how do you reconcile when each blames the other?

[Kyra]

I don't know if we are over or he's just giving me the silent treatment. We normally text virtually every day but I haven't had any response from him since our big fight 1 week ago. 

I miss him every minute of every day and I'm desperate to heal our relationship but I'm also still fuming about everything he did wrong, not just last week but ever. The longer he leaves me to stew, the more time I have to remember all the other times he did me wrong.

I want him to say "let's talk" and for him to want to hear my side and to apologize and make more effort to not hurt me, but I don't think that's going to happen because from his last text (& some history) he clearly thinks that he's done nothing wrong, it's all in my head or made up by me for the sake of creating drama, and that I am to blame for hurting him and ruining the relationship.

So I think that the only way I can be with him is if I go crawling back to him and accept all blame, and I don't say what I really think or feel. I don't want to give up my self respect but I don't want to lose him either.

My friend says I should just wait a few weeks and let him miss me, but I'm in agony not even knowing whether my boyfriend will ever speak to me again. I don't know if he'll ever miss me enough to give up his pride or decide I'm worth the work

[Acacia98]

57 minutes ago, Kyra said:

My friend says I should just wait a few weeks and let him miss me, but I'm in agony not even knowing whether my boyfriend will ever speak to me again. I don't know if he'll ever miss me enough to give up his pride or decide I'm worth the work

Why not take this as a sign that the relationship is unhealthy and it is time to let it go? I know you don't want things to end, but just being in a relationship is not a good enough goal in and of itself. The quality of the relationship matters. There must be things that matter to you and that you hope to get out of your relationship. Does this relationship tick those boxes?

[Wiseman2]

Sorry this happened. Don't chase anyone who has no respect for you.

You miss the idea of a relationship, but you were quite incompatible so be glad it's over.

Break-ups and heartaches hurt. Just work through it. 

Running back to the source of the pain doesn't ease the pain, does it?

[Kyra]

3 hours ago, Acacia98 said:

Why not take this as a sign that the relationship is unhealthy and it is time to let it go? I know you don't want things to end, but just being in a relationship is not a good enough goal in and of itself. The quality of the relationship matters. There must be things that matter to you and that you hope to get out of your relationship. Does this relationship tick those boxes?

Quote

You miss the idea of a relationship, but you were quite incompatible so be glad it's over.

Break-ups and heartaches hurt. Just work through it. 

Running back to the source of the pain doesn't ease the pain, does it?

Ah, no, most of the time we are extremely compatible and have a wonderful relationship that makes us both very happy. He is/was my best friend and when things are good I am happy just to be with him. So, no, sorry this advice is not helpful at all. You can't assume that because we had (are having a fight) that we are incompatible and it's an unhealthy relationship. I know you must make assumptions because you can't know everything but that seems like a big leap to make. Isn't it possible to have a great relationship and still have issues or misunderstandings or even fights? Thanks for responding though

[Acacia98]

9 hours ago, Kyra said:

You can't  just make assumptions because you can't know everything but that seems like a big leap to make. Isn't it possible to have a great relationship and still have issues or misunderstandings or even fights? Thanks for responding though

I like to give folks the benefit of the doubt instead of assuming they're just being melodramatic and making stuff up. So to me, your first post describes a relationship with serious issues.

Mind you, my response to you was based 100% on the things you said. For example,

14 hours ago, Kyra said:

I don't know if we are over or he's just giving me the silent treatment. 

(...)

I want him to say "let's talk" and for him to want to hear my side and to apologize and make more effort to not hurt me, but I don't think that's going to happen because from his last text (& some history) he clearly thinks that he's done nothing wrong, it's all in my head or made up by me for the sake of creating drama, and that I am to blame for hurting him and ruining the relationship.

So I think that the only way I can be with him is if I go crawling back to him and accept all blame, and I don't say what I really think or feel. I don't want to give up my self respect but I don't want to lose him either.

These words hardly describe a healthy relationship. In healthy relationships, yes, people have disagreements. But they are then able to talk again after a reasonable cooling-off period. And the idea that you have to surrender your self-respect and "crawl back" to him to reconcile is pretty messed up.

