Can this work

[elaine567]

2 hours ago, ZA Dater said:

Was still a good experience.

So what have you actually learned from this experience that will stand you in good stead moving forward?
What are the  lessons learned that you can use in the future?

BTW what did you specifically do that elicited the "cold shoulder" treatment from this woman? 

[Wiseman2]

Where are all these tall, successful, well dressed, Maserati driving, gourmet dining men you are supposedly completing with?

All you need is one woman who likes you for who you are. Try not to be brainwashed by the incels hategroups.

[ZA Dater]

1 hour ago, elaine567 said:

So what have you actually learned from this experience that will stand you in good stead moving forward?
What are the  lessons learned that you can use in the future?

BTW what did you specifically do that elicited the "cold shoulder" treatment from this woman? 

Lessons. I am best off not ever trying this again because even when I have a better chance than ever I still lack the qualities people actually find desirable. Very, very seldom do I ever interact with someone as comfortably and easily as I did with her so I know it I am unlikely to get that again. Friend and I were speaking about this and I basically told him I am giving up now because I cannot see myself ever being able to find a better experience than what I have had.

I can move forward with the knowledge i tried the best I could, had many of the experiences I wanted to have and for while got to enjoy the company of someone who I really do like spending time with.

My view remains the same, if I had more superficial qualities and experience I might have had a better chance but it is what it is. I am sad but time will pass and I can look back on something good and that is some comfort at least.

[ZA Dater]

47 minutes ago, Wiseman2 said:

Where are all these tall, successful, well dressed, Maserati driving, gourmet dining men you are supposedly completing with?

All you need is one woman who likes you for who you are. Try not to be brainwashed by the incels hategroups.

Bottom line is I am never going to the guy the people I like will ever pick EVEN if we get along well. It about simply living with that, at the moment I have an unemployed mother of 3 kids chasing me for a coffee date, I am really not interested at all. I'd rather have the very rare amazing experience than contend with going round and round and round the same circle and taking loss after loss after loss as I try compete when I simply have nothing the people I am competing for actually want.

I do not blame women for going after the super successful super good looking guys, I really do not I can actually respect that I am just never going to be one of these guys so instead of settling for what I do not want I'd rather just live in a world where I either keep chasing the impossible dream or simply just give up altogether. There are always going to be fundamental red flags about me, I cant over come the lack of experience, I cannot overcome the lack of history and those are both bad things when a women wants someone to date, she wants a guy who has experience who has dating experience and I have no doubt my lack of those things killed any chance I had here along with my lack of superficial.

Just this morning a friend tried to set me up with a 25yo waitress, I am really not interested, what would I have in common with a 25yo waitress, it will once again be on the "oh you do not drink", "oh you are not fun".

At least now I know how good it can be so I do not need to imagine that anymore.

[basil67]

And again, where does one find all these super successful, super good looking guys who drive Maseratis and dine only in fancy restaurants?    Better question, why do you chase the kind of woman who seeks this type of guy?  

Further, you've just stated that you have a woman chasing you.  This is after all your complaints about women being superficial and not interested.  While you may not be interested in her, clearly, it is false that women are not interested in you.

Edited April 16, 2021 by basil67

[elaine567]

1 hour ago, elaine567 said:

BTW what did you specifically do that elicited the "cold shoulder" treatment from this woman?

Did you try to kiss her, touch her, ask her out on a real date or something else?
Did you actively try something or did you just assume?

[BaileyB]

37 minutes ago, ZA Dater said:

Lessons. I am best off not ever trying this again because even when I have a better chance than ever I still lack the qualities people actually find desirable. Very, very seldom do I ever interact with someone as comfortably and easily as I did with her so I know it I am unlikely to get that again. Friend and I were speaking about this and I basically told him I am giving up now because I cannot see myself ever being able to find a better experience than what I have had.

I can move forward with the knowledge i tried the best I could, had many of the experiences I wanted to have and for while got to enjoy the company of someone who I really do like spending time with.

My view remains the same, if I had more superficial qualities and experience I might have had a better chance but it is what it is. I am sad but time will pass and I can look back on something good and that is some comfort at least.

You didn’t answer Elaine’s question. Just more of the same complaint, that you can’t get what you want...

[ZA Dater]

43 minutes ago, basil67 said:

And again, where does one find all these super successful, super good looking guys who drive Maseratis and dine only in fancy restaurants?    Better question, why do you chase the kind of woman who seeks this type of guy?  

Further, you've just stated that you have a woman chasing you.  This is after all your complaints about women being superficial and not interested.  While you may not be interested in her, clearly, it is false that women are not interested in you.

I can count the number of times I have been chased on 3 fingers. Frankly its inconsequential if I myself am not interested in the person.

Most women would seek that kind of guy, the fact they never struggle to get dates tells me there is a huge captive market, far more than there is for a guy like me.

