grocery store.     

except for the mask I did that before! But yes, me too. 

[gaius]

5 hours ago, Ellener said:

I don't know which other first world countries you live(d) in but it's very difficult usually to get benefits here, 80% are turned down and have to be appealed. People work two and three jobs here. Who are all these lazy stupid people? You're out of touch with ordinary life here I think.

I don't know where you live Ellener but here's a good summary of several European countries coronavirus benefits vs ours.

https://www.businessinsider.com/europe-fight-coronavirus-pay-workers-wages-plan-economy-stay-home-2020-3

It fits well with the dozens of times I've heard Europeans say they'd never live in the US because they don't offer this or that entitlement or benefit.

[gaius]

3 hours ago, NuevoYorko said:

I can guarantee you that you won't see any gangs of liberals mounting protests against social distancing protocols all over the place.  

I think jumping checkpoints on the highway on their way into Florida counts as protesting. And then stopping at the whole foods in my city, because nothing short of organic will do, and leaving some virus along the way.

Unless of course you agree with d0nnivan and want to argue it might just be the Republican, evangelical New Yorkers and Ma**h***s in those cars.

Honestly I haven't witnessed what you have in the red areas. Almost everyone at Walmart had masks on last time I was there. And I haven't run across a single gas station or business in Alabama, Georgia or Florida where the people weren't taking it somewhat seriously.

Actually, out of the hundreds of rednecks I've run into one asked me if I was afraid he'd give me Corona, then made a joke about giving me Coors instead  and another asked me where I got mine since he was stuck with a surgical mask. That's been it.

 

[littleblackheart]

7 hours ago, NuevoYorko said:

We're expecting some lovely protests in our state in the next few days.  

 This is actually shocking. Conspiracy theorists have always baffled me; I wonder what their reasoning is. I mean this affects everyone, not just a select few so they're not the only ones having to make adjustments. Is it misinformation, selfishness, 'rage against the system' or just a profound misunderstanding of the concepts of 'civil liberties' and 'freedom'? Do they think they are immune? 

 What do they think a protest will achieve, apart from make things worse?It's not like the virus is going to listen to them and do a U-Turn...

These 'anti lockdown' protests seem to be unique to North America, which is quite interesting from a sociological standpoint, but probably infuriating for everyone else in the country. I hope they don't do too much damage.

Here in the UK we had protests from a group called Pause the System in mid-March when we were in 'herd immunity' mode - they actually (rightly) wanted stricter lockdown measures and a universal basic salary, and the PM to listen to the WHO instead of prioritising 'the economy'.

 

[Libby1]

On 4/13/2020 at 12:24 AM, underpants said:

In the south, I have noticed a lot of deniers, almost (jeez you should be arrested) stuff.

My state has scored an F on social distancing.

Any tips on social distancing?  I know the recommendations but how do you confront rule breakers?

I don't think it would be a good idea to confront them.  When you get into a conflict with people like that, it tends to just entrench their views unless they're in a position of responsibility where they'll be held directly accountable for a mistaken view on this.  What you need to focus on doing is giving them as wide a berth as possible.  These careless characters are the ones who are most likely to pick up/carry the virus, and they won't give a damn who they pass it on to.  If possible, you should avoid having any dealings with them that would bring you into close proximity with them.

[NuevoYorko]

6 hours ago, littleblackheart said:

 

These 'anti lockdown' protests seem to be unique to North America, which is quite interesting from a sociological standpoint, but probably infuriating for everyone else in the country. I hope they don't do too much damage

 

It's fundamentally American to hold ones personal liberties so dear that complete disregard for the wellbeing of others can be easily justified.  "Socialism" is a filthy word;  society has no responsibility for the health, housing, or food of any of its members.  An individual's "right" to have an arsenal of machine guns supersedes children's rights to go to school without fear of being shot.  Etc.  In this situation, MY "right" to shop in a mall, shake your hand,  and earn money trumps (hahaha) this society's "right" to be spared an illness.  There are disparaging terms people who exhibit concerns for society as a whole, like "social justice warrior" and "virtue signaling."  I think it's difficult for people from other cultures to wrap your mind around this, but it's "normal" here and there are many posts and threads that illustrate it on this forum every day, not just in relation to COVID-19.

What baffles me is that this fervor over these freedoms seems to often go hand in hand with a disinterest in independent thinking and a propensity to be easily led.  

Edited April 17, 2020 by NuevoYorko

[littleblackheart]

40 minutes ago, NuevoYorko said:

What baffles me is that this fervor over these freedoms seems to often go hand in hand with a disinterest in independent thinking and a propensity to be easily led.  

Yes, I remember 'heated' discussions I have had on these boards on politics and guns that I really struggle to get to grips with. Without even getting into 'socialism' (there seems to be a complete lack of knowledge of the most basic political concepts in some parts of your country - sorry!), it's the rejection of complete common sense and consideration to others. This C19 thing doesn't even need to be a political thing; all you need is a bit of thoughtfulness. But I suppose when it's lacking at the highest levels of command... What's happening in the USA with all these protests is as heartbreaking as it is concerning. This virus crystallises that even more. So sorry for those of you who have to deal with this daily.

[Ellener]

14 hours ago, gaius said:

I don't know where you live Ellener but here's a good summary of several European countries coronavirus benefits vs ours.

https://www.businessinsider.com/europe-fight-coronavirus-pay-workers-wages-plan-economy-stay-home-2020-3

It fits well with the dozens of times I've heard Europeans say they'd never live in the US because they don't offer this or that entitlement or benefit.

Oh they must all be 'lazy and stupid' then? ( to quote you ) Americans just had to be given the largest benefit package in our history because so many people are living hand-to-mouth.