elaine567 Posted January 19, 2021 Share Posted January 19, 2021 5 hours ago, Wiseman2 said: Just like getting behind the wheel drunk. Conscious choice Not necessarily, alcohol is an actual drug and some drunk drivers are barely "conscious" enough to make that choice. Their judgement is impaired by the alcohol. But not many of the OW posting here, are so "intoxicated" they just had to get mixed up with a married man... for years. Link to post Share on other sites
Wiseman2 Posted January 19, 2021 Share Posted January 19, 2021 23 minutes ago, elaine567 said: Not necessarily, alcohol is an actual drug and some drunk drivers are barely "conscious" enough to make that choice. When a drunk driver kills a loved one of yours, you won't make excuses for this illegal deadly behavior. And who put the alcohol in their bodies in the first place? Link to post Share on other sites
elaine567 Posted January 19, 2021 Share Posted January 19, 2021 14 minutes ago, Wiseman2 said: When a drunk driver kills a loved one of yours, you won't make excuses for this illegal deadly behavior. And who put the alcohol in their bodies in the first place? No excuses offered or implied. BUT what someone does under the influence of a drug is completely different to what one chooses to do stone cold sober. 1 Link to post Share on other sites
Bittersweetie Posted January 19, 2021 Share Posted January 19, 2021 Savannah, I ask this gently...could there be a possibility that you - for lack of a better term - "enjoy" being the victim in this situation? I have come across others that continue to complain about being in a difficult situation, yet take no action to end that difficult situation. I found that they have almost become attached to being the victim in that situation...it defines them, it allows them to not take any true risks (by not making a change), and even absolves them responsibility for their actions ("I don't know how to stop"). I bring this up because you continue to make this choice over and over again, and wonder if you now see this situation as a definition of yourself...a woman in love who is the victim of a MM's callousness. As others have mentioned, and I have mentioned over and over again, you are not a victim, you have the power to make a change at any time. It may not be easy or painless but you can do it if you truly want to. Now would be a great time to start. Good luck. 4 Link to post Share on other sites
Author Savannah2 Posted January 19, 2021 Author Share Posted January 19, 2021 I don’t know the answer to that really .. . I think it’s like mark Clemson said in a previous post .. I hit rock bottom and decided to make a home out of it all these years because it was the only way to be with him ..and the pain of not being with him always outweighed staying all this time. This is the longest we’ve ever gone without talking in 8 years. He has his phone with him and is conscious and alert so the decision to not contact me at all during this time has been his and not anything completely out of his control like not having access to his phone. Link to post Share on other sites
BaileyB Posted January 19, 2021 Share Posted January 19, 2021 (edited) 1 hour ago, Bittersweetie said: you continue to make this choice over and over again, and wonder if you now see this situation as a definition of yourself...a woman in love who is the victim of a MM's callousness I totally agree. Although, I don’t believe Savannah to be a victim of MM callousness... He does the most terrible things to her, and she’s not angry. She is hurt, because she expected more from him... I believe that she defines herself as a woman in love who has no control, no ability to leave because she loves him... And she has justified staying all these years exactly as she states above, by telling herself that it’s better to have him in her life however she can have him, than not at all. Edited January 19, 2021 by BaileyB 2 1 Link to post Share on other sites
mark clemson Posted January 19, 2021 Share Posted January 19, 2021 7 hours ago, Wiseman2 said: They're "in too deep" the moment they decide to carry on with someone who is in another relationship. Yes. It's that simple. It's not like a cocaine addiction. That's an excuse to hurt a lot of people, especially kids. You're right to a certain extent. What does "carry on" mean? People who work together and talk can start to develop feelings. They shouldn't act on those feelings, true. Maybe they should have never spoken to each other? Maybe we can be like Saudi Arabia and not have the sexes mix - that will fix everything, so that nothing bad ever happens, right? Some might say someone was in to deep the moment they decided to try coke or a cigarette? They actually weren't at the time, but eventually they were. Some people can handle mild social attention and/or flirting, and some can't I suppose. You ARE right that people have a choice early on to avoid, e.g. if they start to realize they are "catching feelings" or similar. I do know that limerence can creep up on someone e.g. who they interact with, or even just see, regularly, e.g. at work etc. It does happen. "I have a crush on my coworker." If that other person is taken, they SHOULD stay away. I think USUALLY people do, actually. This is only a certain % of affairs anyhow. In many it's simply an unethical decision, that might stem, e.g. from an unhappy marriage, not wanting to deal with separation/divorce, or in some cases simply boredom/desire for "extra". Link to post Share on other sites
