A story of love, infidelity and denial. I could really use some insight here. Thank you!

[MaxxNY]

Hello Everyone,

Before I start I would like to thank you for taking the time to read my story, and for the very insightful information I found on the forum. 

Background story: ME 41, her 28. We met online back in April. I was 4 months out of a relationship, she was out of a two year "relationship" she had with a married man that ended in December of last year. The guy is her friend's father so she knew the entire family. He was also supporting her financially.  I told her I was dating other women, she told me she recently got tired of being a side piece for a married man and has not been with anyone since then. 

At first the relationship was great, as they usually are. we had amazing sex, and spent a lot of time together. Fast forward to July. We are seeing each other about twice a week, either on her weekends off when her kid is with the father, or during the week. She makes hints that she is starting to fall for me, at the time I am still seeing other women. Few weeks later, she is at my place and sees a condom on the night stand. She is understandably hurt by this, and it shows. I could have sat there and justify that she knew about other women, etc. However, I told her how sorry I was for hurting her and told her I will never hurt her like that again. I tied up my loose ends and saw her exclusively. We continue with the relationship, we speak over text and video chat several times a day. She is affectionate, loving and wants to spend all the time she can with me. We have few disagreements about her going out for her b-day with friends and disappearing for the night or putting herself in situations that could lead to "Im sorry I did not mean for that to happen".

Fast forward to about three weeks ago. We talk in the morning, I ask if she has any plans for the evening, she says no, so I tell her see you later tonight, without discussing specifics. I was pretty busy during the day, but by the time I reach out to her around 6 she is already in a car with some friends. Oh hey, Im hanging out with some friends, I will talk to you soon. I simply respond by saying enjoy thinking she would go out, have fun with them and see me afterwards. Her phone dies, she gets back to me at 10pm before going to bed. When I question things, she blames it on me for not picking up during the day. However, if she truly wanted to see me, she would have confirmed when I spoke to her earlier in the evening. I wrote that off as a silly fight where we should have been together instead of arguing about it. 

Here is where things get interesting: She lives about 40 minutes from me and does not normally frequent this side of town. Im sitting in the car, on the way back from lunch. As the light changes, I see her drive right past me. Pleasantly surprised I try to catch up, but see that at the next light she makes a turn into a hotel parking lot behind the building. By the time I pull in she is not in the car anymore, but it sits two parking spots away from the entrance. I sit there thinking OMG, could this be possible? We have had some arguments, but overall we are having a great relationship. She is very affectionate, tells me how much she loves me, and how much she wants to see me all the time. She has not distanced herself emotionally or physically in a typical fashion of a cheating partner. I send her a text asking "what are you up to?" She does not respond until about an hour later. By then she is driving to run some errands. We talk later on going over how our days went. I ask specifically where she was when I sent her that text. She responds that she was home. I dont say anything but she can tell I am suspicious. We meet the following day, on Friday. I approach her in a very non confrontational manner, asking how she feels about our relationship and where she sees it going. I also ask if she has been or would like to see other people. She says that she does not want to see anyone besides me, and with the exception of our arguments about her hanging out with friends, and her feeling like I dont trust her, she loves me.

I tell her how I saw her drive by, and how I followed her into the parking lot of the hotel. She said yes I was there, but did you actually see me go into the hotel? No, I responded. She says, I was in the bar right next door meeting my friends. You should have followed me in and you could have had some wings with us. When I asked why she lied about it, she said I gave her such a hard time about hanging out with her friends she wrote it off as a white lie. She said, I cant belive this is what was bothering you, and she does not know what she would do if she lost me over something as silly as that. I also felt like a huge weight was lifted off my shoulders. We hugged, and I told her I dont care if she hangs out with her friends as long as she is honest about it. I will put my trust in her. We spend Friday night and Saturday together but she has to cut the day short as she has to go back home to help her mom with something. We video chat around 9pm after she takes a shower. She is in her pajamas, in bed. I ask why she is in bed so early, she responds that she had a long day with me and will just get some rest. However, as we video chat, the conversation gets interrupted as someone called her phone 2-3 times. I ask if she needs to take that, she just responds its her friend and she does not want to talk to her. We end the call. It was a bit odd, so 5 minutes later, I call her back. She does not answer the Video call, but texts back "good night handsome" I do not hear from her until around midnight when she texts me how much she wishes I was in the bed with her. I suspect she put on the show so she could go out that night. Next morning I tell her that Im tired of the white lies, and that she hurts me ever time she does that. If she wants to see other people she should let me know so we dont have to hurt each other. We dont talk for few days then she writes me a long text saying that she has lied to me about a lot of things because she did not have much going for hersefl and feared I would not accept her, but none of them were meant to hurt me. She insists however that she never lied about loving me and that she was always faithful to me. After some back and forth texts, she admits that the guy was sending her money as far as March, but she ended that since she did not want to sleep with him. When I asked she also said she want out with friends when she put on her "sleeping beauty" performance. I ask her to think about our relationship and tell me if she would rather keep things casual. She returns the question. I insist she thinks about it, but she is not pushing for the relationship or fwb, and says she is confused. 

