My husband has been cheating on me for the last 3 years

[husbandcheating]

41 minutes ago, elaine567 said:

Why would she?
She smells the whiff of success.
Rebecca is correct, she can afford to play Lady Bountiful, she sees you as no threat...
 

@elaine567 I don't believe this and I do think she sees me as a threat given some text messages I have read. I would if I was her as I am his wife. The one that is his real life partner.

[husbandcheating]

4 hours ago, torn_heart said:

OP to be quite honest, I do believe your husband won't leave, but the fact that you know and don't tell him is not doing you any good mentally. If you know confront him a find a way to work it out. Delaying it will make it worse.

Thank you @torn_heart. I would like to ask why are you different than most posters. Do you see things as I see it?

[husbandcheating]

3 hours ago, elaine567 said:

Truth  is he is telling you "anything" so as not to rock the boat in case it harms his children... He has a huge motivation to keep you sweet, at least at the moment.,.

@elaine567 I find this interesting that you think he is telling me "anything" but I understand your view point from the circumstances

[husbandcheating]

3 hours ago, HadMeOverABarrel said:

I have just read this post.

Here is what I think about it: 😔

and then: 🤦

@HadMeOverABarrel I do appreciate your posts, could you elaborate on your emojis? I am not used to your post being simplified into emoticons.

[RebeccaR]

30 minutes ago, husbandcheating said:

I also want to keep observing as well to be honest.

I think this makes sense. The only advantage you have is him not knowing that you are reading his messages. I assume he has no clue you have access to his messages?

[RebeccaR]

25 minutes ago, husbandcheating said:

Three days is significant don't you think? It shows volumes! 

Sorry, I don’t agree. She knows he is busy with family time. She may have her own kids or other family and be equally busy

[S2B]

29 minutes ago, husbandcheating said:

Thank you @S2B and this isnt to sound cocky, but I am have been in his life for way more significant years, through many of trying of times. 4 years hardly compares to over two decades.

I will not accept Amanda, at all. 

What do you mean? You’ve already accepted her - there are THREE people in your marriage.

you haven’t made any demands or even asked your husband to stop seeing her.

she’s been there… she will continue being in your marriage whether you like it or not… because YOU aren’t willing to change a thing.

[RebeccaR]

5 minutes ago, RebeccaR said:

She may have her own kids or other family and be equally busy

Adding, especially if she works long hours or a stressful job. She may not be focused on every detail of this man’s activities even if they are in a serious relationship. In other words, her life is full even without him - which is healthy. A few days of expected  not communicating does not give her reason to fret.

[torn_heart]

27 minutes ago, husbandcheating said:

Thank you @torn_heart. I would like to ask why are you different than most posters. Do you see things as I see it?

I'm looking at it from the cheater perspective, the behavior you describe of your MM makes me think that, as you do, he won't leave you... yet. 

He is eating the cake, as they say, and enjoying it, if you don't confront him it that might grow and turn into a real risk. You are in a good point to confront him and work it out, later, you might risk to confront him and so give him the excuse to leave (I'd have liked that scenario in my case), and if you never confront him, she might, at some point, preassure him to leave you and your family, and that will depend how emotionally invested is he in the affair (this is what happened in my case).

My point is, the affair, like any relationship, the longer it is the more emotionally invested you get, and it goes for both parties.

[husbandcheating]

3 hours ago, introverted1 said:

Of course this is what he says.  He already offered once to buy a house for you so he could leave with the boys and you turned him down.  So the only way to achieve that goal is to pretend he plans to live with you. Once the house has been purchased, he will find reasons not to move out of his house.  He will have the perfect opportunity to test drive co-parenting from separate residences. He'll also have the perfect set-up for seeing Amanda more often, including at night.

It doesn't matter whether you accept Amanda.  Your husband has.  I don't think things will work out the way you think they will when you confront him.  Actually, I don't think you are so confident, either, or else you'd have done it by now.

It's a lie not because the things you or he posts didn't actually happen, but because it's a small slice of his life, not the totality of it.  I asked you before you did not answer:  when was the last time you had an intimate conversation with your husband?  Not a conversation about the house or the kids, but one in which you are both sharing hopes and dreams and vulnerabilities? 

What you should see here is that your husband has never been all in with you. What he has been committed to -- and apparently remains committed to -- is your children.  He married you because you were pregnant, not because he loved you and wanted to forego all others.  In fact, he did not forego others. He dated someone else while you were pregnant.  This is not the stuff of a love story.  This is the stuff of a man who was trying to do the "right" thing by marrying his pregnant gf.  And at some point 4 years ago (and maybe sooner - we have no idea if this is his first affair), he grew hungry enough for love to take up with Amanda, with whom he shares intimacy both physical and emotional, and with whom he is building his future.

