Can this work

[normal person]

42 minutes ago, ZA Dater said:

conversely I spend lots of time with someone I do not find attractive and she becomes very attracted to me, then I am in an awkward situation, one I do not want to be in.

Like the one you were happy to put this woman in. Certainly you being the one rebuffed (rather than rebuffing) is the more awkward position, right? Anyways...

42 minutes ago, ZA Dater said:

Attraction does matter because even if I does not happen I'd like the potential to be there.

Seems odd. If you're going to be so happy doing all this easy stuff, why don't you just do it with friends/family until the opportunity presents itself to also do it with someone you find attractive? Food for thought, I'm just thinking (typing) out loud, here. 

[ZA Dater]

11 minutes ago, normal person said:

Like the one you were happy to put this woman in. Certainly you being the one rebuffed (rather than rebuffing) is the more awkward position, right? Anyways...

Seems odd. If you're going to be so happy doing all this easy stuff, why don't you just do it with friends/family until the opportunity presents itself to also do it with someone you find attractive? Food for thought, I'm just thinking (typing) out loud, here. 

Because I have no friends and very little family. Its also not the same.

I'd rather be the one rebuffed than the one doing the rebuffing. I never actually went too far as I knew a loss would be the ultimate conclusion, especially when I looked at the competition. My perspective is its about hoping to have something that the other person finds desirable, which I am never likely to have hence this rather poor substitute where I get some of what I like which better than nothing at all.

[Weezy1973]

On 4/15/2021 at 11:15 AM, ZA Dater said:

I need to know my place and my "league". 

Considering you used to completely discount the idea of leagues, if you’ve learnt to accept that leagues exist, then you may have learned something valuable.

Keep in mind leagues have nothing to do with people being better or worse human beings, it’s just about superficial traits and how generally people pair up along those lines. You keep trying for women out of your leagues which is in essence the same idea as trying to get rich by playing the lottery. 
 

If you were sensible you’d save and invest and not play the lottery. If you were sensible you’d date women in your league. But you’re not attracted to those women.

[Trail Blazer]

57 minutes ago, Weezy1973 said:

Considering you used to completely discount the idea of leagues, if you’ve learnt to accept that leagues exist, then you may have learned something valuable.

Keep in mind leagues have nothing to do with people being better or worse human beings, it’s just about superficial traits and how generally people pair up along those lines. You keep trying for women out of your leagues which is in essence the same idea as trying to get rich by playing the lottery. 
 

If you were sensible you’d save and invest and not play the lottery. If you were sensible you’d date women in your league. But you’re not attracted to those women.

OP doesn't believe in leagues as he only just stated as much in a response to one of my posts on a previous page.  The use of the term was, I believe, done so sarcastically.  The inverted commas is the give-away here...

[ZA Dater]

1 hour ago, Trail Blazer said:

OP doesn't believe in leagues as he only just stated as much in a response to one of my posts on a previous page.  The use of the term was, I believe, done so sarcastically.  The inverted commas is the give-away here...

Correct. If the matches I get are the only people that find me attractive then I am happy to never go on another date again.

[elaine567]

I think you are very aware that leagues exist. You are against and do not believe in leagues as they do not suit you but you are very aware that the matching process is for real.
You just cannot get over the fact the top tier women you want, will not see you as top tier.
As they are perfectly entitled to chose who they want, (dating is a two way street) then you will always be on a hiding to nothing.

You do a lot of self denigrating talk which seems to  indicate you get it, but in the next sentence you are back on the,  "I am entitled to a top tier woman" trip. "I will not "settle" for anything less.", "If I can't get what I want I will give up..."
Your self denigrating humbleness is I guess false, underneath you must have a very high opinion of yourself.   

I get aspirational dating and it can work for some but these individuals usually make up for lack of looks by having other strings to their bow.
They are charming, talented, rich, very good company, sexy or have a mix of some very desirable traits.
Nothing you have said about yourself will make you stand out from the crowd in a good way unfortunately.

