Married men reveal

[Whaatamidoing]

I am unsure whether this is the place to post this but I would like to hear a genuine account from the male side of things.

I have been OW for 7 years and it has been a rollercoaster of emotions, I joined this forum as I am seeing sense that its not how I want to continue.

Married men, can you be honest on what does actually go on in your marriages? So many posts on here are from anxiety clad women worried about being lied to about what really goes on in their AP marriage, so many of us are fed the same lines time after time about no intimacy, I suppose almost as justification for being with us OW.

I suppose what I would like to know is MM, do you still have regular sex with your wives and do you feel guilt for your OW?

Can emotions be switched on and off like that? Do you see your OW at lunch and then do the same with your wife in the evening?

Is the arrangement perfect for you, marriage material at home and someone all your friends know of and then a secret second wife who comes with none of the normal relationship demands?

I'm just trying to gain perspective from the other side. If I end things with my MM is there any emotion involved or is it just flick the switch back to soul focus being the marriage. 

[Nats_16]

I think there is more than one answer for this. I think some genuinely care about their OW but lack the strength to restart their life for her, I think some are just in it just for the ego boost and the sex/companionship. I think so many couples are together through habit and the OW provides the extra to keep it ticking along. Some I think would miss the OW terribly in terms of her company if they had formed a genuine bond, some would miss the attention that an affair provides and some would just carry on as if the OW never existed, I think it depends on the relationship. 
only you can decide if you are happy with how things are for you? How he feels if you were to end it is neither here nor there. You have to do it for you. I am the OW and terribly unhappy with the situation, he has been telling me he is planning on leaving for almost three years now. Every time I try to end it he pulls me in but I am not such an idiot that I can see his words and actions do not add up. I know feel down if he really wanted to be with me he would be, no matter the sacrifice.

[Whaatamidoing]

I think you may be right, I dont suspect there is a one size fits all, it is dependent upon the relationship. I did wonder if there is a majority though, the same as for us OW that we all seem to hear the same lines.

I think that 'the extra to keep it ticking along' applies in so many cases, we fuel their ability to stay married. I wonder if I had been more demanding from the outset, then my circumstance may be different. For some reason it feels like the norm in these situations to put yourself last. I know many will read this and think that we as OW put ourselves first but its simply not true. 

The irony in what you are saying is true in my circumstance, we know words and actions do not add up. It does border on abusive behaviour, my MM is much more interested in me when I decide not to bother and leave him to it, this only fuels the thrill and attention thing. I much preferred it when i was in the bubble, unaware of the effects of his behaviour on me. Its now a cycle, i can say to myself, oh we are in the hes ignoring me phase or the hes really keen phase, i wonder whether its linked with his wifes menstrual cycle or something. 

 

[elaine567]

1 hour ago, Whaatamidoing said:

If I end things with my MM is there any emotion involved or is it just flick the switch back to soul focus being the marriage

There are very few MM who post on here.
They are usually panicking because their wife found out or worried that she will find out, as opposed to pining for their OW...

But what you ask is a "How long is a piece of string?" type question.
As Nats_16 says - 
it depends...

And whatever the answers given by any MM on here, should you get any, does not mean your MM necessarily feels the same way....

Some care about the OW, some don't.
Some of their marriages are indeed "perfect", some are varying degrees of "perfect" and some are varying degrees of hell...
Guys who cheat, cheat, the state of their marriages can be irrelevant. 
An affair is just a type of relationship, so hardly surprising they vary widely.

But what does seem to stand out, is that MM in general are pretty selfish and self absorbed, so what suits him flies, what doesn't suit him doesn't.
And some are pretty good at compartmentalising and being pragmatic. 
So once the OW is gone, he is often on the look out for another or he decides to pick up his marriage again or sometimes both...

[gamon]

Most married guys who are cheating on their wives don't care about anyone but themselves.

8 years of your life wasted on a guy who has no intention of leaving his wife and who is probably screwing both of you and enjoying the attention he's getting from two (or more) women while deceiving both of them.

Time to pick up your self respect and kick him to the curb once and for all.