Next Thursday comes around, that was the day I found her at the hotel parking lot. When we talk in the morning, she tells me she is heading to the mall to return something. I say great, lets meet there for lunch. Oh, Im sorry I already made plans with my friend, but I can see you tomorrow instead. It seemed odd. I call the restaurants next to the hotel, it does not open until 4pm. the one next to it opens around noon...its a 50/50 chance. So around noon I headed back to the same parking lot behind the hotel. About 20 minutes later she drives in, parks and this time I watch her enter the back entrance of the hotel. I dont confront her. That day we text a little and she tells me she feels like the more things come to light, the more she feels me distance myself away and she is afraid of loosing me. 

When she comes over the next day, I sit down with her and ask if she has anything to tell me. Of course she responds by saying no. I tell her that this time around I stuck around to watch her go in. As she hears me say that she smiles and says "why couldn't you just let that go". That response strikes me as odd. She gives me all the excuses: You didnt see me go in...yes I did, I saw you look around as you entered to make sure nobody was watching. It wasn't me...Im pretty sure I can recognize you and your car. I swear to you on my child I was not fu**ing anyone. I follow up by asking if it was the old sugar daddy or someone new. She insists she was not sleeping with anyone and I am wrong about the whole thing. At this point Im upset because she is blatantly lying. I tell her, listen just be honest  with me. At this point it does not matter which one it was but you being honest makes the difference between parting ways on good terms vs me resenting you. She responds by asking, so its over? I say yes. She storms out without a single sing of remorse. 

 

That was last Friday. I cut all contact with her and have not reached out at all. I will remain in NC. However, she might reach out to me on my birthday in 6 weeks.

 My intuition and my gut is telling me that she was lying to me all along, perhaps still sleeping with the married guy. It tells me she was dishonest about a lot of things and even if we got back together I would have to sleep with one eye open. You dont hurt people you supposedly love.

My heart tells me that she truly loved me, after all she was very affectionate towards me, expressed her love and there was no signs of her distancing herself. It tells me that as a single mother she was in a difficult situation and did that to make the ends meet. Perhaps she was trying to leave her past in the past but was not able to do it as quickly as I did.

I am in NC, and intend to remain that way. However, I am SOOOOO freaking lost because she seemed so in love with me. Please help me shed some light onto this difficult situation. Thank you again for your help and guidance

 

M

 

[MaxxNY]

P.S. Im torn between walking away and never looking back and giving it a week or so then telling her I am willing to give her another chance as long as she ties up her loose ends. 

[kendahke]

57 minutes ago, MaxxNY said:

she says she is confused.

Anytime anyone tells you they are confused, it's because they are waiting for someone else to give them the green light to move forward with them in a relationship, but they're keeping you as the one to fall back on if it doesn't work out.

She's hedging her bets with you and she's playing you out.

Quote

I will remain in NC. However, she might reach out to me on my birthday in 6 weeks.

Every phone has a block feature. Use it. All she'll be doing is bating the hook and you are going to be so hungry for that bait that you will bite--and you leaving avenues open to her getting in contact with you bears that out.

Quote

and giving it a week or so then telling her I am willing to give her another chance as long as she ties up her loose ends.

If she hasn't done that by now, she's not going to do it. She'll lull you back into a stupor and go on doing what she's been doing, but hiding her tracks better.

At her core, she is deceitful and dishonest and you aren't enough to make her open up a can of "act right".

Don't waste a week. End it now. She's not the one.

Get an STD test while you're at it. She's in that hotel on her back a bit too much for your health's sake.

Edited October 11, 2020 by kendahke

[salparadise]

2 hours ago, MaxxNY said:

My intuition and my gut is telling me that she was lying to me all along, perhaps still sleeping with the married guy. It tells me she was dishonest about a lot of things and even if we got back together I would have to sleep with one eye open.