One little tweak of the mindset and the happy times you experienced in these past few weeks could be a permanent fixture, but whilst you remain hung up on landing a top tier woman you will always have to navigate this life alone.

[ZA Dater]

4 hours ago, elaine567 said:

but whilst you remain hung up on landing a top tier woman you will always have to navigate this life alone.

Which is fine. None of what I enjoyed these past few weeks would happen if the person was not attractive to me. Attractive overall.

It's really that simple.

At the end of the day with everything dating we once again go back to the superficial and how vitally important that is. 

If I have to do everything on my own, well so be it. It's just sad but I'll hide that emotion just like I hide most emotions.

[elaine567]

29 minutes ago, ZA Dater said:

Which is fine. None of what I enjoyed these past few weeks would happen if the person was not attractive to me. Attractive overall.

It's really that simple.

No-one is disputing that, but you are cutting off your nose to spite your face...
Why are you sabotaging your whole life for something so trivial in reality?
Looks fade, people get fatter or saggier and wrinklier... or do you expect to keep getting lucky and land a perfect unicorn every few years?
You need to use this experience to open up to more people whoever they are,  whatever they look like, in the hope of getting more social and less judgemental.
Bu no, you seem to be stuck in that same rut, the rut of failure.

Edited April 17, 2021 by elaine567
typo

[Weezy1973]

6 hours ago, ZA Dater said:

Correct. If the matches I get are the only people that find me attractive then I am happy to never go on another date again.

You don’t get matched on Tinder. Why do you keep saying they’re matches? These are just people that swiped right on you? Not matches.

[ZA Dater]

57 minutes ago, elaine567 said:

No-one is disputing that, but you are cutting off your nose to spite your face...
Why are you sabotaging your whole life for something so trivial in reality?
Looks fade, people get fatter or saggier and wrinklier... or do you expect to keep getting lucky and land a perfect unicorn every few years?
You need to use this experience to open up to more people whoever they are,  whatever they look like, in the hope of getting more social and less judgemental.
Bu no, you seem to be stuck in that same rut, the rut of failure.

It's cool. My attraction is based on overall not just physical looks though they are important. I know there are people who are attractive overall. Reality is looks and inexperience will kill my chances with anyone nevermind the other qualities I apparently lack. So irrespective who I chase the result will be the same.

I am as judgemental as those who throw me away like rubbish so that's fine. I'd rather have the odd unicorn than sit with someone for pure convenience.

 

[ZA Dater]

23 minutes ago, Weezy1973 said:

You don’t get matched on Tinder. Why do you keep saying they’re matches? These are just people that swiped right on you? Not matches.

Then I get no matches at all. The principal remains the same.

[jspice]

So why are you here? You have all the answers. We all agree you’re not going to find a gf. What more you do you need from this 1000 response thread?

[Weezy1973]

2 hours ago, ZA Dater said:

Then I get no matches at all. The principal remains the same.

That’s because you’re only swiping on women out of your league. Tinder is actually a horrible app to base any belief in. Look at married couples. You’ll see they match for the most part. 

[ZA Dater]

54 minutes ago, Weezy1973 said:

That’s because you’re only swiping on women out of your league. Tinder is actually a horrible app to base any belief in. Look at married couples. You’ll see they match for the most part. 

Seriously sorry but I do not believe in superiority in any form and its this which makes me completely dismiss so called leagues, the only leagues created relate to economics and societal rather than physical looks. So please tell me who I should be liking, actually anyone I'll even take this offline if you and other like. Maybe then some would understand why I have the outlook I do.

@Trail Blazerhas gone to extraordinary lengths to tell me how attractive ladies are where I live and how easily he matches with them, perhaps its time to actually compare my so called matches to what is actually deemed attractive.

Every single dating app is the same, they are all exactly the same as walking into a room but nobody here will admit it but nobody is going to look at the down trodden person sitting in the corner if there is someone glamorous sitting at the bar BUT, I forgot looks do not matter AT ALL. Funny then that this never happens on OLD all ALL of which make looks and appearance the most important thing. I mean if looks are so unimportant why not have an app with no picture function at all. I mean surely a lovely personality is enough to offset someone who is really not physically attractive.

