Dating a Married Woman

[kconleyk]

1 hour ago, ExpatInItaly said:

This a great learning moment: don't believe everything someone says. 

She is not to be trusted, and never was. Her words are meaningless when her behavior and choices speak a lot more loudly and betray those words. 

She has shown you very clearly that she's incredibly self-serving and will say whatever she thinks sounds good to get what she wants.   Don't let this woman near your home again. You'll never move on if she's always lingering around in some way. 

Out of curiosity, how did you think this was going to play out? That she would file for divorce and start a relationship with you, or?

Also, what do you plan to say to her husband if he finds out and comes banging on your door? Or tells everyone in your circle and daughter's team that you were nailing his wife? I don't say that to be crude, but have you genuinely taken the time to anticipate the consequences of this? It could go a lot further than your own hurt feelings, OP. 

Replying from a phone so sorry for any errors, but I wanted to reply because I appreciate your response.  

I take your response in sections.  First she told me she had been unhappy in marriage, since her oldest was born, I asked why have two more kids then and she said she wanted a family.    She lost her brother when she was younger and the way she said it all it made sense to me.   So I'm probably just naive and stupid.  

I thought it would play out with casual dating while she was going to persue and initiate a divorce.   She told me to please let her get through holidays before she started anything.   I tried to keep it light hearted and fun, but feelings hit quick, on both of our parts.   At least from what I can tell.   I think things happened to quicky and scared her.    She kept saying she needed to learn to be happy for herself and not rely on someone else.    She told me the entire time her marriage was over.  Her saying to me always was "the situation is temporary, we are not".   Then as I said she spent the night Saturday and we had a great night together but Sunday she mentioned not having a crystal ball and not knowing if her marriage was over, she thought it was but she has to live day to day and couldn't predict the future.       

If her husband showed up I would show him the texts, show him how she told me her marriage was over and how I told her I wasn't allowing anything  to happen unless they were truly separated.  

I live in a small town, the other parents on the team know the situation and know what was happening.   The majority of them are good friends and I've known for 10+ years.  I talked with all of them, and told them what happened and they said they understand why I did it and that I can't be blamed because she blatantly lied to me.    

I still can't wrap my head around that nothing she said she felt was true.    I saw the look in her eyes when we talked, I read all her texts again and everything shows she has/had strong feelings for me.    I'm having a rough night missing her so hard right now.   We would text all day and all night long, she made me feel wanted.  Now I feel worthless.  

[ExpatInItaly]

You weren’t allowing anything to happen unless they were separated?

You let all of this happen knowing she wasn’t separated. I somehow don’t think showing any messages to an angry husband about to open a can of whoop-ass on you is going to make him sympathetic toward you.

Forgive me, but unless I’m missing something, you knew the entire time that she was married. It doesn’t matter how unhappy she claims she was - you knew was still another’s man’s wife, no? She didn’t exactly lie about that, based on your description. I don’t see where she told you she had even filed for legal separation. 

At the end of the day, you got burned in exactly the same way so many affair partners do. You need to own your role in this and realize that while she’s might have indeed fudged the truth in her favour, you are not innocent in this. It doesn’t make you a bad person but it does mean you need to make much better decisions and polish up your moral compass. It got very tarnished somewhere along the way here and I think that’s part of what’s upsetting you now. You compromised your own ethics and it only hurt you. 

[mark clemson]

15 hours ago, kconleyk said:

My daughters mom was definitely Borderline, so I am used to it but why am I attracted to these people, there are perfectly good women in my area who would love to go out with me and I am not remotely attracted to any of them.

This sucks

Hmm. Perhaps you have a type and that type is "complicated". I get it actually and agree that, taken too far, it's NOT good.

Something to consider therapy about, perhaps. If you "fix your picker" and can feel attracted to women more capable of healthy relationships, I imagine you'll have a much easier time of things in the long run.

[mark clemson]

5 hours ago, kconleyk said:

  She told me the entire time her marriage was over.  Her saying to me always was "the situation is temporary, we are not".   Then as I said she spent the night Saturday and we had a great night together but Sunday she mentioned not having a crystal ball and not knowing if her marriage was over, she thought it was but she has to live day to day and couldn't predict the future.      