Yea man, you're exactly right. You'd never be able to trust her, and justifiably so. I know it hurts.

There are some people that don't have integrity, conscience and congruency as part of their makeup. And some of them are wrapped in pretty packages with the ability to seduce and convince those who do, for a time. She knew that day was coming but she held if off as long as possible. She was creating a false reality for you, for the purpose of getting her needs met. I mean, anyone who would continue to deny it was her going into the hotel after you caught her red handed... she knew the gig was up, but she had nothing to lose by seeing if she could get you to doubt what you saw with your own eyes (gaslighting). And when you didn't go for it she just makes a quick exit and that's that. The pajama act was precious too. Blatant, premeditated deceit. She has ZERO inhibition. Running scams is de rigueur.

I would bet a thousand dollars that she has a Cluster B disorder. I can't tell which exactly but there are sociopathic features. It's somewhat unusual to encounter people who are willing/able to carry it on to the degree she does. Most people need to believe in their own integrity. She doesn't. Borderline, histrionic, sociopathic are the possibilities. Most likely a blend as these are related and don't have discrete boundaries. I ran into one of these lovelies once up on a time, I wasn't born knowing it either.

Edited October 12, 2020 by salparadise

[schlumpy]

If you could fast forward to the future and look back on this episode in your life detached from the feelings, what advice would you give yourself?

If you could go back in time to where you met this woman and talk with your past self, what advice would you give?

 

Type into your browser "cheating 180" and read the 180 program. Use what applies to your situation. It will help you to detach from your feelings.

[Wiseman2]

Sorry to hear that. The married guy is her lover. You're the wallet. End it. You seem flattered that a younger woman wanted you, but don't be a fool.

[Fletch Lives]

People who lack integrity might be able to love - but love is not enough........you need integrity too. It will hurt for awhile, and then you will feel better, time heals.

[MaxxNY]

12 hours ago, salparadise said:

She knew that day was coming but she held if off as long as possible. She was creating a false reality for you, for the purpose of getting her needs met.

Good morning Thank you all for your replies. We did have strange conversations where she would mention that she would always want to be with me even if it meant she was my lover while I was with someone else. When I asked why not be the main person, somehow she did not see that. No self worth? She also mentioned that I would be the one to let her go, not the other way around. 

As for creating a false reality, for the purpose of getting her needs met, what would those be? I was not giving her money, so it was not abou that. I provided her with love, affection and good sex. Furthermore, she had the ability to remain FWB without creating a messy reality. Why would she insist on loving, caring and wanting to be with me if that was not her goal??? Why fake that when she didnt have to? That is what is messing with me the most, the whole things felt SOOO real. She also mentioned few times how tired she is of her "job" and she wants to find something else. She has a crappy retail job, but maybe she was talking about the guy that kept paying her? Did she truly love me and was struggling with letting go of her sugar daddy? Why would she go to such lengths if she did mean it?

Sorry if Im repeating myself, it just hurts like hell now

Edited October 12, 2020 by MaxxNY
details

[schlumpy]

If it's worth it to you, hire a PI to work up a profile on her.

You may get your answers.

[elaine567]

18 hours ago, MaxxNY said:

Few weeks later, she is at my place and sees a condom on the night stand. She is understandably hurt by this, and it shows. I could have sat there and justify that she knew about other women, etc.

That I guess was the moment she demoted you to "casual".
She put on an act and messed around behind your back... you hurt her badly, it could then have been about revenge...

Also never underestimate the hold MM have on their OW.
Yes it may be convenient to think she was only with him for the money but many OWs are deeply in love and highly addicted to their MM.
They find it difficult if not impossible to move on.
She may have used you to try to even the score with him or to make him jealous, or to try to get him to leave his wife.

OR she is only 28, so hanging around with a 41 yo was maybe "boring", so she lied to get free... 
Whatever it was/is she doesn't sound like relationship/love material - not at present anyway...

[ExpatInItaly]

She is not in the right place in her life to offer you the sort of relationship you want, OP. 

Let her go. This is far too messy and she's got far too many shady dealings for this to ever work out. 

[mark clemson]

7 hours ago, MaxxNY said:

As for creating a false reality, for the purpose of getting her needs met, what would those be?

Some people need a "Plan B".

Yeah, it was remotely plausible until you saw her enter the hotel. You were smart to not trust her TOO much and do some verification for yourself.

It's possible she really does need the MM's money (or "him") or even that she is a prostitute on the side.

