Glad to see life is almost back to normal, but how?

[Spring1234]

My news station barely talks about the virus anymore. As soon as something else is in the news the virus isn't really talked about, first were the protests, now are the conventions. 

I have been pleasantly surprised how things have gone almost back to normal without spikes. I live in PA and outdoor dining, some indoor dining, outdoor bars, stores, gyms, hair salons, nail salons, day cares, graduation, casinos, birthday parties, you name it everywhere is opened. Our shore towns have been packed without people wearing masks since May. I m shocked our cases aren't higher. We have about 600-750 cases a day which I don't think is bad considering everyone is everywhere. They haven't spiked. 

I don't understand how there are no outrageous spikes, hospitals full and higher cases? I guess masks make all the difference? I don't hear any outbreaks at casinos, Vegas, Disneyworld, even sports teams aren't having cases anymore. Planes are fine and have always been fine. Colleges are the only things I hear about. 

In the beginning you were hearing about hair salons, nail salons, other places having outbreaks, but not anymore. Why?? What happened to this contagious virus. I thought not everyone wears masks and I thought you can still get it from surfaces. All these places opened and everything is fine?? I don't get it. I thought it was insane when these places reopened and anyone who went had a death wish, well I guess I'm the one who overreacted and has egg on my face. I like made a fool of myself telling my family and friends how bad this is and they shouldn't go anywhere but essential places. I just am tired of staying home when nobody else is and are pretty much fine. I know some people are getting sick, but now it seems rare to get it or get that badly sick. Sports players were just asymptomatic. I'm not saying I will go to some huge party, but seems like everyday life can return. 

I guess  it's good everything opened. I see so many people with their noses out of their masks and the sanitizing has reduced though. 

Also what happened to Florida and Texas?? They were so bad how did they get better? Didn't thousands of people keep spreading it to thousands of people??

I don't understand this virus and honestly I don't think anyone does. 

[Wiseman2]

It's up to you personally to inform and protect yourself. Make your decision based on your own best understanding about it.

Take whatever risks you are willing to take. Whether that's from defiance ignorance or following the wrong herd off the cliff.

[basil67]

Why aren't you hearing about sources anymore?   Because there aren't enough contact tracers to trace the sources of your 650 to 700 new daily cases. The number of cases is so high that nobody knows where the infections are coming from. 

You were absolutely right to be wary - your state has had about 7,500 COVID deaths.    To put it in perspective, I live in NSW, Australia and we've had 52 COVID deaths. 

And that your radio doesn't report information doesn't mean there's no information to report.  

 

 

Edited August 23, 2020 by basil67

[schlumpy]

Remember that you, your family and friends are individuals while the virus warnings are based on large groups of people. The individual experience will always vary from the large group as a whole.

I imagine if you could look at every covid case and build an infection map, it would look much like a forest fire that jumps from area to area leaving many stands of woods untouched. I personally do not anyone that has or had Covid or anyone that has died from it. I do read and hear about it daily. My state map is still colored in bright red especially where I live.

I think the experts and their computer models predicted over 2 million deaths in the US when the reaction to the virus was getting into gear. A lot of public officials response and warnings were based on this obviously erroneous scientific guess.

Yes, things are returning to normal. Every time I leave the house I can feel it and see it but there is also the psychological remnant of fear. I feel that also.

[QuietRiot]

6 hours ago, Spring1234 said:

My news station barely talks about the virus anymore. As soon as something else is in the news the virus isn't really talked about, first were the protests, now are the conventions. 

I have been pleasantly surprised how things have gone almost back to normal without spikes. I live in PA and outdoor dining, some indoor dining, outdoor bars, stores, gyms, hair salons, nail salons, day cares, graduation, casinos, birthday parties, you name it everywhere is opened. Our shore towns have been packed without people wearing masks since May. I m shocked our cases aren't higher. We have about 600-750 cases a day which I don't think is bad considering everyone is everywhere. They haven't spiked. 