If you're still convinced that we're wrong, perhaps you should share more info about what you actually fought about and what his and your perspectives are (as much as you can share without violating your privacy). And maybe some more info about how often the silent treatment thing happens and whether you routinely have to take the blame for any disagreements would help.

[emprosnet7]

On 6/2/2021 at 7:33 AM, Kyra said:

I don't know if we are over or he's just giving me the silent treatment. We normally text virtually every day but I haven't had any response from him since our big fight 1 week ago. 

I miss him every minute of every day and I'm desperate to heal our relationship but I'm also still fuming about everything he did wrong, not just last week but ever. The longer he leaves me to stew, the more time I have to remember all the other times he did me wrong.

I want him to say "let's talk" and for him to want to hear my side and to apologize and make more effort to not hurt me, but I don't think that's going to happen because from his last text (& some history) he clearly thinks that he's done nothing wrong, it's all in my head or made up by me for the sake of creating drama, and that I am to blame for hurting him and ruining the relationship.

So I think that the only way I can be with him is if I go crawling back to him and accept all blame, and I don't say what I really think or feel. I don't want to give up my self respect but I don't want to lose him either.

My friend says I should just wait a few weeks and let him miss me, but I'm in agony not even knowing whether my boyfriend will ever speak to me again. I don't know if he'll ever miss me enough to give up his pride or decide I'm worth the work

How old are you and he? What are the things he did wrong? Are you keeping a score of the mistakes he makes ?

[Alpacalia]

Sometimes it is practically impossible to reconcile with someone you have not forgiven if you do not know the circumstances of the conflict.

What was the bone of contention? It seems to be continuous, from the sounds of it.

Especially considering you haven't spoken to each other in over a week.

I'm not sure what you've done to warrant his acting this way, but ignoring you for more than a week suggests he's over the relationship.

[Kyra]

99% of the time it was a fantastic relationship and he was great. Usually if I have a concern he'd listen calmly and it would be resolved. I'm the emotional one.

We have a history of misunderstandings - he says a thing and it says to me he doesn't care about me and I get upset. Within a few days or less he says that wasn't how he meant it, I misunderstood and he does care. So I believe him and forgive him and we go back to a fun and loving relationship.

So it happened once again that he said something that amounts to him not caring about me. I tried to ignore my doubts and how it made me feel because every other time it's happened, I then believed that it was a misunderstanding so this most likely was too, but after some weeks I thought it safest to clear it up so I had no doubts to compound next time he is careless with his words. So I said we need to talk about the certain discussion we'd had weeks ago. I could have worded it better. 

He refused to talk about it at all because he believes he has been perfectly reasonable so I must be making up some drama to get out of out sex. He seems to think that each time there has been a misunderstanding it's my fault for just taking things negatively (he thinks this because in one particular instance I admitted I did - so it must always be true, otherwise he'd have to admit he was at fault for his poor choice of words).

At his refusal to even hear what I wanted to talk about and his insults, I lost my temper and said something stupid like, fine, we'll just have a relationship where we never talk at all. This was all by text. He made no reply for almost a week. I then apologised for that and said of course we have to talk. Sent a couple of emails to explain my position. A couple of days later he texted that he didn't know what to say but he had no interest in "going over all this ground again and delving further into obsessive self-centred instrospection. I believe that I have done and said everything that is reasonable in the circumstances. this will surely be insufficient but I can't do anything about that."

What he said doesn't really make any sense to me. I think it's a shitty reply but once again I gave him the benefit of the doubt - that maybe he has some reasonable excuse for acting like this which is quite out of character. I tried to make it clear that he has to take this seriously if he wants to continue the relationship. No reply in 5 days now.

Part of me still hopes that he's just being an idiot and will come to his senses because he's usually so loving and considerate - that if I could just get him to listen and hear how hurtful he's being he'd want to make up for it. I can't really understand how he can be so callous now but with each day that passes in silence there's less hope of any reconciliation

[Kyra]

17 hours ago, emprosnet7 said:

How old are you and he? What are the things he did wrong? Are you keeping a score of the mistakes he makes ?

