Is it acceptable for my gf to talk about sex with another man

[basil67]

Talking to them when she's been admitted to hospital is one thing.  But talking with them about things she does which you don't approve of is another thing altogether.   

Do they know that you don't trust her?   

[Jonny80]

1 hour ago, basil67 said:

Talking to them when she's been admitted to hospital is one thing.  But talking with them about things she does which you don't approve of is another thing altogether.   

Do they know that you don't trust her?   

Yes they know it have my reservations,  they were round my G/f yesterday after work..  they asked me how I was feeling as last time we had spoken I was upset..

like I said in an earlier post,  they told me not to worry about anything said in the pub, told me to be happy and said we were both lucky to of found each other,  they said she’s agreed to marry you don’t worry about any pub banter,  they said i’ll always come across this in these situations....

but everyone said I can’t believe the parents, I disagree as, the only person my gf doesn’t talk over or get snotty with is her step mum, she would be fuming if my gf done anything stupid.. 

having the close relationship with her parents is lovely..... Because she has an illness, no job, 2 kids and 13 or so cats even before I mentioned the pub talk 95% of people are saying get rid walk away,  does she not deserve to be happy and cared for?    Initially I was struggling with the whole lack of sex but realised it’s not personal towards me..

this sex chat in the pub was a whole different ball game..  everyone is still saying walk away,  what kind of guy would she deserve?  I’m personally not happy with the sex talk but that 1 thing alone isn’t worth ending the relationship over unless there’s real intent or she’s done something...

I find it hard to believe that anyone who loved a woman enough to get married would end the relationship over inappropriate sex talk in the pub?

[Alpacalia]

9 hours ago, Jonny80 said:

I have no reason to lie so no it’s all true.

That's fine.

In any case, if something bothers you, you have a say in how you deal with it.

However, I agree with basil67.

Some of the approaches you are mentioning will just make you look like the bad guy, and she will lose respect for you.

[Jonny80]

46 minutes ago, Alpaca said:

That's fine.

In any case, if something bothers you, you have a say in how you deal with it.

However, I agree with basil67.

Some of the approaches you are mentioning will just make you look like the bad guy, and she will lose respect for you.

To be fair she’s doing that behind my back any way, making me look like the bad guy..

I remember when she asked me to cook because she was to tired, I offered to bring food which Iv done plenty,   She said no Iv got food here..

when I turned up I hadn’t been in the house 5 minutes and she was asking what we were having for tea?  There was nothing other than Bacon which I bought the week previous..  there was rice and pasta but nothing to have with it other than bacon and she didn’t want that.  I politely said I offered to bring food you should of told me.  All I got was why the f*** didn’t you bring some and use your initiative then..  as I said I was told not to as there was food in.

Considering I had spent 2 weeks building her sheds for her cats and saving her over £1500. She became very abusive because I didn’t have a meal plan when I arrived not knowing what food she had, she said I don’t help with f*** all abs bring f*** all to the table either help or f*** off...

needless to say I left within being in the house 10!minutes at most, that’s after driving an hour to get there..

she went and told her parents I was to sensitive as a result of me going home after being sworn at..  it later got bought up in conversation with her parents she missed out the swearing and telling me to f*** off etc,

despite constantly doing DIY, building, dressing her son, being chained to the kitchen sink, I don’t help out enough, I work all day and then tend to her needs..

i put up with that so can’t blame that on anyone but myself. Her parents have always played a close part in our relationship, she needs there help, without there help she would really struggle but I’m doing more to help the more I’m with her.

if I get my head around this sex thing n the pub I think it will be ok..

[Uruktopi]

9 hours ago, Jonny80 said:

it’s the pub thing I need to be at ease with..

From my point of view, a personal one, it’s the pub thing you need to be NOT at ease with..

[Jonny80]

1 hour ago, Uruktopi said:

From my point of view, a personal one, it’s the pub thing you need to be NOT at ease with..

I can see this,  so you think it’s the start of something with this guy or her behaviour in general?

life’s to short to be miserable, I’m trying not to worry and enjoy life,  I’v just had her 6 year old play fighting and jumping all over me, he kissed me and told me he loved me bless him, not easy to walk away from but I’m going to keep an eye out for bad behaviour..

