did I over-react?

[Ruby Slippers]

He's a former Marine, right? Proud of his service? They usually are.

I have a feeling this Flag Day service meant a lot to him, gave him a sense of connection to a wider family that he really needs right now. Tension can build up in this situation. Try not to take it out on each other.

I think any judgment around how other people conduct themselves right now isn't very helpful. I take all reasonable precautions but am not as careful as some. I've been to a few restaurants and cafes - with proper protocols in place. Ascertaining one's own level of comfort with exposure risk is a personal decision. I believe in respecting and supporting other people's free choices.

Edited June 15, 2020 by Ruby Slippers

[d0nnivain]

52 minutes ago, Ruby Slippers said:

He's a former Marine, right? Proud of his service? They usually are.

I have a feeling this Flag Day service meant a lot to him, gave him a sense of connection to a wider family that he really needs right now.

I can see the facial logic of that argument but DH is not a joiner & never volunteers for stuff.  I actually talked him into participating.  He was asked first.  I was asked last minute.   He didn't even come to this annual ceremony half the time when I was the one running it! 😧  I have much more of an emotional attachment to it than he does.  

While I was distressed to see so many people behaving in a manner I found cavalier & borderline reckless, that is on them.  I'm still harboring resentment for DH's failure to support me.  I didn't even really need him to leave with me although that would have been nice.  I did need him to not touch the other participants & at least acknowledge how upset I was rather than imply that I was crazy. 

[Ellener]

5 hours ago, d0nnivain said:

He's been trying to make amends.  He still doesn't get it so I have not quite let him off the hook.  We will be OK but I'm still hurt & kind of sulking.  

((((((((((((((((((((((((((((((((((((((((((((((((( ))))))))))))))))))))))))))))))))))))))))))))))))))

[Ruby Slippers]

Is he aware that you're prone to panic attacks and does he know how you'd like him to respond to those? Many people are feeling mental health effects during this strange time. 

[d0nnivain]

I can't speak to what he knows but that was the 3rd one I've had in 2 weeks that he witnessed.  So he should know.  Lord knows I have told him enough times.  

When we got in the car to drive over to the event I made a point of telling him that I had taken some Ashwagandha,  an herbal remedy to combat stress &  anxiety.  

Edited June 15, 2020 by d0nnivain

[QuietRiot]

8 hours ago, d0nnivain said:

I have calmed down a lot since the initial shock yesterday.  I did have a full blown panic attack when I got home yesterday.  DH still doesn't understand why I was so upset & actually thought I was being overly dramatic when I couldn't breathe or stand during the panic attack.  If you have never had one, severe ones feel like a heart attack.  

Anyway, my rational mind says it's probably unlikely although not impossible that people there were contagious.  However, I know from their social media posts several of them have been unmasked in other social situations.  

I think what made me so steamed is that when I was invited to participate, I said no.  The organizers all promised me  it would be done to minimize the spread.  The assured me people would be required to wear masks.  They assured me that everyone would be 6 feet apart but nobody adhered to any of that.  I also couldn't just move my chair. . . .I was supposed to be one of the speakers.  If I was only there to observe I would have just stayed 30 feet away by my car.  

This morning when I looked at my phone I realized that 3 people actually sent me messages telling me that I over-reacted & I should spread my liberal fear to them.  Those mean spirited messages really hurt because they were from people I thought were my friends; they were also people I went out of my way for in the past.  Well no more.  

If they chose not be responsible, I have to chose to disassociate myself from them.  

 

I am starting to wonder that with this new pandemic, violations like this would be grounds for divorce and split friendships.

THEY left you means spirited messages when it was THEM who assured you that social distancing would be enabled.? What a bunch of pricks.

Also ...I haven't heard of too many people celebrating Flag Day. No offense, but is it not rather an unobscure holiday? I mean, even govt institutions don't have that day off.

Edited June 16, 2020 by QuietRiot

[QuietRiot]

3 hours ago, Ruby Slippers said:

He's a former Marine, right? Proud of his service? They usually are.

I have a feeling this Flag Day service meant a lot to him, gave him a sense of connection to a wider family that he really needs right now. Tension can build up in this situation. Try not to take it out on each other.

I think any judgment around how other people conduct themselves right now isn't very helpful. I take all reasonable precautions but am not as careful as some. I've been to a few restaurants and cafes - with proper protocols in place. Ascertaining one's own level of comfort with exposure risk is a personal decision. I believe in respecting and supporting other people's free choices.

What's interesting is....this pandemic and social distancing is the only time you actually DO Have the right to judge others. I would say this is the exception to the rule when it comes to passing judgement...why? Because it is impacting the welfare of others.

[d0nnivain]

1 minute ago, QuietRiot said:

I am starting to wonder that with this new pandemic, violations like this would be grounds for divorce and split friendships.

THEY left you means spirited messages when it was THEM who assured you that social distancing would be enabled.? What a bunch of pricks.

Also ...I haven't heard of too many people celebrating Flag Day. No offense, but is it not rather an unobscure holiday? I mean, even govt institutions don't have that day off.

