How do I deal with an ex who potentially has mental health issues?

[lee179108]

56 minutes ago, Wiseman2 said:

Unfortunately she seems to be on your mind 24/7. You are still hoping they fix her so you'll have a GF.

I know, im hoping she fixes herself to be honest... and at least reaches out like last time. Im not saying id welcome her back straight away... I would take it slow like I've said to her.. but yeah, its been left at a point where she knows she can reach out.. but to discuss everything and not just be friends. 

[lee179108]

Today I took the step of contacting this free councelling organisation myself..  they just talk to you about your problems, mental health and all that...  I know they will just tell me to move on and all that but I dont know, I just did it...  I dont know if my absence will make her miss me, but I know I have to stay silent now and I will.. i don't doubt that. Im just thinking if she had strong feelings for me, which I know for a fact she did based on how she was with me through tough times with her family and other stuff and how I helped her, and also how she missed me through lockdown etc...  that she will reach out at some point. But its a tough one, she hasnt deleted my number anyway. But yeah I feel like i need to talk to someone about the whole thing, take it day by day and just hope that I get better.. its the worst experience of my life relationship wise.. and I dont think she understands what im going through.

[ExpatInItaly]

29 minutes ago, lee179108 said:

Today I took the step of contacting this free councelling organisation myself..  they just talk to you about your problems, mental health and all that...  

That's a good idea. 

They're there to help you untangle all of this. It will take time to learn to live without her and without the constant wondering and over-thinking about what she might or might not be doing. 

[Beachead]

@lee179108

33 minutes ago, lee179108 said:

I dont know if my absence will make her miss me, but I know I have to stay silent now and I will.. i don't doubt that. Im just thinking if she had strong feelings for me, which I know for a fact she did based on how she was with me through tough times with her family and other stuff and how I helped her, and also how she missed me through lockdown etc...  that she will reach out at some point.

I encourage you to avoid temptation of seducing yourself into a fantasy of her coming back to you.   You need to understand your hope is dangerous.  This girl may never come back or contact you again, and just because she does, it won't imply they're genuine reasons or that everything is going to be fine.  People come back for self-serving reasons all the time.  They use their exes.  When they get whatever it s they came for, they then dispose of the person again, leaving the person in even worse pain than before.

Nobody needs to remind you that she broke the relationship up, twice now.  With every subsequent breakup the two of you have,  she will realize, she can come and go when she pleases, which makes it more likely for her to just do it again meaning she's more likely to leave you a 3rd time.  In any case, two breakups are a sign things weren't quite right between you two and even if those two breakups were just about her depression, and nothing else, she will still need an indefinite amount of time and space and freedom to explore herself, and work through her personal problems.   

 Do you think your hope is pragmatic?

3 hours ago, lee179108 said:

I know, im hoping she fixes herself to be honest... and at least reaches out like last time. Im not saying id welcome her back straight away... I would take it slow like I've said to her.. but yeah, its been left at a point where she knows she can reach out.. but to discuss everything and not just be friends. 

 

The way your mind is right now, you'll gladly welcome her back, if she contacted you and you would give her a 3rd shot..not because it would be right for you, but because you are in pain, and her presence would take that pain away.   That's not a mental state that you want to be operating out of, for a 3rd run with her.  You've got some work to do.  Some healing to do.  It's going to take you several months to kick your hope and rediscover how to be happy, find joy, purpose and fulfillment, without her being the reason.  Without her being the central focus.   That is the point where you'll be ready to take her on, a 3rd time.

But before you get there, you've got to understand that you have to kick your hope and set it in your mind that she's not coming back, so that you can work towards letting go to genuinely rediscover life after her, to be ready in the event she ever came back again.

You will get there, but the process will be slow, painful, and real tricky to navigate.  Make sure you constantly check yourself along the way regularly.

Keep up with the councelling though.  That's a good thing.

- Beach

 

Edited September 1, 2020 by Beachead

[lee179108]

9 minutes ago, Beachead said:

@lee179108

I encourage you to avoid temptation of seducing yourself into a fantasy of her coming back to you.   You need to understand your hope is dangerous.  This girl may never come back or contact you again, and just because she does, it won't imply they're genuine reasons or that everything is going to be fine.  People come back for self-serving reasons all the time.  They use their exes.  When they get whatever it s they came for, they then dispose of the person again, leaving the person in even worse pain than before.

