Feel like i'm going crazy

[elaine567]

9 minutes ago, BaileyB said:

And Becca, it stuns me how some women will take back their wandering husbands... I can understand the desire to keep your family together for so many different reasons... but, my husband choses another woman and lives with her for another year - he better not come knocking on my door again!! It is kind of stunning that she took him back. 

I am not surprised.... Some woman love being married, some women have little else in their lives, some women want the father of their children to be part of the family... some women will fight tooth and nail to get that man back into her life.
Some women are completely bonded, they do not want another man, the thought of being alone for the next few decades is not something she wishes to contemplate.
The divorcee who is often ostracised by society and married friends and who is used by men, is not something she wants to be, she wants that married label, even if she has to swallow her pride to keep it.
There is also the problem of being a single parent, scrimping and saving.. why do that if you don't really have to?
Another wage is a big asset and not something to be discarded lightly.
"Sure he cheated, but the kids are fine and I still have my house, my garden, my friends, my holidays and my status as a married woman."

[Beca L]

26 minutes ago, elaine567 said:

I am not surprised.... Some woman love being married, some women have little else in their lives, some women want the father of their children to be part of the family... some women will fight tooth and nail to get that man back into her life.
Some women are completely bonded, they do not want another man, the thought of being alone for the next few decades is not something she wishes to contemplate.
The divorcee who is often ostracised by society and married friends and who is used by men, is not something she wants to be, she wants that married label, even if she has to swallow her pride to keep it.
There is also the problem of being a single parent, scrimping and saving.. why do that if you don't really have to?
Another wage is a big asset and not something to be discarded lightly.
"Sure he cheated, but the kids are fine and I still have my house, my garden, my friends, my holidays and my status as a married woman."

I totally agree. I remember before I'd discovered this website this time last year I pondered over why my xmm's W had decided to take him back and it baffled me. But listening to comments on this site it made total sense. In fact she never really let him go and constantly messaged, phoned and wrote to him whilst we were together. In fact she discovered all her letters to him (unopened) when he returned. She wanted to be married, wanted her husband, her property. They had been together for 32+ years, 3 adult sons, their lives were completely entwined, she probably wouldn't be able to cope without him. Fear of the unknown is another factor. Financially she was in a bad way after he left, even with the money from the sale of their home she couldn't afford to buy her own place so she would have been renting until she died, she wasn't about to let him move on with a new wife and family and a new home. 

Anyway it is sad but I think I've been brushed under the carpet and how these BS cope is beyond me, it must be like someone who has suffered severe trauma, it just gets pushed to the back of the mind, like it never happened. I'm guessing in this case MM is confident his wife will do the same. 

[NAB]

Or his wife has fun with the available pool guy, or lawn guy, who she wouldn’t leave her husband for either!

[DKT3]

1 hour ago, Beca L said:

I totally agree. I remember before I'd discovered this website this time last year I pondered over why my xmm's W had decided to take him back and it baffled me. But listening to comments on this site it made total sense. In fact she never really let him go and constantly messaged, phoned and wrote to him whilst we were together. In fact she discovered all her letters to him (unopened) when he returned. She wanted to be married, wanted her husband, her property. They had been together for 32+ years, 3 adult sons, their lives were completely entwined, she probably wouldn't be able to cope without him. Fear of the unknown is another factor. Financially she was in a bad way after he left, even with the money from the sale of their home she couldn't afford to buy her own place so she would have been renting until she died, she wasn't about to let him move on with a new wife and family and a new home. 

Anyway it is sad but I think I've been brushed under the carpet and how these BS cope is beyond me, it must be like someone who has suffered severe trauma, it just gets pushed to the back of the mind, like it never happened. I'm guessing in this case MM is confident his wife will do the same. 

I believe this is a common narrative among OW. Likely far from the truth.  Its a narrative that kinda makes it sound like the BS manipulated him back. As if he had no other option. 

Here is what I dont understand coming from OW: WHY WOULD SHE TAKE HIM BACK? Hmm its the same man that brought you here, the same man you want, (at least you did) why do you? Same lying cheater.

