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I don't know what to do


alsudduth

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I found a suicide note my daughter wrote 3 days ago while looking for something on her desk this morning. She was at a friends last night and I called her immediately to make sure she was still alive,  but didn't mention the note. 

She is in a program with a counselor she saw a few years back for some behavioral reasons,  its a virtual 10 week program,  she is about halfway through  and says she doesn't feel like it's working. She started it because she felt like she was angry all the time and didn't feel like she wanted to be here anymore.  She asked for help. 

I feel like it would help, but she's almost convinced herself that nothing will work and I feel like she's giving up.  

I am so sad that she feels so lost that she could even consider not being here. I feel like no matter what I say or action I take it will make it worse. She must feel so alone and my heart is breaking that she can't see the worth in herself that everyone else sees.

I don't know what else to do. I want to believe that since she didn't go through with it 3 days ago, that she doesn't really want this, but feel like if she is serious, and I lose her I will have failed her and I could never forgive myself. 

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Why won't you take her to a doctor? She needs to confide in a physician about her thoughts and feelings.

Don't waste your or her time in some ineffective " program for behavioral issues"

Get your head out of the sand and let her talk to a real doctor privately and confidentially.

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50 minutes ago, Wiseman2 said:

Why won't you take her to a doctor? She needs to confide in a physician about her thoughts and feelings.

Don't waste your or her time in some ineffective " program for behavioral issues"

Get your head out of the sand and let her talk to a real doctor privately and confidentially.

I do have apt with a medical doctor scheduled. I put it off at first because she asked me to first let her try talking to her child counselor.  I called her the next morning.

The program shes doing with her isn't a behavioral program,  it's a program for finding ways to control/handle her emotions and build self esteem, that she asked for, with the same counselor she saw years ago for some behavioral things. She clicked with the counselor at the time, and said it was the only counselor she felt ever did any good. I felt like she was hopeful about it and it was the first real help my daughter asked for and wanted to give her the opportunity to try it.

The suicidal ideation is not new, we've been dealing with it a couple years off and on. Or rather, I thought things seemed better after the last major incident and counseling. I didn't know how much she still struggled until a little over a month ago when her friends called me at 1am with her having locked herself in a bathroom crying, saying she wanted to die. 

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I also want to clarify, from a professional standpoint, I know what to do and am doing those things. We are at the point where therapy isn't enough and I am working on that piece.

My post is more about, as a mother I personally, within myself, feel helpless to how to help outside of doing the necessary medical things to keep her safe. 

Knowing that nothing I say or do will help is an awful feeling. A mother is supposed to be able to keep her child happy and comfort her when she is sad and upset. I want my baby to be happy, she deserves to see joy in life. 

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I’m so sorry that you are dealing with this. It is our job as parents to care for our children and keep them safe, but there are limits to what we can do/control. How old is your daughter? I would strongly advise you to keep talking - talk to your daughter, talk to her counsellor, talk to her doctor, call for crisis assistance if needed. I had a friend who was once suicidal, these are hard conversations but you need to put it on the table. Hugs. 

 

Edited by BaileyB
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usually when someone says I have suicidal thoughts, they lock them up for a week or so in a specialized facility because they are high risk. Your daughter wrote the message already. 

You are so calm about this

 you should act quickly,You are losing her

you still have time to do whatever you can to save her

what is it .. what are the reasons for her to want to die?

fix the reasons?

Did someone abuse her as a kid, raped her, did someone rejected her, 

does she feel she is not beautiful, not smart or overweight?

You have to know why?

Usually people are depressed for a reason

if you don't want to to do this, at least travel with her to a nice place so she changes the scenery, who knows, that might help!

 

You need to talk to her, watch her all the time, don't let her slip .. 

Maybe social media and technology is doing this

who knows, just do something

don't say I don't know what to do

 

Edited by Noproblem
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3 hours ago, BaileyB said:

I’m so sorry that you are dealing with this. It is our job as parents to care for our children and keep them safe, but there are limits to what we can do/control. How old is your daughter? I would strongly advise you to keep talking - talk to your daughter, talk to her counsellor, talk to her doctor, call for crisis assistance if needed. I had a friend who was once suicidal, these are hard conversations but you need to put it on the table. Hugs. 

