Did I handle this right?

[OatsAndHall]

I have two threads regarding this topic but I'll fill folks in on the gist:

I was married with three stepsons and ended up divorced. My ex-wife encouraged my relationship with the boys until her new/old boyfriend (now husband) moved into the house as the ink was drying on the divorce settlement. Then she told me I couldn't see them anymore which was difficult to handle. I didn't do or say anything remotely out of line that would have warranted me not seeing them. I didn't make any attempts to see them over the years but I did send birthday and Christmas cards each year but, four years in, she said that wasn't kosher and that I wasn't to contact them at all. These weren't attempts to cultivate a relationship with them; just simple gestures to know I was thinking of them on those holidays. Apparently, the cards had been going in the trash for four years which I didn't appreciate but I also didn't try to fight. They're her kids and she has every right to tell me to stay away and I did.

One of the boys (now 17) messaged me to wish me a happy birthday over the weekend. I thanked him, wished him well and went on with my day. He reached out to me again just wanted to chat about video games we were playing. It was just random banter back and forth and I didn't know quite what to do. If I ignored him that would obviously hurt his feelings and I didn't know if a few Facebook messages would warrant me telling him his mother didn't want me talking to him. He mentioned a game that we've both been playing for years and asked to play together. I told him that I didn't think that would be a good idea. When he asked why, I stated the following:

"Look, I'm sorry bud but your mother has asked that I don't contact you or your brothers and I don't think she would be alright with us playing games together This is a request that she has ever right to make and I abide by. I'm not trying to paint your mother in a negative light or cause problems as she has her reasons for asking me not to contact you guys. I'm sorry buddy but it's just not a good idea." He proceeded to ask me to do so behind her back and I told him that I couldn't do that either and I apologized again. He said he understood and that was the end of it.

Now I feel awful because he's hurt and he essentially got tossed in the middle. Should I have handled this differently? I didn't think much about a few Facebook messages back and forth as he's 17 years old. He's contacted me over Facebook before but this is the first time since his mother through down the "no contact" gauntlet.

 

[emprosnet7]

You don't mention what YOU wanted to do, only what others want you to do.

[Wiseman2]

Sorry to hear that. His mother created this drama for this poor kid so now she'll have to take responsibility for it.

[OatsAndHall]

56 minutes ago, emprosnet7 said:

You don't mention what YOU wanted to do, only what others want you to do.

I would love to have some contact with the boys but they're not my kids and it's not my call. As much as I (and most people) disagree with her call, it's still her call to make. She not only has the practical right to make that decision, she has the legal one as well. I could end up with a phone call from the police telling me to cease all contact.

Edited August 4, 2020 by OatsAndHall

[FMW]

At 17 he's old enough to decide who he wants to have contact with.  I really doubt the police would get involved simply because his mother wasn't happy.  How close is he to being 18?  At that point he's an adult and can make his own decisions. 

I understand your decision though, and it's good that you respect your ex's wishes.  But again, at some point, it's out of her hands and it seems that point is very near. 

[Ruby Slippers]

You did the right thing. I think it's really sad the mom insisted you not have any contact with them, after the relationships were formed. Strikes me as very self-serving of her. @FMW makes a good point that at 18, he'll be an adult and it'll be his call. At that point, both he and you can do what you like and you don't owe her any explanation.

[emprosnet7]

I agree with FMW, that is why I asked how you feel. At age 17, her mother can not dictate much, he is heading for 18. IMHO you did not handle it right.

[OatsAndHall]

@FMW and @emprosnet7 He's actually turning 17 in a month so it'll be a little over a year. I'm hoping he'll contact me when he's 18.  Unfortunately, his mother and her husband would absolutely escalate the situation over nothing; they'd contact the police and they would tell the boy he's not to have any contact with me. I know that wouldn't go very far with the police but I also don't want him to have to deal with a circus at home. His stepfather is under the impression that I tried to keep in touch with the kids to stay in HER life which is the furthest thing from the truth. I have ZERO contact with her for good reason. But, that doesn't deter his thought process or reactive behavior. The whole thing is just a mess.

