**hurting, broken and lost - how to move on?**

[HadMeOverABarrel]

5 hours ago, BiancaSW said:

 

she said he did nothing wrong by cheating - it was me who was a “sexual predator” and almost “making her husband to engage in activities with me by manipulating him”.

I was thinking while reading some more of your posts that this guy is very weak. It comes through as his wife is his mommy and he was looking to you to rescue him from mean mommy. I'm not sure if that was pure manipulation on his part, or if he is genuinely so weak.

Well, now mommy has to 'protect her wittle man' from predator you (as per your quoted post here). I can see how you got sucked into this thinking he was a victim that needed saving...but it's his job to save himself if that's even what he needs.

Your questions about what was in this for him is part of your natural healing process. The answers may come with time once you've healed and been able to reflect on this. 

In any case, this guy seems pretty weak and that does not make for a good long-term partner. I'm getting a vibe from you that says maybe you should do animal rescues or child advocacy (maybe volunteer some spare time).

Possibly you enjoyed feeling you were nurturing this guy, and that energy will be better applied elsewhere. Probably also give some of that nurturing to yourself. I think if you put your nurturing energy into yourself and vulnerable (animals/kids), you may heal a bit quicker from this experience. Just a thought. 

[stillafool]

2 hours ago, BiancaSW said:

She would hit me where it hurts the most - I have a disability and she subscribed me for services for disabled and made companies to call me. it was horrendous. I still don’t understand why he would tell her these things about me. he also told her my home address so she made sure she ordered me wheelchair catalogues. it was awful - to describe what happened I need a whole new thread on this website. 

Unfortunately this is just one of the consequences of getting involved with someone else's husband or wife.  You have no idea how the betrayed spouse is going to react once they find out.  Some women/men come looking for you to do physical harm.  Believe it or not this could have been much worse than her just yelling and calling you names.  Everything she said to you was told to her by him to keep her.  He told her you threw yourself at him she didn't just make that up.  He probably offered to quit his job to save the marriage.  All of this is common in affairs when the spouse finds out.  When you think back on your actions imagine how unrealistic is was to make plans with a man who is already married.  I'm sure you know now to never get involved with a MM no matter what he tells you.

[stillafool]

1 hour ago, BiancaSW said:

well I am not sure to be honest. If he was a happy family man he would not be willing to build a relationship with someone else and not asking a new person to be a part of his life. I never looked at any other guy while being with him, it felt strange to even be physical with someone else...

as for the pictures - they are very much recent, showing the happy family. I don’t know what is going on there but he certainly does not look like a victim. He is very much enjoying himself by the looks of things. As for what happens behind the closed doors - who knows...

He was never planning to build a relationship with you other than what you were two were doing.  It was all a fantasy on his part.  He isn't looking like a victim because he never was.

[Starswillshine]

The "he must be unhappy since he engaged in an affair" thinking is a defensive mechanism for society at large. In an affair setting, it serves the OW/OM in convincing themselves that this would be a healthy relationship if it were to ever be a legit relationship out in the open because if he is happy, he will not cheat. That the AP can give the MP everything he/she needs and thus he/she will never have to look elsewhere. This type of thinking is common in many situations, it gives outsiders a bit of feeling that they can control situations. If I do y, then x will not happen to me. People do not like to feel like they do not have control, thus they sort of shift the blame to some actions that the victims have done. The wife must be horrible, etc. etc. 

The problem with this thinking in an affair setting, especially with MM, is that they are not looking to get out of what they have (sure, some are, but most of the men are not), they are just looking for addition to and usually something different. 

[stillafool]

1 hour ago, BiancaSW said:

He did that before me - for example during someone’s retirement party he engaged with that retiring woman in a certain activity at the back of the taxi with other colleagues watching. everyone knew about it, she did not. he was getting busy with females for years when out of her sight.

And you still wanted this MM after knowing all of this?  You need to fix your picker.

[HadMeOverABarrel]

13 minutes ago, Starswillshine said:

People do not like to feel like they do not have control, thus they sort of shift the blame

This is insightful and accurate. Not to tj, but my beloved little dog who's been my constant companion for 14 years is dying. 

