I feel awful

[Wiseman2]

11 hours ago, Hulahoop said:

She’s kept her dignity and been mature. Whilst I had to run and tell her everything.

Have you seen the film "Fatal Attraction"? 

You don't know what he told her about you. He may have told her you were some obsessed psycho he had a one nighter with to cover his own butt.

The best thing to do is unpack and sort some of this out with a therapist. Not because you have psychological problems but for support and dealing better with your unhappy marriage.

[Hulahoop]

Hi yes that is it. 
My husband and I were over before the affair. We had decided before the affair to stay together for the kids so it’s not only because of  what happened with AP that I stayed. The plan was to stay together until they are older. 
If AP and I had stayed together then the plan with my husband would have changed. But I don’t see how telling him now would solve anything? He still wouldn’t leave but he would be upset, because of the lies I guess. We haven’t been intimate for over 3 years now. That was through his choice first, then mine and now both of ours.  
I understand that he won’t like it either way and will be hurt as we are still married but it’s not like that. I don’t mind being on my own. I have before. And in a way I would probably be happier. But my husband wants to stay even though it’s like this. So I feel although you call me selfish, and I was for having the affair, right now I (and he) are sacrificing our happiness for the children. If things had worked out with AP then I would obviously have told my husband and we would have sorted arrangements. I don’t see why now I need to put this on him when it’s over and it wouldn’t make any difference to our living situation. That may sound awful and I’ve tried to explain as best I can but my life isn’t as happy a marriage as I would have wanted. As my husband would agree. 

[Hulahoop]

His wife knows everything now. After I told her (she asked me) he admitted everything (probably not everything). But yes she blames me and she blames herself for neglecting him.  I think he probably did speak badly about me. Especially after I told her. 

[Wiseman2]

19 minutes ago, Hulahoop said:

.  I think he probably did speak badly about me. Especially after I told her. 

Agree. Of course he is going to tell her whatever makes him look better and make you look bad in order to preserve his marriage because that's much more important than an affair he can easily toss like trash.

Stop and reflect. You're very unhappy in your life and marriage. That's the nature of this problem.

 

[Zona]

Best case scenario would be to come clean to your husband and tell him everything. Let him decide what he wants to do. At least this way he will understand why you have been cold and distant while the affair was ongoing. Likely dead bedroom too.

Your husband deserve to be with someone who won't betray him.

[Rocky29]

I feel for you _ I really do because you are showing remorse, guilt, and sincere heartache over what you did by telling his wife.  Have you ever heard the phrase 'she was a smart woman until she fell in love?' Love makes you do things you normally NEVER would. It makes you act downright nuts - I have been there! You also did not lie and say you told her for her 'own good'. You told her because you wanted him to leave and be with you. I bet every single person on here who fell in love with their AP has thought or wished that and more than once. Affairs are selfish - and we all have it in us to be very selfish.  I sure did! What usually happens is what has happened here. He stayed with her, he is probably in hell right now apologizing, seeing his wife in pain, wondering how he got here, but I can promise you he is also thinking of you.  Being still married I am sure makes this doubly difficult because you are grieving the loss of your AP while still married. All you can do now is repent and move forward.  Also - take social media posts, photos, declarations of love with an entire bowl of salt. People more often than not are trying to convince themselves of their happiness, rather than others.  Another positive for you is that it is unlikely she will tell your husband because of one BIG reason: it's better for her if you are married.  If you become single it could make things easier for you to be with her husband, who she clearly does not want to lose.  These situations are painful for all involved but beating yourself up over a mistake you made while under emotional duress won't help.  I never understand the philosophy behind hey this person royally screwed up let's beat them down over and over and then they'll learn! Why not offer support instead. If you are on this forum, you more than likely have had an affair.  So I think the whole glass houses things applies here.  Love yourself and remind yourself of the pain involved with these choices so that they are not repeated. That's all any of us can do.  

[mark clemson]

Leaving is selfish, having an affair is selfish. If you're genuinely unhappy in a marriage (LT, not just a "rough patch") you either get to be selfish or self-less. Take your pick.

Leaving would be more honest, but then you 100% guarantee the kids won't be in their current family. However, there are those who say that's better. Probably is in SOME cases, I'm not so sure about all. There is no abuse in your situation, just a LOT (LOT LOT) of distance. Tough call.

