How can we respond to 'I'm still mad about [something you did long ago] and I wish I weren't'

[Maxpower3979]

My wife suffers from depression, and has intrusive, negative thoughts that neither of us enjoy.  I'm far from perfect, but usually can respond with "people suck some times", "we'll figure out how to make this work", "let's cuddle and watch a show", or "I have cookies!", etc.  If it's about me, usually something I did a long time ago, then I'm lost.  I hear, "I could barely focus today because I was mad about how you used to [something]", and I freeze.  Instead of being able to acknowledge her feeling, I get stuck on the literal words she's saying and my instinct is to be defensive, to use logic, to remind her about what we talked about in therapy together a couple years ago, or 10 other things that she already knows.  She doesn't want to have that thought either.  What are other possible way to respond to this?

 

Extra context:
(it's so difficult to keep these short)

My wife suffers from depression, and the winter, working from home, and Covid restrictions certainly add to the feelings of isolation lately.  I'm less affected by these things.  I have ADD, not depression, and my intrusive thoughts are overwhelmingly positive.  I'll often suddenly laugh at something related to the current situation that someone said years ago.  If I do have a negative thoughts that I don't want in my head, I have strategies for fixing that on my own.  If a coworker said something that reminded me of something awful my mother said years ago, I know I can play a video game for a half hour and although I still remember what they said, the negativity spiral is stopped.  I was stressed about the unpredictability of the election recently, but I knew that if I gathered data, and made some charts and extrapolated, that I'd feel more in control and less anxious.  Say what you want about nerdy engineers, but I know myself, and that works for me.

The intrusive, negative thoughts my wife has are more than her coping mechanisms (traveling, desserts, propagating plants, videos of puppies, etc.) can handle.  I feel like she's relying on my to bridge that gap when it's too much.  Sometimes I can help.  Sometimes I can't.  Usually the intrusive, negative thought is about something I did a while ago (it varies), something we both acknowledge has been discussed, dealt with, or simply doesn't matter anymore.  For example, there were times, years ago, when I didn't defend my wife against something mean my mother said.  Since then, I've confronted my mother, gone through family therapy, realized my mother was not going to get better and was not a healthy person to be around, and we haven't spoken to my parents in 2 years.  We both know we can't change the past.  We both know that it takes time to realize the person that raised me wasn't a good person.  We both know that we're currently doing the right thing by not talking to her.  That's what makes the thought intrusive.  Neither of us want my wife to feel upset about words I didn't say several year ago, but she feels it none the less.

[Wiseman2]

Sorry to hear that. Ruminating is part of the constellation of depressive symptoms. When is the last time she saw her doctor and does she pursue regular supportive therapy?

[Maxpower3979]

9 hours ago, Wiseman2 said:

Sorry to hear that. Ruminating is part of the constellation of depressive symptoms. When is the last time she saw her doctor and does she pursue regular supportive therapy?

She's tapered down from weekly sessions 2 years ago, to monthly sessions, and finally finished therapy this summer.  Fortunately, she's aware of the causes, and symptoms of depression and can discuss it more comfortably than I can.  She used Zoloft once for a few months, and although she'd prefer not to use it, she's open to that again.

[basil67]

Maxpower, if the incident has been dealt with to what you both agree is the best you can do, I'd shut down the conversation with something like "I have done extensive work to correct this error.  I can't keep discussing it with you"   I worry that when you get drawn in to discussing it again years later, that you're rewarding her intrusive thoughts.

What advice did her therapist give for when she puts her thoughts on you?

[Caauug]

On 12/18/2020 at 1:07 AM, Maxpower3979 said:

 I get stuck on the literal words she's saying and my instinct is to be defensive, to use logic,......  She doesn't want to have that thought either.

Don't.... You can't fix her, this is the way she is. These are her thoughts and her emotions, you can not/should not try to control them. She is expressing them to you, for you to listen and understand her, this is her way of processing them. She is not wanting you to "fix" them.... Try to just listen and show a little empathy. 

Remember her thought processes are not the same as yours. Take notice how your wife is around a bunch of women and how they talk about there problems, they mainly listen, agree with each other, maybe a few suggestions might be offered, but nearly never told how to "Fix" the problem unless it is serious.

I know this is going against your natural instincts, but give it ago next time. 

 

[Wiseman2]

8 hours ago, Maxpower3979 said:

 finished therapy this summer.  .  She used Zoloft once for a few months, 

She needs to go to a physician and be evaluated for the untreated and worsening depression.

It's that simple. Depression is not like a sinus infection, where you take antibiotics for a while,then you are cured.

As you can see her untreated depression is causing a lot of problems and distress, no matter how much insight she has into her illness and misery.

 

[Maxpower3979]

On 12/18/2020 at 7:45 PM, basil67 said:

What advice did her therapist give for...

On 12/19/2020 at 2:29 AM, Wiseman2 said:

She needs to go to...

On 12/18/2020 at 11:06 PM, Caauug said:

... this is the way she is. These are her thoughts and her emotions...   ...they mainly listen, agree with each other

 

My wife's depression is indeed her problem that she's got to take the initiative to try to fix.  I can't make her do or think anything.  I understand that.  It sounds like, in my initial question, I should have emphasized that I'm not asking about her depression.  I'm trying to solve my "freezing" problem.  When she brings up these topics, I freeze, without talking for several seconds, several minutes, or as long as it takes for her to talk again, or walk away.  My brain is running through 100 things I should NOT do (e.g. try to "fix" her, tell her not to worry, explain that it's not my fault, remind her of therapy, etc.)....and at no point while I'm "frozen" does my brain come up with something agreeable to do or say, so I don't do anything, and I don't say anything.  I know what NOT to do, but does anyone have suggestions for what I CAN do?

Caauug suggested mirroring how women talk to each other, by listening and agreeing.  I can't imagine (says the guy with the frozen brain) that it would be helpful if I agree with her that I was insensitive.  In fact, saying "You're right.  I was so dumb and mean" might even appear sarcastic given that (answering basil67's question) her therapist suggested that my previous actions had an understandable reasoning behind them.  However, trying to extrapolate from Caauug's idea, perhaps I'm just stuck on the fact that I did something, when the real issue is that she felt something.  Would it be helpful if I asked about that?  Could I say "I bet that made you feel so alone."?  Am I starting to understand something, or (as my frozen brain is suggesting) is this another dead end, and I shouldn't lead her to focus on those negative feelings?

[ExpatInItaly]

This is above your paygrade, OP.

Mirroring her is unlikely to work as anything but a Band-Aid. The problem lies not in how you react to her, but the very fact that she's not currently treated and not managing her depression well. Your response to her is not addressing the real root of this issue. 

Edited December 23, 2020 by ExpatInItaly

[Wiseman2]

13 hours ago, Maxpower3979 said:

 I'm "frozen" does my brain come up with something agreeable to do or say, so I don't do anything, and I don't say anything. 

Excellent. Don't reward her denial and self-defeating behaviors by allowing her to force you into playing therapist.

Freeze. Don't coddle or listen or entertain it.

When you stop allowing her to force you into the role of doctor, she'll have to go to a therapist and doctor.

What she's doing is manipulative and destructive to a relationship. 

If she starts complaining and ruminating and using toxic guilt etc. walk away.