The pain is immense and I have no control over what is imminent. I have been blaming x, y, z and even myself. I cognitively recognize my blaming thoughts are irrational--some would sound just crazy if others could hear my thoughts. But in my distress, it's where my mind goes.

So it is for many posters here who are grappling with loss. The pain can be too overwhelming for body and mind at times. 

Great insight, Starswillshine!

[BiancaSW]

2 hours ago, HadMeOverABarrel said:

I was thinking while reading some more of your posts that this guy is very weak. It comes through as his wife is his mommy and he was looking to you to rescue him from mean mommy. I'm not sure if that was pure manipulation on his part, or if he is genuinely so weak.

Well, now mommy has to 'protect her wittle man' from predator you (as per your quoted post here). I can see how you got sucked into this thinking he was a victim that needed saving...but it's his job to save himself if that's even what he needs.

Your questions about what was in this for him is part of your natural healing process. The answers may come with time once you've healed and been able to reflect on this. 

In any case, this guy seems pretty weak and that does not make for a good long-term partner. I'm getting a vibe from you that says maybe you should do animal rescues or child advocacy (maybe volunteer some spare time).

Possibly you enjoyed feeling you were nurturing this guy, and that energy will be better applied elsewhere. Probably also give some of that nurturing to yourself. I think if you put your nurturing energy into yourself and vulnerable (animals/kids), you may heal a bit quicker from this experience. Just a thought. 

thank you very much for your comment, yes, you are completely right on the points you have raised.

he did have some issues while growing up - from what he told me he had amazing strong mum who encouraged him getting into a career she was also a part of. but she had health and other issues and he lost her being quite young. his mum was his rock and every time he spoke of her he cried. my heart was breaking when I listened to him speaking of her, and I think that would be the wound that never heals. he offered to take me to his mums grave which made me trust him so much as it was such a genuine thing he shared.

i suppose he sees his wife as a mummy figure, scared to be caught and told off. As I said I have never met the lady and I don’t know their internal family dynamics, but he would always look like he is grounded whenever they would have a fight. I guess him moving away from his wife would be the same as cutting connections with his mum?

when he offered to get a divorce from her one of the conditions was for me to be his rock and his shoulder, a shoulder to cry on. I loved him unconditionally so of course I would be there for him. I could not stand his tears and I could not see him crying. When he would cry - my heart was tearing apart into pieces. I would always put him first when we were together, and that was one of many mistakes I have made.

Some of the friends were saying he is a weak and cowardly man, and I think too high of him. But I saw that genuine side and I thought he is just so sensitive and caring. He always took things close to heart and I know how much he cared about everyone and doing things for other people - friends, family, colleagues, people who didn’t care for him that much......basically everyone but me.

Edited June 14, 2021 by BiancaSW

[BiancaSW]

1 hour ago, stillafool said:

He was never planning to build a relationship with you other than what you were two were doing.  It was all a fantasy on his part.  He isn't looking like a victim because he never was.

yes that’s also true. That’s a fantasy that ended badly. I raised that issue with him numerous times - and he said he is not his wife’s property and he can do what he wants but I should not be pushing him for any decisions and just give him time as he has more to lose than me and he has kids as well. And he would divorce his wife and sell the house had it not been for his kids. He was crying saying he can’t think of being apart from them, not sleeping next door. I said if he can’t think of that why to continue with me? he should stay with his kids and obviously his wife.

He said he needs this, he needs me, he needs relationship and needs a chance from me.

[BiancaSW]

1 hour ago, Starswillshine said:

The "he must be unhappy since he engaged in an affair" thinking is a defensive mechanism for society at large. In an affair setting, it serves the OW/OM in convincing themselves that this would be a healthy relationship if it were to ever be a legit relationship out in the open because if he is happy, he will not cheat. That the AP can give the MP everything he/she needs and thus he/she will never have to look elsewhere. This type of thinking is common in many situations, it gives outsiders a bit of feeling that they can control situations. If I do y, then x will not happen to me. People do not like to feel like they do not have control, thus they sort of shift the blame to some actions that the victims have done. The wife must be horrible, etc. etc. 