[Wiseman2]

You're an appendage to their marriage. Much like a car in the garage. When he's in the car/garage , he's not in the house. When he's in the house, he's not in the car/garage.

It's called compartmentalizing. When he's with his wife/kids, you don't exist. When he's with you, he's taking his 2nd car for a drive.... and returns home as usual.

Whatever lies about' for the kids', 'like roommates', 'going to leave soon', etc. are just to string you along for fun. Like the sports car drive. It's a game, a hobby, that's it. It's just an ego trip/power trip in which you are a pawn on his ego game board.

[Gumbeaux41]

I can speak for myself, I cared deeply for the OW. I was willing to leave my wife for her. The problem was her. She kept going back and forth and I could not trust that she would not go back if we were together. I truly feel I was in limerence and had a really rough time getting past it. I am over the OW and I am trying to move on with my wife but I am finding it very difficult. So there are men out there that truly care for the OW. Yes I would see the OW at lunch and would go home and put on the poker face. Yes it was killing me inside to have to think what the OW was doing at the same time, (she was also married). It finally came too difficult to continue, no matter how much I felt for her it all came to an end. Do I still think about her, yes absolutely, almost every day. Will my marriage work, I don't really know, but I do realize that if I become single I will look for single women to talk to, not married women, it is to much stress hiding everything. 

[Starswillshine]

I think you will have a hard time  getting overall accurate opinions from MM. Not many here and those that are here are here because they are hurting. Thus they cared. 

As a BS, I can only share what was going on in my marriage when my xH was having his affairs. Sex was frequent. Affection and intimacy existed as always have before and plentiful. We had date nights. And everything said our marriage was happy and healthy. 

People who truly love other people do not constantly and consistently put them in pain. People who do this but profess to love or whatever other affection love what the AP provide them... not the person. Same can be said for how they feel about their BS. 

Additionally, men tend to have an easier time compartmentalising versus woman. So, as women, we may obsess over our man and they are in every thought, for many men... out of sight, out of mind. 

[Beca L]

1 hour ago, elaine567 said:

But what does seem to stand out, is that MM in general are pretty selfish and self absorbed, so what suits him flies, what doesn't suit him doesn't.
And some are pretty good at compartmentalising and being pragmatic. 

This is an interesting thread, I spend so much of time asking the very same questions. I agree that there is no one size fits all and that it depends on a number of factors. I do know that you may never really know and that as elaine567 says, what we do know is that these men are extremely selfish and self absorbed.  I'm surprised that you have manged 7 years of this type of behaviour, after my MM returned to his wife (after a year together as a couple), I suffered 2 years of this behaviour and it has really broken me as a person. I think that for your own sanity and metal health you need to walk away from this horrible individual. Leave him to it and try to move forward with your own life, you deserve so much better 🙂

[mark clemson]

I agree that there's going to be substantial variety - a range of "emotional sincerity" towards the OW as well as a range of "health" and/or enjoyment of the marriage. Some may be genuinely smitten, others may be behaving as married "players". I agree that men tend to be better at compartmentalization. I also think that practical matters often override sentiment when it come to what actually transpires in life/decision making.

Focusing on whether or not he's being "completely" honest with you** or having sex with his wife or not after 7 years sounds to me like being overly concerned with the trees and not the forest.

 

** Yes, yes irony duly noted.

[mark clemson]

By the way, I would note that many of these generalizations and recognition of variance probably apply to MW as well.

[central]

I can only approximately answer your questions, OP.  I have an open relationship with my wonderful wife, and we have a great sex life (and we are both poly-oriented).  For many years I also had what would best be labeled a FWB.  When she found another relationship, I was both happy for her and sad for myself (even though it was I who introduced her to another best friend).  There was definitely emotion involved throughout that (and other, similar) relationships I've had while happily married.

If this had been clandestine I'd have felt guilt and stress over keeping a secret, but since we all knew about it and approved there were no such issues.  If it had been secret, I'd still have felt the way I did about my FWB, and about the loss of that relationship.  I'm sure other people would have a variety of different feelings ranging from indifference, to sadness, to anger, all depending on their personality and situation.