[spiderowl]

I'm sorry to hear of your situation, OP.  It does sound as if you were feeling vulnerable and then became drawn in by his needs which appeared to match yours at the time.  With time, you've come to realise that his needs are his only concern.

I second what others have said about contacting a lawyer and about seeing a counsellor.  Both have their separate uses and both could be invaluable to you.

Until you have all the true facts, I would not blow up the whole business thing - it sounds like you are doing pretty well for the business and it is your main income at the moment.  Keep it going until you can safely get out with the benefits from the business that you deserve.  You really need the legal advice to deal with this.

The MM is sensing that you are not happy and, like the manipulative person he is, he will try the sob story and if that does not work he will try to knock you back into your place using denigration and demoralisation.   He has tried both here.  It does not mean what he is saying is true, he is panicking that you might put a spanner in the works of a deal that has gone well for him for seven years.  I am rather paranoid but I would advise you to also up your personal security measures.  Change your home locks if he has a key.  Do not let him into your home again or walk anywhere alone with him. Try not to be alone with him and, if you do, make sure you have an alarm and that others know where you are.  You don't need to make him aware of these changes, that would not be wise.  They are just basic precautions when you don't know how he is going to be.

Paranoia aside, you can change things from within this situation.  You can mentally cut him out as a lover, just avoid getting physically near to him.  Assume he is going to try to manipulate you emotionally and switch yourself off from that - imagine he is a two-year old trying to convince you he deserves a new lollipop because he threw one on the ground in a temper. Once you decide he is no longer your lover, your MM, but just someone you work with, you can put up a mental barrier.  It may take a while, but as a free woman you can date others, you can accept the admiration of others - and there will be others once you realise that your self-esteem is the problem not you or your attractiveness to others.  If necessary, tell him you will be dating others - not to try to make him jealous but to detach from him.  There are many ways in which you can emotionally detach from him even while he is present.

Obviously, finding a different job or starting up a different business will take time.  In the meantime, you have your life to lead.  You deserve love and attention like anyone else.  You deserve to have someone who appreciates you and your talents, not someone who takes them so for granted.  I would suggest mentally detaching, grieving for a while, then getting out there and building something better for yourself.  You can do it; what you are facing now is a mental barrier (as well as any legal issues of course).  If you were not his lover, you would not have a problem with working there and leading your own life.  

In time, you will be able to manoeuvre yourself into a better work set-up, but your new life can start today with detachment from this guy.  As a free woman, you have a future.

 

[NAB]

I also think if a person wanted to leave their spouse, and find a new Love, they would open themselves up to a wider field than a “convenient situation”, and divorce.  Many desirable possibilities wouldn’t even consider it unless the person was single or divorced.  

[elaine567]

4 hours ago, spiderowl said:

Until you have all the true facts, I would not blow up the whole business thing - it sounds like you are doing pretty well for the business and it is your main income at the moment.  Keep it going until you can safely get out with the benefits from the business that you deserve.  You really need the legal advice to deal with this.

^^^ this.
If you are serious about leaving, alerting him to the fact you may be pulling out is not very smart. It just gives him time to prepare for your exit, time for him to get lawyered up, time for him to  organise things to his advantage.
However I guess your real  motivation was not to exit, merely to get him to act better towards you, to realise your worth, to even disengage from his wife in favour of you.
You were hoping for reassurance that you were more important to him, but that considering the circumstances as described, was never going to happen.

 

[Beca L]

8 hours ago, DKT3 said:

Likely far from the truth.  I

Ok, then why do these BS's take back their cheating spouses ? because they love them, is that all ?

8 hours ago, DKT3 said:

Here is what I dont understand coming from OW: WHY WOULD SHE TAKE HIM BACK? Hmm its the same man that brought you here, the same man you want, (at least you did) why do you? Same lying cheater.

I get this and I ask myself the same question or have done. I guess it is hard to just turn off feelings for someone. I still struggle to accept that the person I spent that year with, who loved and adored me is the very same person who walked out of my house and back to his XW. I believed all his crap and I became embroiled in his drama and marriage. I do regret that and for all the pain and heartache it has caused me I so wish I could turn back the clock. I don't want him now and I wish I never had to see him again, however it doesn't stop me wishing he was alone and hurting too. Not just getting on with married life as though nothing had happened. Her allowing him to return meant that he has not suffered at all, he caused two women terrible pain and heartache and he just flips from one women to the next with no consequences. That is what I, and OW like me struggle to accept and understand. 