The problem with this thinking in an affair setting, especially with MM, is that they are not looking to get out of what they have (sure, some are, but most of the men are not), they are just looking for addition to and usually something different. 

well I have raised these points with him and asked he wants to be friends with benefits and if he never plans to leave his family. I would not engage into friends with benefits. He got upset and said I am thinking of him as some sort of a lowlife who is looking for thrills, whereas he wants to build something and thinks we can work out - I just need to chill and give him time.

[BaileyB]

20 minutes ago, BiancaSW said:

when he offered to get a divorce from her one of the conditions was for me to be his rock and his shoulder, a shoulder to cry on. I loved him unconditionally so of course I would be there for him. I could not stand his tears and I could not see him crying. When he would cry - my heart was tearing apart into pieces. I would always put him first when we were together

You really need to think about this codependent tendency. As has been said, he is a weak man who is looking first to his wife, and second to you, to direct his life. He is responsible for himself. If he has issues from childhood, he needs to deal with them lest he find himself in a marriage with a “mommy figure” and seeking the affection of other women. Gently, the fact that you allowed him to lean on you in this way and say yourself as his saviour speaks to your caregiving nature but also a lack of healthy boundaries in a relationship. That seems to be a theme in your story. 

[BaileyB]

10 minutes ago, BiancaSW said:

he wants to build something

He is not able to build something with you - he has already built something with another woman and until/unless he has signed divorce papers, he is committed to that relationship. Anything else he discussed or dreamed with you is pure fantasy. 

And no, you don’t want to be friends with benefits with a married man. Affair partner is the appropriate name for that situation. And, as you have discover by his wife’s response to the discovery of your affair - it’s not an option. Thinking it could be anything different is more magical thinking - 

[BiancaSW]

22 minutes ago, BaileyB said:

You really need to think about this codependent tendency. As has been said, he is a weak man who is looking first to his wife, and second to you, to direct his life. He is responsible for himself. If he has issues from childhood, he needs to deal with them lest he find himself in a marriage with a “mommy figure” and seeking the affection of other women. Gently, the fact that you allowed him to lean on you in this way and say yourself as his saviour speaks to your caregiving nature but also a lack of healthy boundaries in a relationship. That seems to be a theme in your story. 

A couple of months before the truth unwrapped I found myself in a situation when I missed my period. I mentioned that to him and he became really scared, which I was not surprised about. 

I said that’s probably nothing and I will wait couple of days and do the test and I don’t expect it to be anything. He started shouting at me saying I want to screw up his life and he will lose everything he has. I asked if we planning to build things with me - what does it change, if that’s what life throws at us. He knew how much I wanted a child but he said the time is not right and he wants me to terminate. He said he should divorce first, then we would move in together and then when the finance is in place plan for a baby. 

He was pushing me towards that, crying, vomiting, saying I screwing up his life. I said if it will prove to be the case after I will do the test - I will want no obligations from him. We had a couple of days of silence alternating with him trying to convince me to terminate if it’s positive.

him and his wife were trying to conceive for more than a decade as he said she had a problem and he said his kids are his awards and his prized possessions.

couple days later he comes back to me and says that he wants me regardless and kid or no kid - it will not define our rship, if we are meant to be together we will be but he is a great dad and he will never leave a child and he will move away from his wife and help me out because he wants to and because he wants me.

shortly after i have done the test, I offered him to meet and after we sat down I stated I have done the test on the day and it’s a negative and he is free to go. I said I respect he is a man who would take on a responsibility but I don’t want to lead him on.

And now we are clear on things I want him to leave my life. He begged me to stay, asked to spend Xmas with his children and then start making big decision like sitting and talking with his wife. He said he doesn’t want to stay in my place, he would move to his dads first and then start seeing me properly and once we grow strong he would move in with me and introduced me to the kids.

 

[BiancaSW]

2 minutes ago, BiancaSW said:

A couple of months before the truth unwrapped I found myself in a situation when I missed my period. I mentioned that to him and he became really scared, which I was not surprised about. 