[Beca L]

1 hour ago, mark clemson said:

I also think that practical matters often override sentiment when it come to what actually transpires in life/decision making.

I think this hits the nail on the head. From my experience, men in particular tend to focus more on this. The feelings of safety, security, what they have verses the unknown with the OW, fear of leaving the W and then the OW dumping them further down the line. So even if they truly love the OW they often don't have the backbone to make the change to be with them long term. 

[RebeccaR]

17 minutes ago, Beca L said:

I think this hits the nail on the head. From my experience, men in particular tend to focus more on this. The feelings of safety, security, what they have verses the unknown with the OW, fear of leaving the W and then the OW dumping them further down the line. So even if they truly love the OW they often don't have the backbone to make the change to be with them long term. 

It’s true that many men put practical matters first. Leaving a spouse is not necessarily a sign of “backbone” though. There is nothing wrong with considering practical matters when evaluating the path that will maximize future happiness. The real lack of backbone is not facing the problems in a marriage and instead embarking on a secret affair.

[BaileyB]

I think the fact that your affair has been going on for seven years and nothing has changed related to his marital status and your relationship status says a lot... Seven years is a long time to spend on a relationship that is not progressing and/or meeting your needs. It’s something to think about when you are seven years in and still asking the question “what is he thinking...” 

[mark clemson]

2 hours ago, RebeccaR said:

The real lack of backbone is not facing the problems in a marriage and instead embarking on a secret affair.

I think that's a fair statement. That must be balanced against the willingness of the spouse to even concede there are issues and be willing to work on them. Doesn't always happen, not all spouses are fair, see reason, and are willing to stop using their partner as an emotional punching bag (or whatever the issues are).

Then of course, it would seem the most logical course of action would be divorce if the situation is really bad. However that not only requires "spine" and emotional fortitude but also brings up the practical matters, such as loss of income/savings, reduced access to kids, the logistics of separating intertwined lives, extremely fun and pleasant meetings with lawyers, etc etc.

So, can be a major challenge/PIA that also leaves one poorer. No doubt one of several reasons why folks reach for the "garden path"/band aid of an affair.

[SMoore]

In my case, just like Gumbeaux41, I cared for the ow.  So much.  In this situation I found that she was always on my mind although I was able to continue at home, in an absent minded way, without much effort.  Of course there was conflicted thinking, but I’m quite pragmatic so just accepted it and tried to compartmentalise.  I wasn’t happy at home, it wasn’t like I was revelling in having the best of both worlds.  But it wasn’t too stressful either.

On compartmentalising - I found it doesn’t mean a complete blocking of one over the other, just a kind of fading and distancing, that comes and goes.

Strange thing is, as the affair developed I became a much happier person due to my new found adventure, and I took that happiness home.  As time went on my wife responded positively too and our relationship actually improved.  Nothing major, but there was a subtle change.  Just more positive interactions.  I never anticipated that.  Ultimately I think it made me realise that making a positive effort in a relationship does actually make a difference.  And that can happen without having an affair.  Obvs.

When we started we were both married and we were both completely open about when sex happened with our spouses.  It was just matter of fact and although neither of us was happy knowing, we agreed it was better than not knowing.  I seem to remember feeling guilty about sleeping with my wife at one point - this must have been early on in the affair.  That feeling didn’t last.  Anyway, after she left her husband she found it a lot harder to take, and the first cracks began to show.

Anyway, I never strung my AP along  deliberately, I was always hoping our relationship would evolve and get stronger, so that I could move ahead with certainty.  I was deluded, it only weakened and crumbled over time.  When I realised it wasn’t going to last I still professed my love but my heart wasn’t in it as much.  She was the same I think although we never got the chance to do a post-mortem on it.  I was preparing for the end but I desperately didn’t want to let go of what we had.

The end result was heartbreak and god-awful pain and an agonisingly slow recovery.  Lesson learnt.  I am NC with her and trying to rebuild my marriage, if that’s possible now.