Bittersweetie Posted January 19, 2021 Share Posted January 19, 2021 38 minutes ago, BaileyB said: I believe that she defines herself as a woman in love who has no control, no ability to leave because she loves him... And she has justified staying all these years exactly as she states above, by telling herself that it’s better to have him in her life however she can have him, than not at all. Yes, I agree...it is like Savannah is a victim of herself and her own choices. 2 Link to post Share on other sites
elaine567 Posted January 19, 2021 Share Posted January 19, 2021 27 minutes ago, mark clemson said: What does "carry on" mean? "be engaged in a love affair, typically one of which the speaker disapproves." Link to post Share on other sites
mark clemson Posted January 19, 2021 Share Posted January 19, 2021 Ah, thank you @elaine567 I thought this meant interact with in some way (so in any way given the context), but I guess it's a colloquialism or similar expression. So, I was in fact thrown off by this. 1 Link to post Share on other sites
Lorryborry Posted January 19, 2021 Share Posted January 19, 2021 6 hours ago, Savannah2 said: I don’t know the answer to that really .. . I think it’s like mark Clemson said in a previous post .. I hit rock bottom and decided to make a home out of it all these years because it was the only way to be with him ..and the pain of not being with him always outweighed staying all this time. This is the longest we’ve ever gone without talking in 8 years. He has his phone with him and is conscious and alert so the decision to not contact me at all during this time has been his and not anything completely out of his control like not having access to his phone. That's really hard Savannah. My friend is not messaging me an update either. It hurts but er got to find ourselves and dig out of this. Are u single? If so this is stopping you meeting someone who you can build a life with 1 hour ago, S2B said: The ONLY reason this continues is because YOU choose to stay involved. take yourself out of it and it will go away. but I guarantee you - he will quickly find your replacement. Yes this is the other side of it. We are only special to them while they are getting some need fulfilled. Link to post Share on other sites
elaine567 Posted January 19, 2021 Share Posted January 19, 2021 Savannah like so many women in bad relationships does not want to leave. She does not want to lose him, she just wants him to be the man she wants him to be. Leaving is not an option. She is "bashing her head up against a brick wall " personified. He upsets her, she gets hurt and frustrated and sad and even bereft, but once he throws her a lifeline, she is rejuvenated, she has hope, she reformats her expectations and she is back in the game. Ready for the next batch of hurtful and uncaring things he throws at her, back to feeling awful, uncared for and upset, BUT then she gets some hope again from somewhere and the cycle continues... She doesn't learn as to learn would be accepting it is all over and she has lost. She doesn't want it to be over and neither does he, so they continue on in their dysfunctional "union". She can never really leave, as she may miss her chance to be with this guy in a proper relationship... 1 2 Link to post Share on other sites
Beentheretoooften Posted January 22, 2021 Share Posted January 22, 2021 On 1/19/2021 at 10:43 PM, S2B said: Actually - I think the evidence shows this MM doesn’t see her as special. If he did it wouldn’t look like this. she should find an available man who actually does think she’s special. this guy is nothing but selfish. He probably is selfish no doubt. It’s not like he’s lying to her though or Leading her on. Sounds like he never made any promises. It is what it is. She has likely overblown the situation. So, actually, by not doing all those things, you could make a case that he’s not selfish and giving her all kinds of reasons to leave Link to post Share on other sites
BaileyB Posted January 22, 2021 Share Posted January 22, 2021 (edited) 11 hours ago, Beentheretoooften said: He’s not selfish and giving her all kinds of reasons to leave He’s selfish in that he has taken what was offered. When he accepts the offer of a blow job at work, knowing full well that she loves him and wants to be with him forever knowing full well that he offers nothing in return - he is thinking only of himself... This woman has subjugated herself to him, and he has taken full advantage, Edited January 22, 2021 by BaileyB 1 Link to post Share on other sites
Prudence V Posted January 22, 2021 Share Posted January 22, 2021 On 1/19/2021 at 10:31 PM, elaine567 said: as she may miss her chance to be with this guy in a proper relationship... I don’t think this guy and “proper relationship” can exist in the same universe, never mind the same sentence. Someone who is capable of treating another human so transactionally must be deeply damaged on some level. 4 Link to post Share on other sites
pepperbird2 Posted January 22, 2021 Share Posted January 22, 2021 3 hours ago, Prudence V said: I don’t think this guy and “proper relationship” can exist in the same universe, never mind the same sentence. Someone who is capable of treating another human so transactionally must be deeply damaged on some level. It's like he sees the people in his life as playthings- there for his amusement and little more. 1 Link to post Share on other sites
SharpMind Posted January 26, 2021 Share Posted January 26, 2021 Just curious is alive still....? Link to post Share on other sites