I said that’s probably nothing and I will wait couple of days and do the test and I don’t expect it to be anything. He started shouting at me saying I want to screw up his life and he will lose everything he has. I asked if we planning to build things with me - what does it change, if that’s what life throws at us. He knew how much I wanted a child but he said the time is not right and he wants me to terminate. He said he should divorce first, then we would move in together and then when the finance is in place plan for a baby. 

He was pushing me towards that, crying, vomiting, saying I screwing up his life. I said if it will prove to be the case after I will do the test - I will want no obligations from him. We had a couple of days of silence alternating with him trying to convince me to terminate if it’s positive.

him and his wife were trying to conceive for more than a decade as he said she had a problem and he said his kids are his awards and his prized possessions.

couple days later he comes back to me and says that he wants me regardless and kid or no kid - it will not define our rship, if we are meant to be together we will be but he is a great dad and he will never leave a child and he will move away from his wife and help me out because he wants to and because he wants me.

shortly after i have done the test, I offered him to meet and after we sat down I stated I have done the test on the day and it’s a negative and he is free to go. I said I respect he is a man who would take on a responsibility but I don’t want to lead him on.

And now we are clear on things I want him to leave my life. He begged me to stay, asked to spend Xmas with his children and then start making big decision like sitting and talking with his wife. He said he doesn’t want to stay in my place, he would move to his dads first and then start seeing me properly and once we grow strong he would move in with me and introduced me to the kids.

 

situation was bad enough as it was but it seemed to me he handled it with dignity and it made me to respect him and believe what he says.

[BiancaSW]

So what confuses me so much how that great guy was so truthful and honest and sensitive could turn around and throw me under the bus? He could have carried out the whole breakup process with dignity leaving it between himself and his wife. But he chose to expose me and blame. I was so shocked I could hardly recognise him - a different person! I know things go differently in affairs - but I never uncovered it to his wife, I never compromised him in any way - I always wanted him to decide and I treated him with so much love. Why did he do that ? The outcome could still be the same - why to hurt me so much?? 

[BaileyB]

4 minutes ago, BiancaSW said:

it seemed to me he handled it with dignity and it made me to respect him

 

8 minutes ago, BiancaSW said:

He started shouting at me saying I want to screw up his life and he will lose everything he has. He said the time is not right and he wants me to terminate. He was pushing me towards that, crying, vomiting, saying I screwing up his life. We had a couple of days of silence alternating with him trying to convince me to terminate if it’s positive.

How exactly did he handle this situation with dignity? 

It seems to me that his intentions were pretty clear - he was primarily concerned with himself and how an unplanned pregnancy would affect his marriage and his family. He had no plans to divorce, he was concerned that he was going to “lose everything” - meaning, his finances (in the event that his wife discovered this betrayal and filed for divorce), his marriage and his family. 

You have somehow twisted this around to indicate that he cared for you and that he handles this with dignity because he came around to say he would do what was required…

12 minutes ago, BiancaSW said:

if we are meant to be together we will be

Note, this is not “I’m choosing to be with you and I have filed for divorce.” It is “this will not define our relationship” ie. we will continue as we have been and “if we are meant to be together we will be” ie. I make no promises, but maybe someday if the fates allow…

I’m not saying this to be unkind. This was probably a very difficult experience for you. But my goodness, you need to look at this realistically and not from the fantasy of “If I get pregnant with his child, we will be a happy family because he is such a wonderful father.” He said in as many words - he did not want to lose everything (ie. his family), he wanted you to terminate the pregnancy, how dare you screw up his life! There is nothing loving or dignified about that. There is nothing to respect here. 

[HadMeOverABarrel]

35 minutes ago, BiancaSW said:

thank you very much for your comment, yes, you are completely right on the points you have raised.

he did have some issues while growing up - from what he told me he had amazing strong mum who encouraged him getting into a career she was also a part of. but she had health and other issues and he lost her being quite young. his mum was his rock and every time he spoke of her he cried. my heart was breaking when I listened to him speaking of her, and I think that would be the wound that never heals. he offered to take me to his mums grave which made me trust him so much as it was such a genuine thing he shared.

i suppose he sees his wife as a mummy figure, scared to be caught and told off. As I said I have never met the lady and I don’t know their internal family dynamics, but he would always look like he is grounded whenever they would have a fight. I guess him moving away from his wife would be the same as cutting connections with his mum?

when he offered to get a divorce from her one of the conditions was for me to be his rock and his shoulder, a shoulder to cry on. I loved him unconditionally so of course I would be there for him. I could not stand his tears and I could not see him crying. When he would cry - my heart was tearing apart into pieces. I would always put him first when we were together, and that was one of many mistakes I have made.

