Are alternative health practitioners part of the problem?

[QuietRiot]

I have a friend that has a side gig as an "energy worker". Beliefs in the alternative methods of health.  Sadly, she admittedly does not socially distant with dating prospects and even invites friends over to her place for game night...maskless of course.

She thinks this is all FEAR -based and fear leads to a lowered immunity, and thusly, catching the virus. She also believes the, yep....the 5G networks are also an issue. I had to cease conversations with her on this topic because I thought she was intelligent enough NOT to believe in such things. It's amazing how this whole thing has driven even our social lives to split up.

[Foxhall]

I suppose in one sense you could say yes, 

based on the notion that many alternative practitioners think they are "above" or "too healthy" to need to wear a mask,

Personally I am all for alternative health therapies, the positives of such approaches far outweigh the negatives,

anything that boosts immune systems and promotes natural healing is all beneficial.

[Wiseman2]

If they turn you off, ignore them. Who in particular is bothering you in this regard?

[basil67]

@QuietRiot it would appear that you're basing your hypothesis on a sum total of one person.   So very scientific of you.

[thefooloftheyear]

Two things I have learned in this relatively long life, when it pertains to this topic..

1) Dr's are just people....They aren't miracle workers and some aren't all that good, well intentioned, or knowledgable...Yet most people follow their advice right off the cliff..so to speak.....And the science that the medical field bases these theories on, constantly changes and evolves...I don't know how old you are, but there was a time that all the "experts" claimed that eating eggs will kill you and leave you with clogged arteries...That has since changed...I could go on, but you get the point...

2) Never underestimate the sheer power of the mind and human will...When harnessed, its been proven to do things that baffles science...One of my aunts, who was very outspoken and opiniated lived her entire life and never once taken even an aspirin or anti biotic...She had a very strong will and a belief system that differed from traditional medical advice....She relentlessly studied how the human body functioned and only used dietary and homeopathic remedies for any ailments she may have had-which weren't many..She lived a more healthy life than most and died or natural causes at 94...

But on aside...OP...You really should not be so judgmental over what other people do or believe in...Seems like a common thread, if your posting has any indication...Live and let live...

TFY

[QuietRiot]

6 minutes ago, thefooloftheyear said:

Two things I have learned in this relatively long life, when it pertains to this topic..

1) Dr's are just people....They aren't miracle workers and some aren't all that good, well intentioned, or knowledgable...Yet most people follow their advice right off the cliff..so to speak.....And the science that the medical field bases these theories on, constantly changes and evolves...I don't know how old you are, but there was a time that all the "experts" claimed that eating eggs will kill you and leave you with clogged arteries...That has since changed...I could go on, but you get the point...

2) Never underestimate the sheer power of the mind and human will...When harnessed, its been proven to do things that baffles science...One of my aunts, who was very outspoken and opiniated lived her entire life and never once taken even an aspirin or anti biotic...She had a very strong will and a belief system that differed from traditional medical advice....She relentlessly studied how the human body functioned and only used dietary and homeopathic remedies for any ailments she may have had-which weren't many..She lived a more healthy life than most and died or natural causes at 94...

But on aside...OP...You really should not be so judgmental over what other people do or believe in...Seems like a common thread, if your posting has any indication...Live and let live...

TFY

I think we're getting into a red herring here...so let me steer it in the direction of how some of these people have a dangerous thinking, and are the contribute to community spread.

So if you're saying medical advice is to wear masks until this Covid dies down is something that should not be heeded by the American population, where even other people of the world think us fools for acting as such?

Edited August 11, 2020 by QuietRiot

[amaysngrace]

I don’t much care what people think of me and this goes for close relatives whom I love dearly.  Caring what the whole world thinks??  Just no. 🤣  

If you start to feel a cold coming on I suggest Cold Nip by Six Persimmons.  It will enhance your body’s wei qi, strengthen your immune system and transform your phlegm to help speed up draining and getting that dried up quickly.

Feel better!  

 

[d0nnivain]

People with dangerous thinking have always been a problem in all walks of life but they are minor fringe actors.   Not every alternative healer is a science denier.  

If your friend is acting & espousing beliefs that you feel are unhealthy, just move away from that person.  I have a few friends who think this a joke or a ploy to restrict freedoms.  I have not seen them since this started nor will I go near them until it's safe to do so.  

[thefooloftheyear]

1 hour ago, QuietRiot said:

I think we're getting into a red herring here...so let me steer it in the direction of how some of these people have a dangerous thinking, and are the contribute to community spread.

So if you're saying medical advice is to wear masks until this Covid dies down is something that should not be heeded by the American population, where even other people of the world think us fools for acting as such?

No...I am not saying that....

But  think about it for a minute....Medical experts say obesity and poor lung function is a main factor in the way people handle the condition, so what do they do?  Food stores open everywhere, but you can't go to the gym??  Or they force  outdoor recreation events to close, but you can go and protest anything you want?

