Can we try again?

[Snakesalive]

So I found out yesterday my ex MM has asked his wife to try again and have a reconciliation I’m not sure why this has hit me so hard but it has . I think it’s partly because he said he would never go  back -there was no love, it was unhealthy etc . Yes I know why am I surprised -he was clearly never 100% committed to either me or his wife . 
I guess its another reminder that I was just an OW not the person he wanted to spend his life with , just someone he wanted to keep as an option while he figured out what he wanted .

Therapy has helped me , I’ve took responsibility for my part in all this mess I really have but I don’t know -this news has shook me and brought everything back 
 

Edited April 23, 2021 by Snakesalive
Grammar

[HadMeOverABarrel]

I think you pretty much answered your own question.

Now, when I think back, I think of the kind/cute/sweet nice things xMM said immediately follow with the thoughts it could have all been contrived, a lie to manipulate me, to get me to act/think a certain way...and then I think that it doesn't matter anyway because it's so done and over, that I will never ever have another conversation with him. Then I feel relieved that all the negative it introduced into my life is gone, doesn't deplete my energy or distract me from better things anymore, and I'm free to create my life however I wish without that misery hanging over me. 

The pain you're feeling is just a reminder of the truth, and the deception by him and yourself (I surmise). We deceive ourselves in affairs. So much of it is fantasy, and it's hard to accept reality when it confronts us. It shows you that he's a fickle, unreliable man. You are better off now without him.

[NYAG]

1 hour ago, Snakesalive said:

So I found out yesterday my ex MM has asked his wife to try again and have a reconciliation I’m not sure why this has hit me so hard but it has . I think it’s partly because he said he would never go  back -there was no love, it was unhealthy etc . Yes I know why am I surprised -he was clearly never 100% committed to either me or his wife . 
I guess its another reminder that I was just an OW not the person he wanted to spend his life with , just someone he wanted to keep as an option while he figured out what he wanted .

Therapy has helped me , I’ve took responsibility for my part in all this mess I really have but I don’t know -this news has shook me and brought everything back 
 

They always go back to what they know. The wife, if she will have him, is safe familiar territory no matter how fed up he is with the situation. It comes as a ready made package he doesn't have to make any effort over. The OW is always the fall back position. Don't let him come back into your life. At some point he'll probably find himself another OW and you don't want it to be you again.

[Stupidkupid]

10 hours ago, Snakesalive said:

So I found out yesterday my ex MM has asked his wife to try again and have a reconciliation I’m not sure why this has hit me so hard but it has . I think it’s partly because he said he would never go  back -there was no love, it was unhealthy etc . Yes I know why am I surprised -he was clearly never 100% committed to either me or his wife . 
I guess its another reminder that I was just an OW not the person he wanted to spend his life with , just someone he wanted to keep as an option while he figured out what he wanted .

Therapy has helped me , I’ve took responsibility for my part in all this mess I really have but I don’t know -this news has shook me and brought everything back 
 

I don't have anything more useful to say than the ladies above so I wanted to let you know that I'm so sorry you're hurting. 

[elaine567]

 A MM used to post here a lot.
He said he was really surprised when he found out his OW really loved him, because whilst they exchanged ILYs, his "love" was more of the I love the sex, I love the moment, I love what we are doing and not the I love YOU kind, where I want to marry you, have kids and die in your arms...
He assumed she felt the same, it was a fun fantasy "love" for him that was never going anywhere... 

[Snakesalive]

1 hour ago, Stupidkupid said:

I don't have anything more useful to say than the ladies above so I wanted to let you know that I'm so sorry you're hurting. 

Thank you @Stupidkupidthat  means a lot .  I know I am so much better out of the relationship than I was when I was in it . I know    Ultimately as time passes the hurt will become. Less -I know I have come a long way   There will always be things to confront on this journey and this is just one example. I just find it incredulous that he played with me like he did -as things unravelled it was so clear that he  is weak -I think that’s a reason why he wants to reconcile-he needs someone -anyone , as others have said when I step back and think logically I am better without him in my life . 
thanks everyone for your support 

[Snakesalive]

1 hour ago, elaine567 said:

 A MM used to post here a lot.
He said he was really surprised when he found out his OW really loved him, because whilst they exchanged ILYs, his "love" was more of the I love the sex, I love the moment, I love what we are doing and not the I love YOU kind, where I want to marry you, have kids and die in your arms...
He assumed she felt the same, it was a fun fantasy "love" for him that was never going anywhere... 