 

Thank you.  She is 16. I did end up talking to her about finding it today.  At first she said that's what I got for "snooping" through her room.  To be clear, this was left right on top of her desk and I saw it while looking for something else on the desk - not going through drawers or anything like that. 

I basically told her that at this point the counseling isn't enough and that we need to start looking at this as well like a medical emergency. That something within her body, whether it's hormones or a mental health condition, it needs to be sorted. Her apt for that is tomorrow - in the meantime I asked her to please - Please try to come to me when she starts feeling that down, or at the very least to call the suicide prevention number, and made sure she had it handy.  I told her that while I understand initially that she was afraid to see a doctor because she didn't want to be forced into a hospital, that I needed her to understand that at this moment, keeping her safe from herself is my #1 priority and that if the doctor says that an in patient facility is what is needed that's what I was going to do.  

I encouraged her to talk to the counselor about this, and sat in the first 15-20 mins of the apt to discuss with her. She told the counselor that she didn't come to me the night she wrote the letter because she knew I'd talk her out of it. She said the reason she didn't go through with it, was because her brother found the letter and forced her out of the bathroom before she could do anything.  Her, myself, and the counselor also discussed whether an inpatient facility might be beneficial.  Then I left her to finish the session. 

I'm currently waiting for her to return from volleyball practice to see how the rest of the apt. goes. 

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It sounds like you did a wonderful job. You were very brave - you spoke honestly, directly, and firmly. And, you continue to seek assistance for her. Well done. 

I remember the day my friend told me she was considering suicide. It shook me to my core. I left the meeting in disbelief, and very emotional. But in the moment, we spoke honestly and directly. When someone tell you they are considering suicide, the only thing you can do is have an direct and open discussion. I asked her intentions, she told me how she was feeling, we talked about options, I encouraged her to get help. For months after, while she was in counselling, I texted her every single day. Some days, she didn’t respond. Many days, she wouldn’t tell me how she was doing - she would ask about me and deflect the discussion. But, after the crisis had passed we had another heart to heart discussion and I told her how scared I was, how helpless I felt... She told me that those texts probably saved her life - because while she couldn’t always respond, she knew that someone cared. 

Your daughter may not be happy with you these days, but you will love her anyway. You will never stop trying to help. And while, at the end of the day the sad reality is it’s her life and you don’t have control here... you can know in your heart that you did your best and you never stopped trying to help her. 💕

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21 hours ago, BaileyB said:

It sounds like you did a wonderful job. You were very brave - you spoke honestly, directly, and firmly. And, you continue to seek assistance for her. Well done. 

I remember the day my friend told me she was considering suicide. It shook me to my core. I left the meeting in disbelief, and very emotional. But in the moment, we spoke honestly and directly. When someone tell you they are considering suicide, the only thing you can do is have an direct and open discussion. I asked her intentions, she told me how she was feeling, we talked about options, I encouraged her to get help. For months after, while she was in counselling, I texted her every single day. Some days, she didn’t respond. Many days, she wouldn’t tell me how she was doing - she would ask about me and deflect the discussion. But, after the crisis had passed we had another heart to heart discussion and I told her how scared I was, how helpless I felt... She told me that those texts probably saved her life - because while she couldn’t always respond, she knew that someone cared. 

Your daughter may not be happy with you these days, but you will love her anyway. You will never stop trying to help. And while, at the end of the day the sad reality is it’s her life and you don’t have control here... you can know in your heart that you did your best and you never stopped trying to help her. 💕

Thanks for the words of encouragement.  

She had her apt with doctor and we from there to the crises center.  We ultimately decided with the crises counselor to put together a safety plan to see if we can try outpatient care first and on Monday will meet with the psychiatrist to evaluate for next steps.  

If during the weekend we determine she's not going to make it, we will take her back to the crises center immediately or call for them to come get her and they will find an inpatient facility for her. 

Hearing from the doctor and the crises counselor the confirmation that she is not alone and there is help for her helped some. She knows I'm not just trying to make her feel better in the moment. 

She is going to have a friend come over for the weekend so that she's never alone (I was worried about the night hours when I can't keep a watch on her) 

I was supposed to meet a friend the next town over tomorrow, but cancelled so I'm not far from her, or if she wants to come with me I'll do that too if it gets her through the day to take her mind off it.  