We might sound like juveniles on paper but we're over 40.

I'm not trying to keep score of his mistakes but they have left scars. When he hurts me I can't help but remember the other times he has done similar and wonder anew if I should trust him.

[basil67]

Rather than jumping to conclusions, I'm going to ask questions to get more of a feel as to what's going on.  

If you compare this to your previous relationships, would you say that you have a pattern of being hurt like this?  Or is being hurt like this something you've never encountered before?  I'm trying to work out if you're sensitive or he's gaslighting you.

You say the relationship is 99% good.  But there seems to be a lot of bits buzzing around bothering you.   To me, a 99% good relationship is one which needs zero improvement, so would it be fair to say that you're over selling how good it is?

How long have you been together?

Just how many issues are buzzing around in your brain, unresolved?

Of the times when you've had a disagreement, how many of them have been resolved easily and without issue.  

Can you give us some other examples of stuff he's said (and the context in which he's said it) which has really upset you? 

How does he speak of the exes in his life?

1 hour ago, Kyra said:

He refused to talk about it at all because he believes he has been perfectly reasonable so I must be making up some drama to get out of out sex.

This is highly problematic.  You have the right to say no to sex for any reason.   Granted, there can be issues arising when sex drives differ, but him accusing you of making up drama to get out of sex speaks to entitlement on his part.  I feel he's heading into territory of coersion here, where you feel pressured to have sex lest he get angry or fight with you.   

1 hour ago, Kyra said:

"going over all this ground again and delving further into obsessive self-centred instrospection. I believe that I have done and said everything that is reasonable in the circumstances. this will surely be insufficient but I can't do anything about that."

Again, highly problematic.  It's one thing to say "we've talked this through as far as we can - we need to let this go".  But calling your need for discussion "obsessive self-centred introspection" shows he's very comfortable talking down to and belitting you.  

On 6/2/2021 at 7:13 PM, Kyra said:

Isn't it possible to have a great relationship and still have issues or misunderstandings or even fights? Thanks for responding though

Yes it's possible.  But the comments he's made above have no place in a great relationship.  Nor does going AWOL and refusing to speak unless the other apologises. 

Edited June 8, 2021 by basil67

[Kyra]

53 minutes ago, basil67 said:

If you compare this to your previous relationships, would you say that you have a pattern of being hurt like this?  Or is being hurt like this something you've never encountered before?  I'm trying to work out if you're sensitive or he's gaslighting you.

No pattern or issues like this in other relationships. I probably am oversensitive from being insecure in THIS relationship though because he's not very forthcoming with his feelings. I think he's uncomfortable labelling them or describing them and doesn't really see the point. He says it's actions that matter - and most of the time his actions are caring.

Quote

How long have you been together?

4 yrs 3 mths

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You say the relationship is 99% good.  But there seems to be a lot of bits buzzing around bothering you.   To me, a 99% good relationship is one which needs zero improvement, so would it be fair to say that you're over selling how good it is? Just how many issues are buzzing around in your brain, unresolved? Of the times when you've had a disagreement, how many of them have been resolved easily and without issue. 

99% of the TIME is wonderful, rather than 99% of the relationship. Does that make sense? When it's good and I feel secure that he truly cares about me it really is a fantastic relationship - I know in part that's because we don't live together or have domestic issues or kid issues or money issues to fight about. We'd see each other once a week, sometimes less but when together it is quality time. We spend give each other our full attention, talk, cuddle and do fun things together. The sex was incredible! We'd text each other most days, just wanting to keep in touch. We were best friends and lovers.

The issues all pretty much come down to me doubting whether he really cares about me, or just cares about getting what he wants - fun. 

Impossible to give any number to the times disagreements have been resolved easily. Quite a few I'd say, but the ones that take longer to resolve stick in the memory more clearly!

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Can you give us some other examples of stuff he's said (and the context in which he's said it) which has really upset you? 

