sexual/emotional affair with a cousin - should I tell what I know?

[Canoehead]

Hi everyone, (sorry if this is the wrong category! I'm doing this for the first time!)

I've never asked a question online like this, but I find myself at a crossroads and I don't know what to do.  In brief, my girlfriend and I are very close, considering marriage.  We've only been together (living together I mean) for a year, although we've known each other for 14 years and had feelings most of that time, but circumstances were always not right for us to be together. Then, the stars aligned, and we fell in love.  It's been wonderful, mostly, and we have a great deal in common, same values, similar spiritual/personal-growth inclination, very sexually compatible, intellectually similar, etc.  In short, we have a great connection and potential for the future.

The issue is her cousin.  They used to have sex, at family reunions, (& once when she travelled to his province to spend a weekend with him).  Overall, I don't know the details, but it happened multiple times, starting in their early 20s.  Now it's been a decade, and they've maintained a private email/chat communication, like penpals, ever since.  More than 100 messages.  They've shared details of their relationships as other people have come and gone, and in every way it seems, they've been 'close.'

Then he got engaged, and STILL showed up at her house afterwards, propositioning her for sex.  She says she turned him down then, but I'm honestly not sure.  It would be the first for her if she did do so.  But it was also just before her and I started dating, and I think she knew if she told me she slept with her cousin who was cheating on his FIANCEE to do so, I would have broken up with her.  Which I would have, because, regardless of what happened in "the past", she's now in her 30s, and having sex with your cousin, maintaining what is effectively an emotional affair, and then cheating on current partners, is not "the past" anymore.  

So what should I do?  I do love this girl, and I can understand her own sexually-questionable choices in the past coming from emotional insecurity, a tough childhood, etc.  I get it.  We all have skeletons in our closet, and I sure found comfort in sex when I was younger and insecure.  I'm not proud of every sexual encounter I had either.  So I can accept "the past". But not the present.

So I have asked her to do two things.  One is to have the decency to tell his fiancee that he propositioned her (my gf) for sex, after getting engaged.  She has a right to know she's marrying a cheater.  (NOTE: They just had a baby together; so now she's co-parenting with a cheater who has sex with his own cousin at family reunions, and she doesn't even know it.)

Two is to tell him she won't continue their 1-on-1 private correspondence anymore, but if they have messages to send (e.g., her last message, she said, was to congratulate him on becoming a dad), they should do it in a group-chat -- with me, the guy's fiancee, my girlfriend, and the guy.  One big happy family, right?  

To me, that seems reasonable.  She does have to continue communicating with her cousin.  But I do not accept her continuing their private relationship.

The thing is, she has promised me she will do these things.  But then, months have gone by and she doesn't.  Because "it's awkward", and obviously she's embarrassed.  However, she's still sending him messages....

I don't want to lose this girl.  I'm in my late 40s, already divorced, and was REALLY selective (so I thought) in making a wise choice with this girl.  She has it all, and together, we have it all.  Except honesty, and a lack of sexual boundaries within her family, it would seem....

So I feel like I should give her an ultimatum, and then leave if she won't confront him.  But I don't want to leave and be alone, and do I break my kids' hearts as they see another "family" bite the dust?  And lose this girl, and long-time friend of mine, over something that happened "in the past" and that she assures me would never happen again (i.e., having sex with her cousin)?

I don't want to throw away a great relationship because of 'mistakes'.  But I don't want to invest in a relationship with someone who lies and won't 'do the right thing' and stand up to this guy, AND tell his fiancee the truth about him.

I also feel like I should tell the guy's fiancee, if my girlfriend won't.  She has a right to know.  That woman is signing herself up for a lifetime of being cheated on, and doesn't even know it.  (Assuming the guy will continue behaving like this; my sense is that my girlfriend is likely not his only affair, but I don't know for sure...)  But IF I tell her, it'll be clear that it was me, even if I somehow do it anonymously, because obviously, others don't know about this, just me.  So in telling her, I am totally exposing my girlfriend's cousin-affair to her whole family.  .....bleh....

Ugh.....advice?

Thanks all. Much, much appreciated.

Edited December 19, 2020 by Canoehead
I feel like this might be the wrong category....sorry about that....

[elaine567]

Its a mess.
If I were you I would walk away.

1) He is far too close for comfort
2) This "habit" of hers will be difficult to stop. She is still messaging him.
3) I wouldn't be able to tolerate him no doubt smirking in my direction at family events...
4) As he has a baby, your gf is NOT going to tell the fiancée and as this whole sorry scenario paints your gf in a bad light she will NOT want to blow up her entire family over this.

