I think my wife is cheating on me with a coworker

[Wiseman2]

"Hope you're ok" sounds like she has been confiding in him about your behaviors and her unhappiness with you, your marriage and her situation.

Clearly it would have been better to come to you and discuss the problems but given your temper,  raging and basic controlling, threatening nature, it sounds like she found a safer shoulder to cry on.

Have you stopped an "affair"? probably not. Have you pushed her away further with your tyranny? probably so.

People who work together really don't need phones to have affairs. It sounds like she deleted the texts to assert her boundaries not cover up some imagined affair with some kid at work.

Basically it seems like your marriage has been in the toilet for quite a while but your temper and ego have prevented any discussion about this.

The pack the bags chaos and drama is an excellent example of someone who flies off the handle .

[MrFlibble_is_very_cross]

@Wiseman2 from what I can tell from messages I saw it was more the other way. My W is his comfidant. But obviously I have no idea about nature od their conversations at work. But I can't imagine situation where I write to my married coworker at 10pm that I'm thinking about her and expect to keep our relationship platonic

Your other observations are plain wrong. I love my wife, our marriage was great until this summer. We always communicated our differences head-on. 
 

I think you are exchanging cause and effect here

[MrFlibble_is_very_cross]

I texted W for the first time since I left. Told her I'm OK, just don't want to talk to her right now. She replied "I understand and I want you to know that I love you" 

Well, that hurt. Thanks

So at least for now there is radio silence. I think my resolution to not get pulled into this without clear mind is working. Mild Yay!

Problem I have now is that I have basicaly nowhere to go. So I will probably end up back home this evening. Not sure if it isn't too soon. f*** this Covid

[Harry Korsnes]

18 minutes ago, MrFlibble_is_very_cross said:

I texted W for the first time since I left. Told her I'm OK, just don't want to talk to her right now. She replied "I understand and I want you to know that I love you" 

Well, that hurt. Thanks

So at least for now there is radio silence. I think my resolution to not get pulled into this without clear mind is working. Mild Yay!

Problem I have now is that I have basicaly nowhere to go. So I will probably end up back home this evening. Not sure if it isn't too soon. f*** this Covid

How about your parents place? Or maybe she can leave for a while? Best is for both of you to clear your minds before speaking and making any divisjons. 

[Ocdude]

28 minutes ago, MrFlibble_is_very_cross said:

I texted W for the first time since I left. Told her I'm OK, just don't want to talk to her right now. She replied "I understand and I want you to know that I love you" 

Well, that hurt. Thanks

So at least for now there is radio silence. I think my resolution to not get pulled into this without clear mind is working. Mild Yay!

Problem I have now is that I have basicaly nowhere to go. So I will probably end up back home this evening. Not sure if it isn't too soon. f*** this Covid

If she wasn’t having an affair,  why would she “understand”?  She should be more focused  that you have the wrong conclusion and trying to be open to prove it.

[Ruby Slippers]

Good for you for making it clear you won't accept this totally unacceptable and highly disrespectful behavior. 

[Watercolors]

OP, if you can stay with your parents that seems like the most ideal solution. 

It’s great that your boss gave you the week off of work so that you can emotionally process your situation with your wife. 

You did not overreact either. Your wife is or will try to gaslight you, to avoid taking responsibility. Don’t fall for her gaslighting.

Don’t let her sidetrack you with discussions that have nothing to do with her inappropriate boundary crossing behavior with her male coworker. She will try to keep you off track, so that she doesn’t have to answer for herself.

She’ll try to keep the focus on you and your reaction as being wrong, or she’ll swing the opposite direction and feign guilt and remorse (don’t fall for that either). 

What your wife has done with her boundary crossing behavior, is shatter the sanctity of your marriage. Sorry to sound dramatic, but she has. She has betrayed your trust and shat on all that was good between you two, choosing to act inappropriately with her male coworker. 

Use this week to ground yourself emotionally, if nothing else. Ground yourself. If that means going on long walks to think and process, and take deep breaths, then do that. Or go biking or running. 

You need to approach your wife with a calm mind that is prepared for the cirque du soleil like mental gymnastics she’ll perform on you, in order to avoid taking responsibility for the way she hurt you and your children together with her emotional (physical) affair. Also, be prepared for your wife to lie to your social network for sympathy, just in case she makes you out to be the bad guy. I don’t know that she will. But that is why you need to use the next few days to ground yourself mentally, or you won’t be able to get through this mess to the other side. 

Edited November 9, 2020 by Watercolors

[Dreamer2017]

Dear Mr. F,

I'm sorry you find yourself here.  I will give you my thoughts after accessing your situation.

1.) Go Home!!! Don't ever leave your home.  It is your wife that committed infidelity and she should be the one that leaves.