[ZA Dater]

42 minutes ago, elaine567 said:

Did you try to kiss her, touch her, ask her out on a real date or something else?
Did you actively try something or did you just assume?

No I told her I enjoyed spending time with her and I appreciated the kindness she has shown me. I guess one should not ever show these sorts of feelings so yeah it is what it is. She has a super successful, super wealthy guy chasing her and throwing everything but the kitchen sink at that so I am sure she is really enjoying all of that.

[elaine567]

2 minutes ago, ZA Dater said:

No I told her I enjoyed spending time with her and I appreciated the kindness she has shown me.

What did she say to that?

[ZA Dater]

6 minutes ago, elaine567 said:

What did she say to that?

'The note you left me, touched my heart so much"

[elaine567]

Just now, ZA Dater said:

'The note you left me, touched my heart so much"

That doesn't sound like a cold shoulder, what did you say/do after that?

[ZA Dater]

3 minutes ago, elaine567 said:

That doesn't sound like a cold shoulder, what did you say/do after that?

Communication continued for a while after that, I wanted to see her again before she went back but that never happened (was at the would be BF's country house), we chatted a bit after that but nothing for the last week or so. Its expected I guess.

She is also quite busy but even when she was I'd still get some communication.

[SumGuy]

16 hours ago, ZA Dater said:

All very good and well but who is she going to be more interested in a shy inexperienced guy or the super confident guy, maybe the former can get by with some very superficial luck but most of the time he wont even get a look. I am tired of being told people do not meet people at bars and clubs for the last time WHERE do people meet them then, mutual friends, OK I concede that might be possible, in the bookstore, that is nonsense as far as I concerned, mutual interest, maybe but honestly barring mutual friends I have no idea where people meet their dates.

People do meet people in bars but it is usually not to find a relationship, it is definitively more a ONS scene at least where I live.  Of course there are music venues for I go to (before the pandemic) where it is not all about looks and you could meet someone...but these are very much not what most people think of when they think of clubs.   

I really don't grasp how you fail to grasp the ways people meet, mutual friends, parties (which are often mutual friends or friends of friends), yes common interests, OLD (obviously), classes, a bookstore is certainly possible if you connect over talking books (but the odds are low, but certainly better than the grocery store).

You are right though in that in every case one needs to be able to converse and have emotional intelligence, you can be shy as long as you can hear the other person and engage in conversation.  Those "super confident" guys may be more about hearing themselves and plenty of women will say can that guy even hear himself.  

You are into cars I thought, have you tried car clubs, perhaps the looks of your car can do the talking for you?  If you work on it yourself I have found women find that attractive.

[elaine567]

Ok so in effect her reply was a nice brush off.
The problem here was really the bf, whose feet were well under the table before you made that move.
You were in fact barking up the wrong tree.
You were pitching at a woman who was already unavailable to you.
As she is no longer responding to you, I think it is done, bar maybe the odd note or Xmas card.
The bf probably put paid to that.
Most guys are not keen on their gfs being friends with other guys.

[elaine567]

16 minutes ago, SumGuy said:

You are into cars I thought, have you tried car clubs

This is a dead end. His car club is full of very wealthy guys about 10+ years older...

[SumGuy]

2 minutes ago, elaine567 said:

This is a dead end. His car club is full of very wealthy guys about 10+ years older...

Wouldn't stop me if worked on my own car.  Especially if not overweight.  Hit the gym some and...  Sure you may not find someone looking to marry you...consider that a plus...but otherwise... 

 

[ZA Dater]

12 minutes ago, elaine567 said:

Ok so in effect her reply was a nice brush off.
The problem here was really the bf, whose feet were well under the table before you made that move.
You were in fact barking up the wrong tree.
You were pitching at a woman who was already unavailable to you.
As she is no longer responding to you, I think it is done, bar maybe the odd note or Xmas card.
The bf probably put paid to that.
Most guys are not keen on their gfs being friends with other guys.

One of the things she did say to me is she would not date a guy who would not allow her to have other guy friends, she had a very possessive husband and does not wat to return to that or so she said. I have known her a long longer than he has but the level of selling that others have done of this man is truly remarkable, someone who makes his date get her own uber to meet him, forgets to fetch her for a date, expects her to wake herself and an 11 month old baby at 6am to go to the golf course with him. No I am not going to say anything suffice to say I would never do those things.

Another thing, he is 2 km away but he cant fetch her, she must arrange her own uber.

But seeing as every single "wow" superficial box is ticked apparently these things are not important. The third date she was introducing her to his parents....you draw your own conclusions.

[ZA Dater]

10 minutes ago, SumGuy said:

Wouldn't stop me if worked on my own car.  Especially if not overweight.  Hit the gym some and...  Sure you may not find someone looking to marry you...consider that a plus...but otherwise... 