"people with dangerous thinking" aren't confined to mask deniers....They are the one's also driving while stoned/drunk...Or not paying child support...you name it....To sit around and b!tch about what people do or don't do is a waste of time...Just live your life and if things bother you about others, then avoid those people whenever it's reasonable to do so...

TFY

[Piddy]

4 hours ago, QuietRiot said:

I have a friend that has a side gig as an "energy worker". Beliefs in the alternative methods of health.  Sadly, she admittedly does not socially distant with dating prospects and even invites friends over to her place for game night...maskless of course.

She thinks this is all FEAR -based and fear leads to a lowered immunity, and thusly, catching the virus. She also believes the, yep....the 5G networks are also an issue. I had to cease conversations with her on this topic because I thought she was intelligent enough NOT to believe in such things. It's amazing how this whole thing has driven even our social lives to split up.

This is tin foil hat stuff.  Mike Tyson famously said,  "everyone has a plan till they get punched in the mouth."  So to take a little liberty with that quote. I'd say everyone can have their own nutty opinions, till reality punches them in the mouth.

In this case and others like it, I'm afraid until she or someone she knows contacts Covid, then she'll continue to live in an alternate reality where people can make up their own rules of thought.  Fact based or not.

 

 

[Piddy]

3 hours ago, thefooloftheyear said:

1) Dr's are just people....They aren't miracle workers and some aren't all that good, well intentioned, or knowledgable...Yet most people follow their advice right off the cliff..so to speak.....And the science that the medical field bases these theories on, constantly changes and evolves...I don't know how old you are, but there was a time that all the "experts" claimed that eating eggs will kill you and leave you with clogged arteries...That has since changed...I could go on, but you get the point...

 

 

This is why it's called "practicing medicine".  Doctors chose to go to medical school and we didn't.  Of course there's good and bad doctors like any other field. There's many medical conditions that have evolved just in our lifetime. 

One is ulcers.  In our lifetime we've seen the conventional wisdom of the cause of ulcers change and they now know they're mostly caused from bacteria.  That wasn't always the case.

The eggs issue was because the yolk contains cholesterol and high cholesterol is not good.  Now it's believed eating eggs several times a week does not increase your cholesterol.  And the so called bad cholesterol (LDL) in excess can clog your arteries.

So yeah, science evolves and that's a good thing.  

 

 

Edited August 11, 2020 by Piddy

[Ruby Slippers]

3 hours ago, thefooloftheyear said:

Never underestimate the sheer power of the mind and human will...When harnessed, its been proven to do things that baffles science...One of my aunts, who was very outspoken and opiniated lived her entire life and never once taken even an aspirin or anti biotic...She had a very strong will and a belief system that differed from traditional medical advice....She relentlessly studied how the human body functioned and only used dietary and homeopathic remedies for any ailments she may have had-which weren't many..She lived a more healthy life than most and died or natural causes at 94...

This is like my mom. She's all about healing through improved diet, activity, and natural supplementation, rarely takes any prescription medication. In her 70s, she's healthier and more active than most women 20 years younger. My dad, on the other hand, wants a pill for every little thing, takes many of them. He's still in great shape for his age, but not quite the picture of health my mom is.

Studies have shown that simple positive thinking and prayer are strongly correlated with faster recovery and better health outcomes.  I also saw some info recently about how people live longer the fewer medications they take. My mom and I have always known this intuitively, which is why we avoid taking medication ongoing. The big medical industry wants ongoing customers, has no interest in teaching people to heal themselves.

Also, OP, it seems clear to me you're fascinated by these woo woo subjects. This is the third thread from you I've seen on similar topics. Always with a critical tone, but your fascination is clear. 

There's tons of free info online about the effectiveness of alternative medicine and all these subjects. Do some searching and you'll find it. 

[mark clemson]

Those who are susceptible to the virus and refuse to take precautions (for whatever reason) are at increased risk of dying from it. Doesn't mean they WILL catch it, or die if they do, just that they have a higher risk of it. The could be alternative health practitioners or regular doctors or religious leaders or just plain old anyone. Virus doesn't care.

Plenty of grocery store workers are still alive, no doubt many of them have been exposed, as have many medical professionals. SOME of these folks did die.

Everyone's part of the problem, it's just to what greater or lesser degree.

I would agree generally that taking care of one's health seems to be paying off these days even more so than normal (via increased resistance to COVID). Not a slam dunk by any means, but helps your probability if you're exposed.

[Angelle]

I have a friend who is trained in Reiki, and she socially distances, wears a mask, etc.

Some of my "woo woo" friends believe it's all a scam, and I've just unfollowed another page on facebook, after they pushed Sweden as an example of everything being fine. From what I've heard, things didn't go so well for Sweden, when it comes to covid. 

[Angelle]

14 minutes ago, enigma32 said:

Well, if it makes you feel any better, I am around 99% or more sure that I won't get Covid. I have been at my same job for 19 years now and never had to take a sick day. I did catch SOMETHING about 6 years ago that lasted a couple days but I was off work anyway. Aside from that, I honestly can't remember the last time I was sick. I just don't get sick. 