Its like a chat I had yesterday

Friend on phone in front of me "you know I tried dating someone who is not physically attractive to me, it just does not work, she is inactive, I like to run and keep active, she eats badly I like to eat healthy food, I like to be active she does not, for the first time I did not date on looks, it simply does not work"

After which I get told "well you know its not all about looks". Nobody here can honestly tell me an inactive person is compatible with an active one.

Oh and about superficial, today I am standing looking at a new Ferrari parked in the street near a coffee shop I go to and a blond in full gym wear, stunning, walks specifically over to me big smile on her face "is that your new Ferrari". Of course I say it is not at which point the smile fades, mask goes back on and she walks away.I guess there is nothing superficial about that at all.

I am really glad apparently all of you are dating people you find attractive.

 

[Weezy1973]

26 minutes ago, ZA Dater said:

Seriously sorry but I do not believe in superiority in any form and its this which makes me completely dismiss so called leagues, the only leagues created relate to economics and societal rather than physical looks.

 

Do you read anything we post on here? I said specifically that leagues have nothing to do with being a better human being than another. It’s just about attraction. And essentially nobody is attracted to people less attractive than themselves, and looks is one of the components in overall initial attraction. Not the only component. With Tinder or similar low investment swiping apps, it practically is the only component, which is why you can’t take the results there seriously. And remember most people are naturally most attracted to people somewhat more attractive than themselves so on Tinder that means people better looking. Even slightly better looking. But it will generally not work because nobody wants someone less attractive than themselves.

Because you refuse to put yourself in situations where you see the same people over and over, like a cooking class or cycling club, then basically you’re stuck with looks being the major component of attraction. And because you’re only attracted to women better looking than yourself, your chances of finding a partner is very slim. 
 

So for you specifically it IS almost all about looks. Not true for the general population of course, but for your it is. 

[BaileyB]

2 hours ago, ZA Dater said:

Seriously sorry but I do not believe in superiority in any form and its this which makes me completely dismiss so called leagues

I would believe you, if you didn’t classify women as “top tier.” 

[ZA Dater]

1 hour ago, Weezy1973 said:

Do you read anything we post on here? I said specifically that leagues have nothing to do with being a better human being than another. It’s just about attraction. And essentially nobody is attracted to people less attractive than themselves, and looks is one of the components in overall initial attraction. Not the only component. With Tinder or similar low investment swiping apps, it practically is the only component, which is why you can’t take the results there seriously. And remember most people are naturally most attracted to people somewhat more attractive than themselves so on Tinder that means people better looking. Even slightly better looking. But it will generally not work because nobody wants someone less attractive than themselves.

Because you refuse to put yourself in situations where you see the same people over and over, like a cooking class or cycling club, then basically you’re stuck with looks being the major component of attraction. And because you’re only attracted to women better looking than yourself, your chances of finding a partner is very slim. 
 

So for you specifically it IS almost all about looks. Not true for the general population of course, but for your it is. 

Well thank you. 

Oh no, people put others in this ridiculous "leagues" not just on looks but on many things. 

"Less attractive than themselves".....how does one rate how attractive one is?

One thing Tinder and dating apps have shown me are EXACTLY the sort of people should I say "leagues" who find me attractive so they have been quite useful from that point of view, in a rather stupid way. If what you all say is true then why do I never match with like? 

The same people over and over, again I do not know one person who has had to do this? Even when the very few times this has happened, guess what I once again get thrown in the trash because, well there is always someone with more. At least you admit looks are the defining element of attraction, kudos for that, really. 

Not sure how "better looking" really is objectively defined. Either looks matter or they don't, cannot be both.

You know why I chase unicorns, simply because I'd rather chase and hope for something I really like than know I have settled for someone I do not like, it would be disrespecting that person and selling out the very fundamental by which I live. Clearly I am in the minority here, clearly others have found everything special they could want and I am happy for them, this does not change the fact that I am SURE for all of those people, they DO find their partner PHYSICALLY attractive? Or am I wrong?

