Friends very slow to respond to messages, I'm noticing a general trend

[TheEternalPessimist]

1 hour ago, ShyViolet said:

"Oh I'm like this with everybody."

That very much sounds like an excuse or a white lie she is telling you just to pacify you or take the pressure off the situation.  It doesn't at all mean it's true.  You have no idea what her relationships with other people are like.

I kinda do because we have talked about it before. She didn't literally say "I'm like this with everybody", as I recall it was more like "I know I haven't been quick to answer, I've had friends who have called me out on it, I don't want you to think it has anything to do with you, rather it's something I have to improve with everyone".

[Miss Spider]

I think in another thread you said that men/women can find it difficult to be friends. I see you identify as a man and it sounds like all of these friends are women. 
 

I can tell you from my own experience with guy friends that it’s very difficult sometimes for me to be as close with them as I am with my girlfriends. Besides the fact that they just don’t understand a lot of the female experience, I can sense sometimes they will try to get too close and I will try to alleviate this by backing off. With my woman friends,  I rarely have this issue. My female friends are often wanting their own space too. It’s often hard to know if my man friends genuinely want to be my friend or they are trying for something else with how close they try to get. It doesn’t necessarily have to be sexual, but I can see them often push for intimacy and closeness and it can be little bit weird. Especially the case if I have a boyfriend. I wouldn’t want my boyfriend to  feel uncomfortable either. 

 

even with my girl friends, it is not 100% attention all the time or texting even each day with most of them. That is usually only my BFF. my friends and I take time for ourselves. We all have our own lives, work, relationships, etc. It’s not an issue and we respect that. 

Again, I’m not saying that this is definitely the case with these friends. I am just saying that this has been a problem for me with my guy friends and it is a possibility.  

Edited February 23, 2021 by Shortskirtslonglashes

[TheEternalPessimist]

Yes I'm male, sorry if that wasn't always clear from my previous messages. I used to have more male friends when I was in my late teens but then everyone from our friend group kinda moved on from the group about 2 years after graduation and it fell apart. I haven't seen any of them or spoken to any of them in almost 10 years now. Since then, almost of my friendships have been with females, not necessarily because I absolutely wanted to but rather because of various circumstances. I went to college in a program that was over 80% female, when I first moved away from my parents and came to Europe, I stayed in a flat that I shared with 3 other women, the vast majority of my coworkers are female (even though I'm not friends with any of them) and my current roommate is female as well.

On a sidenote about my coworkers, this has to do with that general trend I was mentioning about people being more self-centered and too focus on themselve to build and maintain friendships. It's been almost a year now since we've been working remotely from home because of the pandemic and literally no one among the 25+ people I work with proposed that we have an online hangout or even a hangout outside while respecting social distancing. While they of course not obligated to do it, I think that attitude speaks volumes. 

 

 

 

[Acacia98]

Speaking from my own personal experience, as I have grown older, my responsibilities have grown in size. I have way less free time than I did when I was in my twenties. I also have fewer close friends. In addition to work responsibilities, I have familial responsibilities. If I were in a relationship, the relationship would be a priority too. I'm not in a relationship. Still, I have relatively little time for friendship. So I spend that time on 2 or 3 friends max (I kid you not). And we don't even meet or talk regularly.

Do you know one of the factors that has kept these friendships going? It's the fact that I know that if I take a month to respond to a non-urgent message, my friend is not going to be offended. She'll totally get it because she's an overwhelmed single mother or doctor and barely has time to respond promptly and regularly herself. If you and I were friends, TheEternalPessimist, your attitude would push me away because I can't stand it when people have those kinds of expectations of me. The friendship stops feeling like a friendship and starts feeling like a prison.

[Alpacalia]

My friends and I have maintained our friendships as a collective group and individually for 20+ years and this really hasn't been an issue. 

With the exception of adolescence, I think friendships tend to ebb and flow. I suppose you can try to adjust to the delay and difference in communication styles and choose to not chase unresponsive friends.

Consistently unresponsive friends are not worth the effort.