Their are alternatives: attempt to "work on" the marriage so it's better (for both of you). Suggest an open marriage so you don't need to cheat. Frankly neither are too likely to work from what you describe, but they are at least something to consider trying.

IMO those who urge telling your husband are thinking of him, NOT of you. That's not inherently wrong, but the outcomes of telling are EXTREMELY unpredictable. It could be the move the prevents disaster by heading off her telling him, it COULD be the catalyst that heals your marriage. It could also (VERY easily) be the bomb that irrevocably blows it up. Abuse and (in rare cases) violence are not out of the picture. You both could end up happier, either alone or with new partners. Or your "broken" husband could end up shacking up with an alcoholic woman who "helps" raise your kids half the time.

There's really no way to tell what will happen. Most who tell do so (I think) because deep down THEY WANT to. Not all life situations have easy answers and those who claim to be offering them are IMO probably either kidding themselves or deceiving the recipients.

Edited February 25, 2021 by mark clemson

[Bittersweetie]

I know it is difficult, but you need to turn your focus on yourself and where you are going to go from here. I think many people focus on APs in order to NOT deal with their own issues...I know I've done it. Focusing on AP is an escape from one's own reality and consequences of their choices and it's a waste of mental energy.

You are at a crossroads here. You need to decide what kind of person you want to be moving forward. How you want to navigate your current marriage. You made some poor choices in the past but that doesn't have to define you going forward. Look at yourself, figure out why you thought what you were doing was okay, and figure out concrete next steps. 

I know you said your marriage is a marriage of convenience but please remember that the mental gymnastics you have been doing lately to justify your choices can rewrite your own history, even if there were some challenges already in place. When I looked back, my first reasonings behind my affair was my marriage...but the truth was, once I dug deeper, it was me. All of my issues over time led to my own poor, hurtful choices. I know I wouldn't be in the good place I am now if I hadn't taken responsibility for my actions and their consequences. Good luck.

[Hulahoop]

Thank you. Those last three posts made me cry a little. I do need to do something. 
I have tried to fall in love with my husband again but now it just feels awkward, and that’s not because of the affair. I just don’t love him that way anymore. Which he knows. I’ve suggested an open relationship but wasn’t even allowed to finish the sentence. 
 

Although we aren’t the best marriage and he’s not the most willing father, he is a safe one. He would never willingly physically hurt them.  Sometimes it’s better the devil you know. He isn’t under any illusions that things will be the same as they once were. 

I do need to do something about the marriage but at the moment I just don’t have the strength. I need to get mentally healthier. 
 

[BaileyB]

15 minutes ago, Hulahoop said:

I do need to do something about the marriage but at the moment I just don’t have the strength. I need to get mentally healthier.

This is when you call in the troops! Find some support, you can not do this on your own. If you have the ability to speak with a counsellor - do it! Confide in a girlfriend you trust, talk to your mother, or keep posting here. 

Yes, you do need to get mentally healthier. Your decisions have taken you down the wrong path, and it would appear that you can’t go back the way you came. You will have to forge a new path for you and your children and that’s going to be hard. There are people who would help, if you let them.

One thing for certain, you need to turn your attention away from your MM. Right now, he is in your rear view mirror but you continue to look back and he is literally all you see. So perhaps, it’s time to shift your focus from your MM to yourself. It’s time for some radical self care - find a counsellor, take some long walks alone, read some books, spend some time with your children and seek that joy again... If you could turn your attention from the past to just be in the moment, I think you may find more peace and start your healing. 

You have some hard things to deal with - some hard truths to make peace with - you haven’t even begun... But, you don’t need to deal with them today. Gather your strength, put a plan in motion to care for yourself and to begin the introspection you will need to do, and then you can begin to make the decisions you need to make related to your marriage - decisions that will hopefully guide you to find a healthier and happier future for yourself and your children. 

 

[DKT3]

2 hours ago, mark clemson said:

Leaving is selfish, having an affair is selfish. If you're genuinely unhappy in a marriage (LT, not just a "rough patch") you either get to be selfish or self-less. Take your pick.

Leaving would be more honest, but then you 100% guarantee the kids won't be in their current family. However, there are those who say that's better. Probably is in SOME cases, I'm not so sure about all. There is no abuse in your situation, just a LOT (LOT LOT) of distance. Tough call.

Their are alternatives: attempt to "work on" the marriage so it's better (for both of you). Suggest an open marriage so you don't need to cheat. Frankly neither are too likely to work from what you describe, but they are at least something to consider trying.