I’m always intrigued to hear the MM experience  in affairs thanks for sharing this example. I think in my case he has real issues with “love “ -difficult background etc -I think I tried to fix him -to build his confidence, show him he was lovable but ultimately his idea of love and mine were clearly very different

 His loss . 

[Snakesalive]

11 hours ago, NYAG said:

It comes as a ready made package

You are so right. In hindsight there are loads of examples I can think of where he was lazy -sure at the love bombing stage he was full on but that never lasts . 

[BaileyB]

28 minutes ago, Snakesalive said:

You are so right. In hindsight there are loads of examples I can think of where he was lazy -sure at the love bombing stage he was full on but that never lasts . 

It’s hard to do it alone. Many people stay in relationships that have long since run their course because they are comfortable and they don’t have the courage/strength to do it alone - to start over. That’s why many people tend to, as they say, monkey branch from one relationship to another. It’s much easier. Others will try to leave, only to return to what is known and safe when they realize just how much it will cost and how hard it will be...

As you say, it doesn’t really matter. It’s not a reflection of your worth or their marriage, he’s just doing what is convenient for him... in much the same way that he has done all along.

Onwards and upwards for you! 

Edited April 23, 2021 by BaileyB

[elaine567]

I know it is a bit of a generalisation but women in affairs are often looking for a husband/bf replacement, whereas men are not looking for a wife/gf replacement. 
This is the fundamental disconnect and the source of so much OW unhappiness.

[NYAG]

2 hours ago, elaine567 said:

I know it is a bit of a generalisation but women in affairs are often looking for a husband/bf replacement, whereas men are not looking for a wife/gf replacement. 
This is the fundamental disconnect and the source of so much OW unhappiness.

I largely agree with this though I'm sure others will have other views. I have never had an MM because I wanted a proper partner but I get that is often the case and like you say, the cause of so much unhappiness.

[spiritedaway2003]

I think part of the reason it shook you is that you want to believe what he told you was true.  If he was that unhappy in his marriage, then he would leave his marriage and not go back.  He would be proving that he is leaving ..."for him" and not for anyone else.  When push comes to shove, he instead defaulted to what is "most comfortable".  I'm sorry it shook you; I suspect it's because you can't help now but wonder what was real and what were the lies.

Edited April 24, 2021 by spiritedaway2003

[Luna66star]

The Sunk Cost Fallacy is the reason doesn't leave.  MM have invested too much to walk away so they choose to have their cake and eat it too.

Wife would take half of their pension, net worth, house likely.  MM would be in apartment by himself, lonely, no one to pick up after him, do housework, laundry, buy groceries, make dinners, etc.

It's easier for them to stay put and look for entertainment on the side when he's bored or wife not having sex, too busy with other things.

The wife plays a huge role in their everyday lives and they like that security.

Please erase this man from your life.  He can offer you nothing but some breadcrumbs of attention. It is atonishing how many women (I used to be one) put their lives on hold for these jokers.

Take your power back and walk away ... for good please!

 

 

[NYAG]

5 hours ago, Luna66star said:

The Sunk Cost Fallacy is the reason doesn't leave.  MM have invested too much to walk away so they choose to have their cake and eat it too.

Wife would take half of their pension, net worth, house likely.  MM would be in apartment by himself, lonely, no one to pick up after him, do housework, laundry, buy groceries, make dinners, etc.

It's easier for them to stay put and look for entertainment on the side when he's bored or wife not having sex, too busy with other things.

The wife plays a huge role in their everyday lives and they like that security.

Please erase this man from your life.  He can offer you nothing but some breadcrumbs of attention. It is atonishing how many women (I used to be one) put their lives on hold for these jokers.

Take your power back and walk away ... for good please!

 

 

I absolutely agree with this. The wife is always the safety net they go crawling back to. They will only split if she chooses to end it. The husbands rarely do.

[Snakesalive]

On 4/23/2021 at 11:33 PM, BaileyB said:

he’s just doing what is convenient for him... in much the same way that he has done all along.

Spot on. All the talk of “I’ll walk away from my business for you” turned out to be Just talk when the moment of truth came .

He stands to lose a lot financially in a divorce ,they would be very inconvenient for him 

[Snakesalive]

On 4/25/2021 at 3:33 AM, Luna66star said:

The wife plays a huge role in their everyday lives and they like that security.

