What have I gotten myself into?

[Ladyjane14]

Good luck, MLC.

 

I think you'll do fine as long as you remember to speak up when you need to. It's a difficult proposition for conflict-avoiders like you and me. It's sooooo much easier not to have to 'go there'. But when we don't....we find ourselves feeling misunderstood, and fuming because of it.

 

Better to pick our battles, and then go on in and duke it out. At the minimum, we've spoken our minds.

[FWIW]

Thanks for all your input, LadyJ, MzP,FWIW all the rest thanks for holding my hand thru my MLC.

 

You're very welcome. Good luck MLC, it sounds like progress! Best wishes

[midlifecrazy]

Well that didn't last very friggin' long. Vesuvius blew today only it wasn't me, it was her. It was completely out of left field. I didn't even see it coming. A minor comment, I can't even call it a disagreement escalated like a sky rocket. Sometimes I can tell when she's spoiling for a fight. Not this time. I was totally taken off guard.

 

She went from nothing wrong to swearing and throwing things at me in not much more than 5 minutes. No real damage done to me but the set of keys to the forehead smarted a bit. The fact that I stayed calm and wouldn't back down seemed to enrage her even more. The only cuss word I said was toward the end when I told her she really needed to see a f--king doctor.

 

I said I'm done with this and she said fine. I now have absolutely no doubt left about whether or not she is mentally ill. I've seen the raging, unreasoning crazy look in her eyes. And now that she's calmed down, she acts as if nothing had happened.

 

I've said during the course of posting on LS that certain things, among them physical abuse, would change everything. Everything just changed. Over the years I've told her, warned her that I would never put up the kind of treatment her father took from her mother. Maybe she's testing me. I don't know if I passed or failed. All I know is I can't count myself any kind of man if I stay here and put up with this. She's never said she's sorry. Hell, she never apologizes for anything because she's always right and the one who was wronged in the first place.

 

I have to admit this marriage is dead and move on. I gave it my best shot. How odd to almost a year find yourself in the same place again yet for a different reason. There are ends to be tied up. Information to be gathered. Lawyers to be seen.

[lake]

I have only read the beginning and ending of your saga. She sure sounds like she needs to see a counselor to be referred to a psychiatrist for medication. There are many meds out there now that can help depression or manic deprission. Have you asked her when you are both calm--out of the heat of the anger to go and see a Dr.? Again, very sorry to hear of your situation. Hope all goes well for you. You certainly sound like you care about having a quality relationship.

[Ditherer]

Wow.. that's bad news. Sorry to hear that, I'd been meaning to come on and give you the cheery send-off as you seemed to be over it all!

Just wondering.. will you still be puzzled whether you're right to abandon the marriage while she's not well? Will "in sickness and in health" be ringing in your ears still? (as I think you've tortured yourself along those lines before)

Will things calm down and you'll find yourself telling her you'll take it this once, but one more episode like that and you're off?

Good luck MLC.. wishing you all the best..

[Presario]

I have to admit this marriage is dead and move on. I gave it my best shot.

 

Do you call your "best shot" the sex you had with some other woman?

[midlifecrazy]

Dith, thanks. I don't think the "sickness and health thing" will affect me since she refuses to get help or even acknowldege that she needs it. As for the rest I find myself wondering the same thing. Since I am not in a position to walk out the door and file right this instant the possibility exists that I might indeed waver and try to convince myself that it was just a one time aberration that won't happen again.

 

But I think this shows me she's getting worse, losing control. What should I do? Wait till next time or until she ups the ante and comes at me with her fists, nails, or a frying pan? To me this is a line that has been crossed that should never have been, almost as bad as if she had had another affair.

 

Presario, this has been a long and involved story so perhaps you can be excused for not knowing what you're talking about.

[Outcast]

Well, finally. Now for pete's sake get moving before you dither again.

[Ladyjane14]

I said I'm done with this and she said fine. I now have absolutely no doubt left about whether or not she is mentally ill. I've seen the raging, unreasoning crazy look in her eyes. And now that she's calmed down, she acts as if nothing had happened.

 

She's not going to take you seriously unless you start acting like you're serious. In her experience, these things always blow over.

 

Why don't you go ahead and make yourself an appointment with an attorney and explore your options?

You don't have to tell her you saw one if you're not ready to. And you don't have to file just to talk to the guy/gal. But once you get a little information together, I think it'll be easier for you to weigh your decision.