Edited February 25, 2021 by Alpaca

[basil67]

7 hours ago, TheEternalPessimist said:

literally no one among the 25+ people I work with proposed that we have an online hangout or even a hangout outside while respecting social distancing. While they of course not obligated to do it, I think that attitude speaks volumes. 

Speaks volumes about what?

It's entirely likely that they all have solid friend groups already and aren't in need of cultivating more friendships.  People have only so much time in the day for work and play.

[TheEternalPessimist]

1 hour ago, Acacia98 said:

Speaking from my own personal experience, as I have grown older, my responsibilities have grown in size. I have way less free time than I did when I was in my twenties. I also have fewer close friends. In addition to work responsibilities, I have familial responsibilities. If I were in a relationship, the relationship would be a priority too. I'm not in a relationship. Still, I have relatively little time for friendship. So I spend that time on 2 or 3 friends max (I kid you not). And we don't even meet or talk regularly.

Do you know one of the factors that has kept these friendships going? It's the fact that I know that if I take a month to respond to a non-urgent message, my friend is not going to be offended. She'll totally get it because she's an overwhelmed single mother or doctor and barely has time to respond promptly and regularly herself. If you and I were friends, TheEternalPessimist, your attitude would push me away because I can't stand it when people have those kinds of expectations of me. The friendship stops feeling like a friendship and starts feeling like a prison.

That's the thing though, I don't have any friends who are overwhelmed parents or doctors. In fact, of the few friends I have, all are either still studying or have barely entered the job market. If I had friends in those situations, OF COURSE I would lower my expectations, I'm not dumb. With that being said, expecting people I used to text with regularly and in some cases see regularly (live with and share a flat with in one case a mere 2 years ago or so, mind you) not to take several weeks, a month or well over a month to reply to a simple 2 minute audio message or a two-sentence text is hardly a scandalous expectation. If it's considered scandalous in 2021 to expect a bit of basic care and respect then let me go live in a cabin in the woods for the rest of my life and cut all social contact with humans right away. I'm not attacking you personally in any way but I'm amazed that basic responsability in friendship seems to be debatable when really it shouldn't be because it goes without saying. What's particularly hurtful is that I have observed some of them change when it comes to responsiveness and basic care overnight basically, it wasn't a long process which started say in 2015 or something and gradually got worse otherwise I would have noticed it myself and likely would have pulled out. 

38 minutes ago, basil67 said:

Speaks volumes about what?

It's entirely likely that they all have solid friend groups already and aren't in need of cultivating more friendships.  People have only so much time in the day for work and play.

I find it highly improbable that over 25 people, most of which are newly settled in the city and country I live in and a lot of whom came right before or during the pandemic to already have solid friend groups. With all due respect, while I appreciate your opinion, it's easy to assume things through posts on a forum if you're not actually here witnessing it right alongside me and obviously I don't blame you for it. I will say, a lot of them seem to be in solid relationships so maybe they don't feel the need to hang out as much with friends or look for new ones which definitely seems to be a thing when you are in your late 20s and early 30s. I wouldn't know because I've never been in a relationship myself.

I think it speaks volumes about how now it's everyone for themselves, I feel like it didn't use to be like that a decade ago or so. Not sure what's the root cause assuming there is even one to begin with. You would think the pandemic would make people want to maintain some kind of social contact but instead it seems to have done the opposite, oddly enough. 

[Acacia98]

1 hour ago, TheEternalPessimist said:

That's the thing though, I don't have any friends who are overwhelmed parents or doctors.

It doesn't matter, though. The point is not that my situation applies directly to you. It is that my friends and I have our reasons. And your friends have their reasons. And that's fine. You don't have to like their reasons or think they're important enough. People set their priorities according to their respective lives. 

No one signs a contract anywhere saying they're going to make time for this friend or that friend forever. So they're allowed to start slowing down on communication or to cease altogether.

I'm not making any assumptions about you. I'm telling you about my experience and perspective. It is a fact that I would be irritated by a friend who complained I wasn't writing often enough or when he/she wanted. We're all grown ups here. If my communication style doesn't meet my friend's standards, he or she is free to stop investing so much in our friendship. A condescending lecture about how I was not measuring up would simply be annoying and too controlling. 