Nobody needs to remind you that she broke the relationship up, twice now.  With every subsequent breakup the two of you have,  she will realize, she can come and go when she pleases, which makes it more likely for her to just do it again meaning she's more likely to leave you a 3rd time.  In any case, two breakups are a sign things weren't quite right between you two and even if those two breakups were just about her depression, and nothing else, she will still need an indefinite amount of time and space and freedom to explore herself, and work through her personal problems.   

 Do you think your hope is pragmatic?

 

The way your mind is right now, you'll gladly welcome her back, if she contacted you and you would give her a 3rd shot..not because it would be right for you, but because you are in pain, and her presence would take that pain away.   That's not a mental state that you want to be operating out of, for a 3rd run with her.  You've got some work to do.  Some healing to do.  It's going to take you several months to kick your hope and rediscover how to be happy, find joy, purpose and fulfillment, without her being the reason.  Without her being the central focus.   That is the point where you'll be ready to take her on, a 3rd time.

But before you get there, you've got to understand that you have to kick your hope and set it in your mind that she's not coming back, so that you can work towards letting go to genuinely rediscover life after her, to be ready in the event she ever came back again.

You will get there, but the process will be slow, painful, and real tricky to navigate.  Make sure you constantly check yourself along the way regularly.

Keep up with the councelling though.  That's a good thing.

- Beach

 

Based on the whole story, do you think theres a good chance she may reach out?  just because she has done multiple times before????  Im not asking you this to give me hope im just curious... because friends think she will as before she's never left me alone completely, always reached out at some point but this time to me it feels different and that she wont but i could be totally wrong. When ive backed off and gone silent she has been the type as well to kind of panic and reach out.. im not saying that will happen this time though, but last year after time she missed me and said she wanted me in her life.

[ExpatInItaly]

3 hours ago, lee179108 said:

Based on the whole story, do you think theres a good chance she may reach out?  just because she has done multiple times before???? 

She may, but it probably still won't have the happy ending you're hoping for. 

[Beachead]

3 hours ago, lee179108 said:

Based on the whole story, do you think theres a good chance she may reach out?  just because she has done multiple times before????  Im not asking you this to give me hope im just curious... because friends think she will as before she's never left me alone completely, always reached out at some point but this time to me it feels different and that she wont but i could be totally wrong. When ive backed off and gone silent she has been the type as well to kind of panic and reach out.. im not saying that will happen this time though, but last year after time she missed me and said she wanted me in her life.

She may or she may not.  That's the best I can give you.  It's a 50/50 deal and you won't know if or when it'll happen, because it'll all depend on exogenous variables, that you are not in control of.  You ready to bank your hope on a risk like that?

Entertaining the possibility that she does come back:

1. Her feelings and words have already proven to be extremely unreliable in the past.  Ask yourself, could you honestly trust whatever she attempts to tell you or promise you by then?  Could you trust her not to break your heart a 3rd time?  Do you think you could go through all this again, floating in limbo?

2.  Whatever issues broke you two up the first time (And it was more than just her depression), will still be there, unaddressed.

3. Everytime you take her back after a breakup, you just show her she can come and go as she pleases, without losing you, making her more comfortable and confident  enough to do it a 3rd time.

Ofcourse logic never stopped me from holding onto hope back in the day.  It's a natural thing to do, when you're inexperienced.  I was in too much pain at the time to deal with my reality, and the lie I told myself was so much more alluring, so I dove head-first into it, and lived in that world for as long as I could until I couldn't anymore.  Well, lies don't last and the truth always resurfaces and in the end, it's all you end up seeing, which makes it too difficult and too painful to hold on, any longer.  So, you let go, because it makes sense.  That is, the process. 

Once you go through a couple of these, as I did, you learn about yourself and that process, and you stop panicking.  You stop wasting your own time, bullsh*tting yourself and you just get right down to the point, that your relationship is over.  If they were going to be convinced into staying and being with you, it should have happened in the relationship, when you two were together.  And so, you bite your tongue, you wish them well, and you walk away..and you suffer it out in silence.  It'll hurt for as long as it hurts, you let it be, you live your life, and take care yourself.  With time,  and internal and external work, you find yourself, one day, waking up, and realizing, you feel better and that's when you know you'll be alright.  Some people you get over completely.  Some you don't.   But you'll be okay.