Some of the sociopaths and cluster B types can be quite charming/alluring. Regardless of whether she is one of those, enjoy it for what it was, get the STD test, and go back to multidating. There are other fish in the sea and this one isn't LTR material at this point in her life (if she ever was).

Next.

Edited October 12, 2020 by mark clemson

[Lotsgoingon]

On 10/11/2020 at 6:29 PM, MaxxNY said:

 I was 4 months out of a relationship, she was out of a two year "relationship" she had with a married man that ended in December of last year. The guy is her friend's father so she knew the entire family. He was also supporting her financially.  I told her I was dating other women, she told me she recently got tired of being a side piece for a married man and has not been with anyone since then. 

Dude, this "relationship" was going nowhere from the git-go. Both of you showed zero signs of wanting to commit to someone seriously or that you (either of you) had the capacity to commit.

All else is noise.

The big picture is clear: neither of you was ready for a real relationship. 

[kendahke]

Quote

We did have strange conversations where she would mention that she would always want to be with me even if it meant she was my lover while I was with someone else.

So, not only does she not have any respect for you, she has no respect for either your future wife or marriage in general... and she thinks your level of respect for marriage/your wife would be just as bottom of the slime barrel as hers is.  Tells you everything you need to know about how she esteems your character.

Edited October 13, 2020 by kendahke

[vla1120]

It seemed much easier for her to lie than to tell the truth - even about the innocuous stuff. I think letting her go is in your best interest. It might hurt right now, but it will hurt a lot more if you stay involved with her and she continues to deceive you. You'll eventually question everything that comes out of her mouth. That's not a healthy relationship.

[MaxxNY]

Thank you for your insight everyone.

 

On 10/12/2020 at 1:55 PM, elaine567 said:

That I guess was the moment she demoted you to "casual".
She put on an act and messed around behind your back... you hurt her badly, it could then have been about revenge...

elaine567, thank you, I see how me not letting go of other women I was dating in time caused her to feel betrayed and hurt. This is partially my fault. Perhaps in the future I will need to define those boundaries more clearly. 

 

22 hours ago, vla1120 said:

It seemed much easier for her to lie than to tell the truth

Vla1120, I think you are right. The lies started adding up and soon it was hard to cover it all up. 

 

On 10/11/2020 at 8:29 PM, salparadise said:

I would bet a thousand dollars that she has a Cluster B disorder. I can't tell which exactly but there are sociopathic features. It's somewhat unusual to encounter people who are willing/able to carry it on to the degree she does. Most people need to believe in their own integrity. She doesn't. Borderline, histrionic, sociopathic are the possibilities. Most likely a blend as these are related and don't have discrete boundaries. I ran into one of these lovelies once up on a time, I wasn't born knowing it either.

Sal, I had no clue what Cluster B disorders are, but after reading up on them, some of her behaviors made sense. What I couldn't grasp is her affection, and assurances that she wants to love and be with me while she was so insistent on denying her actions. I almost starting looking for rational explanations thinking I must be wrong somehow.  It certainly made me question myself. Please find my picture under the definition of gas-lighting victims. 

 

On 10/11/2020 at 7:18 PM, kendahke said:

Anytime anyone tells you they are confused, it's because they are waiting for someone else to give them the green light to move forward with them in a relationship, but they're keeping you as the one to fall back on if it doesn't work out.

She's hedging her bets with you and she's playing you out.

Thank you

 

On 10/11/2020 at 7:18 PM, kendahke said:

If she hasn't done that by now, she's not going to do it. She'll lull you back into a stupor and go on doing what she's been doing, but hiding her tracks better.

You are certainly right, I was just lying to myself, hoping for her to change. The reality of it is, she does not want to change. She wants to have her cake and eat it too, and Im too dumb to see that via the pink colored glasses

[ExpatInItaly]

1 hour ago, MaxxNY said:

What I couldn't grasp is her affection, and assurances that she wants to love and be with me while she was so insistent on denying her actions.

She probably wanted to close her old account and open a new one with the Bank Of MaxxNY. 

[MaxxNY]

5 minutes ago, ExpatInItaly said:

She probably wanted to close her old account and open a new one with the Bank Of MaxxNY. 

I hear you Expat, but I was always VERY careful to make sure I do not buy a woman's affection or even give them such perception. Sure, I paid for dinners or dates, she did as well, but there was no financial incentives here. 