 

Trust me accountants and finance people make terrible mechanics....been there done that!  Car clubs are dead end here, mostly frequented by people married and in most cases with kids and in many cases far older than me. Better for business networking than dating.

Cars are a passion and a distraction from what I don't have in other aspects of life, funnily enough this lady does actually like cars, comes from a "car family", again very rare.

[elaine567]

1 minute ago, ZA Dater said:

One of the things she did say to me is she would not date a guy who would not allow her to have other guy friends, she had a very possessive husband and does not wat to return to that or so she said. I have known her a long longer than he has but the level of selling that others have done of this man is truly remarkable, someone who makes his date get her own uber to meet him, forgets to fetch her for a date, expects her to wake herself and an 11 month old baby at 6am to go to the golf course with him. No I am not going to say anything suffice to say I would never do those things.

Another thing, he is 2 km away but he cant fetch her, she must arrange her own uber.

But seeing as every single "wow" superficial box is ticked apparently these things are not important. The third date she was introducing her to his parents....you draw your own conclusions.

All irrelevant, sorry to say.
It doesn't matter what you think of him, it is what she thinks of him that matters.

[BaileyB]

11 minutes ago, elaine567 said:

All irrelevant, sorry to say.
It doesn't matter what you think of him, it is what she thinks of him that matters.

And there is a big difference between him not allowing her to have male friends, and her deciding to pull back to focus on her primary relationship. Most people pull back on other relationship when they develop a new romantic relationships. There is just not enough time in the day and they are excited to pursue this new relationship. She should be pulling back from male “friends” out of respect for her new relationship partner. 

I still say, she became aware that you had developed some feelings for her, she did not reciprocate these feelings, and that is why she is pulling back... She thought you were her non-threatening, platonic friend - when she learned differently, her interactions changed. 

Edited April 16, 2021 by BaileyB

[ZA Dater]

2 minutes ago, elaine567 said:

All irrelevant, sorry to say.
It doesn't matter what you think of him, it is what she thinks of him that matters.

Of course, easy to think highly of someone when your friends have done such a fantastic selling job that he has won before even walking into the pitch. When I got to see how contrived this was I could just shake my head and a lot of what I saw here made it even easier to distance myself from dating. 

Admittedly I got a smile out of the fact he did not seem so fond of me, despite me being businesslike friendly, he likes my other and her mutual friend even less which also made me smile. I suppose that is why both of us are now persona non grata. \

You asked me the lessons I learnt and thinking about it some more the lessons I learnt was that no matter what we do, what we say, how we say it, how we act its just a lottery where tangible things can really help. I also learnt how nice it was, my point of reference here being BaileyB's post about the lovely shared times with her bf and those emotions so I learned to enjoy something I wanted to enjoy for a long time. Perhaps its bad to say but, what now really, what is in it for me? Does not seem to be much game worth playing for because inevitably I wont find this again.

I am more inclined to get on with life, see if she moves back here and then see what happens, that to me seems more pleasant than OLD and being set up with 25yo waitresses. In the back of my mind though I know I am nowhere near to find a sustained good experience.

[elaine567]

2 minutes ago, BaileyB said:

. She thought you were her non-threatening, platonic friend - when she learned differently, her interactions changed. 

Yes that is a good point too.
Women do tend to hate that. 
The good close platonic male friend who turns out to be as predatory as any other guy...
He sneaked in, gained her confidence and fooled her into letting her guard down...

[ZA Dater]

5 minutes ago, BaileyB said:

And there is a big difference between him not allowing her to have male friends, and her deciding to pull back to focus on her primary relationship. Most people pull back on other relationship when they develop a new romantic relationships. She should be pulling back from male “friends” out of respect for her relationship partner. 

I still say, she became aware that you had developed some feelings for her, she did not reciprocate these feelings, and that is why she is pulling back... She thought you were her non-threatening, platonic friend - when she learned differently, her interactions changed. 

The sheer amount of time I spent with her would have suggested otherwise fairly early on but I do defer to your experience here. At the end of the day simplistically some people are luckier than others, I had quite an emotional chat with a friend of mine who has recently broken up with his 5 month gf. He has everything, honestly he can go find someone fantastic tomorrow and ironically its the most damaged person (me) who picks him up and motivates him to go out there. 

I do not believe there is any shame in me giving up now, yes if I had lots of unticked experiences I would continue but do I really have many left?

[elaine567]

4 minutes ago, ZA Dater said:

Admittedly I got a smile out of the fact he did not seem so fond of me, despite me being businesslike friendly, he likes my other and her mutual friend even less which also made me smile. I suppose that is why both of us are now persona non grata.

No guy likes other single orbiter males sniffing around their gf, you wouldn't like it either.