 

[ExpatInItaly]

She is showing you very clearly she doesn't want him out of her life. 

Delivering an ultimatum isn't going to change her deep, underlying emotional attachment to him. When you reach that point, your relationship is essentially already toast. 

She is not the devoted girlfriend you are seeking. Exposing all of this is not the issue you should be focusing on. The main problem is why you're attempting to shove a square peg into a round hole with this woman. 

Edited December 19, 2020 by ExpatInItaly

[Canoehead]

Thanks, elaine, for your response.  I appreciate it.  I feel the same way.  TBH, I just wasn't 'ready' to be alone again.  And I did believe so deeply in this relationship.  Like I said, I've known her for about 14 years and thought I knew her deeply....  😢 Anyway, thanks.  Really.  It's starting to look like I'll be taking your advice, and getting out of this before I invest even more of my heart.  Thank you.

[Canoehead]

Thanks ExpatInItaly.  You are totally right.  I AM trying to fit a square peg into a round hole.  I loved/was-attracted-to this girl for so long that I think I put her on a pedestal and assumed some "soul mate" kind of perfection when a very different Reality is staring me in the face.  ......That was tough to hear, but yeah.....I hear you.  Thanks for telling it like it is.  

[Cookiesandough]

Same values and she has sex with her cousin. I agree with what Elaine says, and on top of that I add that you might want to reconsider your values... 

[Canoehead]

Thanks Shortskirt....To be fair, I didn't mean we shared THOSE values...hahaha....  "Bonking family members" doesn't usually come up in discussions of one's values....  But thanks for making me laugh here.  I needed that.    In the future, I'll specify, "we share many of the same values, such as living a simple life, being not-materialistic, believing in personal growth, compassion, ....."  And maybe I'll add, "but we differ in some important respects.  Such as, she has sex with her cousin, and I personally don't share that value...."   

[salparadise]

If you set the cousin distraction aside for a moment... she's still involved with a guy she's been phukking for a long time, and she resists breaking it off. That is all you need to know to decide if this relationship is one you should invest in.

Expecting her to blow the lid off her affair as some kind of test is extremely unrealistic. She will be judged at least as harshly as he, if not more. Plus there's a child involved, and it's simply not your place (or her's) to destroy that family. You don't know what their future will be like. I wish I had a nickel for every time I've heard this "She has a right to know" crap. I'd say she's got a right to live in peace without you interfering in something that's none of your business. You aren't the sex police.

So the only actionable or relevant piece of this mess as it relates to you is the fact that she refuses to cut it off with the guy she's been phukking up until you showed up, and she continues messaging him despite knowing how you feel about it. The cousin part is icky, but barely relevant. Of course it would never be pleasant when you see him at family gatherings and wondering if he's been round visit your wife lately. 

Edited December 19, 2020 by salparadise

[HadMeOverABarrel]

On 12/19/2020 at 10:55 AM, Canoehead said:

So I feel like I should give her an ultimatum, and then leave if she won't confront him.  But I don't want to leave and be alone, and do I break my kids' hearts as they see another "family" bite the dust?  And lose this girl, and long-time friend of mine, over something that happened "in the past" and that she assures me would never happen again (i.e., having sex with her cousin)?

Your feelings here are your common sense speaking to you. Don't ignore that. Be careful to not dance with the devil...he takes small bites while you are dancing, but when you realize the extent of damage it's too late. 

In other words, if you can't enforce your boundaries with her now, how would you enforce them when you're married? Also, granted you are concerned about hurting your kids by breaking it off with your girlfriend, but imagine exposing them to possibly something worse like being in a marriage with someone who will not put you (and kids) above a toxic situation?

You are here posting because you have some legit concerns. And you have other little people whose lives are dependent on your choices. Set a good example by teaching them how to healthfully set and enforce boundaries. Do not ignore your concerns. Address them with her, and let her know there will be consequences if she refuses to follow through. Doing that protects you, your relationship, your kids, and even her to an extent. It also shows good leadership on your part, which I think is important for men in romantic relationships.

As for telling counsin's fiance...no to that. Stay in your own lane. You take care of you and yours, and let others take care of theirs. I question your motive on telling her...while you might convince yourself that your motives are altruistic, more likely they are to try to get her to exert pressure to break up the kissing cousins from her side. That could land you in the center of a big family conflict, which will not end well for you, or your relationship, or your kids. Possibly you also think it will make you feel better to interfere in his relationship the way  he interfered in yours (it won't). Be honest with yourself on your motives. 