Some of the friends were saying he is a weak and cowardly man, and I think too high of him. But I saw that genuine side and I thought he is just so sensitive and caring. He always took things close to heart and I know how much he cared about everyone and doing things for other people - friends, family, colleagues, people who didn’t care for him that much......basically everyone but me.

I think we are on to something here. I'm going to go down the road a bit on helping you figure him out, because I think it will ultimately help you figure yourself out, the role you played in it, and how you can grow from the experience. 

This man does strike me as very emotionally immature. He reminds me a bit of my emotionally disabled brother who, although he is 40 years old by birth, often acts like he's 14 years old with his choices. I look after his finances and it's interesting how he tries to push my buttons for extra monies. The thing to remember with people who are severely emotionally immature is that while they seem innocent, naive, and vulnerable, they also have a bad side where they act out through rebellion, deceit, and other adolescent behaviors.

It seems this MM was asking if you will be his new mummy. Your nurturing mother instincts kicked in and you couldn't say no to this sweet, broken child. However! I also see some similarities to how I related to my xMM. I was very nurturing to him (read: codependent). He would even say at times that he didn't deserve me and I was such a good person, etc. (Fwiw, in hindsight I now take everything he said with a grain of salt because he was also a master manipulator, so who knows what was truth vs lies, maybe all lies and I'll never know).

Sometimes I would answer him saying that all the kind things I did for him also reminded me to do them for myself, that I enjoyed being kind to him. Trust me--he enjoyed my kindness too! Reciprocating that kindness to me? Not so much afterall. 

It is quite possible your MM chose his wife because she was a good replacement for his real mom. It is possible his real mom had narcissist tendencies (like my mom) and encouraged his dependence and weakness so he would 'stick' to her (the same mom did with my brother). His wife definitely has control issues by the way she has acted, and that might fit with his mother's style, too. Does that mean he was ever sincere about trading her for you?  Not necessarily. He clearly likes their dynamic since he chose to marry her, chooses to stay married, and even massively threw you under the bus for her. 

I think his affair with you was a rebellion against his mommy wife (like a teenager has a girlfriend but doesn't share it with his mom). But when mom found out, it proverbially hit the fan and he had to give mom back control by selling you out. She then went on to punish you because (probably) in her mind, he's her little kid and you're another bad kid trying to corrupt him. 

Meanwhile, in this adolescent drama, he gets mommy to 'protect him' while he gets away unscathed as the 'innocent victim.'  Yep, he's good at manipulating her, too. So had you become his new mommy, rest assured he would be rebelling against you too, when you both would've been comfortably settled into your new roles.

Now all this may paint a picture that little 'Tommy' doesn't know what he's done. But! before letting him off so easy, let's consider this... My xMM represented me on a traffic ticket in court about a year after no communication through a totally odd twist of fate (seriously, the original lawyer I hired to represent me broke her foot while out of town on vacation the day before my hearing and the firm reassigned him to appear for me). Afterwards, we hung out and talked. The tone was friendly and non-sexual. During our conversation, he updated me on his kids' lives, etc. I'll never forget one of his comments: "[daughter's name] is a player like me." And! in telling me about his mom's death during the preceeding year, he said he is a lot like his mom (whom he also expressed much contempt about during our affair while she was alive). That says he knows for sure he plays games even though he enjoyed my 'nuturing,' and he learned his manipulative behavior from his mother. I suspect thus is the case with your MM.

My therapist says we each have a 'story.' Our story dictates our lives save repeats itself in our relationships. I have a story of betrayal and I've been betrayed by family, friends, and lovers. The flipside of that is something I'm still exploring.

This is all to say, what is your story? What was it that got you into this situation? Your tendency to nurture comes from a wound within yourself. You identified with his wound (it even made you cry) because it was something familiar within you. It's something that needs your attention now so you can heal it. 