In your case, my guess is that he just doesn’t want to let you go.  Maybe he cares, maybe he loves you, maybe he wants both lives.  It doesn’t mean he’s cynical about what you have or doesn’t care, but he is probably just stuck indefinitely and I wouldn’t hold my breath if I were you.  I’d told myself I wouldn’t leave unless I was 100% sure I had a solid relationship to go to - all selfish delusion, and probably an impossible condition to meet anyway.  You might find he keeps giving himself deadlines - I’ll leave when x y or z happens.  But when x y and z happens it doesn’t feel right to leave, then there’s a b and c, ad infinitum...  I did a fair bit of that.

 I’d take a deep breath and finish it if I were you.  No need to paint him as the devil, just acknowledge that he has created a trap for himself and he can’t get out, and then walk away and let yourself heal.

PS I know my behaviour above sounds appalling etc but I’m just trying to help.  Believe me, I’m dealing with the shame and the pain of this every day.

[Beca L]

58 minutes ago, SMoore said:

Anyway, after she left her husband she found it a lot harder to take, and the first cracks began to show.

I'm not surprised. She did the honourable thing and realised that if she had strong feelings for another then she could no longer live a lie with her H and she left to pursue (what she thought) was a future with you, However, you were not on the same page and you apparently were happy just having her and your wife. You did deceive her. 

 

1 hour ago, SMoore said:

Anyway, I never strung my AP along  deliberately, 

I'm sorry but what did you think was going to happen ? She'd left her husband, did you think she'd happily carry on being the OW whilst you remained married. That type of relationship was not sustainable, she was always going to want more, not sure how you didn't realise that would happen. 

[Beca L]

4 hours ago, RebeccaR said:

the path that will maximize future happiness.

whose happiness ? Most likely his own, not his wife or his OW. 

[RebeccaR]

14 minutes ago, Beca L said:

whose happiness ? Most likely his own, not his wife or his OW. 

Of course, his own. He was thinking about his own happiness, just as you are thinking about your own happiness.

If APs who are upset at the loss of their MM/MW would think clearly, most of them would realize that there is no happily ever after in most situations. (Prudence is one of the exceptions). There was an MM who didn’t like teenagers or didn’t like his OW’s children. Even if he had left his wife, how well would that have played out in the long term?

It’s perfectly rational to decide to stay in an imperfect first marriage rather than bail for... an imperfect second marriage. It probably feels very bad to not get chosen, but if it’s any comfort to the OW’s ego, it’s not about her and who she is. It’s about the complexities of life and realizing that pure love and enjoyment aren’t enough to outweigh the angry families, the kids who hate them forever, the financial losses, etc. It’s s rational decision even if not everyone would make that same decision.

[Beca L]

38 minutes ago, RebeccaR said:

He was thinking about his own happiness, just as you are thinking about your own happiness.

Okay, I agree yes I would but the difference between my ex MM and myself is that I wanted him to be happy and I often put his needs above my own. He on the other hand only really cared for himself. 

 

47 minutes ago, RebeccaR said:

t’s about the complexities of life and realizing that pure love and enjoyment aren’t enough to outweigh the angry families, the kids who hate them forever, the financial losses, etc. It’s s rational decision even if not everyone would make that same decision.

I can see what you are saying and this is what happened to me, however it's still a bitter pill to swallow. Yes, I was a fool to get involved in the first place but women like myself fall for all the lies and generally believe that these MM want to leave a 'miserable' marriage and start something new with them. I believed I had found real love and a true connection with someone, I'm still trying to recover from the deception and rejection, I have questioned myself again and again, how did I fall for this ponzi scheme !

[lifeoflies]

14 hours ago, Whaatamidoing said:

I am unsure whether this is the place to post this but I would like to hear a genuine account from the male side of things.

I have been OW for 7 years and it has been a rollercoaster of emotions, I joined this forum as I am seeing sense that its not how I want to continue.

Married men, can you be honest on what does actually go on in your marriages? So many posts on here are from anxiety clad women worried about being lied to about what really goes on in their AP marriage, so many of us are fed the same lines time after time about no intimacy, I suppose almost as justification for being with us OW.