[ShyViolet]

4 hours ago, TheEternalPessimist said:

I find it highly improbable that over 25 people, most of which are newly settled in the city and country I live in and a lot of whom came right before or during the pandemic to already have solid friend groups. 

Perhaps it is improbable.  What's the common denominator in all these situations?  YOU.  Did you ever consider that there is something about your attitude or the way you come across that is off-putting to them?  

[basil67]

6 hours ago, TheEternalPessimist said:

With that being said, expecting people I used to text with regularly and in some cases see regularly (live with and share a flat with in one case a mere 2 years ago or so, mind you) not to take several weeks, a month or well over a month to reply to a simple 2 minute audio message or a two-sentence text is hardly a scandalous expectation.

And again, it's not a new thing. I haven't lived with flatmates for nearly 30 years, but even back then, we might get on well with flatmates and chat or share meals...but they mostly don't turn into true friends of the type who stay in contact.  

Someone wrote that the common denominator may be you and I'm inclined to agree.  I think you're confusing workmates and flatmates (friendly acquaintances) with real friends.   Most people who we meet during our lives don't become close friends, and even less remain close friends across the years. 

[basil67]

I would add that 'scandalous' is an odd word to use to describe what you want.  Rather, I think it's just unrealistic.

Edited February 26, 2021 by basil67

[TheEternalPessimist]

I feel like most of you don't have or maintain solid friendships or don't care about maintaining solid friendships the way you analyze my situation. I don't see what's so damn off-putting about asking for basic honesty and a bit of responsibility, friends shouldn't be like disposable toys that you use and then throw away when you don't need them anymore and I don't like people changing their attitude overnight for no reason when in some cases they were acting as if we were best friends the day before. Do you all seriously find it normal that C, my own former roommate I lived with invites me over to her family for Christmas 2 years ago, comes to visit me in my city, shares projects and ideas with me only to suddenly decide to not respond to messages for weeks and remove herself entirely without given any explanations? Because I don't find it normal at all, I find it highly incoherent and weird. When she left the flat, she could have easily cut ties with me, I wasn't forcing her to stay in touch. ShyViolet, you say the problem is me yet I haven't changed one bit with regards to my attitude towards those friends over the years, I am the same person towards them that I was a few years ago and for the most part I still care about them as much. 

[elaine567]

People tend to keep in touch with people they gel with. As time moves on, the people they gel with may change.
Seems you have never  been in a relationship, so you don't understand how that can change the dynamics of other friendships.
If they seemed to cut you off after being friendly then I guess it has probably something to do with their partners.
"Who is that guy? Why can't he just butt out and leave us alone...why doesn't he get his own gf..."
OR you said or did something that pissed these girls off.

BTW I suggest you stop obsessing about old "friends" and start trying to form a proper relationship of your own.

[TheEternalPessimist]

It can't be because of their own relationships, I know C and M's boyfriends and I get along with them. With M, we became friends WAY before she got into a relationship with her current boyfriend who I have met a few times and with C her boyfriend knows me and has met me several times. He wouldn't have allowed me to go to her place for Christmas if he had any issues with our friendship.

[elaine567]

34 minutes ago, TheEternalPessimist said:

It can't be because of their own relationships, I know C and M's boyfriends and I get along with them. With M, we became friends WAY before she got into a relationship with her current boyfriend who I have met a few times and with C her boyfriend knows me and has met me several times. He wouldn't have allowed me to go to her place for Christmas if he had any issues with our friendship.

That doesn't mean they are happy with you being long term in their lives.
We get plenty posts here  from men and women who want their partner to cut off opposite sex friends.
They see them as a threat, and want them gone so they don't have to deal with them any longer.
You to them are a single guy sniffing around their gf... why is the question?

[TheEternalPessimist]

If they are not happy with me being around or being long term (I never asked or necessarily expected to be their friend long term) then they should just say so.

Define "sniffing around" please.