Unfortunately, unhealed wounds are our areas of vulnerability that present opportunities for others to take advantage of us. When people want something from us, they can press those buttons within us to get it. You are now extremely well-positioned to reflect on this, heal it, grow from it. Once you do, you could become an extremely valuable resource to help others, too, but not until you do your own work first. 

I feel you are going to do this work and it's going to be an unbelievable benefit to you. 

Best wishes!

[mark clemson]

6 hours ago, BiancaSW said:

I sadly needed to get a lawyers order to stop her from harassing me as it went too far.

This was probably a necessary move and I was going to suggest something along these lines but clearly you've already done it.

It sounds very much like she is not only dominant in their marriage but also at least mildly abusive. The fact that she is nice some of the time and posts pretty pictures on SM is no surprise as many if not most abusive partners use intermittent reinforcement (sometimes unconsciously) to help keep their partner "glued in" and also create a facade of normalcy as best they can. I suspect that if you hadn't called the lawyer it would be continuing. For his part, I strongly suspect he is co-dependent.

 

6 hours ago, BiancaSW said:

he cudve told her anything he wanted. but calling me and humiliating me with her listening to the conversation? why to do that?

Because she made him most likely. Possibly he enjoys taking the role of abuser once in a while as well. Now that you are wrapped up in "their stuff" you are a target for emotional abuse. They sound VERY dysfunctional. Get away and stay away.

 

6 hours ago, BiancaSW said:

well I know people who knew him for a while and they said he is completely under her thumb.

Not a shock in an abusive relationship. HE is the one sticking around for this and probably will for years to come, unfortunately, but co-dependency can be hard to shake.

 

7 hours ago, BiancaSW said:

 I should have learnt quickly he is attracted to strong women like his wife and I was too spineless and allowed him to do everything on his own terms.

Ah, but he gets to be the man he cannot be with his wife with his APs. A bit more in charge AND he gets to vent some of his distress that has built up.

 

17 hours ago, BiancaSW said:

I probably deserve what I got

 

Deserve is such a rigged word. Does Jeff Bezos deserve to be a billionaire while paying the lower level folks in his company so little? Did starving thieves in ancient times deserve having their hands cut off? Opinions will vary widely and depend a LOT on things like personal views and like cultural milieu.

Does your former MM deserve to be in an abusive relationship? Dunno but he stays. Does his abusive BW deserve to be cheated on? Probably not, but she's willing to reconcile and keep him around. Does she deserve criminal charges for her harassment of you? Perhaps, but it doesn't sound like you're in any mood to press them.

The simple thing to do to cut through all the clutter and emotional damage here is walk away as quickly as is reasonably possible, and stay away while you mentally recover and eventually seek a more emotionally healthy partner.

Edited June 14, 2021 by mark clemson

[BaileyB]

6 minutes ago, BiancaSW said:

great guy was so truthful and honest and sensitive could turn around and throw me under the bus?

How was he truthful? He lied to his wife every single day of their marriage about his serial affairs. How is that an honest and truthful man?

This man puts himself first, always. He cheats on his wife - his needs before her. You have a pregnancy scare and he tells you - how dare you ruin this for me, you crewed up my life, I will lose everything because of you, I want you to terminate the pregnancy - his needs before yours. 

And then - you are surprised when he is discovered and he throws you under the bus? I am not surprised - everything you have said about this man indicates that he will do exactly that - his needs before yours. 

He was unfaithful to his wife in front of his coworkers in the back of a taxi - “great guys” don’t do that.

Edited June 14, 2021 by BaileyB

[Starswillshine]

18 minutes ago, BiancaSW said:

situation was bad enough as it was but it seemed to me he handled it with dignity and it made me to respect him and believe what he says.

How did he handle this with dignity? He accused you of trying to ruin his life.... while he was an active participant.  On top of this, he knows you want children and he was trying to convince you to terminate this potential child. How is that dignity and worthy of respect?

Only after he realized how he f'ed up and wouldn't have his play toy anymore does he back pedal. 