I live in a small town, the other parents on the team know the situation and know what was happening.   The majority of them are good friends and I've known for 10+ years.  I talked with all of them, and told them what happened and they said they understand why I did it and that I can't be blamed because she blatantly lied to me.   

Your worth has essentially nothing to do with her, actually.

Clearly this woman does not know her own mind. Either that or she is just a female "player" diving into the fun and then getting right back out again.

The more you talk about this to others, the greater the risk that it gets back to her husband and blows up her life to at least some extent (and yours too, to a lesser extent). I'm assuming you don't want to cause harm to her or break up her family if that's not actually something she wants. Something to keep in mind. "Loose lips sink ships." Those are the risks people take when they cheat.

[Bonifidelifelover]

My situation is entirely Entirely different. We follow each other on Instagram but are not actively hooking up. It’s a long story.  
 

but I definitely feel the anecdote is the no contact. It has to be extreme in order for it to work. I would simply just ignore her! I think she’s been lying alL along about her marriage. End things ASAP 

[Zona]

16 hours ago, kconleyk said:

Every relationship I have allowed myself to get in after I split with my daughters mom has ended truly insanely or now with this been a bad idea from the start.  Why am I attracted to such bad characters?

1) Was in a relationship with another woman from soccer (the girls were no longer on the same team and weren't friends) we dated for a few months.   A mutual friend set us up.   I thought things were going good and then one day I wake up, and the mutual friend who set us up, called me to tell me the woman I was dating and her husband and been having an affair on the side for over a year and she had just found out.

2) I dated a PreK teacher at my daughters school (funny thing is the married woman is a PreK teacher at the same school) we dated for 3-4 months and things were going great.    One day she told me her ex showed up at her door and proposed, and while she said no to him she wants to to be with him again, they are now married...

3) I get involved with a married chic

Something has to be wrong with me

 

Well I am certainly not one to judge about getting involved with people who have issues. My LTGF from when I was much younger cheated on me after a year of living together. I still love that woman and suffered from limerence for decades. Looking back I see now that she was likely BPD. Had all the classic traits. Narcissism run in my WW's family.

However I have never cheated on anyone ever. I would never get involved with a married woman for the reasons you are discovering now.

[Milly May June]

I think logically you understand that this situation is not sustainable nor healthy for you (or your DD). With NC, if you choose to go this route, i think in a short time you will see this woman in another light and your heart will catch up with your head. 

What can this woman offer you and your DD in the future (that is if she even wants a future with you)? Lies, manipulation and complications. 

See a therapist to learn your relationship patterns and why you are attracted to certain traits in ppl. 

[kconleyk]

4 hours ago, Milly May June said:

I think logically you understand that this situation is not sustainable nor healthy for you (or your DD). With NC, if you choose to go this route, i think in a short time you will see this woman in another light and your heart will catch up with your head. 

What can this woman offer you and your DD in the future (that is if she even wants a future with you)? Lies, manipulation and complications. 

See a therapist to learn your relationship patterns and why you are attracted to certain traits in ppl. 

I do logically grasp everything, the fact of the matter is I am not even sure it was so much about her, yes she was hot, yes things she did drove me wild but at the end of the day it was the incredible High feeling she left me with.    She made it seem like she cared so much.   Asking about my day, remembering things about my friends or family and the stories I told, holding my hand, if we were together and we were cooking dinner or something, she would make sure we touched every time we passed by.     She knew the right things to say in the bedroom, or first thing in the morning.   She told me she didn't say or take certain things lightly that if she was telling me them it was a big deal.     

She was/is like a drug and I feel like I am with drawling, it's such a crazy feeling.

I know I am just as much at fault here, and I am not trying to deny any of that, but I don't understand how someone says and does those things and can do it with no care or meaning.

[Milly May June]

I really think that in the beginning of trying to connect with a person you tune into their unmet needs and say and do things that you think the other person is craving. This tactic is kind of munipalative. Some people do it unconciously and some are very concious of what they are doing. So what you are experiencing is nothing unusual. You probably do the same to her weather you know it or not. 

Look, when you are single and date single people you have the luxery to live in the blissfull infatuation phase of a relationship. You can just live in the moment and not think about the long term aspect of how things may or may not work out. If it works out great. If not, well you move on. But once you enter in an affair it is crutial to think about the long term goal here and long term potential. Because the conseqvences of your actions are affecting so many people outside your bubble. You, MW, her H, your DD, her DD, families on both sides, friends etc... So think long term, once the infatuation fades (and it will), can you see a future with this woman long term and all the bagage she will bring to your door? 