 

It's been a long time, and I'll be honest...there have been times when I felt like you weren't speaking up enough for yourself. Still, you're way past the six months you gave yourself originally to straighten this thing out, and you've done an a fairly good job overall of thinking things through. If you're ready to be done with it, I think it's unlikely that you'll have a whole bunch of recriminations to deal with.

 

There is still the possibility that your wife will finally 'get in the game' if she knows you're serious. The "ultimatum" still exists as a final option.

[Mz. Pixie]

Wow, MLC. I'm sorry to hear this, but maybe it is time.

[johnlucas]

You and your wife have out-of-sync sex drives & that's just it.

 

She's UNsexual and you're SUPERsexual.

 

It basically boils down to that.

 

Why SHOULD someone have to put up with a spouse that doesn't value them as a lover?

I mean REALLY, folks, what the hell is a marriage about anyway?

A marriage is nothing more than the state-approved stamp on an already existing long-term relationship. There really is no such thing as marriage. What people are connected by is the bonds of a long-term relationship.

And SEX is at the core of this bond.

Friendship makes up the mantle & crust.

 

You have a roommate, midlifecrazy.

I just wrote in a post called "Marriage counselors? Why?"

http://www.loveshack.org/forums/t89131/

about why I think marriage should be overhauled with a periodical reevaulation system. Stories like this shouldn't have to happen & WOULDN'T happen if conscious thought & review was put into the union on a repeated basis.

 

That way if the two parties evolved in separate directions then they split when they no longer have any semblance of being on the same page.

 

Didn't you say that she basically was resistant to your touch & showed disgust at anything sexual? Well there's your answer. Her sex drive is dead. Which is sad. Kids make a woman's body haywire. You said she lost it after having your child, right?

 

People put in the wrong ideas when they think of marriage. It's a mass miseducation, a trick on the populace. They think of marriage as a biosphere that provides sustenance to the inhabitants of that small ecosystem.

 

It is NOT living. It is a CONTRACT. Just a legal agreement, OK?

What's LIVING is the physical & mental bonding brought about by sexual connection nurtured by the bonds of friendship/companionship.

Marriage doesn't live, folks. The BOND does.

 

I see it in the language people use.

"I'm not happy in my marriage"

As if Marriage was a world with fauna & flora that gives life. As if a container that preserves the contents. As if a special house with proper insulation, ventilation, bedding, bath, & kitchen.

 

Get that outcha minds, folks.

 

Marriage is NOT a container NOR a sustainer.

It is MERELY a *legal contract* by gov't to give special rules & regulations to an existing long-term relationship or bond.

 

Midlifecrazy, you're about to be MidLifeCrazier if you don't do one of TWO things:

 

(1) Either you sit your wife down & let her know how much sexual connection you would like from her. Making sure to let her know how you don't feel valued or desired.

 

OR

 

(2) You divorce your wife and pursue this mind-dominating fantasy with 'DG' &/or any other gal out there who can match up with your strong lusts & passions.

 

'Cause, buddy, it sounds to me that you're on the verge, the edge, the vedge of cheating on your wife of decades.

And that wouldn't be fair to your wife ESPECIALLY when you won't level with her about what you need from her.

 

They talk about abstinence as sexual education.

Bah! What they should do is teach the value & methods of sexual connection so things like this won't come up.

To educate folks on how sexual drives get out of wack & how to restore them. To teach the importance of what REALLY matters in LTR's so they won't fall into the trap of the "head" marriage as opposed to the "heart" marriage.

 

Not a surprise to me to know that sex education is in the dark ages at this point in time. The experts can't even give you solid answers on why something goes haywire much less tangible ways how to fix it. Not that old "it's in the mind"" line.

All that money we waste on giant weapons could be better put to use by studying the healths especially sexual health.

Figure out what's going on with that & you'll get better human relations & most likely less need for war.

Hard to fight when you're too busy immersed in pleasure.

 

Midlifecrazy, do yourself a favor & break the situation down now before you end up betraying your wife.

Or you'll end up Crazy in Oldlife.

 

Words from a recently-turned 30 year old,

John Lucas

[johnlucas]

Whoops! I posted my last commentary before getting to the end of the thread. I was on page 6 & didn't realize how long this thread had been going on.

 

Your wife may be chemically unstable in the brain or hormonally-out-of-wack as a result of years with a lacking sex drive.

You know sex is a basic human need like food water & air.

Slightly different since you won't necessarily die without it but important in that without it you don't quite function right.

 

This may explain her attitudes to you & that 'Vesuvius' fight you mentioned.