[Snakesalive]

21 minutes ago, Beca L said:

I don't want him now and I wish I never had to see him again, however it doesn't stop me wishing he was alone and hurting too. Not just getting on with married life as though nothing had happened. Her allowing him to return meant that he has not suffered at all, he caused two women terrible pain and heartache and he just flips from one women to the next with no consequences. That is what I, and OW like me struggle to accept and understand. 

Agree -I could almost hear the self satisfaction in the voice of my xMM yesterday when he told me how well he was doing and getting his life back on track . Unbelievable. The devastation he’s left in his wake seems to be much less of a priority than telling me he and his wife are getting on better than before -like I need to hear that 

[Whaatamidoing]

I have barely been able to sleep because I am feeling so angry with him.

He loves to leave me hanging as well, after his little revelation he has decided that working from home is more appropriate. I am grateful for the space but I think its tactical because of lockdown his wife is at home. Maybe in the hope that Ill get jealous? It's going to take me a long time to calm down from everything that was said.

Im a roller coaster of thinking about all the good times, all the things he has shared with me, how he always always tells me the only time he is really himself is when he is with me, how long is working from home going to last if that's the case (I don't think for 1 second its true). Its the retreating that I find painful, that if not great at home he comes into the office to have attention from me and if I'm giving him grief then he stay at home with his wife. He flits between the two of us in who is showing him more attention or who is being least demanding, never actually having  a proper conversation about anything. If he owned up to how he actually felt about either of us, one of us is going to disappear. Its making me feel sick how used and played I have been. 

I have given him opportunity to get out of this on a number of occasions, when he has said hes getting grief at home for working so much, late etc (due to job demand, not me). He has always insisted its what he wants.

Something that's been bothering me is we both support the same football team and I don't have access to all the games so he leant me his tablet so I could watch on Sky Go. I watched the match and had no reason to snoop through his tablet because I thought things were ok with us, I thought I was fulfilling where I was meant to. We had a meeting the next morning and the tablet was to hand so I was going to find out how long from my house to meeting destination. I clicked on the google search tab and it comes up with recent searches, this thing is linked to his phone. The search was for plentyoffish.com UK free dating site and from friends I understand mostly a sex hook up site. I was completely devastated staring at the screen, I dont know whether this was a regular thing or a one off or he had just signed up that evening. So I decided to search through the tablet history. I found 3 days prior and 5 days prior he had searched the same site but nothing before that. A looooot of porn in that history like Saturdays/Sundays 3 or 4 times a day. I was as you can imagine a bit shocked. I text him and said that I was absolutely gutted that if he was bored with me that he wouldnt just be open and say so, I dont want to be third in this, let alone whatever else/whoever else he has going on. I was shaking, I didnt sleep a wink that night. I then had a text the next day saying what was I on about so i sent him a screen shot of his search. He said I was being ridiculous. Next day we attend the meeting and then get a coffee afterwards, I have to be honest that I was expecting an apology but he was in a rage, he said he was furious with me for thinking he would go on a dating website, i said well I didnt but the evidence is compelling. He was furious I mean like red faced and shaking with rage in Costa Coffee, I said I dont want to think that of you but look at the evidence, he said after everything we have been through blah blah blah, he said sign up to them you will see that Im not on any of them. I said the intent was there though wasnt it, he told me that he was disgusted that I thought so little of him.

My point being that even in that situation he made me feel awful, he made me feel like I was going crazy when his actions were not right. he didnt speak to me for well over a week and never offered an apology or explanation other than saying to me hes not stupid about the tablet his kids use it, why would he risk everything, to this day Im still unsure what on earth went on with that or whether he realises how much porn history is on there for his 10 year old girl to discover?! Hes offered to lend me the tablet since and I have declined.

My point being that he does not have the ability to accept any of his actions as hurtful to someone else.