What qualities do you see in her as a partner? At this time all I can see is her manipulating you to string you a long, laying and betraying her husband and puttning her DD and your DD friendship at risk to make herself feel good. Actions show a persons true character. She is showing you who she really is. Believe her actions. Not her words or romantic gestues. 

[kconleyk]

47 minutes ago, Milly May June said:

I really think that in the beginning of trying to connect with a person you tune into their unmet needs and say and do things that you think the other person is craving. This tactic is kind of munipalative. Some people do it unconciously and some are very concious of what they are doing. So what you are experiencing is nothing unusual. You probably do the same to her weather you know it or not. 

Look, when you are single and date single people you have the luxery to live in the blissfull infatuation phase of a relationship. You can just live in the moment and not think about the long term aspect of how things may or may not work out. If it works out great. If not, well you move on. But once you enter in an affair it is crutial to think about the long term goal here and long term potential. Because the conseqvences of your actions are affecting so many people outside your bubble. You, MW, her H, your DD, her DD, families on both sides, friends etc... So think long term, once the infatuation fades (and it will), can you see a future with this woman long term and all the bagage she will bring to your door? 

What qualities do you see in her as a partner? At this time all I can see is her manipulating you to string you a long, laying and betraying her husband and puttning her DD and your DD friendship at risk to make herself feel good. Actions show a persons true character. She is showing you who she really is. Believe her actions. Not her words or romantic gestues. 

Thank You. Truly.  Thank You 

[kconleyk]

Her daughter is coming over for a play date tonight, I asked her to just stay in the car, that her daughter could just run in, to just stay in the car.  

I will keep hurting so my daughter doesn't have to. I know probably to little to late but now I'm hurting for my daughter too

[kconleyk]

She Sent me this text out of the blue today....

No matter what you think you were not just a distraction to me. But things can't go back to how they were. I cannot be in another relationship right now while I'm figuring out what's going to happen in my marriage. Things went too far too fast with us. No matter what I feel, no matter how much I miss you, I can't go back. No one can help me focus on me except me. I need to decide what I really want and need.

It is not him finding the right words. And I am still sleeping separately in the house. I miss you and I feel what I feel, or felt, but I am using my head right now. The physical stuff was great, It was too many texts. They started to become overwhelming. This was before Sunday. And then feeling like if I didn't text you back right away you would be upset or hurt. I was taking too much time away from driving safely, from my kids, from my job to text you, but was so worried that you'd be upset if I didn't. It moved too fast. Most of the texts were about feelings and you wanting to make sure I was still feeling things...I understand and you have that right, but it was too much too fast. I can't worry about making other people happy right now. I did that growing up with an alcoholic father. I always put my wants and needs at the bottom of the list. It's something I learned about myself through the sessions. And I can't figure things out if we are together. It's hard enough still being married and separated in the same house and trying to figure things out, let alone in another relationship.

 

[Milly May June]

OP, Its good that you are seeing things more realisticly and not with rose colored glasses.

If you want to extract yourself from this situation i would recomend complete NC. You need to set firm boundries with the MW. Avoid all contact if you can. If you must then answer only texts regarding DDs playdates. It will get harder unfortunetly. I am sorry you have found yourself in this situation and I hope you find the right partner for you. You seem like a good guy despite all the crazyness. Best of luck to you! 

P. S. If I were in your shoes i would also mentally prepare for a potential fallout if the H finds out. You have told some people so the chances are things will come to light and this will affect you and your D. If her H finds out, be honest with him. 

[BareBones]

Wow.
I’m glad she texted you back—I believe she’s trying to be as honest as possible, but the weight of figuring out what she’s doing with her marriage mixed with trying to be in a relationship with you is clearly too heavy for her now. 
 

My advice would be to extremely limit contact/NC with her. And let her situation play out… If she really has feelings for you when she ends her marriage, she would reach back out to you. And if she doesn’t, then it wasn’t meant to be. I don’t think anything good can come of you guys connecting any further because it’s just gonna push her way more because of the pressure she feels of this potential relationship.

