Husband sees massage therapist and lusts after my niece

[Floresnodolores]

By looking through my husband’s messages I found close ups of my 28 year old niece’s back side.  He forwarded to his friend. They commented “what an ass”.   My niece lived with us for four years, she doesn’t anymore.  At 9 years old she was a jr. bridesmaid at our wedding.  We’ve taken her camping and slept in the same tent as a child.  She doesn’t live with us anymore however the texts also said “I think I should be able to do her since I’m supporting her”. This is not all I also found out he visits those happy ending massage places.  We have a 12 year old daughter.  I’d hate to put her through the stress of a divorce but I’m breaking inside. Also I’m 46, he’s 67.  Also he’s wealthy, worth about 100 million and I signed a prenup that would leave me penniless (I was proving my love).  I’ve been with him since I was 28 the same age my niece is now.  Ironic.  I gave this man the best years of my life.  What would you do?

[stillafool]

3 minutes ago, Floresnodolores said:

 What would you do?

Well if I was married to a man with 100 million, a prenup and found out he's a pig, I would start stacking cash in my own private bank account, go back to school in order to get a good job, secure an apartment and file for divorce.  You are still entitled to child support.  You should get quite a bit since your child is used to a high standard of living.  What did  your husband say when you confronted him with this info?

[Floresnodolores]

I haven’t confronted him.  I’m waiting to speak to an attorney.  I’m trying to get my ducks in a row.  

Edited June 6, 2021 by Floresnodolores

[Floresnodolores]

31 minutes ago, stillafool said:

Well if I was married to a man with 100 million, a prenup and found out he's a pig, I would start stacking cash in my own private bank account, go back to school in order to get a good job, secure an apartment and file for divorce.  You are still entitled to child support.  You should get quite a bit since your child is used to a high standard of living.  What did  your husband say when you confronted him with this info?

I didn’t yet.  I’m looking for advice and to speak to an attorney.

 

 

[Wiseman2]

27 minutes ago, Floresnodolores said:

I haven’t confronted him.  I’m waiting to speak to an attorney.  I’m trying to get my ducks in a row.  

Absolutely speak to an attorney and get your ducks in a row.

Does he have (other) signs of early dementia besides inappropriateness?

Why bother confronting him? He'll deny it or rationalize it.

Do not threaten divorce. Just get your ducks in a row. 

[LivingWaterPlease]

I am so sorry you're going through this! Surely the law makes some type of allowance for a long term marriage in which a pre nup has been signed. Definitely check with an attorney as soon as possible. Do you have access to any type of checking/savings account or an allowance?

[Floresnodolores]

2 hours ago, LivingWaterPlease said:

I am so sorry you're going through this! Surely the law makes some type of allowance for a long term marriage in which a pre nup has been signed. Definitely check with an attorney as soon as possible. Do you have access to any type of checking/savings account or an allowance?

No, I don’t have access to anything unfortunately.  Thank you for the advice.

[LivingWaterPlease]

I am so sorry that after all of this time you have no access to cash of your own. Reading that makes me sad. When I was married I was in a similar situation (though he didn't have as much money as your H does) and I would save money from the small amount of grocery allowance he gave me, just so I could have my own stash. It added up after some time and I began to buy stock with it. Little bits here and there.

[basil67]

Pre-nups can be overturned if they are deemed to be unfair, and yours sounds unfair.   

When you signed the prenup, your husband would have had a lawyer and you would have had a different lawyer representing you.  Did your lawyer at the time advise you that the prenup was fair and equitable?  

[Blind-Sided]

4 hours ago, basil67 said:

Pre-nups can be overturned if they are deemed to be unfair, and yours sounds unfair.   

It depends where she lives. And lets face it... the majority of prenups are one sided and unfair. (for wealthy people)  But the bigger issue is... if he is worth that much... he can hire VERY powerful lawyers. And if a lower court trys to overturn a contract, he can appeal the ruling. At that point... a strategy could simply be to hold it in court until our OP is totally bankrupt, and can no longer defend.  I know that sucks... and is cruel... but that's how it would work. 

OP... I think you need to talk with a lawyer, and try to put some money aside.  OR... go back to school now, and get yourself ready.  Because of the prenup, and his power... it's going to be a rough and long road. 

[BaileyB]

19 hours ago, Floresnodolores said:

I’d hate to put her through the stress of a divorce but I’m breaking inside.