 

[nodramallama]

Would it be possible for you to communicate this to him?  Explaining that until he's 18 and legally and adult, you need to respect his mother's wishes, while at the same time, expressing your extreme disappointment that it has to be this way? Because of his mother?  I would bet that the minute he's 18, he'll reach out again.    I wish you the best!

[SincereOnlineGuy]

On 8/3/2020 at 5:30 PM, OatsAndHall said:

I have two threads regarding this topic but I'll fill folks in on the gist:

I was married with three stepsons and ended up divorced. My ex-wife encouraged my relationship with the boys until her new/old boyfriend (now husband) moved into the house as the ink was drying on the divorce settlement. Then she told me I couldn't see them anymore which was difficult to handle. I didn't do or say anything remotely out of line that would have warranted me not seeing them. I didn't make any attempts to see them over the years but I did send birthday and Christmas cards each year but, four years in, she said that wasn't kosher and that I wasn't to contact them at all. These weren't attempts to cultivate a relationship with them; just simple gestures to know I was thinking of them on those holidays. Apparently, the cards had been going in the trash for four years which I didn't appreciate but I also didn't try to fight. They're her kids and she has every right to tell me to stay away and I did.   (<<<<<<<<<<<  this part is morally inaccurate in 2020 )  (of course it does NOT give you any sorts of predatory rights, when I say that)

One of the boys (now 17) messaged me to wish me a happy birthday over the weekend. I thanked him, wished him well and went on with my day. He reached out to me again just wanted to chat about video games we were playing. It was just random banter back and forth and I didn't know quite what to do. If I ignored him that would obviously hurt his feelings and I didn't know if a few Facebook messages would warrant me telling him his mother didn't want me talking to him. He mentioned a game that we've both been playing for years and asked to play together. I told him that I didn't think that would be a good idea. When he asked why, I stated the following:

"Look, I'm sorry bud but your mother has asked that I don't contact you or your brothers and I don't think she would be alright with us playing games together This is a request that she has ever right to make and I abide by. I'm not trying to paint your mother in a negative light or cause problems as she has her reasons for asking me not to contact you guys. I'm sorry buddy but it's just not a good idea." He proceeded to ask me to do so behind her back and I told him that I couldn't do that either and I apologized again. He said he understood and that was the end of it.

Now I feel awful because he's hurt and he essentially got tossed in the middle. Should I have handled this differently? I didn't think much about a few Facebook messages back and forth as he's 17 years old. He's contacted me over Facebook before but this is the first time since his mother through down the "no contact" gauntlet.

 

How do I... put this (more slowly and considerately than the complete rant I want to leap into) ???

 

Your seeming sense for all of this is woefully outdated  ( as if you were typing in 1962 or so)   (and it ain't your grammar...   or your gramma )  (OK, Grammer Rock was more 1972)

 

THESE DAYS...  in the same way that male biological fathers are now on the hook for everything (as soon as DNA proves it...)   (and in the same way that there are "PAternal rights")...

 

A MALE SPOUSE who marries someone who previously had children, signs-on for the whole ball of wax  when he marries her.

 

IN SO DOING...    you get a right to a relationship WITH THOSE KIDS AS IF they were your own!  (and THAT relationship right does NOT end on 'divorce day'  when you are no longer romantic with their mother)

 

AND as such,   you should (have always) fostered a relationship with them...   with certain perspective when you were married to their mother, and somewhat different perspective now, BUT STILL A RELATIONSHIP.

 

( The most awesome female mind I've ever been around (for a good amount of time) is also someone whose ex husband had court-given rights to maintain a relationship and have visitation with the woman's biological daughter who was NOT the biological kid of the ex husband.  SHE (the woman, not the daughter) grumbled about that being somehow 'unfair'...    but she was logically wrong, and too emotionally invested in the relationship to be objective)

I understand/perceive that your relationships with these one-time stepkids are NOT under the watchful eye of the courts...  BUT MORALLY you still do have every right to maintain relationships with them.