 

 

[ZA Dater]

7 minutes ago, BaileyB said:

I would believe you, if you didn’t classify women as “top tier.” 

I was waiting for that, it was simply an expression to prove a point. Fact of the matter is and people will not like this, some put in effort to look good, others do not, some put in an effort to learn about the world around them, others do not. We are all the same but fundamentally different, you might like apples, I might not. 

My life experience has been that the models everyone laughs about, often they have the most life experience, they are the most learned, they have the most confidence and conversationally they are far better than someone who has not had to live their life under scrutiny, have there ever move watched and been leered at by men posing as gentleman. 

Nobody gets it here, so much of attraction for me is how someone communicates, yes a pretty face is VERY helpful but its not mistake that the people who have been nicest to me, treated me the best, taken an interest in me were all very good people, NONE of them came from dating sites. I enjoy people who can communicate about their lives, not tell me about their 9-5 but tell me what they actually want, where they have been, what they think of this and that and actually make me think.

I simply cannot and will not go on dates with people where I need to drag conversation out from them and then they ask me nothing about myself. Funny its the models who ask about me, ask about what I think and I actually get some platonic attention, of the dozen or so I have met this, was always the case, the vast majority actually were very nice to me. And yes none would date me but the experience I get while sporadic as in every few years is FAR better.

Compare this to OLD and the general disdain I get from these many of them bitter women and you wonder why I cannot be bothered with going on anymore of these sort of dates with so called people in my "league". You try sitting for an hour and getting asked nothing about yourself? What is the point and please its got nothing to do with being nervous. At what point does perhaps a "thank you for the date" become something so rare that I have yet to hear it? 

Look at what I got for effectively four weeks, I got welcomed into someone else's life, she shared what was going in, asked my opinion, asked me how I felt (amazing really never had that before), actually had some concern for me (again never had that before), did things with me, listened to me, gave me good constructive feedback, supported me when I had a difficult day, I supported here, absolutely loved spending time with her and her son. I even had a conversation with her mother. I could give and really give because I wanted to give, I wanted to get out of my shell, throw it off, I showed more emotion with her than with most people, I had confidence, I saw everything as good. It was nice for once to have someone I enjoyed spending time with, yes there were cons, she loved to leave things lying around but even that I was alright with. 

There is not ONE OLD date which had anywhere near this sort of appeal, WHY...Because I felt nothing for them. I could see it was just an interview, I was one of 100 choices and well there will be another guy tomorrow. Say what you want but I got more from this unicorn that I received from 20 years of dating. And you know what, for once I was really happy and life felt sort of complete. But then by the logic of here, well she is leagues above me and well I should maybe just accept less because well guys like me can only get less, I must kiss and bow for the guys who well they are more appropriate. 

No I have been slogging it out in the dating boxing rink for the EXACT hope of achieving this one day. And to some extend I did. 

Please tell me how "top tier" differs from the "'leagues" you all tell me exist?

[BaileyB]

You really like to hear yourself talk... That’s all I can think at this point, because there is nothing constructive happening in this discussion anymore. 

[Yosemite]

On 4/16/2021 at 7:05 AM, elaine567 said:

K is hanging around because you pay her to do so???

 

On 4/16/2021 at 7:16 AM, ZA Dater said:

 I guess there was a very minimal economic incentive, the lovely thing with her, like this lady I can sit down with her and just talk about anything and get warmth back rather than disdain.

How is this any different than being a sugar daddy? You paid K to talk to you and spend time with you? That's exactly what you would do as a sugar daddy. You should try it again. 

[ZA Dater]

1 minute ago, Yosemite said:

 

How is this any different than being a sugar daddy? You paid K to talk to you and spend time with you? That's exactly what you would do as a sugar daddy. You should try it again. 

Nope. Been there done that not interested in going there again. K actually helped me with events, the time I spent was a function of that.