[Ruby Slippers]

You're putting all your energy into complaining about the situation... when you should let it go and put that energy into creating a better situation in the present and future. Subtract the negative, add the positive.

[Miss Spider]

6 hours ago, TheEternalPessimist said:

If they are not happy with me being around or being long term (I never asked or necessarily expected to be their friend long term) then they should just say so.

Define "sniffing around" please.

Existing.... some guys do not want their gfs chatting with other guys. Not saying it’s right, but you see it here all the time. & bf’s take precedence over guy friend. Likewise, some girls don’t even want to put their bf in a position where he’d need to be. so  orbiters get put  way out there. If you were Mars you get Neptuned out there cold. 

Edited February 26, 2021 by Shortskirtslonglashes

[TheEternalPessimist]

5 minutes ago, Ruby Slippers said:

You're putting all your energy into complaining about the situation... when you should let it go and put that energy into creating a better situation in the present and future. Subtract the negative, add the positive.

I'm not really complaning, I'm not a victim of anything. I'm simply trying to understand this trend and how to navigate around it. I want to create a better situation for sure, that's exactly why I opened this topic, to get ideas, hear from people who have had similar experiences etc. 

[Miss Spider]

Plus, a boyfriend takes care of a lot of reasons why women even have orbiters/male friends in the first place. They don’t need them as much anymore 

[flitzanu]

On 2/23/2021 at 8:16 AM, Shortskirtslonglashes said:

I think in another thread you said that men/women can find it difficult to be friends. I see you identify as a man and it sounds like all of these friends are women. 
 

I can tell you from my own experience with guy friends that it’s very difficult sometimes for me to be as close with them as I am with my girlfriends. Besides the fact that they just don’t understand a lot of the female experience, I can sense sometimes they will try to get too close and I will try to alleviate this by backing off. With my woman friends,  I rarely have this issue. My female friends are often wanting their own space too. It’s often hard to know if my man friends genuinely want to be my friend or they are trying for something else with how close they try to get. It doesn’t necessarily have to be sexual, but I can see them often push for intimacy and closeness and it can be little bit weird. Especially the case if I have a boyfriend. I wouldn’t want my boyfriend to  feel uncomfortable either. 

 

even with my girl friends, it is not 100% attention all the time or texting even each day with most of them. That is usually only my BFF. my friends and I take time for ourselves. We all have our own lives, work, relationships, etc. It’s not an issue and we respect that. 

Again, I’m not saying that this is definitely the case with these friends. I am just saying that this has been a problem for me with my guy friends and it is a possibility.  

this.  Skirtz hit this on the head.

as a male friend to female friends, if you ever start feeling "second best" or "left out" it is a pretty good sign that you have different expectations of the friendship, or that you harbor some type of interest that you don't want to admit.

i have a hundred female friends that i don't worry every day about how they treat me, but if i have one female friend that i'm secretly into and won't admit it, damn right i'll start feeling tension as to why i'm the one that seems to be making the effort and she isn't trying.

[Acacia98]

12 hours ago, TheEternalPessimist said:

I feel like most of you don't have or maintain solid friendships or don't care about maintaining solid friendships the way you analyze my situation. I don't see what's so damn off-putting about asking for basic honesty and a bit of responsibility, friends shouldn't be like disposable toys that you use and then throw away when you don't need them anymore and I don't like people changing their attitude overnight for no reason when in some cases they were acting as if we were best friends the day before. 

We have no way of knowing for sure why so many of your friendships play out in this way.

Maybe you have a disproportionate number of flaky friends because you've moved to a new country in your adulthood and it can be harder to meet reliable people with whom you have much in common (especially personality-wise).

Maybe you have a tendency to pick friends who are not as invested in friendship as you are (in the same way that some people pick boyfriends or girlfriends who are not that interested in them).

Maybe there's something you're doing that causes people to pull back, for example, your intense approach to friendships could be exhausting to people who just want a relaxed or laid back friendship.