- Beach

 

 

 

 

 

Edited September 1, 2020 by Beachead

[lee179108]

15 minutes ago, Beachead said:

She may or she may not.  That's the best I can give you.  It's a 50/50 deal and you won't know if or when it'll happen, because it'll all depend on exogenous variables, that you are not in control of.  You ready to bank your hope on a risk like that?

Entertaining the possibility that she does come back:

1. Her feelings and words have already proven to be extremely unreliable in the past.  Ask yourself, could you honestly trust whatever she attempts to tell you or promise you by then?  Could you trust her not to break your heart a 3rd time?  Do you think you could go through all this again, floating in limbo?

2.  Whatever issues broke you two up the first time (And it was more than just her depression), will still be there, unaddressed.

3. Everytime you take her back after a breakup, you just show her she can come and go as she pleases, without losing you, making her more comfortable and confident  enough to do it a 3rd time.

Ofcourse logic never stopped me from holding onto hope back in the day.  It's a natural thing to do, when you're inexperienced.  I was in too much pain at the time to deal with my reality, and the lie I told myself was so much more alluring, so I dove head-first into it, and lived in that world for as long as I could until I couldn't anymore.  Well, lies don't last and the truth always resurfaces and in the end, it's all you end up seeing, which makes it too difficult and too painful to hold on, any longer.  So, you let go, because it makes sense.  That is, the process. 

Once you go through a couple of these, as I did, you learn about yourself and that process, and you stop panicking.  You stop wasting your own time, bullsh*tting yourself and you just get right down to the point, that your relationship is over.  If they were going to be convinced into staying and being with you, it should have happened in the relationship, when you two were together.  And so, you bite your tongue, you wish them well, and you walk away..and you suffer it out in silence.  It'll hurt for as long as it hurts, you let it be, you live your life, and take care yourself.  With time,  and internal and external work, you find yourself, one day, waking up, and realizing, you feel better and that's when you know you'll be alright.  Some people you get over completely.  Some you don't.   But you'll be okay.

- Beach

 

 

 

 

 

Thank you, I mean when I've broken up with someone and they put statuses etc up i never even bothered to look at them.. she will look at mine. Although it may or may not mean anything... I do think shes the type to wonder more with silence. 

[ExpatInItaly]

6 minutes ago, lee179108 said:

Thank you, I mean when I've broken up with someone and they put statuses etc up i never even bothered to look at them.. she will look at mine. Although it may or may not mean anything... I do think shes the type to wonder more with silence. 

Do you genuinely think a third attempt at a relationship would be successful?

[lee179108]

3 minutes ago, ExpatInItaly said:

Do you genuinely think a third attempt at a relationship would be successful?

Although I dont think it will happen again,  if it was to i think shed talk a lot about her mental health and what she learnt from councelling... but i highly doubt she will reach out again..

[ExpatInItaly]

2 hours ago, lee179108 said:

Although I dont think it will happen again,  if it was to i think shed talk a lot about her mental health and what she learnt from councelling... but i highly doubt she will reach out again..

No, what I meant was this: let’s say she reaches out, you two start talking, maybe getting a little closer, all the things you’re currently hoping for. 

Do you think you two would still wind up happily ever after? Do you really feel she wouldn’t break your heart a third time?

You’re not really seeing the forest for the trees here, is what I’m getting at. 

 

[Beachead]

@lee179108

Quote

I do think shes the type to wonder more with silence. 

Yes but so what?  If she gets together with you again, how does she prove her promises/words mean something when they fell short?  How does she earn your trust?   She had you.  She dumped you.  She came back to you and had you again..and then she dumped you again.  Everytime this happened, she thought it was what she wanted.  She's only shown unreliability and if you're not willing to admit that to yourself right now, your anxiety and distrust will do it for you, if you two were ever together again.