At least some here have confirmed it's all about looks. I can live with that because well everyone here finds their partner physically attractive, which is great, I however seem to be quite discerning....for which I am roundly criticized.

 

[ZA Dater]

8 minutes ago, BaileyB said:

You really like to hear yourself talk... That’s all I can think at this point, because there is nothing constructive happening in this discussion anymore. 

No I an just being told I am wrong to want to date someone I find attractive, amazing really. All this mumbo jumbo about how I should give so and so a chance because of ABC reason, odd really, never seen many people given chances, oh wait superficially gifted people get lots of chances.

[Weezy1973]

2 hours ago, ZA Dater said:

"Less attractive than themselves".....how does one rate how attractive one is?

It’s not really a conscious thing. You’ll find some people attractive and others you won’t. Most people (not you) will also have a neutral or gray area in between people they find attractive and ones they don’t. 

 

2 hours ago, ZA Dater said:

If what you all say is true then why do I never match with like? 

It’s like you’re not reading. The women swiping right on you are shooting out of their league for you, and you’re swiping right on women out of your league. Hence, almost no matches. But remember you have had actual matches. 7 out of 200. It’s likely those 7 women were an actual match for you in terms of initial attractiveness. Doesn’t mean it’ll be a love connection of course. Just superficial attraction.

 

2 hours ago, ZA Dater said:

The same people over and over, again I do not know one person who has had to do this?

I didn’t get many dates from Tinder. Less than you. And no second dates. But I was  on quite a few other sites at the same time. It’s a numbers game with OLD.

 

2 hours ago, ZA Dater said:

Not sure how "better looking" really is objectively defined. Either looks matter or they don't, cannot be both.

They matter in terms of initial attraction, but are pretty meaningless when it comes to a long term relationship. They also are only part of initial attraction, but with methods such as Tinder, bars, and clubs etc. looks will carry most of the weight for initial attraction. Because that’s all people can see. If you actually see the same people over and over, looks play less of a role because you actually get to know someone’s personality which can have an impact, both positive or negative (or neutral). 

 

2 hours ago, ZA Dater said:

Clearly I am in the minority here, clearly others have found everything special they could want and I am happy for them, this does not change the fact that I am SURE for all of those people, they DO find their partner PHYSICALLY attractive? Or am I wrong?

Probably not all are attracted, but for sure most. 

[Weezy1973]

1 hour ago, ZA Dater said:

No I an just being told I am wrong to want to date someone I find attractive, amazing really.

Seriously. The issue is not that you want to date someone you find attractive. Everybody wants that. I posted a survey in another thread and it showed 92% of men and 84% of women wanted to date someone attractive. You’re not alone. 
 

The difference is you only find 1% or less of the population of women attractive. But hey, there was a woman who posts on this forum who said she estimates that she only finds 1 in 1000 men physically attractive. And of course she was always single too. 

[chillii]

It's ridiculous, of course people get you want personality , people want that , it's not only you. l see personality and depth in a person , their face , their ways , everything . lf l don't see that l have zero interest l couldn't care less how pretty that face is it's an empty shallow shell. Mutual interest , communication as with this lady , of course people get that , your not the only one. But you don't get and just deny what everyone's trys to tell you over and over. Without the perfect shell you won't touch it. They tell you over and over you can have all those things in a women , we all want that , well anyone that isn't a shallow brick like so many you describe. But they're saying among many many other things too, she might not be a model , and you can't get a model . So ok you say you'd rather have a thing as with this one even if with nothing more, bc she looks how she looks.

Well , lf you'd rather a half empty cup, ok then that's what you'll get, but you won't keep her in your life anyway , just like this one , they'll want the real thing too, not sitting around you with some friend thing . You can have both , but you'd have to open your eyes and mind to someone a bit lower down the old ladder. She doesn't have to be an over weight single mother, but she might not be a model either. lt's beyond me with all your standards as many have said 1000 times , how you don't see up and down any street , the combo of real couples out there.

Edited April 17, 2021 by chillii