I don't understand how there are no outrageous spikes, hospitals full and higher cases? I guess masks make all the difference? I don't hear any outbreaks at casinos, Vegas, Disneyworld, even sports teams aren't having cases anymore. Planes are fine and have always been fine. Colleges are the only things I hear about. 

In the beginning you were hearing about hair salons, nail salons, other places having outbreaks, but not anymore. Why?? What happened to this contagious virus. I thought not everyone wears masks and I thought you can still get it from surfaces. All these places opened and everything is fine?? I don't get it. I thought it was insane when these places reopened and anyone who went had a death wish, well I guess I'm the one who overreacted and has egg on my face. I like made a fool of myself telling my family and friends how bad this is and they shouldn't go anywhere but essential places. I just am tired of staying home when nobody else is and are pretty much fine. I know some people are getting sick, but now it seems rare to get it or get that badly sick. Sports players were just asymptomatic. I'm not saying I will go to some huge party, but seems like everyday life can return. 

I guess  it's good everything opened. I see so many people with their noses out of their masks and the sanitizing has reduced though. 

Also what happened to Florida and Texas?? They were so bad how did they get better? Didn't thousands of people keep spreading it to thousands of people??

I don't understand this virus and honestly I don't think anyone does. 

Well, there has been a downward trend...so...but the schools just started today here in Florida (first day) so we'll see what happens.

Even I"m getting this vibe that it may be okay to let your guard down a bit and hang out with a handful of friends.

Edited August 23, 2020 by QuietRiot

[QuietRiot]

Where I live...Florida...after the theme parks opened...time passed, and reports on Disney and other places ceased. I had to GOOGLE "Covid cases in Disney" to see if they had to shut things down...like with the universities.

Guess what, no cases were reported...obviously due to mask requirements and other measures, so....*Shrug* go figure.

[Eternal Sunshine]

Wow. I live in Australia (VIC) and we now have 200 cases a day. We are not allowed to leave 5km radius of our home and can only leave house for an hour a day for exercise. There is also a curfew between 8pm and 5am. Absolutely everything is closed and our state is under "State of disaster". Just to put your 700 cases of day "being nothing" in prospective. 

I certainly wouldn't be OK with relaxing in your situation. I can't believe how lax US is and is just ignoring the body count.

[Els]

Masks make some difference but wearing masks is NOT a replacement for social distancing.

Frankly I suspect that your state just isn't taking things seriously and they aren't testing, so the numbers you see are only the severely ill ones and there are many cases that don't show up in the numbers. If everything is "business as normal", I'm sure the govt isn't knocking door-to-door doing blitz tests and I guess people aren't coming forward to get tested if they're not heavily symptomatic.

[Spring1234]

Thanks for the replies! Okay so I guess contact tracing or as much testing isn't happening. 

I know of 2 people who died from it, both in their 80's and they were someone I went to elementary school's grandfather and a coworker of my dad's mom. My friend's cousins who are in their 50's were in icu and friend's in law had a mild case. 

I just want to go out and do things again like everyone else, but I am still worried like I could be the one to get sick. 

Yes America stinks and nobody really cares here. 

I just find it still surprising hospitals are fine and I don't hear about more people I know getting sick. I see my friends and family on Facebook and I hear they're out and about and everyone is fine thankfully. 

I just thought this virus was so contagious. I can't believe casino workers and Disney employees aren't having outbreaks. It just doesn't make sense to me. I would like to know one way or another about how risky doing things are.

I feel like there's barely any guidance anymore.

[gaius]

Having everyone wear a mask, especially an N95 or surgical one, is a very effective way at blunting transmission. From what I understand it's also a lot harder to transmit outside vs inside.

I'm still not going to places where someone might have their mouth uncovered indoors, like indoor dining at restaurants. But places where masks are required 100% of the time and people are abiding by the rules are pretty safe at this point. So keep your mask on and enjoy a round of bowling, get a haircut, even hit the beach if it's not crowded to the point you can't keep some space between you and other people.