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SincereOnlineGuy
On 8/28/2020 at 4:46 PM, alsudduth said:

Thanks for the words of encouragement.  

She had her apt with doctor and we from there to the crises center.  We ultimately decided with the crises counselor to put together a safety plan to see if we can try outpatient care first and on Monday will meet with the psychiatrist to evaluate for next steps.  

If during the weekend we determine she's not going to make it, we will take her back to the crises center immediately or call for them to come get her and they will find an inpatient facility for her. 

Hearing from the doctor and the crises counselor the confirmation that she is not alone and there is help for her helped some. She knows I'm not just trying to make her feel better in the moment. 

She is going to have a friend come over for the weekend so that she's never alone (I was worried about the night hours when I can't keep a watch on her) 

I was supposed to meet a friend the next town over tomorrow, but cancelled so I'm not far from her, or if she wants to come with me I'll do that too if it gets her through the day to take her mind off it.  

Don't forget, you don't have to win anything...      but to avoid losing  is critical.

 

You did well in being direct, and sensing appropriate priorities with regard to having discovered the note and having had to admit as much.

 

We out here can't tell whether  this is a completely random, chemical imbalance within her, or whether anything about past environment created a good deal by you might have been a strong contributing factor.    But if YOU let your (walls) down...    you won't regret having dared to be so bold.

This issue is much bigger than any dumb disagreement in the past or present, and I sense you are prepared to treat it as such...   

 

So far you are probably doing the best you can...  and never be afraid to let her see your pain.  As your honesty and sincerity mean more than almost every tangential factor.

 

 

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How is her relationship with her father and siblings? 

What is the nature of her distress? Why is she chronically suicidal?

How much do you know about her school and social life? Or her self imagine or use of drugs or interest in boys?

You as well would benefit from some therapy to sort out and cope with things.

If she's leaving suicide notes around she's screaming out for help. But to whom and who is really listening?

Professional guidance would help you tremendously both for guidance and support. Her peers should not be on suicide watch.

 

Edited by Wiseman2
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12 hours ago, Wiseman2 said:

Her peers should not be on suicide watch.

I agree with this. It's not her friends job to monitor your daughter's suicidal ideation. They are teenagers just like she is. They are hardly responsible for themselves. 


 

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So I have suicidal ideation and I can tell you what has worked for me and what has not. But I am not a licensed LMFT and do not have any formal training in psychological help. I have even attempted suicide twice, though it's been years. 

This is going to be a difficult topic for me at the moment because I am going through a difficult period in my life. 

You need to see a therapist/counselor immediately. You will need help navigating this in the proper ways. You will need guidance on how to talk to your daughter, how to help her and what you should not do. You will also need someone to you learn how to identify the signs and symptoms that she might be ready to attempt it.  Her therapist needs to be informed that she has suicidal ideation immediately. If your daughter is an adult, then therapist likely won't be able to communicate with you much (or at all) due to HIPPA laws, unless your daughter approves it. 

Some simple things you need to do with your daughter that can help. Go for a drive with her, don't press the topic of suicide. But just talk to her about life, about her life. Keep it casual and keep your emotions in check. You do not want to trigger a fight. If she says things are difficult, encourage her that life has ups and downs, ask her if she wants to talk about it. Things can and will get better.

Let your daughter know you love her. Let her know she is amazing person. Try and back it up with some legitimate compliments that are personalized to her. Maybe even look through a photo album with her and go over some good happy times. 

When she says that certain treatments do not work, then discuss the options. Most treatment will not work instantly, it's not like having an infection taking some antibiotics and feeling better a few days later. Even medications to treat depression or other mental illness can take a month to feel any impact. It can take 3-6 months to really see if the medications works. It can also take trying different medications to figure out which ones will work best for her (if that's what she needs). For me it took nearly 10 years and trying just about every medication on the market before I found something that worked. How ever I resisted medication for large portion of that time.

Look for therapist who really enjoy their careers. I have seen the same one since I was 19 (I'm 36 today). But this guy loves what he does and he is amazing at it. I don't always like what he has to say.. But he knows what he is doing and he genuinely cares. When something is not working, he really puts in the time and effort to make sure he find something that will. You'll only get that kind of treatment from people who really really love what they do. If your daughter accepts the help, talk to her about the therapist and help her find one that she likes and is comfortable with. 