IMO those who urge telling your husband are thinking of him, NOT of you. That's not inherently wrong, but the outcomes of telling are EXTREMELY unpredictable. It could be the move the prevents disaster by heading off her telling him, it COULD be the catalyst that heals your marriage. It could also (VERY easily) be the bomb that irrevocably blows it up. Abuse and (in rare cases) violence are not out of the picture. You both could end up happier, either alone or with new partners. Or your "broken" husband could end up shacking up with an alcoholic woman who "helps" raise your kids half the time.

There's really no way to tell what will happen. Most who tell do so (I think) because deep down THEY WANT to. Not all life situations have easy answers and those who claim to be offering them are IMO probably either kidding themselves or deceiving the recipients.

Leaving is not necessarily selfish,  sometimes leaving is in the best interest of the children.  Better to be from a broken family then to live in one. Affairs are abuse,  so in essence you're encouraging abusers to continue the abuse. 

Op has acknowledged that her kids are not seeing a loving relationship so its better to leave. 

Alast, her staying is selfish,  isn't it? The affair is selfish,  telling mm wife was selfish, leaving the very real possibility that her husband finds out from MM wife is selfish...see a pattern here?

I suspect her husband doesn't really know the marriage is over, if he did its shouldn't be a huge surprise.. right?

[BaileyB]

2 minutes ago, DKT3 said:

I suspect her husband doesn't really know the marriage is over, if he did its shouldn't be a huge surprise.. right?

She proposed an open marriage and she wasn’t even allowed to finish the sentence... I think we know what his response will be to the fact that she had an affair with a married man. 

[Soul-shards]

52 minutes ago, Hulahoop said:

I’ve suggested an open relationship but wasn’t even allowed to finish the sentence.
 

I am curious, what did he say?

This is another reason why I don't understand how people throw around the "open marriage" suggestion so easily, only to avoid 'cheating' at any cost. 

The vast majority would shudder, if not throw up, when being presented with this option. It's weird, and flaky, and humiliating, and awkward ...and 1000 other things.

[elaine567]

I guess the suggestion of an open marriage in and of itself may be a reason for divorce...
Yet it gets bandied about here as if it is a viable solution to just about any marriage problem...

[Hulahoop]

When my husband wasn’t wanting to be intimate I started to ask if he wanted to be with someone else but stay married.  At that time I wasn’t feeling as bad as I do now so it was also kind of scoping to see where his head was at. He just said no that wasn’t an option. He didn’t ask me how I felt. 
I didn’t look for an affair and I know that’s not an excuse. I always said to my friend that we were just friends. And nothing would ever happen. It was sudden and very strong. Like you said I was in a fog, clouded and definitely not thinking straight. 
My husband may not care about the affair but I don’t see what benefit it would bring to him to tell him. It wouldn’t help me, I don’t think, but I don’t want to think about myself at the moment. I feel very guilty for doing that.  He wouldn’t leave.  I think talking on here is helping. Thank you 

[Soul-shards]

12 hours ago, elaine567 said:

This unfortunately is the scenario behind the scenes in many affairs. Women (usually) see a better life for themselves and their kids elsewhere with a more understanding more compatible man. BUT the fly in the ointment is that man.
He is in an affair not to escape his marriage but often to make his marriage more bearable.
A little more excitement, more sex, more affection, more "love" even.  What's not to like?
The OP didn't know or ignored the fact that men in affairs rarely leave for their OW, they have too much to lose usually and are unwilling to give it up for "love" or sex or a bit more "understanding". They learn they can get all that without the need to leave and blow up their marriage.

Well...if the OW could adopt the same view as the OM...wouldn't A-s work as supplemental insurance against existential misery? OW make the mistake of projecting 'wifehood' on the A - despite all the info available.

[basil67]

3 hours ago, Soul-shards said:

I am curious, what did he say?

This is another reason why I don't understand how people throw around the "open marriage" suggestion so easily, only to avoid 'cheating' at any cost. 

The vast majority would shudder, if not throw up, when being presented with this option. It's weird, and flaky, and humiliating, and awkward ...and 1000 other things.

And they wouldn't shudder, throw up and be humiliated if they discovered that a sneaky affair had been going on?   Frankly, I'd take knowledge over deception any day of the week.  

 

 

[Soul-shards]

3 minutes ago, basil67 said:

... if they discovered... 