 

[gamon]

Things are not anywhere close to being back to normal. At least, probably not. So little is known about this virus however most of the so-called experts are in agreement that it will be a year or two or even more before the virus is controlled, and it probably will never be eradicated.

Problem is there's a lot of people who would rather pretend everything is ok and/or they're just sick and tired of being restricted and/or they're facing economic destruction so they HAVE to act like it's business as usual.

Numbers are dropping in some areas where they were high but they're going up in others, including areas that once had reasonably good control of the situation.

 

 

 

[pepperbird2]

The virus has pretty much gone form here, except for one death which was travel related (someone ignored the rule and decided to take a vacation-they returned, got sick and passed away)

How dangerous the virus is seems to depend on who you talk to. It's apparently dangerous enough to keep unis. closed for in person classes, to allow government employees to stay home at full pay, and to keep the borders closed form the USA - but only if you're driving.

It's not dangerous enough for the universities to cancel protests or close their residences for international students or to keep public schools closed. International flights are permitted. It's also not expected to be dangerous enough to keep the CERB payments coming- that's being shifted to unemployment instead.

I'm not sure what my government's going to do. It's not sustainable to keep the CERB payments  going or to keep paying government employees who say they can't go to work because they are "vulnerable" to sit home and do nothing and not be able to hire someone to fill in their position. It's not sustainable, and I can see those people being told they will ether need to return to work or apply for a disability allowance. The upside is that might bring some attention to the abysmally low rate that's currently allotted to people who really can't work because they are disabled.

 

Edited August 23, 2020 by pepperbird2

[basil67]

Regarding where the outbreaks are happening, because we have good contact tracing in Australia, we've found that pubs, clubs and restaurants are great spreaders of the disease.   You may not be hearing about it, but it doesn't mean it's not happening.   

[basil67]

17 minutes ago, pepperbird2 said:

How dangerous the virus is seems to depend on who you talk to. It's apparently dangerous enough to keep unis. closed for in person classes, to allow government employees to stay home at full pay, and to keep the borders closed form the USA - but only if you're driving.

It's not dangerous enough for the universities to cancel protests or close their residences for international students or to keep public schools closed. International flights are permitted. It's also not expected to be dangerous enough to keep the CERB payments coming- that's being shifted to unemployment instead.

It's dangerous enough here that all our borders are closed, including some state borders being closed to adjacent states.   Many expats are unable to return home and those who do make it home must go into 14 day, guarded quarantine at their own cost.   Universities have ceased face to face learning except when a course has a practical element which cannot be done at home.  Protests are cancelled and there's no international students.

[QuietRiot]

What's interesting, theaters have announced they are opening up again...provided Covid protocols are in place...so...no worries? 

[BaileyB]

Is life really getting back to normal? We’ve enjoyed a relatively good summer with many “normal” activities, I put “normal” in quotations because we are still social distancing. Case numbers are rising, schools are about to open (for how long is anyone’s guess), mandatory mask laws are coming into effect, sports are not happening as they normally would, my boyfriend and I will both be working from home, outdoor gatherings with family and dinners on the patio are sadly coming to an end... Winter is coming and everybody that I talk to is saying how they are preparing to go home and stay home this winter... I don’t see a return to anything that looks like normal anytime soon. 

Edited August 24, 2020 by BaileyB

[Spring1234]

10 hours ago, gaius said:

Having everyone wear a mask, especially an N95 or surgical one, is a very effective way at blunting transmission. From what I understand it's also a lot harder to transmit outside vs inside.

I'm still not going to places where someone might have their mouth uncovered indoors, like indoor dining at restaurants. But places where masks are required 100% of the time and people are abiding by the rules are pretty safe at this point. So keep your mask on and enjoy a round of bowling, get a haircut, even hit the beach if it's not crowded to the point you can't keep some space between you and other people.