Her reasons are good for her, but its ultimately your heart being driven through the mud.  Ask yourself?  Is it fun being in pain all the time, struggling to get through the minutes and not look at your phone.  Struggling to get a decent sleep?   She is the cause of that.  And although there is a lot to learn in the recovery process, that process is still time and energy out of your life.  It's a slow process and the longer you refuse to let go, remain in contact, or try again with her, the more possible opportunities you miss out on, being with someone else who would have valued what you had to give and fight to keep it.

- Beach

 

 

Edited September 2, 2020 by Beachead

[lee179108]

6 hours ago, Beachead said:

@lee179108

Yes but so what?  If she gets together with you again, how does she prove her promises/words mean something when they fell short?  How does she earn your trust?   She had you.  She dumped you.  She came back to you and had you again..and then she dumped you again.  Everytime this happened, she thought it was what she wanted.  She's only shown unreliability and if you're not willing to admit that to yourself right now, your anxiety and distrust will do it for you, if you two were ever together again.

Her reasons are good for her, but its ultimately your heart being driven through the mud.  Ask yourself?  Is it fun being in pain all the time, struggling to get through the minutes and not look at your phone.  Struggling to get a decent sleep?   She is the cause of that.  And although there is a lot to learn in the recovery process, that process is still time and energy out of your life.  It's a slow process and the longer you refuse to let go, remain in contact, or try again with her, the more possible opportunities you miss out on, being with someone else who would have valued what you had to give and fight to keep it.

- Beach

 

 

I honestly cant answer how she proves her worth again... especially since I dont think she will ever reach out again, like I said if she does I will let you all know. I just keep thinking oh this week shes back in work, yesterday she started councelling. In 2 weeks its her birthday... will me staying silent make her crack.... I dont know, there was genuine love there and especially though the things we did and how we supported each other. I just dont know if she will ever reflect on that and want to reach out after clear distance.

[ExpatInItaly]

I think that honestly, this is done. 

You two have tried twice, and both times she's backed away and broken up with you. And even she "cracks" and reaches out? A third attempt is likely to bring exactly the same result. It would only be a matter of time until she withdraws and leaves again. On-off relationships nearly always off for good, sooner or later. One person either gets sick of being treated that way, or the flighty party eventually just loses interest altogether and moves on to the next person. 

Not a pleasant thought to think, I know. But you have to also start getting real with yourself about the long-term prospects of a relationship like this. There's a reason very few couples with this much chaos make it in the end. 

[Beachead]

@lee179108

5 hours ago, lee179108 said:

I honestly cant answer how she proves her worth again...

Because she can't.  How can she?  She has broken your trust.  And therein lies the problem Lee.  

Its going to be up to you to put the past behind you, and have faith in her, to not burn you again, should you try again.  And if you choose to that, then you will need to let go of any feelings associated with her past actions; any resentment, anxiety.  If you guys start going through problems again, hanging the past over her head, either to evaluate who she currently is, or using it as a weapon to guilt her, will kill your relationship.  All of that has to go and you'll have to treat this 3rd run as its own thing.  That is a tall order. 

Do you think you have that in you?  

These are the things that matter.  This is what's real.  And this is what you'll have to consider and acknowledge to be prepared.

It's fun and easier to fantasize over an old flame returning to our arms and everything ending happily ever after, without ever considering the challenge/difficulties that might arise in the actual reality of such a situation.   ..but in doing so, you may be surprised by how ill-prepared you are, if it actually happens.

- Beach

 

[lee179108]

So I found out yesterday I got a new job, Ironically not too far from where she lives...  i did a status on whatsapp about it and she then messaged me saying congratulations on your new job, i said thank you then she said youre going to do great, i then said yes definitely and she said i am proud of you. I then said thank you again and we left it at that... Again why reach out like that if we are broken up, she knows I dont want to be friends and wont.  I was thinking of messaging her tonight saying 'missing you' but i get that may seem needy etc...   my thinking was it may put a thought in her head and reflect over time, then when i dont message her on her birthday at least she knows the last thing i said was that i miss her..   whereas if i stay quiet and not message her, not even on her birthday then that may make her think oh hes moved on ok then whatever....  my head is so messed right now i dont know what to do.. I mean even if i sent that message how much worse can it get?

[ExpatInItaly]

You're underestimating the power of guilt. 

