Would you consider a permanent live-out relationship?

[SumGuy]

11 minutes ago, Emilie Jolie said:

 

I don't think that's an issue coming from them, it's more of a 'me' issue; it just means that I'm the one who has to adjust or the pool of men I'd me compatible with would be incredibly small.

 

It often goes together, committed easy going men are going to want to be together...now I'm certain there are men that see it just like you but it is also likely that men who never want to live together see such relationships as good enough for now.

Is the man you are seeing and introvert or extrovert?  I've found that makes a big difference for me, much more comfortable living the day to day with another introvert in my space. 

P.S.  If understand correctly you two are 2 hours apart, so cohabitating is a big change.  For me we are 20 min apart..so back and forth and even cohabitating is not much of a change at all.

Edited June 23, 2020 by SumGuy

[Ellener]

1 hour ago, SumGuy said:

she is a being of pure light

I look forward to someone saying that about me! 👩‍❤️‍💋‍👨

I just watched The Celestine Prophecy DVD about the energy and nature in beings; I have not yet been able to find the balance between my energy and another human in a romantic relationship. My ex and I were wonderful business partners, and I've had fabulous whirlwind romances. The whole package? Still trying to decipher if that's an artistic ideal 😃

[SumGuy]

5 minutes ago, Ellener said:

I look forward to someone saying that about me! 👩‍❤️‍💋‍👨

I just watched The Celestine Prophecy DVD about the energy and nature in beings; I have not yet been able to find the balance between my energy and another human in a romantic relationship. My ex and I were wonderful business partners, and I've had fabulous whirlwind romances. The whole package? Still trying to decipher if that's an artistic ideal 😃

She is great but not perfect...but darn close (for me) and the closest I've encountered in the last 30 years.  The whole package but given we've both been mishandled in the shipping of life a few dents and scratches are to be expected.    I'm far from perfect myself so who am I to cast stones.   

Communication and a willingness to see and work on ingrained habits is key, on both our parts including expectations.  Perhaps comparability is not so much an alignment of the positives as anyone can accept a positive, but their negatives are acceptable to you...we all have our negatives.  

[Emilie Jolie]

29 minutes ago, SumGuy said:

It often goes together, committed easy going men are going to want to be together...

Not sure I agree on the easy-going part if cohabiting is a must, to be honest. 

Usually, we reach a compromise that works for my circumstances for a while, then I get guilt-tripped into cohabiting, and the cycle continues. 

It's a moot point as I know it's my problem; it just makes me a sad to have my commitment questioned just because I want to spend some nights in my bed on my own.

Sounds like you have it all figured out with your lady - long may it continue

[Els]

I know a few men who would prefer that, but none of them want to get married (or share finances, or be in a civil partnership, etc), so I would hedge a guess that it depends on what sort of relationship you would require aside from the living situation. I think it would be somewhat rare to find a guy who wanted to get married and live apart, but not entirely uncommon to find a guy who wanted to date monogamously without ever moving in together.

Personally I find that the size of the house matters (a LOT!) when it comes to my comfort re: living together. In our 2-bedroom I don't find that I have to compromise on anything at all to live with H, but when we lived in a 1 bedroom (or even worse, studio - never doing that again!!), it was difficult.

15 hours ago, SumGuy said:

We’ve vacationed together for a week, so really non-stop together in a room instead of spacious house.   No problems, were both introverts and are happy doing and letting the other do there thing.   There is comfort for us just being in the same room. 

To be fair, a week while on vacation is really different from a year or even a month of everyday life, though! 😛 We've shared a room for 2-3 weeks of vacation without issue, but when we lived in a studio for 6 months it started getting very difficult logistic- and comfort-wise.

Edited June 23, 2020 by Elswyth

[SumGuy]

26 minutes ago, Emilie Jolie said:

Not sure I agree on the easy-going part if cohabiting is a must, to be honest. 

Usually, we reach a compromise that works for my circumstances for a while, then I get guilt-tripped into cohabiting, and the cycle continues. 

It's a moot point as I know it's my problem; it just makes me a sad to have my commitment questioned just because I want to spend some nights in my bed on my own.

Sounds like you have it all figured out with your lady - long may it continue

We are far from having it all figured out but we work on figuring it out...or enough of it out; we've had our rough patches.

I agree, a guilt trip is not the way to go, it's not easy going...but perhaps not unusual as many of us were raised that way.   

How much time passes before the insistence on cohabitation?  Can I ask your age range here, you, them?  For me cohabitation is a big step, slow steps first, and sleeping under the same roof never guarantees commitment to a person or relationship....as pretty much any divorced person can tell you.  Cohabitating too soon, too fast can kill a good thing.

This coming from a guy who wants to get to the cohabitation and it has nothing to do with sex, if it was just about sex the current arrangement is excellent as we are so close and we are both more willing than we are able given life responsibilities  

[SumGuy]

1 minute ago, Elswyth said:

...