The more I think about other instances like this over the 7 years, the first 2 years were lovely, the last 5 have been more challenging. I can really see how under a spell I have been, I have been manipulated into not asking questions and only accepting what he throws at me because I love him. I mean the majority of what I write on here must make people think am I crazy but its not been as black and white as the things I have written about, there was a time when he was there and said all the right things I am just really struggling with the fact that it probably wasn't real, it was all fabricated to get me exactly where he wants me. 

[pepperbird2]

OP,

I could be wrong, but it sounds very much like he's taken a page from the "Cheater's Handbook". He's trying to keep you off center, blaming YOU for snooping, not trusting him etc. Some call it "gas lighting". It's all about trying to shift the guilt on to you for not trusting him...never mind that he's being a jackass, how dare you not trust him! How dare you snoop! You terrible, terrible person!
Please don't fall into that trap.

Also, he may be engaging in the tactic of pitting you and his wife against each other, as if you are focused on her, you won't blame the person who is really causing you all this heartbreak...him! Meanwhile, he may well have her believing this is all your doing and he's just some innocent little lamb. 🤮

You have a lot of power here, even more than he does. Mind you, he may try and make you feel differently, but really, in effect, you hold his happy, self satisfied life in your hands. One call from you and his whole life could be turned upside down.

 

 

[BaileyB]

1 hour ago, Whaatamidoing said:

His  little revelation he has decided that working from home is more appropriate. I am grateful for the space but I think its tactical because  his wife is at home. Maybe in the hope that Ill get jealous?

You are still playing games with the man. You are still in competition, trying to “win” him from his wife. I don’t know that was his purpose, I think you have tipped him off that you are losing it and he’s putting space between you for that reason... the fact that this makes you jealous is telling. 

1 hour ago, Whaatamidoing said:

The search was for plentyoffish.com UK free dating site and from friends I understand mostly a sex hook up site. I was completely devastated staring at the screen, I dont know whether this was a regular thing or a one off or he had just signed up that evening. So I decided to search through the tablet history. I found 3 days prior and 5 days prior he had searched the same site but nothing before that. A looooot of porn in that history like Saturdays/Sundays 3 or 4 times a day. I was as you can imagine a bit shocked. I text him and said that I was absolutely gutted that if he was bored with me that he wouldnt just be open and say so, He said I was being ridiculous. I have to be honest that I was expecting an apology but he was in a rage, he said he was furious with me for thinking he would go on a dating website

I’m not surprised. This is in keeping with the selfish, entitled, philandering man you have described. However, you continue to respond to the man from a reactive, emotional place. And that’s a real problem for you. 

I get that this is a lot to wrap your mind around in a short time, but you need to stop spinning and stop engaging with this man if you want to protect your financial future. 

4 hours ago, elaine567 said:

However I guess your real  motivation was not to exit, merely to get him to act better towards you, to realise your worth, to even disengage from his wife in favour of you.
You were hoping for reassurance that you were more important to him, but that considering the circumstances as described, was never going to happen.

Yup! Shocked that he could search a dating site. Angry that he would chose to work at home. 
She is continuing to talk with him because she wants him to act better toward her, to give some reassurance that she is still in the game. That’s clear from the above posts. And, it’s not happening... He is already looking for another woman... while retreating home to shore up his defences...

Edited February 10, 2021 by BaileyB

[Whaatamidoing]

I really am not jealous, I am merely analysing his behaviour traits, he can come in, he can work from home, I am pleased to not have him near me right now. He/we didn't communicate on this, he just hasn't showed up or called which is unusual.

There is a part of me that wanted him to treat me better of course there was when I first came on here for advice but the accusations over the last two days have made me realise that he cant have the equilibrium upset, I either take what he gives me and shut up like I have been for the last god knows long or or I do not accept what scraps he's throwing me and try and detach myself from him.

Its very difficult given its been a couple of days to act with no feeling, I cant just switch off my feelings for him although most of those feelings are of anger right now.

I dont want to be in any game, I stupidly at some point wanted the man I love to choose me. 

 

[pepperbird2]

2 minutes ago, Whaatamidoing said:

I dont want to be in any game, I stupidly at some point wanted the man I love to choose me. 

 

Given what you now know about him, do you still want that? You can love him to death, but that's not enough. That doesn't mean your love has no value...it just means you wasted it on someone who may well not be capable of returning it in a meaningful way.