2.) Asked her for a complete timeline for future consideration.

3.) Start the 180.

4.) Contact the HR department of their organization.

5.) Most importantly, focus on yourself!!  Find hobbies and other things that bring you joy and excitement.

6.) Don't be afraid to expose the entire affair.  Expose it to everyone.

Best,

Dreamer

[TobyBoy]

Have you checked your wife’s phone usage online? That is where I would start. Although, if they’re using iMessage on iPhones, they’re texts won’t show, but calls will. 

[MrFlibble_is_very_cross]

Thank you all for your advice. You give me tremendous help and show insight which I am unable to see. I sometimes have tendencies to overact and you help me to keep myself in check. 
 

Everything around here is closed down due to Covid restrictions and I have nowhere to go. My parents can't take me in and I don't want to pull more of my friends into my problems. Not in global pandemic.

 

So i decided to go back tonight. I miss my kids

 

[mark clemson]

I think, speaking generally, that men and women who forbid their partners to have ANY friends of the opposite sex are insecure, jealous, and controlling. No need for any retractions, I think that's a statement of fact.

That wasn't you IMO - you allowed this friendship, didn't attempt to forbid it. You did "monitor" it, which I think is reasonable.

The flips side is that, unfortunately, friendships CAN SOMETIMES be a slippery slope to an affair, which it seems is exactly what happened with you. You are not alone - this has happened to literally millions of other people as well.

It's POSSIBLE that much of the "interest" was coming from him and she deleted the texts so that you wouldn't worry about something she enjoyed but also thought wasn't a betrayal and that she could handle. The role of confidante without it become more than that. There's no way to know for sure now. From what you've posted, I think the chance of that actually being true is LOW. I think this was most likely a genuine EA that was heading towards PA if it hadn't made it there already unfortunately.

You'll have to sort out what you think is most likely and what your next steps are. There are those who can attempt to reconcile and those who simply cannot. You are who you are. It seems she is very interested in reconciling - that's positive. However, it's also by no means guaranteed. You definitely should NOT allow all this to be rugswept. IF you want to reconcile too, then you don't want to be SO harsh and/or ruled by negative emotions that it drives her away. While I don't recommend divorces, it's also true that for some people, if they can't regain their feeling of trust then they have little wish to stay married. I think you'll need time to process your emotions and figure out what you really want to do.

[mark clemson]

1 hour ago, Dreamer2017 said:

4.) Contact the HR department of their organization.

6.) Don't be afraid to expose the entire affair.  Expose it to everyone.

People on forums like this like to give this advice or similar based either on their personal morals or on vindictiveness towards affair partners generally. Probably sometimes both. However IMO it is NOT in your best interest to rush into either of these suggestions without making some decisions AND talking to a lawyer first. The reasons are:

• If you want to divorce and you reveal this her HR dept she may lose her job. THEN your spousal support payments would go up substantively. This hurts both you AND your children economically (she will have at least partial custody). If she can't find another job it may hurt your children economically PERMANENTLY. It may impact your ability to live the lifestyle you choose AND possibly to move on (if that's in the cards) as dating costs money.
• If you DON'T want to divorce, then you should be aware that in some areas an AP (your wife) can be sued if there is a divorce. That would obviously potentially impact you, your kids, etc. You don't mention whether the OM is married or not so possibly this doesn't apply, but I strongly suspect most people would want to know this before informing his wife.

A talk with a lawyer should help clarify these matters at which point you can make the most sensible decisions that align to your personal views. In the US many family attorneys will give free 1/2 hour consults and you can go to several and get many questions answered; however I'm not sure if that's true where you are. Possibly you are very rich and simply don't care, but that's not something I would assume to be true.

It may be a good idea to talk to a lawyer just in case SHE decides she wants to divorce, as that can sometimes happen as well in these situations. Be aware that in SOME areas, if there is court-admissible evidence of an affair it can lead to substantive changes in any settlement. I also DO think that IF you stay together, your wife changing jobs to a new company as soon as is reasonably possible would be a reasonable request if she wants to regain your trust, so that would be something for you to consider as well.

Edited November 9, 2020 by mark clemson

[elaine567]

If you are certain you want to divorce and don't care that your kids may be singled out for gossip and abuse over their cheating mother, then go ahead  tell everyone in sight.
But if you suspect you will want to stay and reconcile, then tell as few people as possible.
We had a guy on here, whose family rejected his cheating wife and so family events were then no go areas, his kids were banned from their cousin's birthday parties and even he became person non grata as he had decided to stay and forgive his wife...  He forgave but his extended family wouldn't.