HI suppose what I would like to know is MM, do you still have regular sex with your wives and do you feel guilt for your OW?

Can emotions be switched on and off like that? Do you see your OW at lunch and then do the same with your wife in the evening?

Is the arrangement perfect for you, marriage material at home and someone all your friends know of and then a secret second wife who comes with none of the normal relationship demands?

I'm just trying to gain perspective from the other side. If I end things with my MM is there any emotion involved or is it just flick the switch back to soul focus being the marriage. 

I said whatever I would encourage her. The only person to whom I owed any honesty was my wife and I certainly wasn’t going to be honest with her. I’m my case, the young woman wasn’t interested in my marriage. You probably should not expect honesty from a man who is cheating on his wife. We weave a story to satisfy the other woman. It’s not all lies but a guy will do just about anything to keep it going until he gets caught and then panic and damage control. Like most of the guys I read about here, I threw the OW under the bus. 

As for emotions, what you’ve read about male compartmentalization is real. I was able to have an affair on my terms with an attractive intelligent woman. I would see her at work, meet her for coffee and once at her apartment. When I went home, I would wash my hands and face and act like nothing had happened. 
 

The arrangement was far from perfect and after two months I was exhausted. I wasn’t capable of walking the tightrope for very long. My wife caught me and I dumped the OW. I felt bad about that. I cared about her. I will never forget her. 
 

Affairs are dishonest and for me, at least, an escape from reality. I know she’s doing well. My affair signaled the end of my marriage. It limped along for too long before I called it quits. I regret hurting my wife. We ignored me affair and I never got to the root of my problems. To be honest, at the time I was more than happy to ignore the affair. Of course she never recovered from my betrayal and out divorce was inevitable. 
 

FWIW I think you should try to end it. Of course he will think about you but he’s just another lying guy and what he thinks shouldn’t matter to you. He’s cheating on his wife. He’s not worthy of your concern. 
 

 

[Wiseman2]

10 hours ago, SMoore said:

 Strange thing is, as the affair developed I became a much happier person due to my new found adventure, and I took that happiness home.  As time went on my wife responded positively too and our relationship actually improved.

Exactly. The mistress is just an appendage to the marriage. An "adventure"

Not a contender, as they would like to and are led on to believe.

Edited November 19, 2020 by Wiseman2

[Whaatamidoing]

@lifeofliesThank you for your honesty. I hadn't really realised the ability to compartmentalise. What was is that attracted you to the affair? Was it simply that you could? Or did you really see something in your AP that made you want to go beyond friendship? I am thinking that men choose their AP's carefully, there are some women that even I know as a woman would not be the person to have an affair with. I am trying to figure out in myself why have I been ok to be treated like that, why am I not wife material for him. 

I know that his wife has seen texts from me on his phone, nothing sordid but enough to ask about me, he threw me under the bus then. He told me he told her that I have been encouraging him to text and socialise outside of work. He has throughout our time always suggested that he is the innocent party and I pursued but I remember a different version of events in the beginning and unlike him I don't have to delete everything. It does make you think you are slightly unhinged though, he would have me believe that I have made the whole thing up and he would probably not even admit to knowing me in front of his wife. 

It was just a small comment from him that made me realise I need out of this. We were talking about things and back when I first met him we would talk openly about being together, he moved house to a massive mortgage forever home with his wife and those conversations stopped. We would talk about going on holiday and country walks together, normal 'coupley' things to do, nothing spectacular. When we talked recently he denied any knowledge of saying he would like to do anything of the sort with me and this was it basically, even if we were together we wouldn't do anything like that, he doesn't like doing that sort of thing and wouldn't. I don't know where this came from but it made me realise he has probably changed far beyond anyone I would actually want to be with so why am I still here. I have been mulling it over ever since. 

 

[Wiseman2]

2 minutes ago, Whaatamidoing said:

@lifeoflies . 

I know that his wife has seen texts from me on his phone, nothing sordid but enough to ask about me, he threw me under the bus then. He told me he told her that I have been encouraging him to text and socialise outside of work. 

Very common to depict the mistress as some unhinged Fatal Attraction case to save his own butt