The most recent example was when I asked him to refrain from telling me he's disappointed with me if I don't do something he asks me to do for him. I do a lot for him and only don't do something when it's a real issue for me to do it, not because I just can't be bothered, but it seems like he doesn't know this (from his answer). Anyway I thought that if I explained how stressful, hurtful and unhelpful it was for him to say he's disappointed, he'd say, "sorry, won't do that again," but actually he seemed to confirm that he consciously does it to pressure me into doing what he wants "because otherwise you won't" and refused to stop doing it. This sounds to me like getting every little petty pleasure he can is more important to him than my happiness or emotional wellbeing - which is a deal-breaker. But because of previous doubts being put down to miscommunication - and because he was in a bad mood that night, I believed this was probably not what he meant and wanted to ask about it, but he refused to even hear what I wanted to talk about - which he's never done before

Quote

How does he speak of the exes in his life?

He hasn't said a great deal. Never b****ed about them. I think he's too classy for that.

Quote

This is highly problematic.  You have the right to say no to sex for any reason.   Granted, there can be issues arising when sex drives differ, but him accusing you of making up drama to get out of sex speaks to entitlement on his part.  I feel he's heading into territory of coersion here, where you feel pressured to have sex lest he get angry or fight with you.   

No it wasn't like that. I was insulted because if I didn't want sex I would have just said, and it wouldn't have been a problem. I don't need to make up excuses and lies. I wanted the sex + talk but didn't make that clear and he jumped to conclusions. It was actually a particular thing we had planned and his first response was that he would refrain from suggesting that activity in future, thinking that would mean there was no need for an unpleasant serious discussion. I explained that really wasn't the issue but he still said he say no point talking about it.

Quote

But calling your need for discussion "obsessive self-centred introspection" shows he's very comfortable talking down to and belitting you.  

Yes, that was horrible.

I'm kind of hoping he has a brain tumor to explain his horrid behaviour over the past few weeks because it's shocking and no other way it's okay.

[emprosnet7]

7 hours ago, Kyra said:

We might sound like juveniles on paper but we're over 40.

I'm not trying to keep score of his mistakes but they have left scars. When he hurts me I can't help but remember the other times he has done similar and wonder anew if I should trust him.

You should focus on his actions and not his words. He must have poor communication skills. I suggest the book why_men_dont_listen_and_women_cant_read_maps. 

[Kyra]

1 hour ago, emprosnet7 said:

You should focus on his actions and not his words. He must have poor communication skills. I suggest the book why_men_dont_listen_and_women_cant_read_maps. 

Thanks. I'll look for that book. Could be interesting regardless whether he ever talks to me again.

My theory is that he lacks some communication skills, in particular having consideration for how your words might actually sound to someone else. Also seems like he lacks emotional intelligence, particularly empathy for feelings he hasn't experienced himself. I think he's somewhat out of touch with his own feelings (and that's why he can't describe them or be sure what he feels is love or not) and thus doesn't give my feelings the consideration I think they deserve. Almost like feelings aren't that important. 

Physically I feel very safe with him. He's very careful and he's very considerate about tangible things like making sure I have enough food I like, that I'm warm/cool enough, safe from danger etc. But when it comes to being careful of my feelings, either he just has no clue the pain he causes and how to avoid it, or he doesn't regard that as important because he doesn't feel anything that deeply. Rather like when your 3 yr old has a meltdown because her cup is red not yellow and it's hard to sympathize because to an adult it's such a ridiculous thing to be so upset about. I think that must be how he sees me when I am upset with him. I like this theory better than the one where he's just been pretending to be caring and loving and had me fooled for 4 yrs, anyway

[ExpatInItaly]

17 hours ago, Kyra said:

But when it comes to being careful of my feelings, either he just has no clue the pain he causes and how to avoid it, or he doesn't regard that as important because he doesn't feel anything that deeply.

I am 40 as well. I would not be able to tolerate a partner like this. 

It would mean that he is incapable of meeting a fundamental desire of mine for a functional, happy, emotionally-connected relationship. At this age, he is very unlikely to change. What you see is what you get. 