Better divorce than have her father send photos of her backside to his friends. Or worse. 

[Floresnodolores]

7 hours ago, basil67 said:

Pre-nups can be overturned if they are deemed to be unfair, and yours sounds unfair.   

When you signed the prenup, your husband would have had a lawyer and you would have had a different lawyer representing you.  Did your lawyer at the time advise you that the prenup was fair and equitable?  

Yes.  I was stupid.  My attorney advised against signing it.  He suggested changes but my H threw an intimidating fit.  I said he didn’t need to worry I wasn’t after his money and I would sign “as is”.  I remember thinking how humiliating it would be to back out since I had already sent out all the invitations.  My attorney even made me sign a letter that said I was signing the Pre-nup against his advice, etc.  Again, I was and probably still am, so stupid.  

[Floresnodolores]

2 hours ago, Blind-Sided said:

It depends where she lives. And lets face it... the majority of prenups are one sided and unfair. (for wealthy people)  But the bigger issue is... if he is worth that much... he can hire VERY powerful lawyers. And if a lower court trys to overturn a contract, he can appeal the ruling. At that point... a strategy could simply be to hold it in court until our OP is totally bankrupt, and can no longer defend.  I know that sucks... and is cruel... but that's how it would work. 

OP... I think you need to talk with a lawyer, and try to put some money aside.  OR... go back to school now, and get yourself ready.  Because of the prenup, and his power... it's going to be a rough and long road. 

I thank you for your advice.  It’s hard for me to think straight and having clear headed opinions really helps.

[stillafool]

But she's still entitled to a healthy allowance for child support.  The CS with a job can get you out of there soon.  Talk to your attorney, like yesterday.

[Blind-Sided]

1 hour ago, stillafool said:

But she's still entitled to a healthy allowance for child support.  The CS with a job can get you out of there soon.  Talk to your attorney, like yesterday.

maybe?  Possibly?  I hate to say it... but the rules can change for the wealthy.  I've known people who would rather spend $100,000 defending a $100 judgment, just because they can. (because of spite)  I know of a CEO of a large company who is like that.   Heck... I've worked with one CEO/President that was angry with the local bus company because they wouldn't run shuttles from the airport to his property... so he bought the bus company, fired everyone... and re sold it.  

Yes... I'm sure if he is at least human, he will want to take care of the kid.  But he could set up a trust that is watched over, and no money will go to our OP.  OR... it may be spelled out in the prenup that he gets custody if the mother leaves.  OR...... who knows what one-sided... border line illegal thing it could be.  BUT, the reality is... unless she has the money for a GOOD lawyer who is good picking apart a prenup, she signed it, and he holds the power.  This is not a normal situation.

The thing is... this is all speculation at this point since we don't know exactly what is in the prenup.

OP... I'm very sorry you are in this situation. 

Edited June 7, 2021 by Blind-Sided

[stillafool]

At the age of 12 can you choose which parent you want to live with?

[Blind-Sided]

3 minutes ago, stillafool said:

At the age of 12 can you choose which parent you want to live with?

Depends where they live.   Where I'm at (PA USA)... there is no age a kid can chose.  Every place is different.

Edited June 7, 2021 by Blind-Sided

[mark clemson]

All the below would need to be confirmed with a lawyer in your jurisdiction:

Generally a pre-nup won't supersede state laws and there are some areas where they are (depending on the intent) essentially a waste of time. That varies a LOT by jurisdiction and there are some where they have a lot of "teeth". Creating the ability to drag out court motions beyond your ability to pay for them (if it came to that) as noted above may have been the primary intent all along.

If your husband puts money in an account with your name on it (even both your names, I believe) it should "change the nature" of the money and make it at least half yours, despite what a pre-nup may say about assets that are purely his. Also you would have the power to move it around (although you might need to give half of it back at some point) or simply move only 1/2 of it and keep documentation of the full amount that was in the account.

You could ask that he put money into a joint account so you would be able to "take care of things" should he become hospitalized or incapacitated. Else it could be a real hassle to constantly prove to banks that you are his wife to e.g. pay for hospital bills, college tuition for your kid, or other necessary actions. At 67 this is a real potential issue. There will be a need to show "proof" that you are legitimately acting on his behalf. In the event of his death, people could hold money up in court by suing his estate/trust, etc, etc.