She doesn't dislike you, she knows she hurt you, and is probably just trying to extend an olive branch and soothe her own conscience for causing you pain. Don't send her a "missing you" message. Her message to you wasn't an invitation to try to open that dialogue again, and yes, it will seem very needy. She knows you miss her. This is why exes trying to be friendly so soon after a break-up just doesn't work. The dumper often doesn't realize (or sometimes just doesn't care) how a few words from them give their exes all sorts of mixed messages and send them into an emotional tailspin. 

Whether you stay silent or not isn't even the point anymore. The relationship ended because she wanted it to, so what you do (or don't do) isn't going to make much difference. It's too broken for your silence (or even lack thereof) to have a significant effect on the outcome. If she cared that much about the idea of you moving on, well, she wouldn't have let you go to begin with. 

[Beachead]

@lee179108

1 hour ago, lee179108 said:

So I found out yesterday I got a new job, Ironically not too far from where she lives...  i did a status on whatsapp about it and she then messaged me saying congratulations on your new job, i said thank you then she said youre going to do great, i then said yes definitely and she said i am proud of you. I then said thank you again and we left it at that... Again why reach out like that if we are broken up, she knows I dont want to be friends and wont.  I was thinking of messaging her tonight saying 'missing you' but i get that may seem needy etc...   my thinking was it may put a thought in her head and reflect over time, then when i dont message her on her birthday at least she knows the last thing i said was that i miss her..   whereas if i stay quiet and not message her, not even on her birthday then that may make her think oh hes moved on ok then whatever....  my head is so messed right now i dont know what to do.. I mean even if i sent that message how much worse can it get?

I feel for you man but I know this is a valuable experience for you.  If you blocked her on whatsapp, she wouldn't have been see that status and contact you and you wouldn't feel this pain and confusion you feel.   So now you understand from experience,  why pulling her off social media is important. 

Recall, you reluctantly let go of the relationship.  You didn't want this. She wanted this.  She's leading this, knowing why and what she wants from it, while you're stuck at mercy of following her lead, not knowing her intentions.  And that generates so much anxiety.  Anxiety keeps your mind stuck on her which stops you from healing.

Like Expat said, she doesn't dislike you, but she also doesn't want to be with you.   If she wanted to be with you, she'd be with you.  Her messages don't mean what you want it to mean.  It has more to do with her wanting to be polite and cordial with you.  It's for her conscious.  Maybe for the guilt she might feel.  It's more so for her, and less for you.  She may or may not realize how much she is hurting you.

But this is where you have to make the tough calls for yourself and do what's best for you...because she's not going to do that.  Nobody will look out for your well-being except for you.  What's best for you is you've got to block her.  Atleast on Whatsapp.  You need space and distance and her out of sight, out of mind..to heal yourself.  You do not want her to see you breaking apart.   Whatever she feels about that is her own problem.  She's the one that broke it off.  She doesn't get to keep you around in whatever way she wants.   If she wanted out, she loses you altogether.  

Do not tell her you miss her or fall apart in front of her.  She won't respect you for it.  She will pity you (Despite her being the cause of it).

Your short responses were good but leave it as that.  Block her on Whatsapp.  Grieve without her seeing you suffer.  

- Beach

 

 

Edited September 3, 2020 by Beachead

[lee179108]

11 minutes ago, Beachead said:

@lee179108

I feel for you man but I know this is a valuable experience for you.  If you blocked her on whatsapp, she wouldn't have been see that status and contact you and you wouldn't feel this pain and confusion you feel.   So now you understand from experience,  why pulling her off social media is important. 

Recall, you reluctantly let go of the relationship.  You didn't want this. She wanted this.  She's leading this, knowing why and what she wants from it, while you're stuck at mercy of following her lead, not knowing her intentions.  And that generates so much anxiety.  Anxiety keeps your mind stuck on her which stops you from healing.

Like Expat said, she doesn't dislike you, but she also doesn't want to be with you.   If she wanted to be with you, she'd be with you.  Her messages don't mean what you want it to mean.  It has more to do with her wanting to be polite and cordial with you.  It's for her conscious.  Maybe for the guilt she might feel.  It's more so for her, and less for you.  She may or may not realize how much she is hurting you.