[mark clemson]

She is clearly the type of person who finds social attention and "gab" very reinforcing.

Some people are, I think, feel overly threatened by those who are charming and socially at ease.

The flip side of this is that those charming and socially at ease people MIGHT allow that to slip into something more under the wrong circumstances.

As a partner, you need to be able to set boundaries that are reasonable for both yourself and your partner and recognize whether this person "is right for you". Otherwise you aren't likely to be too happy.

Overall, I'm still wondering why you are considering marrying a person with the totality of the issues you mention. I feel like each issue on it's own might not be a big deal, but the convergence is pointing to an unhappy situation.

And yes, as some have pointed out, you are in the early stages and things are likely to go downhill (at least slightly) from here once you are married/"locked in".

[Jonny80]

8 minutes ago, mark clemson said:

as some have pointed out, you are in the early stages and things are likely to go downhill (at least slightly) from here once you are married/"locked in".

Really?   Does marriage get worse?

I don’t intend to rush it,  she’ll need to cheer up a bit 😳

[mark clemson]

^^ you see a lot more of the other person and there can be a tendency to take them for granted as well as to "vent" emotionally on the other person, e.g. when under stress. People are only human.

Many (certainly not all) women have less interest in sex than the man they are with, and so may reduce the amount of sex after they have "won" him. It can become more "duty sex" than "bonding sex" (duty sex can still be quite good, in a somewhat similar way to leftover pizza still being good the next day; but it's not quite as good; also certainly not ALL married sex is "duty sex".).

There can be other issues that develop as both people slowly change over time and face the various "curveballs" life throws your ways.

I would note that this woman already has significant issues, such as the incurable medical issue you mention. This may or may not "intensify" problems too much, but I doubt it will help matters.

Edited May 20, 2021 by mark clemson

[Acacia98]

12 hours ago, Jonny80 said:

I haven’t spoke to her friends about her actions,   Iv always spoken with her parents about things,  they even phone me and ask how I am..  I mearly told them what had happened at the pub and said I was worried..

(...)

she’s ill and will only get worse,  her daughter has issues witnessing her ex husband beating my gf up 5 times over 5 year marriage,  her daughter has also recently been diagnosed with the same illness as has her 5 year old son, her daughter also has a liver disease which could kill her untreated and her daughter refuses to take her medication,  her daughter can be violent and verbally offensive towards her mum,

(...)

took me along time to come to terms with the fact she was to ill to make love on a regular basis but I did and we were happy...

the whole pub talk thing has made me ask questions as like most of you I think it’s wrong but it’s not enough to end it..

I could find another women no problem I’m not exactly ugly, but they wouldn’t be her, I only have eyes for her..  and Iv grown to love her children and am very fond of her family too..

You told her parents she was talking about anal sex with this other guy? Yikes! IMO, that's  too much information. It sounds to me like their family generally has hazy boundaries and you're being drawn into that dynamic.

But setting that aside, I suspect this is not the only issue that's come up over the course of your relationship. I think there are likely to have been other red flags but you didn't recognize them for what they were. I also think that, as this discussion develops, you will start to remember some of those things.

Do I think you should just flip a switch and dump her because one thing she did bugged you? I dont think that's possible. Based on what you say, that's not how your emotions work. I think you should take the time to learn what her behavior means and then to decide whether you're truly compatible. That's probably not something that will happen overnight. So take as much time as you think you need to figure stuff out. Don't rush into marriage.

Edited May 20, 2021 by Acacia98

[Acacia98]

6 hours ago, Jonny80 said:

To be fair she’s doing that behind my back any way, making me look like the bad guy..

I remember when she asked me to cook because she was to tired, I offered to bring food which Iv done plenty,   She said no Iv got food here..

when I turned up I hadn’t been in the house 5 minutes and she was asking what we were having for tea?  There was nothing other than Bacon which I bought the week previous..  there was rice and pasta but nothing to have with it other than bacon and she didn’t want that.  I politely said I offered to bring food you should of told me.  All I got was why the f*** didn’t you bring some and use your initiative then..  as I said I was told not to as there was food in.