To be fair, a week while on vacation is really different from a year or even a month of everyday life, though! 😛 We've shared a room for 2-3 weeks of vacation without issue, but when we lived in a studio for 6 months it started getting very difficult logistic- and comfort-wise.

Oh I know, it was just the space on vacation was very small...and a studio would drive me crazy even alone these days, one can get addicted to having kitchen space.  It's just in the past on similar vacations with other women it is rare wouldn't feel a bit claustrophobic at some point even if just a small bit.   

Our places are 4 bedroom houses, we have yards, decks, gardens, etc.  Plenty of outdoor and indoor space.  So providing physical space as well as mental space is not an issue.

[Ruby Slippers]

On a rational level, I can kind of see the appeal of this. But on an emotional level, it feels a little off. I guess in my mind, if the relationship is good, you can find a way to live together peacefully and happily. For me, the not-living-together version feels like a next-best alternative to living together permanently.

[Emilie Jolie]

30 minutes ago, SumGuy said:

Can I ask your age range here, you, them? 

I'm in my mid-40s, he's in his late 40s.

I was very clear and upfront with him from the beginning on this. He doesn't seem to get it at all. Which is completely out of character for him.

I'm not a particularly great housekeeper or a great cook, so I don't really know what he thinks he gains from having us living together 🤷‍♀️. Even simply using the spare room can be the cause of an argument. Probably something to do with his exW, I don't know. I know he wants to, he tried to be accommodating for a month or so, and he is a really patient, but this cohabitation thing is his Achilles eel. Or mine. Or both of ours - you know what I mean...😅

 

[Emilie Jolie]

1 hour ago, Ruby Slippers said:

I guess in my mind, if the relationship is good, you can find a way to live together peacefully and happily. 

Yes, you can. My issue, I guess.

[SumGuy]

3 minutes ago, Emilie Jolie said:

I'm in my mid-40s, he's in his late 40s.

I was very clear and upfront with him from the beginning on this. He doesn't seem to get it at all. Which is completely out of character for him.

I'm not a particularly great housekeeper or a great cook, so I don't really know what he thinks he gains from having us living together 🤷‍♀️. Even simply using the spare room can be the cause of an argument. Probably something to do with his exW, I don't know. I know he wants to, he tried to be accommodating for a month or so, and he is a really patient, but this cohabitation thing is his Achilles eel. Or mine. Or both of ours - you know what I mean...😅

 

Unless you are thinking of starting a family, in my view you have plenty of time..no need to rush and in fact I'd like to be seeing someone at least 6 months, go on long vacations with them first, etc. before moving in.  It boggles my mind he doesn't understand at late 40s that people are different and you being reluctant to cohabitate does not mean you don't care or at not committed, you know "I'm OK, You're OK", Meyer-Briggs personality types and all that.

It is a big step, akin to marriage in my book, especially if one person gets rid of their place.

[Emilie Jolie]

1 hour ago, Elswyth said:

I think it would be somewhat rare to find a guy who wanted to get married and live apart, but not entirely uncommon to find a guy who wanted to date monogamously without ever moving in together.

I see what you're saying. I don't see a huge difference between being married and being in a long-term, committed, monogamous relationship so to me it's not the issue. I'm happy sharing everything, but I also like being in my own space and sleeping in my own bed on my own. I feel like it's more of a 'force of habit' thing at this point.

[Ruby Slippers]

14 minutes ago, Emilie Jolie said:

I'm not a particularly great housekeeper or a great cook, so I don't really know what he thinks he gains from having us living together 🤷‍♀️

I tend to agree with Elaine that on a practical level, it's probably sex and affection. Anytime I've lived with a boyfriend, we have sex every day or more than once a day and lots of affection. I have high sex drive and am very affectionate, so it works for me and I love it - but the man is definitely driving that. For a man with a healthy sex drive, it seems as if this clearly is a biological need/want. I'm guessing that for a man who has feelings for a woman of the long-term bonding kind, it feels like an affront to be kept at arm's length some of the time.

However, you're doing the right thing being honest about your preference from the get-go. I hope it works out for you.

[Emilie Jolie]

5 minutes ago, SumGuy said:

It boggles my mind he doesn't understand at late 40s that people are different and you being reluctant to cohabitate does not mean you don't care or at not committed, you know "I'm OK, You're OK", Meyer-Briggs personality types and all that.

Thank you for getting it. It's not a new relationship, and everything is mostly fine really, but it'd be great if he would consider it. Hopefully we'll figure it out; I don't want it to be a deal-breaker but fear it may end up being one on his end as he is showing big signs that he's running out of patience. We'll see.

I don't know his Meye-Briggs thing - I come up as INFJ-A on those tests. I don't know what the A stands for, nor have looked closely into it, to be honest. Maybe I should ask him.

[Emilie Jolie]

35 minutes ago, Ruby Slippers said:

 I'm guessing that for a man who has feelings for a woman of the long-term bonding kind, it feels like an affront to be kept at arm's length some of the time.

This is exactly how he describes it. I don't seem to find the right words to reassure him.

[SumGuy]

48 minutes ago, Emilie Jolie said:

...