But this is where you have to make the tough calls for yourself and do what's best for you...because she's not going to do that.  Nobody will look out for your well-being except for you.  What's best for you is you've got to block her.  Atleast on Whatsapp.  You need space and distance and her out of sight, out of mind..to heal yourself.  You do not want her to see you breaking apart.   Whatever she feels about that is her own problem.  She's the one that broke it off.  She doesn't get to keep you around in whatever way she wants.   If she wanted out, she loses you altogether.  

Do not tell her you miss her or fall apart in front of her.  She won't respect you for it.  She will pity you (Despite her being the cause of it).

Your short responses were good but leave it as that.  Block her on Whatsapp.  Grieve without her seeing you suffer.  

- Beach

 

 

Yeah I just cannot block her, and as stupid as you may think I am I wont block her...    i left the door open last week when she said all this and told her to talk to me about her experience and everything when shes better mentally and then we can see where we are both at in life and if we want to take it slow or not... she then didnt reply until yesterday about my job offer and i was short..  

The texting her saying i miss her is a tough choice, and so far i think i will stick to my guns and not message her. I know you guys say its all over and theres no hope etc.. but let me ask you this... if there is a slight chance of her reaching out in future and wanting to talk to me....  is not messaging her at all better than sending her that small text???  making her think ive moved on?  like i said my thinking behind it was if i said 'missing you' it would make her reflect and think the same maybe, and when her birthday comes and she doesnt hear from me then at least she knows my last text was to say i miss her...    If i do say it Id expect her to just read it and not reply.. at the moment anyway. I dont think she knows how much im suffering.. she cant know. 

[Beachead]

@lee179108

Quote

Yeah I just cannot block her, and as stupid as you may think I am I wont block her...    i left the door open last week when she said all this and told her to talk to me about her experience and everything when shes better mentally and then we can see where we are both at in life and if we want to take it slow or not... she then didnt reply until yesterday about my job offer and i was short..  

I'm going to make this very clear to you, very bluntly.  And I apologize for it.

Nobody thinks you're stupid.  But you are in denial about your situation, and nothing anyone tells you here or in any immediate future, is going to click with you, until some indefinite period of time goes by (Of her not talking to you or her messing with you through breadcrumbing) before you grow tired and put an end to it.  Life isn't romantic film, where if you stay and fight for the girl, she'll see the light and run back into your arms.  The reality in staying and being available to a person who has willingly broken up with you, only teaches them you can't live without them.  Knowing they have that power over you, they begin to lose respect for you and devalue you.  They start to feel sorry for you.  You consequently destroy any chance you would have because they learn, they will never lose you.   And although it's sweet and commendable and noble, its not attractive and its damaging.  

Leaving is not about playing games or proving to her how independent you are to her or you abandoning her.  You're leaving because its the only way you can heal yourself, given the decision she took to breakup with you.  To rid your resentment and anxiety of not being able to live without her.  To feel strong on your own. To feel clearer about things and more positive about life.    And only through this, can you heal, grow and become a better version of yourself.  But its for YOU.  Because you care about you.

Right now, you are pretending you're already there, attempting to carefully construct responses to her message.  While may be fooling her, you're only wasting your own time because you're evidently breaking down piece by piece, not healing, not moving forward, not growing and changing...but damaging yourself.  If she ever decided to return to you, you'd  be the same person you were in the relationship, but now with added anxiety, pain and resentment that you didn't work through and heal, on your own when you should have.  You won't have the strength, clarity or maturity to handle a 3rd run with her.

So if you want the best shot at being with her, then let her go and get on with your life. 

 

She congratulated you on your job, because the door was open, which you left open.    That was your choice and your choice caused YOU pain.  You need to own that responsibility.   And why did she contact you?  Because she can.  Because you allow it.  You don't want friendship but you demonstrate that you do by sticking around.  Stop obscuring your intentions to remain in contact, because of care for her, when its really because its too difficult to let go.  It's self-deceit.  You stay because the only thing you care about in this moment, is to get back together with her.  You're not really concerned nor do you care about who she is, what she wants or what she needs or where her head is at..you just want to soothe your anxiety and pain, and have her back in your arms.  You want to fantasize the version you wished she could be.  Not who she is.  She's no longer a person to you, but a object of desire.  A fix to an addict, who is struggling with his withdrawal.   And at this point, you don't care if you destroy yourself in the process.

