schlumpy Posted May 21, 2020 Share Posted May 21, 2020 9 minutes ago, CaliforniaGirl said: Including in an emergency situation? I'm not going to pretend I'm a lawyer CG but lets say the President creates an executive order that he was banning all newspapers from printing for a week due to National Security issues. The Newspapers would seek a stay of that order from a Federal judge who questions the constitutionality of the EO. The stay would keep the newspapers printing while the suit moved up to the supreme court. The Court would makes it's ruling and the Newspapers would either shut down for a week or flip the President the bird. There's more to it then what I've written but it should suffice to get the idea across. As you are aware, the process takes time but government is not, in principle, allowed to abrogate our rights without due process. We all know what reality is. 1 Link to post Share on other sites
sothereiwas Posted May 21, 2020 Share Posted May 21, 2020 (edited) 1 hour ago, CaliforniaGirl said: Including in an emergency situation? A state of emergency does grant some short term power to the government that they wouldn't normally have. There are laws around this as well, and those laws have to be obeyed or relief will be granted. One in Ohio already I guess, probably more to come. Lawsuits are promised to follow. As usual, the people who carry the brunt of the tax burden will be footing most of that bill as well. Edited May 21, 2020 by sothereiwas Phrasing Link to post Share on other sites
CaliforniaGirl Posted May 21, 2020 Share Posted May 21, 2020 1 hour ago, schlumpy said: I'm not going to pretend I'm a lawyer CG but lets say the President creates an executive order that he was banning all newspapers from printing for a week due to National Security issues. The Newspapers would seek a stay of that order from a Federal judge who questions the constitutionality of the EO. The stay would keep the newspapers printing while the suit moved up to the supreme court. The Court would makes it's ruling and the Newspapers would either shut down for a week or flip the President the bird. There's more to it then what I've written but it should suffice to get the idea across. As you are aware, the process takes time but government is not, in principle, allowed to abrogate our rights without due process. We all know what reality is. In a matter of national security there might or might not be that kind of time. That determination quite possibly could be able to be made. Nobody can determine how many undiagnosed people may be carrying a serious illness that could physically impact people and waiting around messing with red tape may not be an option. Isn't there a difference here? Link to post Share on other sites
sothereiwas Posted May 21, 2020 Share Posted May 21, 2020 “A right delayed is a right denied.” ― Martin Luther King Jr. 1 Link to post Share on other sites
gaius Posted May 21, 2020 Share Posted May 21, 2020 "in every well ordered society charged with the duty of conserving the safety of its members the rights of the individual in respect of his liberty may at times, under the pressure of great dangers, be subjected to such restraint, to be enforced by reasonable regulations, as the safety of the general public may demand" -US Supreme Court 2 Link to post Share on other sites
amaysngrace Posted May 21, 2020 Share Posted May 21, 2020 Thank goodness we have someone who takes our liberties seriously enough to not hold us down for longer than is necessary. My son and his wife are coming up here from Maryland pretty soon because where they live no restrictions have been lifted and all events are cancelled until the end of August. They won’t be getting fireworks on the Fourth this year. I don't get some leaders. Do they really think so lowly of their constituents and just think they’re all babies? 1 Link to post Share on other sites
schlumpy Posted May 21, 2020 Share Posted May 21, 2020 7 hours ago, CaliforniaGirl said: Isn't there a difference here? It isn't life threatening, but today salon owners in New Jersey are suing the Governor over his order to stay close. This process occurs with regularity in our government regardless of the demand for a prompt solution. There are other types of government that can supply immediate and irreversible results. Link to post Share on other sites
Redhead14 Posted May 21, 2020 Share Posted May 21, 2020 (edited) 16 hours ago, SincereOnlineGuy said: ... of course that's what you think All I know is the owner thanked me for letting him know that he had an employee who wasn't observing his rules/requests and his customer's needs (he is high-risk as well) and specifically mentioned that he was concerned about losing customers over this. He assured me that that delivery guy was out. He offered to take the charge off my card, but I told him it wasn't necessary. I want to support the small businesses in my area if I can but if they can't help ensure my safety, I don't have much choice but to take my business elsewhere. My children and a few of my friends also want to know who is and isn't using some care and will not patronize any establishment that isn't doing that. We are all are keeping each other advised when out and about when we find places that have completely thrown caution to the wind now. I have a fairly large network now, about 30 people who are doing this for each other. There are other places to patronize who are doing at least the minimum so F the rest of the establishments. I'm doing online for grocery delivery and just about everything else online. Don't have much reason to go out at all but some people do want to go out some if they can and they should be able to do that like everyone else and as safely as possible at least. I have the absolute right to be safe in and around my home too. If I request contactless or advise of my high-risk status and a delivery person comes to my place and isn't wearing a mask and standing away from the door, I will not open the door. They can take the food back to the store and I will call the store to make sure they know I didn't accept the delivery and cancel the charge on my card. Edited May 21, 2020 by Redhead14 Link to post Share on other sites
FMW Posted May 22, 2020 Share Posted May 22, 2020 On 5/20/2020 at 6:30 PM, CaliforniaGirl said: I hate what we're all becoming. It's not surprising. We have non-stop reports of sickness and death, so fear is at an all time high. Many are in doubt of their ongoing financial stability and security. Add all that to the emotional/mental impact isolation is having on most people (sure, some people are loving it, but most are struggling with it to some degree), all of our worst impulses and reactions are brought to the fore. Link to post Share on other sites
sothereiwas Posted May 22, 2020 Share Posted May 22, 2020 "A person is smart. People are dumb, panicky dangerous animals and you know it." - Men in Black 1 Link to post Share on other sites
CaliforniaGirl Posted May 22, 2020 Share Posted May 22, 2020 3 hours ago, FMW said: It's not surprising. We have non-stop reports of sickness and death, so fear is at an all time high. Many are in doubt of their ongoing financial stability and security. Add all that to the emotional/mental impact isolation is having on most people (sure, some people are loving it, but most are struggling with it to some degree), all of our worst impulses and reactions are brought to the fore. No, I don't mean fear, per se. Actually, what I saw in the beginning, at least near me - and we're talking a pretty densely populated area - was alert caution, but zero panic. There was concern for other people as well as ourselves and we were all moving toward one goal: flattening the curve so we could reopen as fast as possible. Not drag things on and on. Where there's "fear" is on hysterical memes which I see from both sides (there are sides? that's the other insane thing about this) - hysterical fear via conspiracy theories about how it's all been invented and it's a control thing is just as strong as any fear "mask wearers" have been accused of, probably stronger. It's certainly louder. It's real. I have never heard and read so many frightened consipiracy theories or projections in all my years on the planet. Yes, fear is real right now and so are anger, outrage, and just...turning on eachother. Link to post Share on other sites
QuietRiot Posted May 22, 2020 Share Posted May 22, 2020 An update about the mask...it can protect people at 75% effectiveness if everyone wore them. Reduces transmission by 75% https://thehill.com/policy/healthcare/498458-surgical-masks-can-reduce-coronavirus-spread-by-75-percent-researchers Basically, it seriously slows down the velocity by which someone sneezes or coughs big time. Here's a video talking about it. Link to post Share on other sites
QuietRiot Posted May 22, 2020 Share Posted May 22, 2020 (edited) Sadly, we still have idiots that are calling face mask wearing unconstitutional. People said the same thing about the seat belt. I'm sure people whined about having to wear a seat belt once it became law...but that whininess eventually became acceptance. No shirt, no shoes, no service? Add "No mask" to those 2. Edited May 22, 2020 by QuietRiot 1 1 Link to post Share on other sites
Recommended Posts