Considering I had spent 2 weeks building her sheds for her cats and saving her over £1500. She became very abusive because I didn’t have a meal plan when I arrived not knowing what food she had, she said I don’t help with f*** all abs bring f*** all to the table either help or f*** off...

needless to say I left within being in the house 10!minutes at most, that’s after driving an hour to get there..

she went and told her parents I was to sensitive as a result of me going home after being sworn at..  it later got bought up in conversation with her parents she missed out the swearing and telling me to f*** off etc,

despite constantly doing DIY, building, dressing her son, being chained to the kitchen sink, I don’t help out enough, I work all day and then tend to her needs..

i put up with that so can’t blame that on anyone but myself. 

Wow. I hadn't seen this when I made my previous post. But here there are: those other red flags I guessed existed. 

[Jonny80]

43 minutes ago, Acacia98 said:

You told her parents she was talking about anal sex with this other guy? Yikes! IMO, that's  too much information. It sounds to me like their family generally has hazy boundaries and you're being drawn into that dynamic.

But setting that aside, I suspect this is not the only issue that's come up over the course of your relationship. I think there are likely to have been other red flags but you didn't recognize them for what they were. I also think that, as this discussion develops, you will start to remember some of those things.

Do I think you should just flip a switch and dump her because one thing she did bugged you? I dont think that's possible. Based on what you say, that's not how your emotions work. I think you should take the time to learn what her behavior means and then to decide whether you're truly compatible. That's probably not something that will happen overnight. So take as much time as you think you need to figure stuff out. Don't rush into marriage.

To be fair I didn’t tell her parents any details and didn’t mention anal sex lol.. even I’m not quite that lose with my words..

I just eluded that a guy who 2 weeks ago was only a parcel delivery guy has now become such an important friend that she’s meeting him at the pub and discussing sex as if they were a couple..

 

she’s lucky I’m naturally placid,  I definitely think she’s controlling and a dictator to a certain degree...

im 48 now and have lived alone since I was 22, Iv had gf’s here and there but my longest relationship was 3 years and that finished when I was 19. Since then Iv never had a gf at Christmas, I was a computer gamer for years and was happy single doing my own thing...  she did say because of my lack of experience with relationships that I was inexperienced and lacked the knowledge etc,?truth is I know right from wrong and I have morales which includes being respectful to others..

 

it could be this lack of experience is why I’m allowing her so much freedom?

[basil67]

1 hour ago, Jonny80 said:

it could be this lack of experience is why I’m allowing her so much freedom?

The bolded is concept of control.

In a respectful relationship, a person doesn't prohibit or allow freedom like an adult to a child.  Rather, the partner is given the freedom to make their own decisions and we decide whether they are suitable for us.   Of course, if we feel there's a problem with their behaviour, we can talk about it.  Sometimes they choose to adjust and sometimes, they tell you that this is their way and we have no choice but to accept that this is the case.

If you don't like their choice of behaviour, you leave.  You don't remove their freedoms. 

 

[DKT3]

I think a lot of women are hypersensitive about controlled.  However,  most of these situations here are about controlled. 

This guy is clearly not controlling so I'm not understanding why it keeps being mentioned.  If anything he is a very passive doormat. 

[basil67]

8 minutes ago, DKT3 said:

I think a lot of women are hypersensitive about controlled.  However,  most of these situations here are about controlled. 

This guy is clearly not controlling so I'm not understanding why it keeps being mentioned.  If anything he is a very passive doormat. 

I didn't say he was controlling.  I said that the concept of allowing a partner freedom is connected to control.    "Allowing" being the operative word.

Edited May 20, 2021 by basil67

[Uruktopi]

5 hours ago, Jonny80 said:

I can see this,  so you think it’s the start of something with this guy or her behaviour in general?

 

"Something" is a very wide an so an ambiguous expression.

If what you understand by "something" is a torrid affair behind your back, I sincerily don´t think that it will necessarily happen.