 

However most people don't wear N95 masks..

[Spring1234]

I went out today someone in a store wasn't wearing a mask, some had their noses out, someone just had a shield and was coughing and the take out place I was going to get food out from had the guy making and taking the food orders wearing a mask on his chin no plexiglass either. How is this behavior not causing more outbreaks?

I really thought there was no way Disney, casinos, shore towns could reopen. I thought this virus was so contagious and masks are not enough.

I just don't think it's as contagious as people thought it was or as serious since hospitals are fine. My cousin works at our local hospital he sees like 1 covid patient a day. I'm not saying it's not a problem, but I think it's ok if people resume their lives. I am going to try, I still get worried I'll be the one who gets sick though. I wish I could be like the people who go out and aren't worried. 

I just don't know what happened??? If there was an outbreak at Disney or casinos or any attraction you would hear about it. I understand testing could be delayed wrong etc. But that doesn't explain not hearing about  employees getting sick.  

I just think it's crazy how life has returned to almost normal except for masks. I mean my friend went to 3 weddings this month 2 outside 1 inside, there was like 25 people inside and 150 outside. 

I see everyone doing everything on the news, Facebook. I just want to be them! I just think I'm overreacting and being foolish for staying home. 

 

[Wiseman2]

Stop using social media as accurate information. Protect yourself whatever way you see fit. If you want to deny there's a pandemic fine. If you want to take precautions fine. But you are oversaturating with too much media. Why are you obsessed with Disney and casinos? Do you have to work there? If not, shut off the news feeds for a while and decide what makes the most sense for your area and situation. 

[elaine567]

Its a virus, it just want to find a bridge between people so that it spreads and doesn't die out.
Scottish Govt. advice.

Quote

FACTS’ is an acronym for:

Face coverings in enclosed spaces
Avoid crowded places
Clean your hands and surfaces regularly
Two-metre social distancing
Self-isolate and book a test if you develop coronavirus symptoms

 

Edited August 24, 2020 by elaine567
spacing

[Weezy1973]

There are better treatments now for the virus. Also, initially cases and deaths were mostly older people and especially clustered in retirement homes. Now that it mostly younger people getting it, the death rate is going down. Knowledge of the virus has changed with time. It’s still very contagious and best to take all necessary precautions. 

[clia]

At this point, you should look at the data and decide for yourself how comfortable you feel with the risk of whatever activity you are planning to do.  It's a virus -- so you can catch it if you go out, as with any other virus.  I think a lot of people out there have figured out that even if they do get it, there is a 99.X% chance they will survive, so it's a risk they are willing to take.  The younger and healthier they are, the chances get even better. This is a virus that largely targets older people (many of whom are past the age of life expectancy in this country) and people in poor health.  It's largely targeted people in close living quarters -- retirement homes, long term care facilities, prisons, households.  Of course there are outliers -- there always are -- but for the most part, if you are under age 60 and in reasonably good health, you'll be fine even if you do get it.  There are reports about longer term effects in some people, but even that we don't know yet.  (And that can even happen with the flu, and no one holes up in their house for months afraid of the flu.)  Everyone I know who has gotten it had a fairly mild case and is fine now.  But going out and doing things is a decision that is yours to make for yourself.  If you are still afraid, by all means, stay home.      

My personal opinion -- and I know it's an unpopular one around here -- is that the virus is going to run its course regardless of what we do.  (We've been through pandemics before and that's what happened...we haven't had Governors declaring a state of emergency for months on end and trying to keep people in their homes.)  We are only putting off the inevitable by trying to keep people in their homes, and I think we would be much better off dealing with things now, in summer, and when are hospitals have very few COVID patients (at least in my state, MI), rather than in the winter during flu season.  And in some states, it appears to have done just that.  AZ, FL, TX are all dropping quickly from their peak.  NY did the same.  But even countries that looked good for awhile are starting to increase again now -- Philippines, France, even Italy is starting to see some higher numbers -- so it's still transmitting.  And despite locking up their borders, New Zealand and Australia are seeing new cases.  (Personally, I'll take the situation in the USA over the "strict lockdown again and stay in your house" approach that New Zealand and Australia appear to be taking.  I just do not think that's sustainable over the long term and eventually they are going to have to face the virus unless they want to completely isolate themselves from the rest of the world.)  