So there are legitimate reasons to request this. You could probably research some news articles on the internet about how "rich widows/widowers" got screwed in various ways by the legal system and had to go through a lot of hassles and distress to bolster your case. Hopefully with $100M floating around, popping e.g.  $2M into a joint account to protect you and your daughter and make your lives easier in the event of unforeseen circumstances isn't crazy. I would let him determine the amount he thinks is appropriate.

This would imply you are staying together. However IF you choose to divorce later on then that money becomes 1/2 yours (or should in theory) and you could consider moving it into an account with only your name on it, e.g. by writing a check, and then using it e.g. to fund court costs for a divorce and possibly even fight the pre-nup if that was something you truly felt was appropriate and sensible.

Last word of advice is to use your head around the lawyers. Even a good and ultimately decent lawyer likes to get paid more and the fact there's 50M theoretically in play might get them a bit too "interested". My personal belief is that many lawyers, including divorce lawyers, find (sometimes fairly subtle) ways to antagonize the parties involved, making them more willing to spend money on letters, not-strictly-necessary legal motions, etc, all of which the lawyers get paid for. The common practice of being served at work is IMO an example of this as it embarrasses you in front of one of your most important social groups. Your husband will likely be pissy enough if you file for divorce, so consider if there are ways to keep antagonizing him to a minimum.

[Lotsgoingon]

Grab a copy of the prenup and head to a divorce attorney.

You need an exact copy of the language of the prenup. The attorney will scrutinize (as attorneys do) every letter in the prenup to see where you might have an angle to get some money in divorce. Even if there is no such angle, sometimes suits can result in a settlement with a better divorce agreement than if you didn't suit.

I'm sorry but you cannot hide behind "I don't want to put my daughter through the stress of a divorce." Oh, so you're willing to put her through the stress of a possible predator living in the same house as her?! And look, it's possible your daughter already feels some strange vibes from her father. 

At the very least, your husband committed a horrible invasion of your niece's life ...a betrayal ...  totally indecent, treating her like a piece of meat. Heck, even guys who are pigs can hit the pause button for their own family members. 

Oh get a copy of that photo by the way ... or forward it somehow to yourself ... and get a copy of those messages he sent to his friend (about the niece). Great weapons to use in a divorce settlement--even with a prenup. He wouldn't want THAT info coming out.

 

 

 

 

[basil67]

7 hours ago, Floresnodolores said:

Yes.  I was stupid.  My attorney advised against signing it.  He suggested changes but my H threw an intimidating fit.  I said he didn’t need to worry I wasn’t after his money and I would sign “as is”.  I remember thinking how humiliating it would be to back out since I had already sent out all the invitations.  My attorney even made me sign a letter that said I was signing the Pre-nup against his advice, etc.  Again, I was and probably still am, so stupid.  

So, now it's time for you to go back to a lawyer and see if it can be overturned.   As I said, courts (at least where I live) will overturn an unfair prenup. 

[Taramere]

9 hours ago, Floresnodolores said:

Yes.  I was stupid.  My attorney advised against signing it.  He suggested changes but my H threw an intimidating fit.  I said he didn’t need to worry I wasn’t after his money and I would sign “as is”.  I remember thinking how humiliating it would be to back out since I had already sent out all the invitations.  My attorney even made me sign a letter that said I was signing the Pre-nup against his advice, etc.  Again, I was and probably still am, so stupid.  

If he's worth $100 million, you've been married almost 20 years and the prenup would leave you penniless then that is very manifestly an unconscionable agreement.  I wouldn't normally want to make an assertion like that quite so boldly, but this is an extreme example.  I'd agree with Lotsgoingon that the likelihood is that you'll agree a settlement rather than have this going all the way through court.  But if your husband is belligerent and insistent on dragging it through court, I doubt you'll struggle to find a high powered family lawyer willing to work on a contigency basis.   You're never going to get anything close to 50% of his fortune, so don't go getting your hopes up on that score...but a court isn't going to let him walk away with $100 million while you walk away destitute.

[MsJayne]

His inappropriate messages are most likely just him trying to assert his virility among his equally creepy associates, a sick joke among dirty-minded old sexist farts. The massages, well, some guys go for the happy ending because they feel it's not being unfaithful, just some light relief. Do you still have a sex life together? If not, I don't think the happy endings are so bad considering his wealth and what he could be doing. At least he's not likely to bring some disease home. But, if you do have a sex life, it's obviously very hurtful that he would do that.  Can I ask how you found out about the massages?  