[kendahke]

1 hour ago, MaxxNY said:

You are certainly right, I was just lying to myself, hoping for her to change. The reality of it is, she does not want to change. She wants to have her cake and eat it too, and Im too dumb to see that via the pink colored glasses

so how are you going to proceed? Knowing this is one thing--it's in the doing that change is made.

[ExpatInItaly]

4 minutes ago, MaxxNY said:

I hear you Expat, but I was always VERY careful to make sure I do not buy a woman's affection or even give them such perception. Sure, I paid for dinners or dates, she did as well, but there was no financial incentives here. 

I hear you , and I believe you.

However, that won't stop opportunists from trying. You don't have be splashing out for her to be looking to attach herself to you, if you are financially stable. So, it's not entirely correct to assume you offer no financial incentives. 

[salparadise]

3 hours ago, MaxxNY said:

Sal, I had no clue what Cluster B disorders are, but after reading up on them, some of her behaviors made sense. What I couldn't grasp is her affection, and assurances that she wants to love and be with me while she was so insistent on denying her actions. I almost starting looking for rational explanations thinking I must be wrong somehow.  It certainly made me question myself. Please find my picture under the definition of gas-lighting victims. 

Keep reading. There is a lot to absorb about how these disorders manifest. They're chameleons; they become who they perceive you want them to be, and they're good at reading what you want and need. But it's a deception, an illusion, a role they play to secure and maintain attachment. They use others attachment and adoration to bolster their empty identity and sense of self. Their need for supply is strong, and they're motivated. But when someone has zero inhibition to carry on an elaborate deception, it's not about love and affection; it's a con and you're the mark. It's sad really. These folks suffer, and they didn't choose to be they way they are. I'm sure they'd love to be normal and have genuine relationships, but they don't have the necessary mental and emotional framework that most of us take for granted. No real empathy, no ability to care about others beyond the compulsion to get their own needs met. Search on the user 'Downtown' in these forums and read the stories he has participated in. There are many, and a lot of them got in much deeper than you.

[LoveAnimals]

On 10/11/2020 at 8:29 PM, salparadise said:

Yea man, you're exactly right. You'd never be able to trust her, and justifiably so. I know it hurts.

There are some people that don't have integrity, conscience and congruency as part of their makeup. And some of them are wrapped in pretty packages with the ability to seduce and convince those who do, for a time. She knew that day was coming but she held if off as long as possible. She was creating a false reality for you, for the purpose of getting her needs met. I mean, anyone who would continue to deny it was her going into the hotel after you caught her red handed... she knew the gig was up, but she had nothing to lose by seeing if she could get you to doubt what you saw with your own eyes (gaslighting). And when you didn't go for it she just makes a quick exit and that's that. The pajama act was precious too. Blatant, premeditated deceit. She has ZERO inhibition. Running scams is de rigueur.

I would bet a thousand dollars that she has a Cluster B disorder. I can't tell which exactly but there are sociopathic features. It's somewhat unusual to encounter people who are willing/able to carry it on to the degree she does. Most people need to believe in their own integrity. She doesn't. Borderline, histrionic, sociopathic are the possibilities. Most likely a blend as these are related and don't have discrete boundaries. I ran into one of these lovelies once up on a time, I wasn't born knowing it either.

All of this is on point. Reading your post on this woman OP, took me back to my experience with a narcissistic cluster B disordered ex from my recent past. It was my first experience with one (hopefully my last) and it is truly shocking the level of deceit these individuals will partake in. I am talking living double, even triple lives simultaneously, all while planning futures with multiple different people. Their act is so shockingly convincing that most people end up with some form of PTSD from it. They study you and will morph into whatever they believe will hook you in. You asked why she would do this because its not like you were subsidizing her lifestyle, but they do it simply for attention, adulation, etc. You are only there to prop their ego and majority of these individuals cant be alone. Do yourself a favor and block her on everything and don't ever look back. Should you go back with her, it will not end well and you may find yourself broke, heartbroken and completely destroyed by then. Be grateful you didn't waste more time with her. 

 

[Goodguy05]

Nah she's deceitful and manipulative she knows she's got you wrapped around her little pinky. I would take a guess and say the hotel was something related to sex with someone probably that married guy that pays her money. She wants the $$ as you mentioned she's a single mum finding it tough 

[spiderowl]

Anyone who can put on a performance of going to bed early and even dressing up in pyjamas and getting in bed is not to be trusted.  She planned that, she carried it out, and she tried to trick you.  Whatever her feelings for you, she is capable of doing that.  I think you did the right thing in dumping her.