My state (MI) is seeing similar numbers to yours now.  I don't really know anyone who is still strictly not going anywhere, other than one friend whose husband has underlying health issues.  I've been going out to eat 2-3 times a week since early June.  I've sat outside, inside, and at the bar, I've had waiters with masks and masks pulled down exposing their nose and/or chin.  Customers are more hit or miss with the mask requirements -- some "forget" to put it on when they go to the bathroom.   Places are taking precautions for the most part, and I don't go when it's super crowded, though.  I've gone to the grocery store at least once a week since it all started back in March -- more now -- and the grocery workers similarly have off and on mask compliance.  I've been getting together with friends regularly (mainly outdoors for grilling, or out on the boat) since the end of May.  I've gone to the hair salon.  Personally, getting out and seeing people is worth the risk of COVID to me, but your miles may vary.  I would be going nuts sheltering in after five months of it.  I don't think I'm alone.  The restaurants in my town are packed and people are out and about, living their lives.  I think most people I know have gone on at least one vacation this summer, too.  I personally think we need to bite the bullet and open everything, at least at partial capacity -- gyms, bowling alleys, movie theaters in my state are still closed after five months.     

I also agree with you on wondering about the true contagiousness of it.  I feel like there is a lot they haven't figured out yet.  It just doesn't make a whole lot of sense to me that more health care workers, grocery store workers, waiters/bartenders, airline staff, etc. aren't getting it.  My recent anecdotal story is that at one of the restaurants we go to, a manager started feeling symptoms on a Saturday and tested positive.  He had worked the previous five days and interacted closely with 30 other employees -- sometimes wearing masks, sometimes not, or masks pulled down.  No one else tested positive.  How can that be?  At my sister's hospital, only 4% of the staff tested positive.  How can that be -- especially given the lack of PPE back in March?  Germany is apparently doing a study right now about the transmission at indoor concerts, so those results will be interesting.         

Edited August 24, 2020 by clia

[QuietRiot]

16 minutes ago, clia said:

At this point, you should look at the data and decide for yourself how comfortable you feel with the risk of whatever activity you are planning to do.  It's a virus -- so you can catch it if you go out, as with any other virus.  I think a lot of people out there have figured out that even if they do get it, there is a 99.X% chance they will survive, so it's a risk they are willing to take.  The younger and healthier they are, the chances get even better. This is a virus that largely targets older people (many of whom are past the age of life expectancy in this country) and people in poor health.  It's largely targeted people in close living quarters -- retirement homes, long term care facilities, prisons, households.  Of course there are outliers -- there always are -- but for the most part, if you are under age 60 and in reasonably good health, you'll be fine even if you do get it.  There are reports about longer term effects in some people, but even that we don't know yet.  (And that can even happen with the flu, and no one holes up in their house for months afraid of the flu.)  Everyone I know who has gotten it had a fairly mild case and is fine now.  But going out and doing things is a decision that is yours to make for yourself.  If you are still afraid, by all means, stay home.      

My personal opinion -- and I know it's an unpopular one around here -- is that the virus is going to run its course regardless of what we do.  (We've been through pandemics before and that's what happened...we haven't had Governors declaring a state of emergency for months on end and trying to keep people in their homes.)  We are only putting off the inevitable by trying to keep people in their homes, and I think we would be much better off dealing with things now, in summer, and when are hospitals have very few COVID patients (at least in my state, MI), rather than in the winter during flu season.  And in some states, it appears to have done just that.  AZ, FL, TX are all dropping quickly from their peak.  NY did the same.  But even countries that looked good for awhile are starting to increase again now -- Philippines, France, even Italy is starting to see some higher numbers -- so it's still transmitting.  And despite locking up their borders, New Zealand and Australia are seeing new cases.  (Personally, I'll take the situation in the USA over the "strict lockdown again and stay in your house" approach that New Zealand and Australia appear to be taking.  I just do not think that's sustainable over the long term and eventually they are going to have to face the virus unless they want to completely isolate themselves from the rest of the world.)  