I will say it once more knowing that you don´t have any need to agree and not even to put any attention about. Not at all a complaint but is what you´ve practiced till now.

As I see it:

- It´s NOT about a conjectural and unknown future (...the start of...)

- It´s NOT about something hidden or done behind your back.

- It´s NOT about individual, personal, concious intentions (which are NOT what attribute meaning to facts that have it by themselves).

It IS about a KIND of behaviour that may NOT have (in quantitative terms) the magnitude of a classical infidelity. But that, as I see it, IS OF THE SAME NATURE.

And it´s not hidden but self evident as facts, regardless it´s "interpretations".

Is it about the sexual meaning of the behaviour? NO, not at all.

It is because all kind of sexually charged signals should (in my personal view) exclusively focused on you.

Undersanding that a third person, never suggestive, talk about sex with others IS NOT a problem but neither the same as what happened.

 

Once more, all the above is based in my only personal take about love, relationships, couples. 

You should choose what kind of relationship you want and be consistent with it regarding the one at your side.

Edited May 20, 2021 by Uruktopi

[Jonny80]

5 hours ago, basil67 said:

The bolded is concept of control.

In a respectful relationship, a person doesn't prohibit or allow freedom like an adult to a child.  Rather, the partner is given the freedom to make their own decisions and we decide whether they are suitable for us.   Of course, if we feel there's a problem with their behaviour, we can talk about it.  Sometimes they choose to adjust and sometimes, they tell you that this is their way and we have no choice but to accept that this is the case.

If you don't like their choice of behaviour, you leave.  You don't remove their freedoms. 

 

Think I said earlier that she accepted my views were different and she wouldn’t act like that any more, time will tell..

 

 having said that after being with her yesterday for a while she was moody due to a stressful day something that happens frequently..  that alone is making me think should I commit long term..

[basil67]

Did you not think about her moodiness before you proposed?

[Jonny80]

2 minutes ago, basil67 said:

Did you not think about her moodiness before you proposed?

Yes but to be honest so much has happened since that moment, her calling me a peace of s*** after being in her house less than 5 minutes because I didn’t tell her son of for refusing to go to bed and then having to witness the sex talk..

allthough both times she said sorry and she thinks saying sorry should be the end of the matter I personally felt I wanted to discuss both occasions in detail which in its self caused another argument where she got angry to the extent her 6 year old told his dad that we were arguing and that we no longer lived each other... 

 

someone said to look up gaslighting,  my enthusiasm has definitely changed but not sure I’ll end it because besides these issues there is also a lot of love which is nice..

[basil67]

2 hours ago, Jonny80 said:

Allthough both times she said sorry and she thinks saying sorry should be the end of the matter I personally felt I wanted to discuss both occasions in detail which in its self caused another argument where she got angry to the extent her 6 year old told his dad that we were arguing and that we no longer lived each other... 

Well yes, I'd get angry too if I realised that what I'd done was bad/hurtful, genuinely apologised to him and then and then he wanted to keep on about it.  I'd never do that to my partner if he had apologised about a wrong doing either.   Granted, it can take a few days after the apology before I really let it go of being annoyed, but I keep it to myself and carry on as usual.  

A 'sorry' should be the end of the discussion.   Followed by a hug and a 'fresh start' (what my kids called it when we all let an issue end and moved on).  The next thing which should happen is that you see changed behaviour on their part.   If you can't accept her apology, then yes, I agree that you should move on.   Or if her behaviour doesn't change, also move on.  But enough with rehashing her mistakes. 

Edited May 21, 2021 by basil67

[Jonny80]

43 minutes ago, basil67 said:

Well yes, I'd get angry too if I realised that what I'd done was bad/hurtful, genuinely apologised to him and then and then he wanted to keep on about it.  I'd never do that to my partner if he had apologised about a wrong doing either.   Granted, it can take a few days after the apology before I really let it go of being annoyed, but I keep it to myself and carry on as usual.  