I say all of this because I struggle with a similar situation. I have yet to meet the MM (I’m single/never married), we only have spoken, which I know is still wrong.

But I know he retreats when he starts to feel guilt. And I’m at the point where I feel like I should just let his situation play out (stop contact) and once he formally separates/gets divorced then we can actually meet up and talk. Because if we take it to a physical level and things blow up there’s nothing but negative that will transpire.
 

And I fear for you if her H finds out, There definitely will be no chance for you all because of the drama surrounding it. And I echo what other folks have said here— I would not tell anyone else about the situation.

keep us updated and good luck.

BB

 

[Bonifidelifelover]

13 hours ago, kconleyk said:

She Sent me this text out of the blue today....

No matter what you think you were not just a distraction to me. But things can't go back to how they were. I cannot be in another relationship right now while I'm figuring out what's going to happen in my marriage. Things went too far too fast with us. No matter what I feel, no matter how much I miss you, I can't go back. No one can help me focus on me except me. I need to decide what I really want and need.

It is not him finding the right words. And I am still sleeping separately in the house. I miss you and I feel what I feel, or felt, but I am using my head right now. The physical stuff was great, It was too many texts. They started to become overwhelming. This was before Sunday. And then feeling like if I didn't text you back right away you would be upset or hurt. I was taking too much time away from driving safely, from my kids, from my job to text you, but was so worried that you'd be upset if I didn't. It moved too fast. Most of the texts were about feelings and you wanting to make sure I was still feeling things...I understand and you have that right, but it was too much too fast. I can't worry about making other people happy right now. I did that growing up with an alcoholic father. I always put my wants and needs at the bottom of the list. It's something I learned about myself through the sessions. And I can't figure things out if we are together. It's hard enough still being married and separated in the same house and trying to figure things out, let alone in another relationship.

 

What I get from this is....

 

1.ur a little overbearing so she’s pulling back

2. shes not ready to leave her husband & juggling u is overwhelming for her.

i think she’s lying about the sleeping apart thing. I can bet $$& on it. It’s alot of work, time & energy  to be in an affair. I feel she’s bit off more than she can chew with u, Hence the pull back now.
 

 

Edited December 4, 2020 by AngelinaCassy

[kconleyk]

5 hours ago, AngelinaCassy said:

What I get from this is....

 

1.ur a little overbearing so she’s pulling back

2. shes not ready to leave her husband & juggling u is overwhelming for her.

i think she’s lying about the sleeping apart thing. I can bet $$& on it. It’s alot of work, time & energy  to be in an affair. I feel she’s bit off more than she can chew with u, Hence the pull back now.
 

 

I definitely have been over bearing because I haven't developed feelings for some for a while and I didn't know how to control it.    I did let her daughter come over last night, and I did see her for about 15 minutes and we talked.  I know stupid idea.    

I know they are sleeping in separate rooms because her daughter has mentioned it to mine numerous times including last night.   They had a talk with the kids a few months ago telling them why they were sleeping in separate rooms and that divorce could be the outcome.   

Last night she asked if we could slow things down keep it light and fun, while she figured things out but she missed me.   She can see a future with me but has to figure things out on her own and her own timeline, that she needs to figure out what she wants and how she wants to achieve it.     That nothing physical has happened with her H is months and months and if it ever did she would be upfront with me, and knows id walk away.      I told her I'd think about it.    She's either really really good at lying or being sincere.

[Milly May June]

32 minutes ago, kconleyk said:

 

I know 

Last night she asked if we could slow things down keep it light and fun, while she figured things out but she missed me.   She can see a future with me but has to figure things out on her own and her own timeline, that she needs to figure out what she wants and how she wants to achieve it.     

She is manipulation you big time! She is what is called a 'cake eater'. If she is serious about working on her self and figuring out what to do then she would not drag you into her mess. 

If this woman cared for you in any meaningful way she would let you go to clear her head, go figure herself out and after she gets divorced (and still wants to rekindle) she would come to you and ask for a chance to have a relationship with you (if you are still available). 

All i read from your posts is that she is only interested in light and fun fooling around with her neighbout and family friend while H is kept in the dark. 

OP, run from this person. This will not end well for you. 