2 hours ago, lee179108 said:

but let me ask you this... if there is a slight chance of her reaching out in future and wanting to talk to me....  is not messaging her at all better than sending her that small text???

Your silence and absence will do more for you and your chances, than your presence ever could at this point.  But as I said, it has to genuinely be for you.  Not for her.

- Beach

 

Edited September 3, 2020 by Beachead

[ExpatInItaly]

2 hours ago, lee179108 said:

if there is a slight chance of her reaching out in future and wanting to talk to me....  is not messaging her at all better than sending her that small text???  

Yes. 

Let me tell you why. She isn't going to worry you've moved on. We ladies don't break up with men if we really care deeply that he might move on, trust me (barring something awful like abuse or cheating in which we might be essentially forced to dump a guy) If she doesn't hear from you, and you hear nothing from her either, you will know that she has moved on. If she does get in touch, it won't be just because she's responding to you. However, you still need to be extremely careful if she ever does reach out of her own volition, as she doesn't have a good track record for not hurting you. 

Something else to consider, even if you don't want to hear it: she's mentioned another guy she has ("had") feelings for. I know she minimized that and said she cut him off but she might be well be exploring something with him now. In spite of everything she's told you about being single, and needing to work on herself and what not...dumpers are not always honest about these things.  How will you feel later if you send her this "I miss you" message and come to find out she's been spending time with another guy? 

The problem you're struggling with is that you're speculating how she might feel (if you send/don't send a message) through your lens, as the dumpee who wants this relationship back. You're not seeing it through the eyes of the person who's chosen to let go of you, twice. She isn't pining for the relationship the way you are, to be blunt. You would want to hear "I miss you" and you would worry she's moved on, but you're also not the dumper. 

I can't know what's going through her mind right now, of course. But I'll share this: I once broke up with a boyfriend I cared about very much, but no longer wanted to be with romantically (we'd been together around 5 years) I had once seen a future with him, but I came to realize that over time, I just didn't have the right feelings for him anymore. It pained me terribly to end it, but I had to. I felt awful. He too sent me emotional messages sometimes, which made me feel even more guilty. I naively thought we could at least still be friendly (I was a lot younger and more inexperienced then!) so I accepted his invitations to grab dinner, or coffee or go for a walk. When I finally took my head out of my backside and realized this was sending him all the wrong messages and causing him more stress, I put an end to it. He thought we were on the path to reconciliation, I thought we had a nice "friendship" going. Months later, I met the guy who would become my next long-term boyfriend. My ex was not happy, as he really thought we could get back together. I felt bad about that for a long time after, but I learned my lesson. 

I share that just to shed some light on what goes through a dumper's mind, and the mistakes they sometimes make, when they've ended a relationship. 

[lee179108]

21 hours ago, ExpatInItaly said:

Yes. 

Let me tell you why. She isn't going to worry you've moved on. We ladies don't break up with men if we really care deeply that he might move on, trust me (barring something awful like abuse or cheating in which we might be essentially forced to dump a guy) If she doesn't hear from you, and you hear nothing from her either, you will know that she has moved on. If she does get in touch, it won't be just because she's responding to you. However, you still need to be extremely careful if she ever does reach out of her own volition, as she doesn't have a good track record for not hurting you. 

Something else to consider, even if you don't want to hear it: she's mentioned another guy she has ("had") feelings for. I know she minimized that and said she cut him off but she might be well be exploring something with him now. In spite of everything she's told you about being single, and needing to work on herself and what not...dumpers are not always honest about these things.  How will you feel later if you send her this "I miss you" message and come to find out she's been spending time with another guy? 

The problem you're struggling with is that you're speculating how she might feel (if you send/don't send a message) through your lens, as the dumpee who wants this relationship back. You're not seeing it through the eyes of the person who's chosen to let go of you, twice. She isn't pining for the relationship the way you are, to be blunt. You would want to hear "I miss you" and you would worry she's moved on, but you're also not the dumper. 