[BaileyB]

1 minute ago, Starswillshine said:

How did he handle this with dignity? He accused you of trying to ruin his life.... while he was an active participant.  On top of this, he knows you want children and he was trying to convince you to terminate this potential child. How is that dignity and worthy of respect?

Only after he realized how he f'ed up and wouldn't have his play toy anymore does he back pedal. 

And somehow you decided OP, that he was a great guy. You think he is honest, and truthful, and trustworthy, and a great father. For what, because he realized he sounded like a total butthead when he blamed you and told you to terminate the pregnancy. Because he came to his senses (at least enough to know that what he had said to you was cruel) and he told you he would offer you some basic human kindness, he earned your respect. I would kindly suggest that you may want to raise your standards a little higher than this, my friend. 

[HadMeOverABarrel]

14 minutes ago, BiancaSW said:

Why did he do that ? The outcome could still be the same - why to hurt me so much??

I think it's because he wanted his mommy wife to do the breakup work for him. He is weak, manipulative, and conflict-avoidant. He knows his mommy will clean up his messes for him so he took the opportunity to play victim, throw you under the bus, so his mommy wife can rush in to save him from the bully vixen. His 'charm' cuts both ways.

[pepperbird2]

1 hour ago, BiancaSW said:

yes that’s also true. That’s a fantasy that ended badly. I raised that issue with him numerous times - and he said he is not his wife’s property and he can do what he wants but I should not be pushing him for any decisions and just give him time as he has more to lose than me and he has kids as well. And he would divorce his wife and sell the house had it not been for his kids. He was crying saying he can’t think of being apart from them, not sleeping next door. I said if he can’t think of that why to continue with me? he should stay with his kids and obviously his wife.

He said he needs this, he needs me, he needs relationship and needs a chance from me.

This reminds me of what my mother in law does. When she sees a difficult conversation isn't going her way, out come the tears. It's a manipulation tactic. The other person shifts from having an issue they want to talk about to comforting her.

He is so worried about his kids? Pffftttt....that's pure, unadulterated bull. No other word for it. He's doesn't want to hurt his kids, yet he'll do the one thing (cheat) that has a high chance of blowing their world up in the worst way possible?

[HadMeOverABarrel]

7 minutes ago, pepperbird2 said:

This reminds me of what my mother in law does. When she sees a difficult conversation isn't going her way, out come the tears. It's a manipulation tactic. The other person shifts from having an issue they want to talk about to comforting her.

Exactly! Back in December, after spending the night with my dying friend in hospice center, I was my mom's house eating breakfast. My narc mom was jabbering away on gossip about people I didn't even know. I looked at her and said, "I just spent a gruelling night sleeping in a chair next to my dying high school best friend in hospice. I don't want to talk about anything else right now."

What did my mom do? She started crying like a little kid whose feelings got hurt. Yep, so insensitive. It's always about her no matter what. She's done the same crap even while I was recovering from in-patient surgery just the day prior. Always expects to be tended to even if you are on death's door, and if you don't perform, out come the tears and manipulations. 

[mark clemson]

21 minutes ago, pepperbird2 said:

He is so worried about his kids? Pffftttt....that's pure, unadulterated bull. No other word for it. He's doesn't want to hurt his kids, yet he'll do the one thing (cheat) that has a high chance of blowing their world up in the worst way possible?

Well, he could divorce if he had the gonads for that. But apparently not. If the BW is half as abusive as has been described above, he'd probably be worried about what would happen to them without him around as a buffer.

[pepperbird2]

3 minutes ago, mark clemson said:

Well, he could divorce if he had the gonads for that. But apparently not. If the BW is half as abusive as has been described above, he'd probably be worried about what would happen to them without him around as a buffer.

Again, he's so worried about his kids, yet he'll do the one thing that has a high rate of blowing their world up and limiting the amount of time he can spend with them?
If she is so abusive, why is he hell bent on keeping his marriage together? Why not report the abuse? If she is so abusive to them, why does he fight so hard to maintain the status quo? Why continue to stay and subject them to that? Why is he only worried about his happiness and not his kids?

This man is full of more crap than one of those port-a -johns. He's got the "poor me" pity party down to an art form.