I'm not going to divorce my husband over this. That would be an extreme overreaction.  I got upset.  People fight.  It will be fine in time. I wrote that post about 15 minutes after it happened.  Emotions were raw.  

The people who snipped at me for leaving, really I could give a flying fig about them.  I have other issues with them.  They are certainly not good friends. 

As for Flag Day, it's a "thing" for this particular group.  It's a really lovely service explaining a lot about American history & all the flags the Union Jack, the Pine Flag, the Snake flag, the Betsy Ross flag.  It is a lovely tribute & I used to enjoy it.  

[QuietRiot]

1 minute ago, d0nnivain said:

I'm not going to divorce my husband over this. That would be an extreme overreaction.  I got upset.  People fight.  It will be fine in time. I wrote that post about 15 minutes after it happened.  Emotions were raw.  

The people who snipped at me for leaving, really I could give a flying fig about them.  I have other issues with them.  They are certainly not good friends. 

As for Flag Day, it's a "thing" for this particular group.  It's a really lovely service explaining a lot about American history & all the flags the Union Jack, the Pine Flag, the Snake flag, the Betsy Ross flag.  It is a lovely tribute & I used to enjoy it.  

I'm sorry this happened. *hugs* Lately, I"m going through the same thing. Not a single one of my co-workers are wearing a mask...and I'm the only one. Although, a couple did ask me why...they really didn't give me a hard time about it. Funny...prior to me starting to wear it, I'd hear water cooler talks about how ridiculous the mask wearing is and how they haven't been wearing a mask ANYWHERE they went in public since this whole thing happened. Most of the people are rednecks, sadly. 

 

ONe I know of is having her wedding this week. So....she'll be coming back after that.

I had to laugh at some sothern gal on the radio said, "My relatives don't believe in cholesterol, much less Covid 19" 

 

[Ruby Slippers]

36 minutes ago, d0nnivain said:

So he should know.  Lord knows I have told him enough times. 

It sounds as if that info is not sticking. I definitely learned in my last relationship that some men can hear something a dozen times and still not remember the info. Annoying, frustrating. My mind doesn't work that way so I don't get it, but I'm guessing it's not uncommon.

[Atwood]

How awful of your friends to send you messages like that! I'm so sorry you've been treated like that. You sound like you were being sensible to me. I empathise with the panic attacks. They feel like you're dying at the time and there have been times I haven't been able to stand up. Would your husband ever watch any videos or read articles on panic attacks that might help him to understand a bit better? 

I do hope he comes round to understanding why you were so upset. Him shaking hands with people is something he can surely see was not a smart thing to do right now? 

[serial muse]

Well...I don't really feel like the issue is whether he was sensitive to the panic attacks, although certainly he should be. But this isn't a case of unspoken expectations or expected mind-reading. This is a case where the parameters were very clearly laid out, and just as clearly ignored.

I totally agree that divorcing over this would be an extreme overreaction. But I would hope this is a one-off, and not a pattern of steamrolling over your concerns, d0nnivain. And I would hope that at this point he is able to own up to the fact that he is the one who violated trust here.

As for the health aspect - I still feel that requiring him to self-quarantine would not have been an overreaction, and is in fact a very reasonable response to what went down. If you've decided at this point that you're feeling willing to risk it (and I'm guessing so, or else he'd already have been in quarantine at this point) then that issue is in the rear window. But it is something to remember and suggest going forward, if you are concerned that he might do something like this again. It doesn't even have to be said in anger, and in fact might be better not. But you could say to him, as you know I am quite serious about this, and should something like this happen again in the future, I would want to take xyz measures.

I do know that people internalize the danger differently, and when people do dumb things like shaking hands it's puzzling to those of us for whom it's more instinctual to be more careful. I don't know whether your H was being actively dismissive of the COVID19 danger in that moment, or whether he was just having a brain fart. That said, he is your H and I'm sure he's capable of stepping up and doing better, whichever it was.

Public health announcement: This pandemic is still happening in the US, because people are not wearing masks and maintaining appropriate distancing. 22 states, as of today, have seen a recent increase in cases, as everyone moves toward reopening. The rising social pressure, as exhibited here, to NOT wear a mask and maintain distance is depressing. I'd encourage others to try to hold the line, for the good of all.

[d0nnivain]

We talked last night.  He promised to be more sensitive & function more as a team.  No more hand shakes.  

[Sarah_Smiles]

Sorry for the loss of 20 friends to covid *hugs* I think because of that fact you didn't over react, can you have your husband get the covid19 test and when it comes back all clear(hopefully) you feel better? Did he wear a mask to the event? 

[d0nnivain]

2 hours ago, Sarah_Smiles said:

Sorry for the loss of 20 friends to covid *hugs* I think because of that fact you didn't over react, can you have your husband get the covid19 test and when it comes back all clear(hopefully) you feel better? Did he wear a mask to the event? 

He wore a mask.  I'm calmer.  I doubt he'd agree to the test but I may suggest it. 