[Harry Korsnes]

2 minutes ago, elaine567 said:

If you are certain you want to divorce and don't care that your kids may be singled out for gossip and abuse over their cheating mother, then go ahead  tell everyone in sight.
But if you suspect you will want to stay and reconcile, then tell as few people as possible.
We had a guy on here, whose family rejected his cheating wife and so family events were then no go areas, his kids were banned from their cousin's birthday parties and even he became person non grata as he had decided to stay and forgive his wife...  He forgave but his extended family imwouldn't.

Imo this is so early and fresh to even think about divorce. They need to sitt down and talk to find out Whats realy going on, and try therapy.

[elaine567]

1 minute ago, Harry Korsnes said:

Imo this is so early and fresh to even think about divorce. They need to sitt down and talk to find out Whats realy going on, and try therapy.

Oh I agree, as really he knows so little about what went on. He jumped the gun with no real proof, and all he has is that text that could be open to interpretation...

[Ruby Slippers]

A text from a dude she's been texting with for weeks/months, gone out to lunch with, and raised suspicion where none was raised before sending her a "can't stop thinking about you" text at 10:00 at night is very obvious evidence of an emotional affair. There's no way in hell any man would ever have texted me "can't stop thinking about you" while I was in a relationship. I never would have let it get anywhere near that point - UNLESS we were doing something we definitely shouldn't have been doing = having at the very least an emotional affair. 

[ExpatInItaly]

1 hour ago, mark clemson said:

People on forums like this like to give this advice or similar based either on their personal morals or on vindictiveness towards affair partners generally. Probably sometimes both. However IMO it is NOT in your best interest to rush into either of these suggestions without making some decisions AND talking to a lawyer first. The reasons are:

• If you want to divorce and you reveal this her HR dept she may lose her job. THEN your spousal support payments would go up substantively. This hurts both you AND your children economically (she will have at least partial custody). If she can't find another job it may hurt your children economically PERMANENTLY. It may impact your ability to live the lifestyle you choose AND possibly to move on (if that's in the cards) as dating costs money.

All of the above. 

I wouldn't go nuclear at this point, OP. I especially wouldn't blow it up at work for her either. Not smart in times like this when work can be hard to come by, and very likely not necessary. It would do more harm than good right now, for you. 

In light of Covid, you may indeed need to go back home (if hotels are also closed or you don't wish to shell out for one right now) but I would make it very clear that you need your emotional space to untangle your thoughts and will speak to her about this when you are ready. 

[IslandSanctuary]

Don't let people tell you that you are 'insecure' 'possessive' and 'controlling' if you are uncomfortable with your spouses relationships with the opposite sex. 

Many leading marriage counsellors, infidelity experts and psychologists agree that close relationships with the opposite sex, and treating opposite sex friendships like same sex friendships while in a relationship is a bad idea and not something they would be comfortable with. 

Over half of the population isn't comfortable with their spouse having close 1 on 1 friendships with the opposite sex, and in a lot of non English speaking countries it is completely taboo. 100 years ago it didn't exist anywhere(you know our grandparents generation that everyone uses as a gleaming beacon of hope for marriages lasting).

Personally I don't have time to be close friends with women. I have my partner, my job, I hardly even catch up with my guy friends. I once dated a girl that was big on guy friends, she'd even get some to stay over at her house when they were visiting from out of town. She told me I was 'controlling' and 'insecure' for having a problem with it. So I started hanging out and fostering friendships with other women that were casual aquaintances. I could tell she had a problem with this, but because I was just mirroring what she was doing she couldn't say anything. I ended up at one of their houses playing cards and it just felt really weird. Isn't something I want to do, isn't something I need. Women that need a lot of male attention and from multiple different men are generally damaged and a divorce waiting to happen. 

If you aren't comfortable with your wife going out with guys, or spending a lot of time with another man  then that is NORMAL. Sure some people have different ideas about what is acceptable and what starts being inappropriate, some people are fine with their partner having multiple opposite sex friends. But these people do not get to label you negative terms used for far more extreme behaviour - this is manipulative abuse. 

Get your wife to read 'Not Just Friends' by Dr Shirley Glass. 

Edited November 9, 2020 by IslandSanctuary

[mark clemson]

36 minutes ago, IslandSanctuary said:

Don't let people tell you that you are 'insecure' 'possessive' and 'controlling' if you are uncomfortable with your spouses relationships with the opposite sex.

If you aren't comfortable with your wife going out with guys, or spending a lot of time with another man  then that is NORMAL. Sure some people have different ideas about what is acceptable and what starts being inappropriate, some people are fine with their partner having multiple opposite sex friends. But these people do not get to label you negative terms used for far more extreme behaviour - this is manipulative abuse.