 

In this case, I say  play the video game with the kid...     (it's  a comfy/cozy/(NOT terribly intrusive) way to engage)

 

 

Edited August 17, 2020 by SincereOnlineGuy

[FudgeSwirl]

This kind of situation really is painful and in the end the innocent parties get hurt.  

As painful as it must have been to write that to him you did the right thing because if she were to find out because he accidentally left his FB account open it would be hell for both you and him.  I agree with everybody who said once he's 18 like the rest of his brothers his mother not longer can prevent him rekindling a relationship with you.  Maybe mention that to him so he knows that he you are leaving the doors of communication open for the future.

[OatsAndHall]

@nodramallama: Yes, it would be possible. With that being said, he's an intelligent kid and understands that he has the right at this time. Honestly, he knows that he currently has that right and still sends me memes here and there.  So, we're still keeping in touch, albeit quietly. He's been walking past my mother's house lately and greeting her when she's outside so he's trying to reach out to us in several different manners.

@SincereOnlineGuy: When we divorced I asked that some type of visitation be written into the settlement. Unfortunately, my state doesn't have laws that allows for that and that door was shut. Honestly, I'm only handling it in this matter for his sake as her and her husband will be exceptionally vocal if she finds out we're playing that game together. . As such, it would end up putting the boy in a bad situation. I am desperately trying to avoid that as his biological father placed him in the middle of many adult situations when he was younger and it took him a lot of time and therapy to move past all of that.

Reality; he has to live with his mother and his stepfather. He doesn't have to live with me.

[Cersei]

I love the way you handled it. It was honest and did not come across as showing negativity towards the Mom.  Good job!

[SincereOnlineGuy]

47 minutes ago, OatsAndHall said:

@nodramallama: Yes, it would be possible. With that being said, he's an intelligent kid and understands that he has the right at this time. Honestly, he knows that he currently has that right and still sends me memes here and there.  So, we're still keeping in touch, albeit quietly. He's been walking past my mother's house lately and greeting her when she's outside so he's trying to reach out to us in several different manners.

@SincereOnlineGuy: When we divorced I asked that some type of visitation be written into the settlement. Unfortunately, my state doesn't have laws that allows for that and that door was shut. Honestly, I'm only handling it in this matter for his sake as her and her husband will be exceptionally vocal if she finds out we're playing that game together. . As such, it would end up putting the boy in a bad situation. I am desperately trying to avoid that as his biological father placed him in the middle of many adult situations when he was younger and it took him a lot of time and therapy to move past all of that.

Reality; he has to live with his mother and his stepfather. He doesn't have to live with me.

OK, I like that you are caring for his environment...    but I still think it even more important to ALL involved that you make fully clear to him (at 17, in more depth than you could offer ...  er, than HE could understand...  when he was 12) that your full preference would have ALWAYS been to maintain the relationship with him. )

 

(Because that's the whole truth...    and it should be clear in his mind and understanding)     (again, if you've not done so recently {and in communication that was direct, and not dependent upon his mom not shredding it before he ever saw it}...   then spell it out clearly for him again)

 

Hope it won't be too long before your state falls in-line with the new world.

 

 

[Blind-Sided]

On 8/4/2020 at 1:19 PM, OatsAndHall said:

 I'm hoping he'll contact me when he's 18.  Unfortunately, his mother and her husband would absolutely escalate the situation over nothing; they'd contact the police and they would tell the boy he's not to have any contact with me. 

When he's 18... his mother has no say in it. 

[mark clemson]

^^ I think that's probably correct, and something you could consider mentioning to the kid(s). It will be their choice (although you might go for one of those free 1/2 hour consults with a family attorney just to make sure there's no legal issue in your state).

However, despite them having the right to contact you, depending on how strongly she feels about it, causing friction with the mom over what is essentially a friendship might not be in their ultimate best interests. Of course, if the mom is crappy and so is the dad, it might be beneficial for them at some level. It seems like you have been maturely and respectfully considering what's in their best interests so far (minimal contact, but not really pressing the issue). Suggest you continue with that mindset going forward.