My state (MI) is seeing similar numbers to yours now.  I don't really know anyone who is still strictly not going anywhere, other than one friend whose husband has underlying health issues.  I've been going out to eat 2-3 times a week since early June.  I've sat outside, inside, and at the bar, I've had waiters with masks and masks pulled down exposing their nose and/or chin.  Customers are more hit or miss with the mask requirements -- some "forget" to put it on when they go to the bathroom.   Places are taking precautions for the most part, and I don't go when it's super crowded, though.  I've gone to the grocery store at least once a week since it all started back in March -- more now -- and the grocery workers similarly have off and on mask compliance.  I've been getting together with friends regularly (mainly outdoors for grilling, or out on the boat) since the end of May.  I've gone to the hair salon.  Personally, getting out and seeing people is worth the risk of COVID to me, but your miles may vary.  I would be going nuts sheltering in after five months of it.  I don't think I'm alone.  The restaurants in my town are packed and people are out and about, living their lives.  I think most people I know have gone on at least one vacation this summer, too.  I personally think we need to bite the bullet and open everything, at least at partial capacity -- gyms, bowling alleys, movie theaters in my state are still closed after five months.     

I also agree with you on wondering about the true contagiousness of it.  I feel like there is a lot they haven't figured out yet.  It just doesn't make a whole lot of sense to me that more health care workers, grocery store workers, waiters/bartenders, airline staff, etc. aren't getting it.  My recent anecdotal story is that at one of the restaurants we go to, a manager started feeling symptoms on a Saturday and tested positive.  He had worked the previous five days and interacted closely with 30 other employees -- sometimes wearing masks, sometimes not, or masks pulled down.  No one else tested positive.  How can that be?  At my sister's hospital, only 4% of the staff tested positive.  How can that be -- especially given the lack of PPE back in March?  Germany is apparently doing a study right now about the transmission at indoor concerts, so those results will be interesting.         

There is a certain arrogance to this post that people in other countries shake their heads at. If you take a look at the Australia post, even though their numbers are down...they are still on curfew and on lock down and NOT scoffing at their govt for doing this. They support it and not fighting against it.

Have to look at the big picture and how other countries see the U.S. 

[clia]

57 minutes ago, QuietRiot said:

There is a certain arrogance to this post that people in other countries shake their heads at. If you take a look at the Australia post, even though their numbers are down...they are still on curfew and on lock down and NOT scoffing at their govt for doing this. They support it and not fighting against it.

Have to look at the big picture and how other countries see the U.S. 

What exactly do you find arrogant about my post?  Are you still expecting everyone in the USA to stay inside and not go anywhere?

Edited August 24, 2020 by clia

[Angelle]

I'm still mostly isolated, because our numbers were shooting up here, and some of the locals freaked me out, pushing the idea that it's all a hoax. I'm used to being pretty isolated, but having "escapes" that are now mostly gone. I went to the Lake Erie coast one afternoon, and felt fine when I was by myself - I found a quiet area, by myself, and it was great - but I didn't want to go down to the beach, after I'd seen it covered in people. Not even when most of them were gone. I usually get hit hard by illness, and I have my dad to think about. I had a panic attack later on, over the fact that I'd seen that somewhat busy beach in person, instead of on facebook or twitter. 

I want to do things, but I have friends who are still recovering after getting sick in March. I can't take the chance, with my dad. Even though I know that I was safe, and my dad is always careful.