[Sun Seeker]

Your boyfriend sounds like my ex girlfriend. Any issue I wanted to talk about was me being negative according to her.

She was also very dismissive of past issues and would not want to bring them up again if I felt they were unresolved. She was constantly disappointed with me if I didn't do X Y or Z, the reason not mattering. She made me feel like everything was always my fault. After every fight we promised to try again, but the same thing kept happening.

In the end I made the best decision of my life. I realised we were not compatible (regardless of how well things were when we were good and had similar interests etc), and an unhappy relationship was not one I wanted to be part of. I broke up with her. It wasn't easy as she ticked nearly every box I was looking for, but it just was not working.

I am now in a new relationship with a woman who is the complete opposite of her, and I could not be happier. None of this drama whatsoever.

I guess the point of my story is you have the power to change things by breaking up for good and finding someone else who appreciates you for you and makes you happy always, not just sometimes.

[elaine567]

Seems to me some men are very happy as long as women do not rock any boats and they comply.
Some men are very used to getting their own way and are not used to being questioned nor used to women having an opinion or being uncompliant..
They throw barbed comments in her direction and expect the women to just take it.
If she complains he refuses to discuss or accept any wrongdoing.
She shuts up to keep the peace and he thinks all is hunky dory.  The issue is closed from his POV.
If she continues expressing her views, he may even sulk or give her the silent treatment until she gives in, as she doesn't want to lose him..
Once she gives in and takes the heat off, he is as happy as Larry, not only has  he established dominance and punished her, she is now oh sooo grateful to him...

 

[Kyra]

Thanks everyone!

He has finally agreed to talk to me when he's back from his trip. It could go either way. I do want to hear his explanation at least, and if nothing else I will have closure

[Wiseman2]

On 6/8/2021 at 12:51 AM, Kyra said:

I'm not trying to keep score of his mistakes but they have left scars. When he hurts me I can't help but remember the other times he has done similar 

Google "injustice collecting".

Why not just walk away if someone is this insensitive?

[Kyra]

10 minutes ago, Wiseman2 said:

Google "injustice collecting".

Hadn't heard that term so googled it and collected a few definitions:

• someone who nurses resentment over real or perceived injustices and no matter how much time has passed the Injustice Collector will never forget or forgive those wrongs or the people he or she believes are responsible.
• The tendency to itemize every unfair knock we've ever suffered is known. Enough grudge holding and soon you'll see more iniquity than actually exists.
• Injustice collecting springs from a sensible motive: the monitoring of fairness as a form of self-protection, 
• the act of creating and maintaining a mental list of wrongs committed by others.  A preoccupation with fairness or rightness drives these cognitions. People who engage in injustice collecting are preoccupied with the guilty party and the unfairness that was bestowed upon them.  
• Injustice collectors ruminate continually about the Bad People who have harmed them. They are preoccupied with the injustices that they believe they’ve suffered; and, as a result, they live in mental prisons of helplessness, hurt, rage, and the longing for vengeance.

I'm certainly not an injustice collector in general, and if I get upset about something he said and recall previous occurrences, it's not about fairness or keeping score. It's about wondering whether I can trust him, whether there is a pattern of selfish behaviour or other red flags. Possibly I am too hyper-vigilant against being used or being tricked by a clever abusive man. I don't know.

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Why not just walk away if someone is this insensitive?

Because he's not normally like that, so I will give him the chance to make amends and prove that he cares enough to address the issues

[ExpatInItaly]

5 hours ago, Kyra said:

Because he's not normally like that

I'm a little confused, because you opened the thread with this:
 

On 6/2/2021 at 6:33 AM, Kyra said:

the more time I have to remember all the other times he did me wrong.

This looks as though you have perhaps minimized other times he's hurt you, maybe because you don't want to see that this relationship isn't as wonderful as you're trying to convince yourself. 

[Wiseman2]

6 hours ago, Kyra said:

Possibly I am too hyper-vigilant against being used or being tricked by a clever abusive man.

Ok, try not to date until you can clear that up whether it's holding grudges from him or others.