Trying to keep that mirage alive won't do anybody any good.

 

Remember, midlifecrazy, that assertiveness is a marker of self-respect.

It's one thing to be kind & understanding but when you let yourself become a pushover for whatever you're showing that you have no respect for yourself.

It doesn't have to come off as bossy which is a marker of arrogance but just standing up for yourself in situations that require it like with telemarketer salespeople & those in the workplace who try to pawn their duties off on you.

 

Life ain't supposed to be this hard & with the advent of civilization it is designed to become easier with each advancement. If you don't accept that life doesn't have to be hell then you'll make sure hell won't find you. Sure hell (on earth) exists & we'll all get a taste of it but at least we won't reside in that realm.

 

People gotta stop putting up with situations that bring no joy to their lives.

If you stopped believing in the afterlife all of a sudden, then what would life mean to you then? You'd know it's short & sudden and that you'd better find one method or another to find the pleasure & heaven this time brings showing little patience for suffering & hell.

If there IS an afterlife, then you'll get TWO good lives.

 

What's the meaning of life? To LIVE. No other meaning. No other purpose. Only what you designate it to be. YOU make the meaning. YOU make the purpose. And chances are you'd make a life that makes you smile & glad for your time spent here. Misery would be almost a foreign word.

 

Good luck, midlifecrazy. Hope you find your way & become midlifesane.

John Lucas

[midlifecrazy]

Folks I think I'm in over my head here, in an entirely different manner the the "what have I gotten myself into" title implies.

 

Today my wife said she was suicidal. That she just wished she could die so the awful feelings she had would go away. She said if she had an easy way to do it she would. She said a horrible thing, that if I loved her I could help her do it. She said she's heard of people doing that.

 

I tried to get her to talk about what was bothering her but there was nothing she could explain except that she felt like she had a great weight on her shoulders. One of our kids has made what we think is a poor decision but nothing tragic or life ruining. This AM she showed me a new purchase she had made and I probably made a mistake by asking how much it cost which I think she took the wrong way. I asked if any of this was making her feel bad. She said no, but I feel it didn't help matters anyway.

 

I asked her how she thought this would affect the kids and grandkids. She said they'd be all right, maybe sad at first but all right. Then I asked what she thought the kids would say if I told them what she was talking about. She said she would just deny it. Early on during the talk I tried to put my arm around her but she didn't want me to. Toward the end I told I didn't know what to do and said I didn't mean it in any smart aleck or bad way but I really thought she needed to see a professional. She still won't consider it.

 

 

This week has not really been too bad since that last blow up. Maybe I've been a little distant but not real seriously if that makes any sense. I could tell this AM she was down before all this came pouring out.

 

 

Ditherer is more astute than one might think. The sickness and health thing is right back in there BIG TIME. I guess she can't help herself so it's up to me to try to do what I can. Gawd the thought flitted through my head during the exchange that it might be necessary to have her committed. I don't think she's at that point yet and as she said she would just deny everything.

 

I've been on some of the suicide prevention sites and can see that maybe I didn't handle it as well as I could have but I didn't do terribly either. My moves today have been to be calm, sympathetic, caring and solicitous of her as much as possible. I've also made sure she stays surrounded by family members.

 

My immediate short term plans are to continue with some intensive caring behavior and to try to run interference and take as many stressors and frustrations out of her daily life as possible and to try to find activities that she enjoys and whatever else I can do to make her life happier and easier. From what I've read on one site that's a pretty good plan along with just listening to her if she wants to talk. A different site says she needs to see a doctor as soon as possible when she went on so much about how she wished she was dead. I don't know how to get her to do that. The ultimatum? Yeah, that wouldn't be stressful at all. I suppose some will think I'm being manipulated. That's because they haven't seen someone is such obvious pain. Hell, the blowup and throwing things was just a bump on her downhill slide into this deep point in the pit of depression, I realize that now.

 

So, advice anyone? What do I do, go with the plan, don't tell anyone and try to weather the storm? Try to find someone to talk me through dealing with this? What?

[Outcast]

This woman has blackmailed you emotionally for decades and she's doing it again. Worst of all, she refuses help. She's one walking pity party. If she were a cancer patient who complained about the pain but refused to see a physician, few people would have sympathy. So, too, must people refuse to be patient with patients who won't take a step to help themselves.

 

Speak to your family doctor about this. It is time that she quit playing the victim and take responsibility for her own mental health.

[Jessie61]

MLC,

 

Things have really turned for the worse for you...? I am sorry to hear that.