Key words.

[mark clemson]

3 hours ago, elaine567 said:

I guess the suggestion of an open marriage in and of itself may be a reason for divorce...
Yet it gets bandied about here as if it is a viable solution to just about any marriage problem...

As the one who first mentioned open marriage in this thread I'll note to be fair (to me) that: 

A)  This isn't just any marriage problem, this is a woman who hasn't been intimate in years, is "ONLY staying for the kids," has had an affair, and attempted to blow up another person's marriage in an effort to get them to leave their partner. So, much more a last ditch effort.

B) *I* don't go bandying about this suggestion as a response to just about any marriage problem. I DO suggest it sometimes when there is a LT lack of intimacy. I think most of us recognize that it's not for everyone.

[Soul-shards]

Quote

 *I* don't go bandying about this suggestion as a response to just about any marriage problem. I DO suggest it sometimes when there is a LT lack of intimacy. I think most of us recognize that it's not for everyone.

Mark,

I didn't realize you suggested this anywhere. I only mentioned that because I have seen people throwing it around like hot cakes in the other community too - as if it's a perfectly acceptable and dignified alternative to the 'dirty cheating.' 

Just go to "honey" and tell them you want an open marriage and then, you're all clean. It sounds preposterous. 

I know people, first hand, who would have clearly preferred quiet cheating from their spouses to this undignified, perverted insanity. People in my own extended family who actually stated that.

"Please do not EVER cheat - but if somehow this happens, please be really good at it and make sure it doesn't EVER come to my attention, because the moment it does - I am out and you'll never hear from me again."  Literally.

These people had superb marriages  - one where they recently celebrated 50 exciting years, the other 70 years but they are both in Heaven now (and I miss them tremendously, as always). 

Edited February 25, 2021 by Soul-shards

[DKT3]

Unfortunately very few are good at it..  you know why? Irrational, illogical and addicted. Nothing there leads to good. 

Unlike the belief, affairs are most often discovered.  According to a study done by the Pew Institute,  one timers and brief fling go undiscovered, not prolonged affairs...too much evidence,  too sloppy. 

Cheaters change who they are while in affairs some become cold and distant,  some like my wife becomes extra everything,  extra attention,  extra love.  I'm astonished that they believe themselves so smart that people don't notice.  Or so deluded and twisted they they can't even notice the difference in themselves. 

[Soul-shards]

Quote

Unlike the belief, affairs are most often discovered. 

I am not one to demand links to studies for just about any argument (constant appeal to higher authority is beyond silly) - but this one really requires some solid data. If you are aware of any solid studies/stats in this regard, I would welcome a reference. Thanks in advance.

Edited February 25, 2021 by Soul-shards

[DKT3]

Haha, any long time poster will tell you I'm a stats guy. 

I gave you the information I'm willing to give, I need no more points.

[mark clemson]

7 hours ago, DKT3 said:

Leaving is not necessarily selfish,  sometimes leaving is in the best interest of the children.  Better to be from a broken family then to live in one.

If your partner wants you to stay, it's selfish to leave. "How selfish" in any given case/situation is a matter of debate. Even if the partner is actually abusive, it's still selfish to leave, although of course it's a completely understandable level of selfishness (ie, self-preservation/removing oneself from harm).

The only time it wouldn't be selfish would be corner cases such where the person WANTS to stay, but the partner is mentally ill and a danger to the kids or similar, so the person decides to leave even though THEY don't want to. No doubt there are many possible scenarios of this kind, however even in total I suspect they are quite rare.

The thing about the broken family is essentially a slogan, particularly since by definition a "broken family" is one where the parents are separated/divorced.

All that said, I do agree of course that yes SOMETIMES it's better to leave regardless of what the partner wants, especially if there's lots of arguing, emotional or physical abuse, the distress of staying would be too great, etc, etc, whether or not the partner wants you stay. Being selfish isn't always the same as being "bad".

Whether a "roommate marriage" is such a case is no doubt something that could be argued either way and could vary depending on particulars, etc.

Edited February 26, 2021 by mark clemson

[mark clemson]

3 hours ago, Soul-shards said:

Mark, I didn't realize you suggested this anywhere.

No worries at all S-s, I was just clarifying some of the implications of Elaine's post. I don't think she was necessarily particularly targeting me either, but since I was the one who brought it up, I'm ok with clarifying to prevent confusion on these things.