But a forum is not the place to get advice for something like this. It would like trying to get treatment opinions for terminal cancer from Web MD. 

Edited by Dork Vader
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At any point in her did you hug her & tell her that you love her?  That message needs to be repeated several times per day! Also compliment her.  Get her brother to complement her too (even if that will be harder)

Did you tell the counselor that you found the note?  I'm really unclear about why you waited to talk about this. 

Sit with your daughter every day & make a gratitude journal.  You both write down 3 things you are grateful for.  They don't have to be profound but they should be varied.  Re-read the lists once per week so she can see the abundance in her life. 

 

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I wish I could have made this post with a different title. I originally tried to make the title "I feel Helpless" but for some reason that wasn't allowed.  I feel like the original title gave the wrong impression, because aside from a few responses I feel more criticized than supported. 

For everyone wondering, part of the reason I was feeling helpless is that there is NO outlying reason that she should feel this way.  Her dad and I are still married (While we've had our issues, we have never let the kids see how bad it was, and we've been in a great place for at least 2 years if not longer now), her and her brother get along much better than they have in the past, She is very close to her dad and I in different ways (her words to the psychiatrist) Our extended families on both sides are very close, she's popular in her social circles, she told us and the doctors that she's not a drinker or a drug doer (She's experimented, because she's 16 and that's what teens do, but not a regular user), and we've covered whether there was any kind of trauma we don't know about and she is adamant that is not the case, and that she doesn't know why she feels this way. 

The note - I spoke to her about it less than 24 hours after I found it.  She wrote it on a Monday, I found it on Wednesday, and talked to her Thursday morning after I was able to gather my wits and have a conversation with her without upsetting her more.  I am the opposite of her in that I'm a very emotional person, I cry for pretty much any reason, so you can imagine how upset I was to read a note in my baby girls handwriting that I've seen her perfect since she could hold a pencil talking about wanting to and preparing to die.  I had to make sure I could keep my composure and prepare for the fact that I may have had to take her to a hospital, which I knew was something she wasn't on board with in the past. 

As to her friends coming over on Saturday, while I can appreciate that the friends are not responsible for suicide watch, they weren't completely alone with her.  The idea around her friends being there (as suggested by the crises counselor as well) was that the more she was distracted with good things, the less time she has to focus on negative thoughts. They came over and brought her a goodie bag of all her favorite things and snacks and they watched happy movies all night.  

YES we have talked to the counselor about the note, yes we told the family practicioner about the note, yes we told the crises center about the note, yes we told the psychiatrist about the note when we spoke to her on Tuesday. 

Psychiatrist - We had an appointment with the Psychiatrist on Tuesday, who started her on a mood stabilizer and said she would lean towards bipolar2, but could also be an Anxiety disorder that has led to severe depression.  If needed later she will add an antidepressant.  She will be continuing counseling, and yes as a family we will probably go as well. I am an advocate for it. 

Lastly - We tell our daughter on a daily basis that we love her, support her, care about her, and want her to be happy.......

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Thank you for clarifying some of the points that weren't clear to me.  It sounds like you love your daughter very much & this is an incomprehensible situation for you. 

It's hard to explain how somebody with seemingly everything going for them can feel as empty as your daughter does.  A good analogy may be celebrity suicides.  I do understand your daughter.  I have "everything" going for me but have struggled with depression born of perfectionism my whole life  I was in the 6th grade the 1st time I wanted to kill myself.  Sometimes the thoughts are fleeting; other times I have the means in my hands, on 2 occasions I made meaningful attempts:  took pills & took a knife to my body.  Even when she doesn't want to hear it you & your family telling her that you love & accept her helps.  Keep that up.  Getting her quality professionals to talk to which you are doing is the best you can do. 

Hang in there.  Hopefully you can love her through this.  

The times certainly aren't helping.  Can you restrict her access to the news, politics & Covid info?  Can you monitor her social media.  All the "happy, happy, life is grand, aren't I fabulous? " garbage on there adds to her feelings that because she is not on top of the world 100% of the time there is something wrong with her.  