 

[mark clemson]

9 hours ago, kconleyk said:

She can see a future with me but has to figure things out on her own and her own timeline, that she needs to figure out what she wants and how she wants to achieve it.     

She's either really really good at lying or being sincere.

Sure you like her, but what is she really asking for here?  Let's assume she is sincere (a big assumption):

Seems to me like she is asking you to keep yourself available to be a monkeybranch/soft landing while she sorts out whether to stay married.  Suggest you ask yourself - how fair is that to you? Seems pretty one sided.

The other negative is that, IF you get together, you are ...drumroll...  a rebound. That's bad news - how can anyone expect her to be ready for a relationship so soon after divorce? That isn't realistic, nor is it likely to be a healthy relationship. There will be talk/judgement about how soon she moved on as well.

All in all I think it's bad news. You might get her, but I think your chances of keeping her LT and for a good/healthy relationship are slim.

I know you're all longing for her and so forth here, but I think you should also try to think about this realistically.

Edited December 4, 2020 by mark clemson

[ExpatInItaly]

10 hours ago, kconleyk said:

  She's either really really good at lying or being sincere.

 Look how smoothly and effectively she lies to her husband.  That's your answer. 

[kconleyk]

She wants to bring the kids over on Thursday and watch a movie, make dinner together and then spend the day together just me and her on Saturday.    All I have had is texting for about 10 days at this point, and while I should probably tell her no, I feel like maybe being in person I can get her to open up more.   If she is scared of her feelings and retreating for that reason maybe being together would bring those back up.

Maybe I am just being Naive, but I really feel like she just wants to file for divorce, and her heart is telling her to be happy and be with me, she has told me all that over the last few months but when she goes to do it or take the next step her head is making her stop because she thinks about life splitting time with her kids, their activities, how people will view her, etc.   It's a gut feeling, I've always told myself to trust my gut and in the past it's been right, with things my with DD mom, to other relationships, to when my Dad was really sick, my gut has never lied to me.     My gut is saying she wants me in her life, but her head is making everything a mess, and she is scared to follow her heart.

Call me an idiot, because I have read this 10 times before posting, and I am calling myself an idiot.

[BaileyB]

 

3 hours ago, kconleyk said:

She wants to bring the kids over on Thursday and watch a movie, make dinner together and then spend the day together just me and her on Saturday.   

It's a gut feeling, I've always told myself to trust my gut and in the past it's been right.  My gut is saying she wants me in her life, but her head is making everything a mess, and she is scared to follow her heart.

Well, my head is telling me that something is REALLY WRONG with her judgment if she is talking about bring her children over to her affair partners house to watch a movie and make dinner together. Am I reading that correctly? 

Let’s ask your gut - how do you think her husband, the father of these children, will feel about that? Put yourself in his position, how would you feel about your wife taking your children to her affair partners home for an evening of dinner and movies?

My friend, I realize that you think the sun rises and sets on this woman and if only you had more time in person, she would think more with her heart and less with her head... that she would open up to you, and trust you, and leave her husband, and disrupt both of your children’s lives... do you see where I’m going with this. When you take a step back, does that sound reasonable to you? Not even mentioning the fact that you have decided you trust this woman that you BARELY KNOW when what you do know about her is that she is cheating on a man that she has promised to love, honour, and keep only unto him... 

Edited December 7, 2020 by BaileyB

[Wiseman2]

On 12/4/2020 at 6:33 AM, kconleyk said:

 

I know they are sleeping in separate rooms because her daughter has mentioned it to mine numerous times including last night.   

Wow. She's dragging her kids into her marital problems and affairs?

Her kid is giving your kid and earful of this unseemly adult topic?

You need to keep this woman and her abysmal judgement away from your kids.

[ExpatInItaly]

3 hours ago, Wiseman2 said:

Wow. She's dragging her kids into her marital problems and affairs?

Her kid is giving your kid and earful of this unseemly adult topic?

You need to keep this woman and her abysmal judgement away from your kids.

This. All of this. 

OP, you need to be a better dad and not expose your daughter to this woman. You and she (the married woman) are both exercising very poor judgement in general, but particularly when it comes to playing House with all these children. 

It's extraordinarily unfair to use them as props in this make-believe "happy little family" scenario you and this woman are trying construct. You are going to make whatever choices you want, but for Pete's sake, leave the kids out of it. 