pepperbird2 Posted February 3, 2021 Share Posted February 3, 2021 op, how are you doing? Link to post Share on other sites
LIRR88 Posted February 9, 2021 Share Posted February 9, 2021 The whole thing is sad. In those 10 years you could have found the love of your life. I think you need see a therapist OP, not trying to be harsh but you need to learn to love yourself before you love others. This guy has been using you for a decade, you’re never gonna get that time back. 1 Link to post Share on other sites
vla1120 Posted February 9, 2021 Share Posted February 9, 2021 @Savannah2 Have you ever been in an exclusive relationship with a man? Do you know what it is like to have someone put your needs before their own, to watch over you and make sure your needs are met? I know you haven't had that with this man for the past 10 years, and now, when he is faced with his mortality, was his first thought of your welfare? No. Please take this as a cue and find someone worthy of your love and attention. Imagine, not having to sneak around to have sex at work - being able to spend time outside of work, doing things together that the two of you enjoy. I cannot imagine how this 10 year facade could possibly measure up to the possibility of having a love of your own. Link to post Share on other sites
Bittersweetie Posted February 10, 2021 Share Posted February 10, 2021 (edited) 19 hours ago, vla1120 said: @Savannah2 Have you ever been in an exclusive relationship with a man? Do you know what it is like to have someone put your needs before their own, to watch over you and make sure your needs are met? I know you haven't had that with this man for the past 10 years, and now, when he is faced with his mortality, was his first thought of your welfare? No. Please take this as a cue and find someone worthy of your love and attention. Imagine, not having to sneak around to have sex at work - being able to spend time outside of work, doing things together that the two of you enjoy. I cannot imagine how this 10 year facade could possibly measure up to the possibility of having a love of your own. Savannah is married herself. Their families are friends, kids are friends, apparently they even vacation together. So the fact that Savannah has continued to make these choices again and again is even more troubling. Edited to add link to previous thread, I hope this is okay to do. Edited February 10, 2021 by Bittersweetie Link to post Share on other sites
Author Savannah2 Posted February 16, 2021 Author Share Posted February 16, 2021 (edited) He’s still alive. Still in hospital though. And now all he does is say how much he loves his wife and how thankful he is for her. He hasn’t contacted me. I just have to sit here and listen to everyone talk about what a great guy he is and how much he loves his wife all the while knowing that he had his d in my mouth for the past ten years. I don’t expect to hear from him though. From what I gather this has been a life changing moment for him and he’s only living his life on the straight and narrow from now forward with his second chance at life . I guess In hindsight I was the villain in his story because all he had to say to me before he went in the hospital was that he didn’t want to die a cheater Amd he loved his wife the whole time Edited February 16, 2021 by Savannah2 Link to post Share on other sites
BaileyB Posted February 16, 2021 Share Posted February 16, 2021 (edited) I find myself wanting to tell you that I’m sorry to hear this update because I know it’s what you want to hear... but truthfully, it is without a doubt the single best thing that you ever happen to you. I’m sure that you don’t see it that way, but it’s very true. What are you doing to care for yourself Savannah? How can you start to look to the future? Edited February 16, 2021 by BaileyB 2 Link to post Share on other sites
Author Savannah2 Posted February 16, 2021 Author Share Posted February 16, 2021 (edited) Bailey, my hope is that the forced no contact the past month and months to come will help lessen this connection I feel for him so that when I do see him again those feelings are not there and are replaced with either indifference or just anger towards him. I try to not let myself romanticize anything I had with him. I try to see it for what it was to him. Easy work sex. But then the what if’s start.. what if he really did love me and just couldn’t show it? Can 8 years be erased in one month of no contact? I’m glad he is going to be ok I really am. But the truth is that whether he lived or died, I am still having to grieve him and what we were because I don’t think there is going to be a coming back for us Edited February 16, 2021 by Savannah2 Link to post Share on other sites
HadMeOverABarrel Posted February 18, 2021 Share Posted February 18, 2021 On 2/16/2021 at 6:35 PM, Savannah2 said: But then the what if’s start.. what if he really did love me and just couldn’t show it? Has he had any issues showing he loves his wife per his own words and those of others? Apparently not. There is your answer...it's not that he can't show his love (for you), it's that he doesn't love you as a person for who you are. I'm so sorry that is painful for you, but I truly feel it's the truth...and the truth will set you free! Please set yourself free, Savannah. There is so much more to life, and you are worth so much more, than what you are accepting. 1 Link to post Share on other sites
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