 

[BaileyB]

1 minute ago, pepperbird2 said:

Given what you now know about him, do you still want that? You can love him to death, but that's not enough. That doesn't mean your love has no value...it just means you wasted it on someone who may well not be capable of returning it in a meaningful way.

 

Someone who may not actually be a very good person...

[BaileyB]

11 minutes ago, Whaatamidoing said:

He/we didn't communicate on this, he just hasn't showed up or called which is unusual.

You’ve tipped him off that you are not happy. You are unpredictable right now, and he wants nothing to do with that. It’s safer for him to be at home right now. First, he doesn’t have to deal with your questions, accusations, and anger. He is also probably preparing his defence... if this blows up, he is preparing to tell his wife that you have “gone crazy” which will position him as the victim here. He is trying to protect his marriage, and probably his business, from you. 

It’s not a good thing that you have tipped him off. He now has time to prepare for the demise of your professional relationship. As was said above, you need to calm down and stop engaging with him in this angry and accusatory way. Quietly go about the business of getting your life in order so that you can do as much of your own damage control as possible - as it relates to your business and your future earning potential. 

[Allupinnit]

You need to get an attorney and as far away from this man as possible.  Do that instead of confronting him on his multiplicity and disgusting porn addiction - let his wife have him, he has no character.  This type of person will stop at nothing to make sure he comes out on top so you better be prepared for a fight.

[sandylee1]

9 hours ago, Beca L said:

Ok, then why do these BS's take back their cheating spouses ? because they love them, is that all ?

I get this and I ask myself the same question or have done. I guess it is hard to just turn off feelings for someone. I still struggle to accept that the person I spent that year with, who loved and adored me is the very same person who walked out of my house and back to his XW. I believed all his crap and I became embroiled in his drama and marriage. I do regret that and for all the pain and heartache it has caused me I so wish I could turn back the clock. I don't want him now and I wish I never had to see him again, however it doesn't stop me wishing he was alone and hurting too. Not just getting on with married life as though nothing had happened. Her allowing him to return meant that he has not suffered at all, he caused two women terrible pain and heartache and he just flips from one women to the next with no consequences. That is what I, and OW like me struggle to accept and understand. 

Why does the BS take them back?

Many years of a happy marriage 

Children (even adult children)

A desire to protect their children's inheritance, which if their Ex remarries can be affected.

Shared friends 

Happy Memories 

Entwined finances 

Lifestyle 

The BS kind of has the upper hand with a truly remorseful spouse 

From my experience on some occasions the BS has previously had their own affair,  that they got away with and that makes them more forgiving.  

Some BS see it as a 'win'. That after cheating, the WS comes back...begging...eating humble pie. it's like...the grass isn't greener.

I certainly wouldn't convince yourself that all is well in their house. They've often lost respect...they struggle with intimacy...they have visuals of their WS with the OW/OM. The trust is gone. 

I've spoken to many BS who regret reconciling, but feel trapped for various reasons. 

[Beca L]

25 minutes ago, sandylee1 said:

Why does the BS take them back?

Many years of a happy marriage 

Children (even adult children)

A desire to protect their children's inheritance, which if their Ex remarries can be affected.

Shared friends 

Happy Memories 

Entwined finances 

Lifestyle 

The BS kind of has the upper hand with a truly remorseful spouse 

From my experience on some occasions the BS has previously had their own affair,  that they got away with and that makes them more forgiving.  

Some BS see it as a 'win'. That after cheating, the WS comes back...begging...eating humble pie. it's like...the grass isn't greener.

I certainly wouldn't convince yourself that all is well in their house. They've often lost respect...they struggle with intimacy...they have visuals of their WS with the OW/OM. The trust is gone. 

I've spoken to many BS who regret reconciling, but feel trapped for various reasons. 