[dramafreezone]

How much would you stand to receive in child support?

From perusing circumstances that would invalidate a prenuptial agreement, it seems as if receiving child support would be sufficient enough means to not render you destitute.

If I were in your place and were set on getting a divorce my priority would be making sure that I could live on my own and keep this as brief an ordeal as possible.  From my layman legal opinion it seems like overturning the PNA would be an uphill battle and would be costly (if you're already lacking in finances).  The terms were reviewed with you and your lawyer, your lawyer advised against signing it and you acknowledged that you were signing it against his advice.

Edited June 8, 2021 by dramafreezone

[Taramere]

1 hour ago, dramafreezone said:

 

From perusing circumstances that would invalidate a prenuptial agreement, it seems as if receiving child support would be sufficient enough means to not render you destitute.

If I were in your place and were set on getting a divorce my priority would be making sure that I could live on my own and keep this as brief an ordeal as possible.  From my layman legal opinion it seems like overturning the PNA would be an uphill battle and would be costly (if you're already lacking in finances).  The terms were reviewed with you and your lawyer, your lawyer advised against signing it and you acknowledged that you were signing it against his advice.

As far as her the acknowledgement she signed (declining to follow her lawyer's advice) goes - that would simply be a disclaimer the lawyer would require her to sign to protect themselves from being sued at a later date.  

Generalised advice on the internet about prenuptial agreements won't necessarily be instructive when it comes to a situation as unusual as this one.  Generally in the agreements you're reading about, there will be some reasonable amount of provision made for the dependent party.   It's downright bizarre, one sided and very unloving sounding for somebody worth $100 million to instruct their lawyer to make absolutely no provision for their partner in the event of a divorce.   I don't understand why anybody would agree to sign such a thing.   There's enormous disparity here, added to the fact that they have been married for almost 20 years.

But besides all of that, she needs to consult with a family lawyer because it may well be that despite what she thinks, the prenup does not in fact leave her penniless.  Presumably, given her husband's wealth, a significant amount of funds have accrued in the course of the marriage.  She needs to take proper advice on this from a family lawyer.  Given the funds at stake here and the lack of information about what the prenup actually states, it would be completely ludicrous for her to make a decision, based on the advice she gets on here, that she's not going to bother consulting an experienced, knowledgeable family lawyer in her area.

Edited June 8, 2021 by Taramere

[dramafreezone]

33 minutes ago, Taramere said:

As far as her the acknowledgement she signed (declining to follow her lawyer's advice) goes - that would simply be a disclaimer the lawyer would require her to sign to protect themselves from being sued at a later date.  

Generalised advice on the internet about prenuptial agreements won't necessarily be instructive when it comes to a situation as unusual as this one.  Generally in the agreements you're reading about, there will be some reasonable amount of provision made for the dependent party.   It's downright bizarre, one sided and very unloving sounding for somebody worth $100 million to instruct their lawyer to make absolutely no provision for their partner in the event of a divorce.   I don't understand why anybody would agree to sign such a thing.   There's enormous disparity here, added to the fact that they have been married for almost 20 years.

But besides all of that, she needs to consult with a family lawyer because it may well be that despite what she thinks, the prenup does not in fact leave her penniless.  Presumably, given her husband's wealth, a significant amount of funds have accrued in the course of the marriage.  She needs to take proper advice on this from a family lawyer.  Given the funds at stake here and the lack of information about what the prenup actually states, it would be completely ludicrous for her to make a decision, based on the advice she gets on here, that she's not going to bother consulting an experienced, knowledgeable family lawyer in her area.

A PNA is not about love, it's a business agreement. 

Of course I would recommend that she consult a lawyer, except for I would not go with a family lawyer.  I would recommend outside counsel, one skilled in interpreting prenuptial agreements.  A family lawyer may not even have such expertise.  Just like physicians, lawyers have different areas of expertise; one wouldn't go to an OB/GYN if they had a heart ailment.

She would benefit most from dispassionate counsel that will be able to outline pros and cons to challenging her husband in court.  Most lawyers will provide a free consultation.  Family is too close to everything to give a balanced, neutral legal opinion.

Edited June 8, 2021 by dramafreezone