[DKT3]

What I'm getting from what you've wrote is he says something then you (with all your baggage from past relationships) hear something different.  You then jump off the deep end and get upset because he doesn't really engage with you while you're doing this.

You can never have a successful relationship while you are projecting past issues on current partners.

[Lotsgoingon]

I want him to say "let's talk" and for him to want to hear my side and to apologize and make more effort to not hurt me, but I don't think that's going to happen because from his last text (& some history) he clearly thinks that he's done nothing wrong, it's all in my head or made up by me for the sake of creating drama, and that I am to blame for hurting him and ruining the relationship.

First step is for you to clear up your own thinking. There is so much wrong in the passage above. The first thing wrong is that you are reverting to child mode ,victim-powerless mode. What kids want, when mommy gets mad at us for something when we think we haven't really done anything really bad, is for mommy to come to us and say, "I'm sorry baby. I was wrong. You're good. You didn't do anything wrong."

That's kid thinking.

You're an adult. An adult realizes people are different and you are not going to be rescued by your partner as a mommy might rescue a kid. Kids need to fantasize about mommy's forgiveness because kids don't quite have the strength and individuality (independence) to judge their own actions. An adult can say, "I'm right on this one. I'm unhappy. The other person over-reacted." And stand by that position, without all kinds of guilt and fear.

You need to step into adult mode. BTW: my words aren't as insulting as they might sound because most of us revert to kid-like thinking in intimate relationships, especially during serious conflict in intimate relationships.  So, you're in big company, but you don't want to be stuck in that company. 

Time to really get clear. And you need to flip your thinking here. You need to think in multiple and sophisticated ways if you want to resolve this. First of all, get clear on the insult or why you are angry with him.  And why you feel hurt by him. Don't try to understand him at this step. Get clear on you and your feelings. The next step is then think about what insecurities you have that your man's actions triggered. 

Conflict isn't just our partner does something we don't like. The deeper conflict is that our partner does something we don't like that TRIGGERS a strong, often over-the-top response from us.  What insecurity or wound is your bf's behavior triggering? The next step is to do the same thinking about your bf. What in him (what set of insecurities and wounds) is triggered by your actions?  Now this is a longer-term work that takes time.

The immediate step is to be an adult. Step up and initiate a conversation and be clear about what you want. To set the stage for some openness of his part, you start off announcing what you really like about the relationship and about him. Get very specific. Someone has to take the initiative to get both of you out of defensive mode. It's nearly impossible for couples to have a constructive conflict-discussion when each person is defensive. One of you has to lead here. In great couples, both people alternately step up to lead the pair out of defensive positions. 

Expecting him to come begging back is to expect the fairy godmother to oversee your relationship. It is equally wrong for you to apologize without first stating what you want and what you really need in the relationship. That's being a kid apologizing to mom not because the kid really thinks they did something wrong, but because the kid is simply overwhelmed by guilt and fear at the prospect of their protector being angry at them.

So I'll give you a first practical step. GET OUT of this conflict. Every couple has a pattern of conflict. How does this recent blowup fit into a broader pattern? Nail that down. You want to have a discussion about that pattern. Trust me, 90 percent of your previous conflicts follow the pattern. 

BTW: you can go back apologizing, but the pattern is only going to continue and each time the pattern repeats the weaker and weaker the relationship becomes.  With blowup the anger on both of your parts and the hurt only increases. Figure out the pattern and address that. Find YOUR role in the conflict. Sounds like this hyper-vigilance could be a factor. That does not help ANY relationship. Just doesn't. But if it's there, he needs to know it's there and learn how to work around that ... and you need to practice being aware of how that is interfering with the bond with him. 

Of course, your man could just be a jerk. In which case, you need to just break up. Or you guys simply might not have the skills to offset each other's triggers. 

 

 

 

Edited June 9, 2021 by Lotsgoingon

[Kyra]

2 hours ago, Lotsgoingon said:

I want him to say "let's talk" and for him to want to hear my side and to apologize and make more effort to not hurt me, but I don't think that's going to happen because from his last text (& some history) he clearly thinks that he's done nothing wrong, it's all in my head or made up by me for the sake of creating drama, and that I am to blame for hurting him and ruining the relationship.