Edited by d0nnivain
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SincereOnlineGuy
On 8/30/2020 at 11:13 PM, Dork Vader said:

So I have suicidal ideation and I can tell you what has worked for me and what has not. But I am not a licensed LMFT and do not have any formal training in psychological help. I have even attempted suicide twice, though it's been years. 

This is going to be a difficult topic for me at the moment because I am going through a difficult period in my life. 

You need to see a therapist/counselor immediately. You will need help navigating this in the proper ways. You will need guidance on how to talk to your daughter, how to help her and what you should not do. You will also need someone to you learn how to identify the signs and symptoms that she might be ready to attempt it.  Her therapist needs to be informed that she has suicidal ideation immediately. If your daughter is an adult, then therapist likely won't be able to communicate with you much (or at all) due to HIPPA laws, unless your daughter approves it. 

Some simple things you need to do with your daughter that can help. Go for a drive with her, don't press the topic of suicide. But just talk to her about life, about her life. Keep it casual and keep your emotions in check. You do not want to trigger a fight. If she says things are difficult, encourage her that life has ups and downs, ask her if she wants to talk about it. Things can and will get better.

Let your daughter know you love her. Let her know she is amazing person. Try and back it up with some legitimate compliments that are personalized to her. Maybe even look through a photo album with her and go over some good happy times. 

When she says that certain treatments do not work, then discuss the options. Most treatment will not work instantly, it's not like having an infection taking some antibiotics and feeling better a few days later. Even medications to treat depression or other mental illness can take a month to feel any impact. It can take 3-6 months to really see if the medications works. It can also take trying different medications to figure out which ones will work best for her (if that's what she needs). For me it took nearly 10 years and trying just about every medication on the market before I found something that worked. How ever I resisted medication for large portion of that time.

Look for therapist who really enjoy their careers. I have seen the same one since I was 19 (I'm 36 today). But this guy loves what he does and he is amazing at it. I don't always like what he has to say.. But he knows what he is doing and he genuinely cares. When something is not working, he really puts in the time and effort to make sure he find something that will. You'll only get that kind of treatment from people who really really love what they do. If your daughter accepts the help, talk to her about the therapist and help her find one that she likes and is comfortable with. 

But a forum is not the place to get advice for something like this. It would like trying to get treatment opinions for terminal cancer from Web MD. 

 

There is something  very interesting in this post...

 

The person who has-been/IS  there  may be best armed to suggest the best course of action/outlook for the PARENT of the affected.

 

This person quoted is entirely willing to help and guide from inside  (assuming  as long as it isn't ('me')  I'm needing to solve ).

 

So how can the OP get her daughter to perhaps step outside of herself  and converse with the mom on how to address this very subject with another person.   Simultaneously calling upon the daughter to help make clear just what she feels inside...  for the good of everyone involved ???

 

(maybe the OP would do well in creating a mythical 3rd person, and ASKING as if for sincere advice, what the daughter thinks the parent in that scenario would gain most by doing or saying in that situation)

 

(maybe go online and google   "my daughter is thinking about suicide"... and then find an EXACT story as related by (a random internet stranger) (but with so much detail it has to be true)... and the OP seeming to be especially drawn-in by the specifics of THAT story...   and then she ask her own daughter  how (the daughter) feels that the random mom online should interact with her own daughter with the only clear goal being to keep the daughter alive?

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13 hours ago, SincereOnlineGuy said:

 

There is something  very interesting in this post...

 

The person who has-been/IS  there  may be best armed to suggest the best course of action/outlook for the PARENT of the affected.

 

This person quoted is entirely willing to help and guide from inside  (assuming  as long as it isn't ('me')  I'm needing to solve ).

 

So how can the OP get her daughter to perhaps step outside of herself  and converse with the mom on how to address this very subject with another person.   Simultaneously calling upon the daughter to help make clear just what she feels inside...  for the good of everyone involved ???

 

(maybe the OP would do well in creating a mythical 3rd person, and ASKING as if for sincere advice, what the daughter thinks the parent in that scenario would gain most by doing or saying in that situation)

 

(maybe go online and google   "my daughter is thinking about suicide"... and then find an EXACT story as related by (a random internet stranger) (but with so much detail it has to be true)... and the OP seeming to be especially drawn-in by the specifics of THAT story...   and then she ask her own daughter  how (the daughter) feels that the random mom online should interact with her own daughter with the only clear goal being to keep the daughter alive?