Most things hit me hard, so I have to be careful, but my main concern has always been that I might pick up corona, and pass it along to someone who can't handle it. 

I've been making a soup with turmeric, chicken broth, ginger, several other basic soup ingredients, white miso, a little apple cider vinegar, and that's kept me mostly healthy for the last few years. Not completely - I was hit hard with something two years ago. I think it was a parasite that was in the news.

I'm all for alternatives - I take supplements, and am semi-careful with my diet. I also take tylenol for pain, and pay attention to doctors. I've leaned too far in each direction before, and am happy in the middle ground. 

[QuietRiot]

56 minutes ago, enigma32 said:

Well, if it makes you feel any better, I am around 99% or more sure that I won't get Covid. I have been at my same job for 19 years now and never had to take a sick day. I did catch SOMETHING about 6 years ago that lasted a couple days but I was off work anyway. Aside from that, I honestly can't remember the last time I was sick. I just don't get sick. 

I'm sure many can say the same...but I"m not going to get cocky about it. I'm all about erring on the side of caution.

 I'm sure many are saying "I haven't been sick in years", but aren't going to get cocky about it. You can't really rely on that fact as this is a totally new game changer that's coming up against an human that's never been infected with such a thing....EVER.

If you're among groups of people and not wearing masks and social distancing...it can hit pretty hard, regardless if you've never been sick in years. I have people who were cocky about it, and then...they got it...and regretted it deeply. Good friend got it because he admitted to slipping up and not wearing a mask when out and about. Though he wasn't hospitalized, he was miserable feeling for a month.

Don't be that guy. 

 

[Veronica73]

15 minutes ago, enigma32 said:

I follow the guidelines. But then, I am not the most social of guys unless I have a reason to be, so I would be following most of the guidelines anyway. I stopped going to the gym for now too. 

That’s kind of my situation too. I had been going to the gym before mid-march,, but that seems like a very bad idea to me at this point. I don’t think I will going back until there is an effective vaccine, or unless somehow herd immunity basically eliminates it (don’t even fully understand how that works, but it seems like some people think it could happen. I guess that means we beat the virus through mostly population and our immune response?) I don’t know. But whatever. Something needs to change for me to feel comfortable going back to the gym. And I hope something does change sooner than later. Otherwise I may seriously turn into a very dysfunctional hermit. I don’t want to be that.

[QuietRiot]

6 hours ago, enigma32 said:

@Veronica73 I think a lot of us are turning into dysfunctional hermits. 

Yeah, and as a single guy...I'm still tempted to meet with a woman from a site, but I'd feel weird about telling her "we need to be 6 feet a part"., it's like "what's the point"?

[Eternal Sunshine]

Eh, I do beleive most doctors are not that knowledgable. So I do my research and shop around until I find one that is. Science and prescription medication has extended our life span - there is no doubt about that. Natural therapies sometimes work but tend to have a milder effect and are useful when taken in addition to traditional medical treatment.

As for anecdotes, my grandma has just turned 90. She has been taking ton of prescription medication ever since I was a kid. I remember colorful pill boxes so that she doesn't forget any. She still takes care of herself independently.

Edited August 16, 2020 by Eternal Sunshine

[QuietRiot]

On 8/16/2020 at 7:33 PM, Eternal Sunshine said:

Eh, I do beleive most doctors are not that knowledgable. So I do my research and shop around until I find one that is. Science and prescription medication has extended our life span - there is no doubt about that. Natural therapies sometimes work but tend to have a milder effect and are useful when taken in addition to traditional medical treatment.

As for anecdotes, my grandma has just turned 90. She has been taking ton of prescription medication ever since I was a kid. I remember colorful pill boxes so that she doesn't forget any. She still takes care of herself independently.

Wow, and I keep seeing situations where people said they  threw out most of their pills due to changing their lifestyle , eating habits, exercise, etc.

[Acacia98]

39 minutes ago, QuietRiot said:

Wow, and I keep seeing situations where people said they  threw out most of their pills due to changing their lifestyle , eating habits, exercise, etc.

I think the key to this health thing is realizing that we're different from each other. So what works for one person won't necessarily work for another. Then there's also genetics: some people live longer than the average person even if they make terrible life choices. In my own family, my uncle lived significantly longer than some of his sisters even though he was an alcoholic for his entire adult life. His sisters (my aunties) made healthier choices but still developed issues like heart disease.

[QuietRiot]

1 minute ago, Acacia98 said:

I think the key to this health thing is realizing that we're different from each other. So what works for one person won't necessarily work for another. Then there's also genetics: some people live longer than the average person even if they make terrible life choices. In my own family, my uncle lived significantly longer than some of his sisters even though he was an alcoholic for his entire adult life. His sisters (my aunties) made healthier choices but still developed issues like heart disease.

I am wondering though, as an alcoholic, even if he lived....what kind of quality life did he have?

[Acacia98]

19 minutes ago, QuietRiot said:

I am wondering though, as an alcoholic, even if he lived....what kind of quality life did he have?

It certainly wasn't the best. He would have lived a much better life if he'd set aside the alcohol.