I can't know what's going through her mind right now, of course. But I'll share this: I once broke up with a boyfriend I cared about very much, but no longer wanted to be with romantically (we'd been together around 5 years) I had once seen a future with him, but I came to realize that over time, I just didn't have the right feelings for him anymore. It pained me terribly to end it, but I had to. I felt awful. He too sent me emotional messages sometimes, which made me feel even more guilty. I naively thought we could at least still be friendly (I was a lot younger and more inexperienced then!) so I accepted his invitations to grab dinner, or coffee or go for a walk. When I finally took my head out of my backside and realized this was sending him all the wrong messages and causing him more stress, I put an end to it. He thought we were on the path to reconciliation, I thought we had a nice "friendship" going. Months later, I met the guy who would become my next long-term boyfriend. My ex was not happy, as he really thought we could get back together. I felt bad about that for a long time after, but I learned my lesson. 

I share that just to shed some light on what goes through a dumper's mind, and the mistakes they sometimes make, when they've ended a relationship. 

I get what you're saying on this... and it could be possible but I will never know unless she tells me...    BUT..  shes said shes staying single for the near future and to work on her mental health. I would be surprised if this happened as she is super close to her mom who knows literally everything about what she does..  i think her mom and her family would be shocked if she just dumped me and got with another guy, as they loved me as a partner for her more than anyone before.. but like i said i dont know.. but it would be a shock if she did. I dont know if she will reach out again, im highly doubtful but i know now that i cannot say anything more to her and i will remain quiet... even on her birthday.. she only started back in work this week so shes getting back into the routine of that. Its kind of similar to last year, before she started the job she had this mindset of being alone, focusing on her new job and thats it...  she got into the swing of it and the first few weeks she was clear she did not want a relationship, told me to move on and more.. 2 months go by and she missed me after reflecting...   im not saying thats going to happen again but theres bound to be a point where she does think something of me. Weather she will reach out or not i dont know.... but she knows what the last thing i said to her was and she knows i wont settle for friends. 

[Beachead]

@lee179108

She dumped you because she wasn't feeling it.  If she was, she'd be with you.  

Edited September 4, 2020 by Beachead

[ExpatInItaly]

On 9/4/2020 at 9:21 PM, Beachead said:

@lee179108

She dumped you because she wasn't feeling it.  If she was, she'd be with you.  

This is a basic (albeit painful) truth you need to remember, OP. 

Stop making excuses for her, and stop making excuses for yourself to hang on. It's very hard not to do this when we're in the thick of an unwanted break-up, but the best thing we can do for ourselves is confront the pain head-on and realize that if someone really wants you in their life, they're not going to opt out.

[Beachead]

@ExpatInItaly @lee179108

Quote

if someone really wants you in their life, they're not going to opt out.

Yep.   True, we don't know what were reasons are for sure, but we don't need to know for sure.  You just have to apply a little intuition and sense to it, to understand, the significance of a breakup and how powerful of message it is sending.

Your ex had you in every way a person who'd want a relationship with someone, would appreciate; intimately, physically, emotionally etc.  All she had to do was be in that relationship and you two would have likely married and had a life together and everything would have been right.  But she let you go even though letting you go would mean you would likely end up with someone else.  That you'd have sex with someone else.  Have children with someone else.  And she'd no longer be in your life.   She was willing to accept that.

Ordinarily, this is the stuff of a tragic nightmare to anyone who sees a future with someone else.  

How you'd feel if she moved on with someone else?  I know for a fact the idea of my exes being with someone new, devastated me.  When you want the relationship, you don't choose out of it.  You choose into it.   ..and your ex, Lee, has chosen out of it more than once  by her dumping you twice and allowing herself to catch feelings for someone new.  

She might come back and you two may get back together, and as happy as you may be for a short while,  it doesn't change the above.  So at some point again, all of that will once again show its ugly face, and you'll be back to dealing with all this.   

This is all painful to accept which is why it takes many people, months to come to acceptance of it.  For all my experience having been on the receiving end of being dumped, I'd still struggle with my thoughts.  Breakups will always be difficult.  But what I tell you above, helps cut the bs out, and get you right to the point, so that you can just get on with the crappy process.

For now, I know you don't even want to think about it.  You just want to fantasize thoughts of her returning to you.  Do what you need to do and you'll figure it out when you do.

- Beach

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

Edited September 6, 2020 by Beachead