I don't know his Meye-Briggs thing - I come up as INFJ-A on those tests. I don't know what the A stands for, nor have looked closely into it, to be honest. Maybe I should ask him.

Perhaps, it could help in communication.  For me I found it helped me better see that two people can have the same goal and values but approach it in different ways, so to stop judging other peoples actions solely by what they mean when I do them, versus what they mean when they do them.  (I have no idea what the A means either)

I do get where it can be an affront after a long time, I tend to be more ready to cohabitate than my girlfriend, and we have had similar discussions...at the end of the day it can come down to does he want to throw it all away because he can't get 100% right now?  I can also understand if he thinks this will never turn into something permanent, which is a common complaint about women trying to get a guy to commit.  

Having two homes is not necessarily arms length, anymore than if you did live together needing to have your own space and alone time...would he understand that?   It can also be subconscious, in that it is a claustrophobic feeling that just arises, not because of him or you not caring or trusting him, but could just be an autonomy protection measure, especially if one has had bad experiences in the past. 

Are there things you can do to that he believes would make him feel more connected and close to you when you can't be physically together? 

And are there things he could do to make you feel more comfortable with being physically together for any length of time?  

[Emilie Jolie]

17 minutes ago, SumGuy said:

It can also be subconscious, in that it is a claustrophobic feeling that just arises, not because of him or you not caring or trusting him, but could just be an autonomy protection measure, especially if one has had bad experiences in the past. 

That's it. I explained that to him. He understands the words that come out of my mouth, but he can't seem to see past the idea that for him, it means I'm not as committed as he is, which is completely false. I don't know how else to reassure him but to relent. I've tried everything, he seems to think he's been patient enough (he has, from his perspective) but that cohabitation is the end game. 

17 minutes ago, SumGuy said:

And are there things he could do to make you feel more comfortable with being physically together for any length of time?  

He won't even let me stay in the spare bedroom...

Edited June 23, 2020 by Emilie Jolie

[Weezy1973]

Generally I’d say without kids, definitely an option for many, and I suspect this will become more common in time. 
 

With kids, living together actually makes things a lot easier.

[Emilie Jolie]

3 minutes ago, Weezy1973 said:

definitely an option for many,

Neither definitely nor many where I live - maybe it's a geographical thing.

Kids or no kids seems to make zero difference, in my limited experience. They are fine with it the first few months, I expect because they like the 'casual' aspect of it (not sure why, I don't ever give the impression that I do casual, it's just not my thing) but cohabitation seems to be a given after a while. 

I've too much time on my hand at the moment, so have been reading about it a little bit; turns out these types of relationships have a name. Living Apart Together, or LAT. Pretty happy with that, will be able to show him that I'm not completely crazy for wanting this. 

 

[snowboy91]

I'd definitely consider it. Although I have no clue how I would feel after 3-5 years or so or how my feelings would change. I'm aware I feel this way only because I moved in way too soon in both my serious relationships (it was just "expected" of me) - and into tiny 1 bedroom apartments so this concept of "space" is virtually non existent. Especially during these times. 

[SumGuy]

How would he react to, i can do two of these things, but not all three:  I can do what you want (move in with you), do it when you want (now), or how you want (same room, etc.).     You choose two and I decide the third. 

so if the spare room is off limits as well as any other space and time alone desire you have, then you choose when...if he wants cohabitation (but you LAT) now he has to give on how.   

[central]

I'd consider it, in certain circumstances that are hard to predefine.  A dear friend (former lover) had this as her ideal, as she'd lived alone almost all her life and didn't want her home and routine disrupted.  Ideally, any husband would live around the corner.  She never found one, though.

It wouldn't be my preferred scenario, but it might work.  I can see it working for a secondary relationship (actually, I did that and it worked; we're poly and live together, but it is easier to manage another relationship that didn't involve cohabiting).

[Emilie Jolie]

8 minutes ago, central said:

She never found one, though

Not what I wanted to hear (but kind of what I was expecting). I'm going to have to suck it up, aren't I... Sigh. (not your fault, central!  )

Edited June 23, 2020 by Emilie Jolie

[Emilie Jolie]

9 minutes ago, SumGuy said:

I can do what you want (move in with you), do it when you want (now), or how you want (same room, etc.).     You choose two and I decide the third. 

Not a bad idea. I've already pushed my luck on the now option, so he won't go for that, but yeah, maybe he'll be more receptive if he gets some form of decision making even if I'm not hopeful. I'll see if I can get him to read about LAT himself first so he knows it's an actual thing, not a product of my imagination. Thank you @SumGuy!

[Emilie Jolie]

33 minutes ago, snowboy91 said:

I'd definitely consider it. Although I have no clue how I would feel after 3-5 years or so or how my feelings would change. I'm aware I feel this way only because I moved in way too soon in both my serious relationships (it was just "expected" of me) - and into tiny 1 bedroom apartments so this concept of "space" is virtually non existent. Especially during these times. 

I hear you. Not ideal. Can you get back to your own place once this situation is over?