Absolutely true , I actually feel sorry for her and I hope she won’t t be fooled by his attempt at hoovering 

[Snakesalive]

On 4/24/2021 at 9:20 PM, spiritedaway2003 said:

I think part of the reason it shook you is that you want to believe what he told you was true.  If he was that unhappy in his marriage, then he would leave his marriage and not go back.  He would be proving that he is leaving ..."for him" and not for anyone else.  When push comes to shove, he instead defaulted to what is "most comfortable".  I'm sorry it shook you; I suspect it's because you can't help now but wonder what was real and what were the lies.

There’s something in this for sure. I definitely wanted to believe what he told me  and actually now I don’t think any of it was real it was all a fantasy - he has no concept of what genuine feelings are. I often thought he had narcissistic type traits , I am so much better out of this destructive relationship that much is absolutely true 

[elaine567]

The other thing that MM have said is that when Dday hit, they were shocked to find their wife had no idea and was completely devastated.
They thought she knew or even condoned it, or that she wouldn't care a damn.
Finding out she didn't know, she did care a damn and was totally hurt and shocked to the core, was a huge wake up call.
Suddenly they were not "justified", suddenly they were a very bad guy indeed... suddenly they want her back.
The innocent Madonna wife, the mother of his children, loving him always vs the devious scheming temptress, the devil incarnate who helped him or encouraged him to cheat and lie... no brainer... hypocritical and blame shifting but hey ho....
So they want to reconcile, to beg and plead for her to take him back... they deny the OW, though they may have a few relapses... if the OW will let him...

32 minutes ago, Snakesalive said:

I am so much better out of this destructive relationship that much is absolutely true 

Too true.

[mark clemson]

I think some substantive part of why a WS (male or female) may suddenly (sometimes "desperately") chase their BS is the very substantial dopamine drop associated with a break up (along with all the practical issues that may come into play).

I think WS's are, in part, dopamine "chasers" so while they get a "high"/positive feelings from their AP (shiny and new perhaps, relative to the BS), unless they are VERY self-aware or VERY genuinely "done" with their marriage, they can't handle the BIG drop that comes from the breakup of their marriage.

Just my pet theory. YMMV.

This comes into play with regular breakups too of course. But a WS may not have had a break up in years and years (and thus be psychologically unprepared for what they go through).

 

https://www.psychologytoday.com/us/blog/the-mindful-self-express/201603/is-your-brain-breakup

https://www.insider.com/why-do-breakups-hurt-so-much-2019-2

https://www.cbc.ca/life/wellness/broken-heart-broken-brain-the-neurology-of-breaking-up-and-how-to-get-over-it-1.4608785

[Snakesalive]

On 4/25/2021 at 9:34 AM, NYAG said:

I absolutely agree with this. The wife is always the safety net they go crawling back to. They will only split if she chooses to end it. The husbands rarely do.

I do feel contempt for him now -i realise how weak and  pathetic he really is -not just by wanting to go back  to his wife but for the way he’s really been throughout our relationship-I just chose to ignore those bits of him -he has a facade and that’s really it -no depth just a pretence- eugh ! 

[Blind-Sided]

On 4/24/2021 at 4:06 AM, elaine567 said:

I know it is a bit of a generalisation but women in affairs are often looking for a husband/bf replacement, whereas men are not looking for a wife/gf replacement. 
This is the fundamental disconnect and the source of so much OW unhappiness.

I agree.  I know 3 girls who are currently in affairs.  One of them is open about it... so I don't know if it's still classified as an A or not.  (Married, and miserable)  One just filed for divorce... and the third has told her H that the affair is over... but I know she still goes over to the OM's place. It's kind of funny... she tells me she knows it's wrong, but her OM is just so much more loving, and caring than her H.  Anyway.... all 3 of them are looking for their next "Love".  (BF/Husband)   The one guy that I knew was fooling around when he was married (years ago) was looking for nothing other than a good time because he wife had gotten "Old and boring". (his words)  He would say he was going out with buddies, but in reality, he was meeting his OW.

I know that's a small cross section, but it's my first hand experience. 

Edited April 27, 2021 by Blind-Sided

[Snakesalive]

11 hours ago, mark clemson said:

I think some substantive part of why a WS (male or female) may suddenly (sometimes "desperately") chase their BS is the very substantial dopamine drop associated with a break up (along with all the practical issues that may come into play).