A 'sorry' should be the end of the discussion.   Followed by a hug and a 'fresh start' (what my kids called it when we all let an issue end and moved on).  The next thing which should happen is that you see changed behaviour on their part.   If you can't accept her apology, then yes, I agree that you should move on.   Or if her behaviour doesn't change, also move on.  But enough with rehashing her mistakes. 

A sorry for talking about sex to a man in the pub followed by it’s my body I’ll do as I wish I won’t be controlled in my opinion isn’t an apology at all, it’s like sticking 2 fingers up, and yea her behaviour has been the same with these outbursts for months...   I’m still making my mind up if I can tolerate this behaviour hence why I’m here to talk about it..

[elaine567]

Jonny is not comfortable in a marriage and so is not of the mindset to quickly forgive and forget and move on for the sake of the marriage.
He is still at the assessment stage of this relationship, where he is deciding whether this woman is in fact a person he wants to go ahead and marry.
He has indicated his intention but nothing is set in stone.
He needs to look after himself and weigh up whether "love" is really enough.
When things are good they are good but when things are bad they are really bad...
He feels he needs to get to the bottom of these troubling behaviours, not just gloss them over and kiss and make up.

He has tried to discuss things in more detail to reassure himself, but she has shut him down with anger or tears... so nothing gets resolved.
 Seems to me this is about respect and both of these recent events show a lack of respect for him, IMO.
Now that she knows she "has him" and he is a bit of a soft touch as he loves her, this may just get worse.

[Jonny80]

2 minutes ago, elaine567 said:

Jonny is not comfortable in a marriage and so is not of the mindset to quickly forgive and forget and move on for the sake of the marriage.
He is still at the assessment stage of this relationship, where he is deciding whether this woman is in fact a person he wants to go ahead and marry.
He has indicated his intention but nothing is set in stone.
He needs to look after himself and weigh up whether "love" is really enough.
When things are good they are good but when things are bad they are really bad...
He feels he needs to get to the bottom of these troubling behaviours, not just gloss them over and kiss and make up.

He has tried to discuss things in more detail to reassure himself, but she has shut him down with anger or tears... so nothing gets resolved.
 Seems to me this is about respect and both of these recent events show a lack of respect for him, IMO.
Now that she knows she "has him" and he is a bit of a soft touch as he loves her, this may just get worse.

Thank you, a perfect summary. 😊...

is my love for this person enough to accept these outbursts, perfect question I’m losing sleep over trying to come to terms with..

[basil67]

15 minutes ago, Jonny80 said:

A sorry for talking about sex to a man in the pub followed by it’s my body I’ll do as I wish I won’t be controlled in my opinion isn’t an apology at all, it’s like sticking 2 fingers up, and yea her behaviour has been the same with these outbursts for months...   I’m still making my mind up if I can tolerate this behaviour hence why I’m here to talk about it..

Yes, you're right.  If it was delivered in a single sentence as " sorry for talking about sex to a man in the pub [but] by it’s my body I’ll do as I wish I won’t be controlled", then this is not at all a proper apology.   I had been been thinking that she talked about being controlled after you raised it further.  

So was all in one sentence as above?  Or was her comment about you being controlling after you'd raised further discussions on the topic?

[Jonny80]

1 hour ago, basil67 said:

Yes, you're right.  If it was delivered in a single sentence as " sorry for talking about sex to a man in the pub [but] by it’s my body I’ll do as I wish I won’t be controlled", then this is not at all a proper apology.   I had been been thinking that she talked about being controlled after you raised it further.  

So was all in one sentence as above?  Or was her comment about you being controlling after you'd raised further discussions on the topic?

It was the 2nd time, she asked me if I was ok and I said no I’m still trying to get my head around what happened.

this is when she went on the defensive or attack, she’s trying to justify her mistake by saying and normal person would accept her behaviour because she said sorry,,  she’s saying this is only a problem because I lack trust, I’m jealous and insecure..  clearly no empathy or respect for my feelings on this..

I need to feel I accept this behaviour and to trust her to be at ease and continue the relationship but 1 week in it’s still causing me concern, I can be with her but I don’t need to rush out and get married or pay for a venue this early on..