[LittleDove78]

I can't get past has sex with her cousin...

[Watercolors]

On 12/19/2020 at 9:55 AM, Canoehead said:

also feel like I should tell the guy's fiancee, if my girlfriend won't.  She has a right to know.  That woman is signing herself up for a lifetime of being cheated on, and doesn't even know it.  (Assuming the guy will continue behaving like this; my sense is that my girlfriend is likely not his only affair, but I don't know for sure...)  But IF I tell her, it'll be clear that it was me, even if I somehow do it anonymously, because obviously, others don't know about this, just me.  So in telling her, I am totally exposing my girlfriend's cousin-affair to her whole family.  .....bleh....

Ugh.....advice?

If you scour the internet you'll find thousands of stories of cousins (1st, 2nd, 3rd, 4th) who wound up marrying each other. Hell, 80% of British people are less than 6 degrees of separated from each other genetically due to the incestuous sexing of cousins since the 13th century. 

That said. You cannot expect your girlfriend to respond to your ultimatum positively. You've tried to set a boundary with her already and she's crossed it. So, she already doesn't respect your feelings. And, she's not likely to respect your feelings if she's going to continue to sex up her cousin while she's with you. She's going to continue her "bond" with her cousin, until they both realize that they should be married to each other, not to you or to the cousin's fiance. That's really the best outcome in this situation, I believe. 

You can choose to do the following, and only YOU, and then you have to wait and see what happens: 

1. Break up with your g/f over her sexual encounters w/her cousin
2. Tell the cousin's fiance in FRONT of your g/f and the cousin about their incestuous sexual relationship
3. Tell the cousin one-on-one that you are disturbed by his sexual relationship w/your g/f and you want him to stop pursuing her for sex
4. Tell your family that your g/f has sex with her cousin while dating you

On 12/19/2020 at 9:55 AM, Canoehead said:

So what should I do?  I do love this girl, and I can understand her own sexually-questionable choices in the past coming from emotional insecurity, a tough childhood, etc.  I get it.  We all have skeletons in our closet, and I sure found comfort in sex when I was younger and insecure.  I'm not proud of every sexual encounter I had either.  So I can accept "the past". But not the present.

As you can see, choices 2-4 are heinous choices. And only choice #1 seems to be the most common sense choice for you in this rather awkward situation. 

If you stay with your g/f you don't get to dictate to her anything about her relationship with her cousin. You don't, sorry. You'll just have to accept that she and her cousin will likely have sex on the side and there's nothing you can do b/c they are both consenting adults. She may stop having sex with her cousin, too, out of respect for you. And you have to learn to trust her, and not suspect she's constantly lying to you or that will destroy your relationship with her. 

As much as you love her and feel sympatico with her - the red flag is glaring you in the face and it's not going to disappear even though your g/f or her cousin may cease sexing each other up. You'll always be disturbed by that dynamic between them and that's totally acceptable to feel that way. But, I can. see your g/f feeling shamed by you - her b/f - b/c you bring it up everytime you two may have a spat in the future about anything. "Why didn't you pay last month's electricity bill? Was it because you were having sex with your cousin?" 

I think you are better off admitting the truth. Which is: you don't really accept her past, and definitely not her present, because you have posted about it here.

So, my advice, is to do the tough call: break up with her.

Otherwise, it will be a skeleton that hangs over you both, and cause lots of trust issues between you both. 

Edited January 16, 2021 by Watercolors

[misspalmy]

Run isn’t their laws about having sex with cosin? 
 

she probably still seeing him 

[d0nnivain]

Your request that she stop private communications with him & include you & his wife in the discussions is reasonable.

Your demand that she tell his wife about their past is a terrible idea & I hope she keeps her mouth shut.  They are married & have a kid.  Leave the past in the past.

The week before he got married, a year after we graduated from college,  one of my best friends from high school came home (400+ miles) & showed up on my door step.  He told me that if I told him I loved him he wouldn't marry.  I said I'm going to tell you not to marry because you can even say such a thing.  He & I had hooked up 2x previously -- once as juniors in HS & once as freshman in college, 2 years before he met his FI.  He left. 

They married anyway.  I had not been invited to the wedding & only met his wife once years later at our 25th HS reunion.  They divorced a few years after that reunion but that had nothing to do with me.  Although the guy & I are friends on social media save an occasional "like" usually on a sports related post, we don't interact.   His stupid declaration to me, probably born of fear & cold feet, was of no moment once he married & had kids.  I certainly never spoke of this to his wife, him or anybody who actually knows us both,