I think WS's are, in part, dopamine "chasers" so while they get a "high"/positive feelings from their AP (shiny and new perhaps, relative to the BS), unless they are VERY self-aware or VERY genuinely "done" with their marriage, they can't handle the BIG drop that comes from the breakup of their marriage.

Just my pet theory. YMMV.

This comes into play with regular breakups too of course. But a WS may not have had a break up in years and years (and thus be psychologically unprepared for what they go through).

 

https://www.psychologytoday.com/us/blog/the-mindful-self-express/201603/is-your-brain-breakup

https://www.insider.com/why-do-breakups-hurt-so-much-2019-2

https://www.cbc.ca/life/wellness/broken-heart-broken-brain-the-neurology-of-breaking-up-and-how-to-get-over-it-1.4608785

Thanks for sharing the links mark -understanding the science behind the emotional feelings is really useful and interesting for me . Every affair situation is slightly different but the part the chemicals in our brain  play is a constant to hold on to . 

[Blind-Sided]

11 hours ago, mark clemson said:

I think some substantive part of why a WS (male or female) may suddenly (sometimes "desperately") chase their BS is the very substantial dopamine drop associated with a break up (along with all the practical issues that may come into play).

I think WS's are, in part, dopamine "chasers" so while they get a "high"/positive feelings from their AP (shiny and new perhaps, relative to the BS), unless they are VERY self-aware or VERY genuinely "done" with their marriage, they can't handle the BIG drop that comes from the breakup of their marriage.

 

I agree.  In my last post... the girl who finally filed was honestly just in a marriage with a "Man Child" and wanted out.  But monkey branched to find the courage to do it. (I think she is honestly happy with her new guy)   The one who is being open about the A is dating a guy who is a total D-bag, and well below her station of life.  While I have no issues with dating a "Blue Collar" person.... this guy is older, lives with his mom, and is a drunk... AND is a jerk when other people are around.  But she tells me... "you don't know him like I do when we are alone."  My exact response is... "He shouldn't be any different when he's with you in public."   But she keeps going back to him because he gives her the attention she is looking for.  (and the dopamine high)

[Snakesalive]

4 minutes ago, Blind-Sided said:

But she tells me... "you don't know him like I do when we are alone

And this is what we do .... until we’re out of the affair fog and see things and people for what they really are .
I think back to occasions I actively agreed with people who talked about what an egotistical, weak , self indulgent guy my affair partner was -all the time I was secretly thinking to myself t they don’t know the real person-it’s  just a front he portrayed and anyway there were reasons for it no one else knew -difficult childhood etc they justified his behaviour.  Subconsciously I think I felt good that he showed me “the real him”-privileged even -nope this was just part of his manipulation and tactics to lure in the empath in me. @blindsidedmaybe it’s the same for your friend ? 

I liked  to think I’m pretty level headed but the affair totally knocked me for 6 in that I couldn’t believe how powerful the emotions , effect of brain chemicals etc had on my brain and my actions . There is no excuse for an affair -no justification and I’m sure no one thinks otherwise ( other than the AP’s when they’re in the thick of it ) but it’s pretty mind blowing when you’re out the other side to reflect back on what led to the affair , kept us in it and the aftermath . Learning from it and the understanding I’m getting through therapy etc is all part of the journey. 
 

[BourneWicked]

2 hours ago, Snakesalive said:

And this is what we do .... until we’re out of the affair fog and see things and people for what they really are .
I think back to occasions I actively agreed with people who talked about what an egotistical, weak , self indulgent guy my affair partner was -all the time I was secretly thinking to myself t they don’t know the real person-it’s  just a front he portrayed and anyway there were reasons for it no one else knew -difficult childhood etc they justified his behaviour.  Subconsciously I think I felt good that he showed me “the real him”-privileged even -nope this was just part of his manipulation and tactics to lure in the empath in me.

 

This is so true. Every time I started pulling away he would share something intimate and personal about his family life, his personal struggles. 

At the time, it seemed he was sensitive, caring, needed taking care of, blah blah blah. 

Looking back, he is very sensitive to others' emotions. Which was a big draw, that emotional connection. He sensed when I was pulling away and ready to quit the BS - and chose that time to sprinkle some fish food and bring me back to him.