Edited December 8, 2020 by ExpatInItaly

[salparadise]

14 hours ago, kconleyk said:

...and while I should probably tell her no, I feel like maybe being in person I can get her to open up more.   If she is scared of her feelings and retreating for that reason maybe being together would bring those back up.

On the one hand you are realizing how dysfunctional this whole mess is, and at the same time craving and strategizing about how you can keep it going. This is not a relationship, it's an illicit affair, which is why it feels so intense. Now she's doing the push-pull crap and manipulating your emotions –– like a yo-yo on a string, up and down, up and down. This is what it is, and all it has the potential to be.

You were on track a few posts back (Wednesday 8:19am) when you were starting to be introspective: Why am I attracted to such bad characters? [...] Something has to be wrong with me. Eight years single with all of those opportunities with single, available women and you have consistently chosen women of high drama rather than stability and congruency. And you were married to a borderline (as was I) –– do you not realize what the common denominator is? This is not about your "relationship" with this unstable married woman (who as you commented, could replace you with anyone), it's about what is going on within you that attracts you to these types, and they to you apparently. Did you not do the self work to bring all of this into full consciousness so you can choose differently?

At some point you will realize that this married hottie is simply not partner material, and the reason you're engaging with her is, and I quote you:  "We would text all day and all night long, she made me feel wanted. Now I feel worthless."  This is your Achilles heel my friend. Being married to a borderline will make you that way (if you weren't already, which is likely the reason you married her). You need to get off of this merry-go-round and fix the core reason you are susceptible... so you can choose and maintain a healthy relationship in the future. And so you can self-direct rather than being on the end of someone's string.

 

[kconleyk]

1 hour ago, salparadise said:

On the one hand you are realizing how dysfunctional this whole mess is, and at the same time craving and strategizing about how you can keep it going. This is not a relationship, it's an illicit affair, which is why it feels so intense. Now she's doing the push-pull crap and manipulating your emotions –– like a yo-yo on a string, up and down, up and down. This is what it is, and all it has the potential to be.

You were on track a few posts back (Wednesday 8:19am) when you were starting to be introspective: Why am I attracted to such bad characters? [...] Something has to be wrong with me. Eight years single with all of those opportunities with single, available women and you have consistently chosen women of high drama rather than stability and congruency. And you were married to a borderline (as was I) –– do you not realize what the common denominator is? This is not about your "relationship" with this unstable married woman (who as you commented, could replace you with anyone), it's about what is going on within you that attracts you to these types, and they to you apparently. Did you not do the self work to bring all of this into full consciousness so you can choose differently?

At some point you will realize that this married hottie is simply not partner material, and the reason you're engaging with her is, and I quote you:  "We would text all day and all night long, she made me feel wanted. Now I feel worthless."  This is your Achilles heel my friend. Being married to a borderline will make you that way (if you weren't already, which is likely the reason you married her). You need to get off of this merry-go-round and fix the core reason you are susceptible... so you can choose and maintain a healthy relationship in the future. And so you can self-direct rather than being on the end of someone's string.

 

I really appreciate your response.

Yes I realize how dysfunctional it is, and I know I should be out of it.   It doesn't mean I am not hurting and I miss her like crazy.    I don't know that you can tell me, or anyone really can, but I work so much better on the why and reasoning behind actions.   Why push and pull?   Why not just end?    Why all of sudden tell me she can't be in a relationship while still married (Yes I know how dumb that sounds), why tell me how much is was falling for me, and two weeks later act like I am nothing more than a friend to her?    Why the insane crazy change from not even day to day but hour to hour in her texts?

Why tell me I was her happy place?   Why for three months, make every effort to see me, only act like I don't exist now but a few short texts a day?   Then they next text me a bunch again.

If I had answers I could probably walk away easier, she won't even take time to talk to me in person, saying it's the holidays and she needs to focus on her kids.   Then saying she wants to come watch a movie with us, and wants us to go away on Saturday.

I don't get it, how can someone just be like that, use someone?  Or does she have feelings for me and she is just confused?   Is she really just going insane from the home situation, a new job and the holidays and is shutting down emotionally?  

If I just had an answer maybe I could get closure and I could force myself to walk away.

I hate this.  I hate feeling like this.