Insecure, possessive and controlling are EXACTLY the appropriate labels to put on a person who won't let the partner have ANY opposite sex friends. Claiming they aren't and that those terms are for "worse" behavior is an attempt to dodge the issue. I did not claim it was "abuse" or "cruelty", or use lots of adjectives like "horrible" or similar. Giving THE RIGHT labels to a behavior is not manipulative abuse - it's stating facts.

Now if one's partner is spending tons of time, going on psuedo-dates, etc frequently with a specific friend that SHOULD make one feel insecure IMO as it potential major threat to the relationship. There's a big difference between defending a marriage against an actual, known threat and impotently attempting to defend it against hordes of imagined ones. If your spouse really wants to cheat, no forbidding of friendships will stop them. They'll just find a way to go behind your back.

A partner can attempt to set whatever boundaries they want in a relationship. And there are probably those out there who will accept them if you look for that or simply are fortunate to find someone who's fine with them. But for many if not most people, if your boundaries don't actually make sense in the first place, they will eventually be violated.

[MrFlibble_is_very_cross]

I will read all your posts tonight to kill time since I doubt I will get much sleep. Again, thank you and I am sorry if i'm not able to reply to you all. I will try to answer as many questions as possible

[kismetkismet]

You were right to trust your instincts. I don't think you were being controlling or demanding, if you hadn't delved into this with her,  you wouldn't have uncovered the fact that she's well on her way to an emotional affair, if not a physical one. I don't think that ALL opposite sex friendships are wrong - my best friend of 10yrs is a guy - but you do get a 'feeling' when you see two people together that have some kind of sexual/emotional tension. 

I don't think it's impossible to salvage this, but she absolutely needs to do something about this relationship she's started. "Can't stop thinking about you" is not a thing that friends say to each other. I would go to therapy and get to the bottom of this. You need to find out the nature of their relationship and what exactly led her to go down this rabbit hole. There's no excuse for her behaviour, but it may help to find out what may have been missing in your relationship and how the two of you can work on rebuilding it. OR you may find that things have gone too far to reel it back in. 

[MrFlibble_is_very_cross]

So I made it home.

 

My wife is apparently going through some kind of mental breakdown. She looks utterly crushed.

 

She tried to hug me the moment I took off my coat and let me tell you, that did not go well. The only reason this didn't end up in collosal fight was that kids came rushing in so we just kind of played it off.

I was surprised to find her sister sitting in our living room. I think she wants to play a middleman, but I told her it's too soon for any serious discussion. But I am glad she is here.

 

I spent some time with kids just playing and talking. In the meantime W went out on on a porch and I saw her calling someone while crying. She came back after 10 minutes and just sat there watching us play.

We are pretty civil around our kids, but I know they can sense something is off. We are usually very close to each other, kissing while passing types. But now we are practising this social distancing. Yeah, Funny times we live in. 

 

W came to my office later and wanted to talk. I just told her it's not the right time and she should just leave me alone. At least for today. Before she left she asked me If I am going to leave her. I honestly had no answer for that. I don't want her to think I'm playing some mind games with her, I am just going with the flow and sometimes drowning, other times gasping for air. Maybe I should have told her that. Or not. It sound pathetic and made up and kind of.. I don't know. Enough rambling for now

 

So tonight I am going to sleep in a guest room since kids are used to coming to our bed in the morning for cuddles with mommy (daddy is grumpy in the morning) and i don't want to take this from them. Still oscilling between sadness and anger most of the time. It will probably take some time to get back some kind of stability. 

 

It was nice to put our kids to bed together. When parting ways at staircase (she sleeps upstairs in our bedroom, I stay downstairs in guest room) she asked me to not give up on her and told me she's ready to fight when I am ready. So now I am sitting on a bed sobbing and putting this online for Internet strangers to help me to sort this out

 

Mr. Flibble is not very cross anymore. Just really, really sad. 

Edited November 9, 2020 by MrFlibble_is_very_cross

[SSM3]

On 11/8/2020 at 2:49 PM, MrFlibble_is_very_cross said:

But texting your married coworker at 1am that you just had a fight with your GF and wanting emotional support is NOT OK. It's disaster waiting to happen. And my wife still doesn't see it. Or chooses to ignore it. Which is even worse.

Agreed.

I would NOT be happy either and if something is not going on between them then I think it will at some stage or another. This needs to be 'nipped in the bud' now.

[schlumpy]

You are in the drivers seat. This should all unfold at your tempo, not hers.

She already made her choice. This is about your decision.

[Buffer]

Ok, just breath and let’s get our mind in on this. 
talk to about her EA or possible PA in short periods say 10 minutes at a time. Easy thing is to write out what you want to ask. Just to keep yourself focused. 
Cheaters lie and they lie a lot so to ‘not hurt you’. In reality it is about hiding their actions. 
Just one day at a time. 
buffer