It's not that most people here don't have solid friendships. It's that, by the time they're in their 20s, most people have seen friendships come and go. They have learned to recognize that they can't control people. They stop being super-idealistic about people and, instead, learn to take people as they are and to adapt accordingly. If someone isn't behaving like a good friend, they accept that and move on. They invest in friendships with other people who are better suited to them. They don't dwell as much on the matter as you do. They don't spend as much time as you seem to being frustrated that people don't behave the way you want them to behave.

[basil67]

13 hours ago, TheEternalPessimist said:

 Do you all seriously find it normal that C, my own former roommate I lived with invites me over to her family for Christmas 2 years ago, comes to visit me in my city, shares projects and ideas with me only to suddenly decide to not respond to messages for weeks and remove herself entirely without given any explanations? Because I don't find it normal at all, I find it highly incoherent and weird. When she left the flat, she could have easily cut ties with me, I wasn't forcing her to stay in touch. ShyViolet, you say the problem is me yet I haven't changed one bit with regards to my attitude towards those friends over the years, I am the same person towards them that I was a few years ago and for the most part I still care about them as much. 

Yes, it's really quite normal.   She felt closer to you back when the living situation ended and has slowly drifted away.    The bit which is unusual is that you haven't changed. 

Most people change throughout their lives.  We're impacted by who we socialise with, where we work, where we live, who our partners are, and general living and learning.   And along with all that change, what we enjoy doing and who we enjoy spending time with also changes.   And because most of us change, we drift away from each other at the same time, as everyone finds new social lives and interests....and we repeat the cycle as our lives change further.

[TheEternalPessimist]

2 hours ago, Acacia98 said:

We have no way of knowing for sure why so many of your friendships play out in this way.

Maybe you have a disproportionate number of flaky friends because you've moved to a new country in your adulthood and it can be harder to meet reliable people with whom you have much in common (especially personality-wise).

Maybe you have a tendency to pick friends who are not as invested in friendship as you are (in the same way that some people pick boyfriends or girlfriends who are not that interested in them).

Maybe there's something you're doing that causes people to pull back, for example, your intense approach to friendships could be exhausting to people who just want a relaxed or laid back friendship.

It's not that most people here don't have solid friendships. It's that, by the time they're in their 20s, most people have seen friendships come and go. They have learned to recognize that they can't control people. They stop being super-idealistic about people and, instead, learn to take people as they are and to adapt accordingly. If someone isn't behaving like a good friend, they accept that and move on. They invest in friendships with other people who are better suited to them. They don't dwell as much on the matter as you do. They don't spend as much time as you seem to being frustrated that people don't behave the way you want them to behave.

The disproportionate number of flaky friends is definitely something I've had to deal with, what's weird is that a lot of them weren't necessarily flaky right away, in fact they became flaky rather suddenly. Now when someone is flaky right away, I just don't even bother anymore. My patience for that kind of BS has long ran out. 

I still fail to see what's so intense about expecting a friend not to take weeks or months to reply to text messages, expect friends to be honest about how they feel and overall expect friends to make the first step once in a while. If I wanted to be intense, I would stalk them or spam them with messages until they reply yet I've never done any of that nor have I thought about doing stuff like that. 

1 hour ago, basil67 said:

Yes, it's really quite normal.   She felt closer to you back when the living situation ended and has slowly drifted away.    The bit which is unusual is that you haven't changed. 

Most people change throughout their lives.  We're impacted by who we socialise with, where we work, where we live, who our partners are, and general living and learning.   And along with all that change, what we enjoy doing and who we enjoy spending time with also changes.   And because most of us change, we drift away from each other at the same time, as everyone finds new social lives and interests....and we repeat the cycle as our lives change further.

It's not really unusual, this happened just 2 years ago. Granted, I am not 100% the same person I was in 2019 BUT the way I treat people hasn't changed. I wish I could say the same of her. It feels like I should have been the one to cut ties right after she moved out had I known she would subsequently behave in this way towards me. I don't feel like I've done anything to warrant that kind of behavior being displayed at me. 

[Alpacalia]

Why not refocus your energy on the friends that you do have that are more responsive?