I agree, I guess many of those options apply in my situation. It wasn't years of a happy marriage (maybe 10/30) but I guess when you meet at 18 then you go through a lot together. I wouldn't say they had a great lifestyle but she had a home that would be no more if she hadn't taken him back. Shared friends ? none that lived nearby, inheritance for the kids, yes definitely. In my case I think having the upper hand was a major plus, winning against me, another plus, I have no idea what is going on now with them but I don't think it can be that bad, they are still together and 3 years have passed. I can imagine that as the years pass after the WS returns there must be feelings of regret, especially when things are no better and life returns to the miserable place it was before the Affair ! No-one really wins

[pepperbird2]

3 hours ago, Beca L said:

I agree, I guess many of those options apply in my situation. It wasn't years of a happy marriage (maybe 10/30) but I guess when you meet at 18 then you go through a lot together. I wouldn't say they had a great lifestyle but she had a home that would be no more if she hadn't taken him back. Shared friends ? none that lived nearby, inheritance for the kids, yes definitely. In my case I think having the upper hand was a major plus, winning against me, another plus, I have no idea what is going on now with them but I don't think it can be that bad, they are still together and 3 years have passed. I can imagine that as the years pass after the WS returns there must be feelings of regret, especially when things are no better and life returns to the miserable place it was before the Affair ! No-one really wins

and some of us stay because we we really do love our spouse. I know that may be hard for some to believe, but we really do.
I didn't stay because I had to. I could have left, but I made in informed decision to stay..

[Beca L]

Sorry are you a WS or a BS? don't know your story. If you are a WS, then if you loved them so much why cheat? If you are a BS then ok I get why you would't leave but not sure I could forgive.

[DKT3]

31 minutes ago, pepperbird2 said:

and some of us stay because we we really do love our spouse. I know that may be hard for some to believe, but we really do.
I didn't stay because I had to. I could have left, but I made in informed decision to stay..

Its hard for OW to get because they've convinced themselves that mm was miserable and there was no longer love there.

@Beca L as someone who was with my wife since I was 17, her 16, I can tell you there is a great deal of codependency in those relationships.  I divorced my wife after her affair but it got harder by the month.  I was fully cognizant of the dynamics but it didn't make it easier.  You've been through everything with that person,  every single milestone, every trauma. 

I wanted to try with my wife again because I saw a version of that 16 year old girl that took my breath away, after a few years apart.

Ultimately your short time can't compare to thier history,  codependency,  and secondary instinct to reach out for that person. 

[DKT3]

22 minutes ago, Beca L said:

Sorry are you a WS or a BS? don't know your story. If you are a WS, then if you loved them so much why cheat? If you are a BS then ok I get why you would't leave but not sure I could forgive.

Cheating is actually rarely about love, especially for men. Men can carry on a 5, 10, 15 year affair and never have it impact what he feels for is wife. 

[Jen_tully]

Lots of good perspective on this thread...unfortunately their is quite a few posts where accountability is not taken by an individual for their own actions.

Too much is being made about the spouse and I don’t think that’s a productive path to go down! Plus it’s not the other person’s business what the spouse is about!

 

 

 

[spiritedaway2003]

2 hours ago, pepperbird2 said:

and some of us stay because we we really do love our spouse. I know that may be hard for some to believe, but we really do.
I didn't stay because I had to. I could have left, but I made in informed decision to stay..

Actually, that’s not hard to believe at all.  I believe you.  Just as I’ve often say that not all affairs or relationships are the same, I can absolutely see why a BS might take back a cheating spouse even though I generally think that is the harder path to take.  It’s easier to start anew than try to put the broken pieces together.  If that love, or the history and of potential, of grace and forgiveness isn’t there (or whatever it is that applies to the BS), there won’t be any reconciliations.  I am not saying reconciling works for everyone (because it doesn’t), but it’s not hard to understand why a BS wants to take back their “cheating” spouse.  Love is not just an emotion. It encompasses a lot more.
 

It’s just that on these boards, there is this huge contrast where the OM/OW are told ad naseum that the MM or MW are scums of the earth.  And if they are, then why in the world would a self-respecting BS take them back? (This is rhetorical). And even if it’s hard to believe, the same can be applied to OW. I know there is the common narrative  that OW are the crazy ones who pursued someone’s else spouse, but that isn’t always the truth.  The WS often has to minimize his/her part in the affair to limit the damage or to not cause further hurt.  It’s often why it’s so hard to draw information after an affair and where the “trickle-truth” begins.  

Edited February 11, 2021 by spiritedaway2003
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