First step is for you to clear up your own thinking. There is so much wrong in the passage above. The first thing wrong is that you are reverting to child mode ,victim-powerless mode. What kids want, when mommy gets mad at us for something when we think we haven't really done anything really bad, is for mommy to come to us and say, "I'm sorry baby. I was wrong. You're good. You didn't do anything wrong."

That's kid thinking.

You're an adult. An adult realizes people are different and you are not going to be rescued by your partner as a mommy might rescue a kid. Kids need to fantasize about mommy's forgiveness because kids don't quite have the strength and individuality (independence) to judge their own actions. An adult can say, "I'm right on this one. I'm unhappy. The other person over-reacted." And stand by that position, without all kinds of guilt and fear.

You need to step into adult mode. BTW: my words aren't as insulting as they might sound because most of us revert to kid-like thinking in intimate relationships, especially during serious conflict in intimate relationships.  So, you're in big company, but you don't want to be stuck in that company. 

Time to really get clear. And you need to flip your thinking here. You need to think in multiple and sophisticated ways if you want to resolve this. First of all, get clear on the insult or why you are angry with him.  And why you feel hurt by him. Don't try to understand him at this step. Get clear on you and your feelings. The next step is then think about what insecurities you have that your man's actions triggered. 

The immediate step is to be an adult. Step up and initiate a conversation and be clear about what you want. To set the stage for some openness of his part, you start off announcing what you really like about the relationship and about him. Get very specific. Someone has to take the initiative to get both of you out of defensive mode. It's nearly impossible for couples to have a constructive conflict-discussion when each person is defensive. One of you has to lead here. In great couples, both people alternately step up to lead the pair out of defensive positions. 

I don't really understand why it's childish to want or expect your partner to understand how they hurt you, apologize and make amends. The alternatives are I just dump him after a fight without allowing any attempt to reconcile or I just allow him to treat me badly and accept it. Those two options are not what I'd call mature, adult responses.

But perhaps you misunderstood me. I'm not sulking. Multiple times I have initiated contact and been clear about what I want. It's also very clear to me why I am hurt. My point about wanting him to agree to talk, hear my side and to apologize and make more effort to not hurt me, is that, if he can't do that then he doesn't value me enough and I will end this relationship. It's not childish to expect your partner to treat you with consideration and respect and that includes addressing what they have done wrong.

[Lotsgoingon]

What's kid-like (I didn't say childish ... because "childish" is more dismissive--and like I said--we all act kid-like at some point) ... is that you want him to apologize. In real world conflicts, that rarely happens. Especially in a relationship where the "offenses" are really subjective and where couples have dynamics, meaning how one partner acts can affect how the other partner acts. 

Heck criminals don't apologize when they violently victimize people (only a few apologize and usually that's years later when they've been a decade or more in jail). 'Expecting him to apologize can put you in an unnecessary position of powerlessness.

If you really don't like how he behaves, then logically you would draw a line and say certain behavior is unacceptable and break up with him if he doesn't change. That's giving YOU power. 

Yes, there are some people in love who have the capacity to apologize, but you should probably know by now whether your partner is that kind of person. He should have already displayed that capacity. 

And yes, I agree: it's not childish or kidlike to expect a partner to treat us well. That expectation is fantastic!

What's childlike is imagining and fantasizing that our will on their own recognize when they treat us badly without us getting in their faces or without us taking some real initiative to tell them why you're hurt and mapping out a path by which they can avoid hurting us--especially when our partner has NOT displayed that capacity. It takes a ton of maturity and humility and self-awareness to apologize. Huge amounts.

We get in trouble expecting that of a partner who simply doesn't have that skillset. And if they don't have that skillset, then we have to be willing to take the initiative. Hiding from taking that initiative puts us in an unnecessary position of powerlessness, as if we are in relationship with a supervisor. 

 

Edited June 9, 2021 by Lotsgoingon