I agree that reading online can help. But take it with a grain of salt, there is a lot of bad information out there. I often share articles I read on the internet with my therapist and ask his opinion. This has helped me avoid making some big missteps in treatment. I also ask for books, most of those revolve around OCD because well, I'm OCD (along the lines of Howard Hughes OCD). 

Some things to consider if medication does become a treatment you and her decide to try. They can do a blood test that will help doctors identify which medications are most likely to work for her. That might help her avoid the troubles of trying medications that do not work. When I was going through that I took many that actually made things worse. When/if she does find medications that work, you/her might consider keeping a log of side effects and improvements. She can then weigh the cost/benefit factor of the given medication with the prescriber and her therapist. 

There are unconventional treatments as well. I did one known as Brain Paint, basically it's a type of neurofeedback therapy. I found that was really effective at helping me practice various ways of dealing with anxiety. 

From what I've read I think you're doing all the right things. 

Also my parents were both happily married and good parents. Did they mistakes raising me? Sure, did they have arguments? You bet. But every parent/family does. I think the key is that you're trying and involved. You're also paying attention. There was no abuse. There was trauma in high school but I already had suicidal ideation before that happened. This is just kind of what mental illness is, there is no known reason for it. You and your husband have not done anything wrong. I'm sure my parents felt the same way, I'm sure they felt helpless and often times they were. But that is a normal feeling because it's not something you can fix yourself. It can be treated and you're doing exactly that..  

Edited by Dork Vader
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6 hours ago, Dork Vader said:

There are unconventional treatments as well. I did one known as Brain Paint, basically it's a type of neurofeedback therapy. I found that was really effective at helping me practice various ways of dealing with anxiety. 

Thanks for the response!  This sounds interesting. Was this something on your own or with guidance from one of your counselors?  I'm going to do some research. 

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SincereOnlineGuy
10 hours ago, Dork Vader said:

I agree that reading online can help. But take it with a grain of salt, there is a lot of bad information out there.

Clarity:   in no way am I implying one should seek the remedy online.

The ploy  is to capture THIS daughter's interest and focus for a bit...   and get her expressing about similar feelings to where THIS mom might accidentally get to learn (the important understandings here)  (beCAUSE the daughter begins talking completely about somebody else )

 

And SOME of my impulse is also akin to many years ago, in order to curb a significant number of Japanese taking their own lives by leaping in front of subway trains... authorities simply put mirrors on the other side  so those originally of the mind to do this, would have to view themselves doing it.  (and it became something they wouldn't do)

 

So our OP...   just finding a place  where she can engage her daughter  (on a more level ground  than mere  'parenting'  tends to afford)...   could do WONDERS for prevention.

 

Life is a lot easier when you take risks which let you balance potentially winning   with   potentially losing.

 

But our OP is in a place where she can't  **win**...     and everything is invested in merely  avoiding losing.

 

 

*it's probably a lot easier to leap off of a giant bridge when nobody is around, and nobody is talking/watching, than it is when someone is trying to engage you.

(psychologically speaking, I mean)

 

 

 

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Dear OP, I really feel for you.  You are in an awful position.  You sound a very caring person and you are doing the best you can in this horrible situation.

Some people become depressed and suicidal because of outside events - unhappy childhoods, trauma, failure, all sorts of reasons - but some seem very prone to suicidal thoughts for no obvious reason.  Hopefully, with therapy she will uncover any reason that might be bothering her that she has hidden from you.  If, however, it is basically a chemical imbalance problem, then medication is the best bet at the moment.

All you can do is to bring in therapists, be supportive and loving, and you are doing that.  It is an awful situation for a parent.  You must feel held to ransom by this 'threat'.  Ultimately, you may never be able to prevent her from making that choice if she has a serious illness.  You can't be on guard forever.  You can only hope that whatever therapy or medication helps will always help and that your daughter matures and learns to manage her down times herself.  Hopefully, with a diagnosis and appropriate treatment, she will feel lots better and will not end up in this situation again.

Please don't blame yourself, your child is significantly genetically different from you.  You have no control over how she is.  She will make her own choices as children do.

I am thinking of you.

 

 

Edited by spiderowl
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