[contel3]

I don't blame you for being uncomfortable, especially if you're at a place with that many cases, it's probably not smart to go to events like that at all....My experience is once you're there people just do whatever they want and some people will be extremely disrespectful about distancing….I'm young, but I've had several older ladies (80+) hug me, just to prove a point I guess…. It's easier to just decline altogether.

I'm sorry about your friends acting that way.

I think you did absolutely nothing wrong, you don't have to stay somewhere if it makes you panic. Everybody has different comfort levels. I think it's mostly a lack of empathy from your friends (and husband)… They are probably feeling fine, or want to pretend like life is back to normal... and want to forget other people don't necessarily feel the same. 

Take care of yourself and don't be too hard on yourself 😃

[contel3]

38 minutes ago, d0nnivain said:

He wore a mask.  I'm calmer.  I doubt he'd agree to the test but I may suggest it. 

Masks protect other people , not the person wearing it. If you're really worried, I would suggest you both avoid big gatherings for the time being.

[BaileyB]

Donni, I would have stayed in the car and gone home. And I would absolutely ask my husband to self isolate. 

I’m sorry this happened to you. I don’t think you over reacted. I think the other people are ignorant. We have literally no infections where I live right now and we are still distancing. I went to a family gathering last week, no hugs and everyone sat apart. I went to a school meeting for work yesterday, everyone sat two meters apart. I went to a restaurant this past week, for the first time. Hand sanitizer is available at the door, no menus, our table was about 4-5 meters away from the next group. Lots of distance and protective measures. 

Take care and I’m so sorry for your loss. 

 

Edited June 18, 2020 by BaileyB

[Redhead14]

On 6/16/2020 at 12:58 PM, contel3 said:

Masks protect other people , not the person wearing it.

I never believed that and read recently, that it does help the wearer.  If masks prevent forcing particles out by coughing or sneezing and or talking, the mask will protect against breathing the particles in which is a much gentler process.  Yeah, it could get into the eyes, but I've read it's not that big of a concern.  Masking coupled with hand-washing is good for both sides of the mask. 

[Ellener]

It's always difficult, the altered life.

But isn't that where closeness and growth starts out? And isn't all closeness and personal growth about empathy?

I'm starting to think we redefine 'empathy' as 'recognising the space between self-interest and the self-interest of others'.

[chillii]

No one much wearing masks around my area , some but no one bats an eyelid if someone is but people are also pretty wary about distance and things so l haven't worried about it.  We also haven't had a case in 12 wks now l just heard within a 180k radius too so that was damn nice to hear. In our main city they're still getting a few though.

Weird though l was up town today think it must be pension day because l saw quite a few small groups of older people standing about chatting away no distancing. Dunno if they're just the type to think fk it if we get it we get it which l've heard a few say , or what. Noticed a few coughing .

Edited June 19, 2020 by chillii

[QuietRiot]

On 6/19/2020 at 2:45 AM, chillii said:

No one much wearing masks around my area , some but no one bats an eyelid if someone is but people are also pretty wary about distance and things so l haven't worried about it.  We also haven't had a case in 12 wks now l just heard within a 180k radius too so that was damn nice to hear. In our main city they're still getting a few though.

Weird though l was up town today think it must be pension day because l saw quite a few small groups of older people standing about chatting away no distancing. Dunno if they're just the type to think fk it if we get it we get it which l've heard a few say , or what. Noticed a few coughing .

The older generation will be the spreaders as the common attitude is that "we have a few years left in our lives, so we're not going to let this stop us". 

[Ellener]

1 hour ago, QuietRiot said:

The older generation will be the spreaders as the common attitude is that "we have a few years left in our lives, so we're not going to let this stop us". 

The seniors I am hearing from are being locked up by their family or nursing homes, they are getting upset and annoyed, people are not applying the creative solutions to their situation we are seeing elsewhere. They are being overlooked.

[QuietRiot]

3 minutes ago, Ellener said:

The seniors I am hearing from are being locked up by their family or nursing homes, they are getting upset and annoyed, people are not applying the creative solutions to their situation we are seeing elsewhere. They are being overlooked.

Well, I live in an area where seniors 55+, even in their 70s, are active and out doing things. The non nursing home types. Typically they are married couples with adult kids far away. These elderly types are living independently from their adult children. These are in very large retirement communities, they are the threat where I live....and they don't give a crap typically.

They have this, "I'm old, and I don't care!" attitude.

Edited June 20, 2020 by QuietRiot

[Ellener]

1 hour ago, QuietRiot said:

Well, I live in an area where seniors 55+, even in their 70s, are active and out doing things. The non nursing home types. Typically they are married couples with adult kids far away. These elderly types are living independently from their adult children.

I spoke to my friend yesterday and frankly she is using the pandemic as an excuse to bully her elderly mother, I told her to stop it! Her mother hasn't been allowed out in months, I said take her for a drive...

I don't think we will have any choice soon but to go the route of ending lock downs and more of an attitude of if people get sick they get sick...but there's loads more can be done for improving quality of life for seniors in nursing homes, just no one wants to spend the money which is otherwise corporate profit.