 

I am no expert in psychiatry, BUT I have seen depression and suicide first hand as a close friend of my family suffered manic depression for years and she eventually killed herself.

 

You have to realise that YOU are not equipped to "cure" your W. Yes, there are ways that you can support her etc, but you cannot cure her so don't take on that responsibility on yourself. If she won't consider getting help, then I think you should to a doctor yourself about what to do with your W. If she really has to be committed (having spoken to a doctor about it), then so what? It is still better than running the risk of a suicide, isn't it?

 

Yes, you talk about "in sickness and in health", and you are right. But this is sickness and she cannot help herself. But there are limits to what YOU can do too!!! There is a whole science out there dealing with these things; if depression/suicide was straightforward then there would be no need for doctors, research, years of studying and the rest of it. Leave the suicide prevention websites to one side for a while and and seek some PROFESSIONAL help instead on behalf of your W...

 

I mean, if you thought your wife had a serious heart condition, you would not be looking up the internet to find a cure, would you...? You would bring her to the A&E...

 

Please don't take on the whole responsibility for this yourself. I don't think you would be fair to her or to yourself.

[Ladyjane14]

She needs to see her doctor, MLC. If she won't go, then call and ask the doctor what to do. S/He'll probably tell you to take her to the ER.

 

It's best if you can get her to agree to seek treatment, but if you can't, and you feel the threat is imminent... you can always dial 911 as a last resort. They'll more than likely send police as well as ambulance and hopefully they can influence her choice about going to the ER. Usually at the hospital, they'll assess the patient and if they believe there's a risk, they'll admit her for a few days to keep an eye on her.

 

I dunno. I'm not sure I'd be keeping this information secret from the family. In some respects, it would seem to me that the more intervention you can manage the better. But I can see where it might be difficult for you to 'let the cat out of the bag' too. I think we're all very hard pressed to betray our loved one's confidence even when it's done to ultimately provide support for them.

 

The bottom line though is that you do need some help. This is more than you can handle on your own. And there's also the argument that you owe something to your grown children in terms of maintaining the trusting relationship you already have with them. How would they feel if things went badly and they had been kept in the dark? So.... are there a few family members you can trust to help you make decisions?

 

I'm not sure what to tell you. Suicide threats are over my head too.

You really need some professional guidance at this point.

[whichwayisup]

Today my wife said she was suicidal. That she just wished she could die so the awful feelings she had would go away. She said if she had an easy way to do it she would. She said a horrible thing, that if I loved her I could help her do it. She said she's heard of people doing that.

 

I hate to say it, but she definately needs to be evaluated by a DR. She is depressed and the fact she's spoken about suicide and thought about it, in detail. That's a BIG red flag. Please get her some help and fast.

 

She sounds like she is feeling hopeless and where her mind is right now is a dangerous place. She may not be showing classic signs of depression, but it's there.

[seven]

Geez MLC, sorry to see things have taken a severe turn south. The suicide comments should definitely be taken seriously. Others were wise to suggest you speak to a family doctor about Mrs. MLC. Were I you, I'd want to talk to a counselor myself about how to cope with a depressed spouse and all else. You need a safe place to let it all out. She does too. You just cannot be that for each other at this point—too much history between you and she needs to find emotional wellness again You can support her sure, but it’s ultimately up to her to want to feel better and work at that. Enabling her depression won’t help either of you in the long run.

 

I would share your wife’s comments with your adult children and/or close siblings if she has any. I say this for two reasons. One, you really shouldn’t have to bear this burden alone. Two, from personal experience. A nephew of mine (who was 19 and lived long distance) committed suicide (to me, was out of the blue). Only to find out that he mentioned suicide to his parents and adult brother, starting giving things away, exhibiting many suicidal behaviors. No one shared this with me or my other siblings, and we were left in a friggin' shocked stupor! The domino effect of both those decisions (his suicide and others’ silence) forever changed our family history. Personally, I had to make a conscious choice not to let either take away my God given right to have peace of mind.

 

You will find your way through this ... just don't try to do it all alone.

[Mz. Pixie]

MLC-

I echo what the others have said. Call her doctor. Tell him that you don't want to know any specifics about her medical care- but that she is considering suicide and you need to know what to do. ALso tell the kids without her being present and let them know she threatened to deny it if confronted.

 

She needs help. Quickly. What she's doing sure doesn't jive with all the statements that she has made that she's perfectly happy, does it??

[Ditherer]

Any news, bud?