 

You can deny this all you like, but he has told family that he loves her, he has moved assets into her account(s), he is in daily contact with her, he is working on buying a house so you and the boys will have a place to live.

@introverted1 Thank you for your insight.  The house thing was only in an argument years ago, I had said plenty of things I did not mean either. A lot of posters are putting more weight on that. That was years ago and we have fought after and he has never mentioned again.Fights happen and terrible things are said. 

Our youngest child not being with my husband or explaining to him his parents do not live in the same house? That will never happen. 

I am confident that he will not leave our family. 

"It's a lie not because the things you or he posts didn't actually happen, but because it's a small slice of his life, not the totality of it.  I asked you before you did not answer:  when was the last time you had an intimate conversation with your husband?  Not a conversation about the house or the kids, but one in which you are both sharing hopes and dreams and vulnerabilities? "- Yesterday as we talked about getting a new home, we do not not talk about things intimately, I am always bringing up things about hopes and dreams for our future . I am a chatterbox. Communication is very important to me.

"What you should see here is that your husband has never been all in with you. What he has been committed to -- and apparently remains committed to -- is your children.  He married you because you were pregnant, not because he loved you and wanted to forego all others."- I am having trouble agreeing with this but thank you.

 

[heartwhole2]

I encourage you to view the choices as yours. Yes, it seems like your husband is at this advantage because he ostensibly gets to pick between two women. But you don't have to be part of the competition. It's always a choice to walk away from the triangle he's conjured with secrets and lies and say, hey, you can come rejoin the family when you've committed to being an honest monogamist. Otherwise, I'll assume you're with Amanda. Or out there playing the field. I don't care. Anything less than "my 100% committed, honest husband" is immediate separation. That doesn't mean you'll keep your family intact, but you will keep your dignity intact. And it's honestly the best chance for your marriage, if your marriage is what you want. 

Re vacations, I know my husband told the OW he would be out of touch when we were together. We went to the Caribbean for a romantic getaway during the affair. Later I discovered she would be tweeting things like, "When you love someone, their happiness matters more than yours!" or "Do what is right, not what is easy!" (she really loved exclamation points) during these times. To me that says, "I'm struggling so I will Tweet stuff that makes it seem like I'm not." 

But really, the reasons for her dysfunction or your husband's dysfunction are a million times less important than the reasons for your avoidant response here. You are the only one you can control. That is true of everyone in your life -- your parents, your kids, your partner. You can have boundaries that are rooted in self-respect, and you can enforce those boundaries. That's all you can do.

So is your husband having a girlfriend a violation of your boundary, or not? 

During the affair my husband was all about the dates too. He was throwing me a bone, I guess. I think he also felt very guilty. He signed his Valentine's Day card to me, "I'm yours," but in super shaky handwriting. It's funny the things you see after the fact. We had a date night right after his getaway with the OW. We had a getaway the next week. I was already asking questions and trying to figure out why he was being so weird, so he was trying to be as normal as possible. He also started seeing a therapist who told him to put more effort into his marriage. When he told me this, the undercurrent was that he wanted the therapist to tell him it was OK to go be with the OW. He was frustrated the therapist's homework was, "Try harder in your marriage." Because I was the big bad wolf who wouldn't let him have any fun! Except I wasn't. 

The long and short of it is:
a) you need to look out for you and the boys (STD test, lawyer, support from friends)
b) most affairs are fantasy and don't survive the real world, but you can never know for sure which one you are dealing with until DDay, and even then second DDays are common
c) respecting and standing up for yourself is important for you, for your boys, and for whatever the future looks like (staying together or divorcing)
d) living in limbo based on lies is not sustainable if you want a real relationship based on mutual respect and love
e) you can postpone confrontation until you've seen a therapist, doctor, and lawyer, but it should happen sooner than later
f) you need to know that even if he commits to NC with the OW and staying in the marriage, it is a long, hard road from there. You don't go from selfish and dishonest to selfless and honest overnight.

There is no way out but through. You've got this, mama. You are stronger than you know. Find that anger and use it.

[RebeccaR]

8 minutes ago, husbandcheating said:

we do not not talk about things intimately,

But you do not talk about Amanda who is clearly important to him, so he’s not opening up. If he just wanted sex, why didn’t he ask for it with you? I notice no one is bringing up sex, but a healthy guy in his early 30s does not expect his marital sex life to dry up to a few times a year. I doubt you are giving enough weight to this. If he ends things with Amanda, who will satisfy his sexual needs?

[S2B]

This is on you. You stay when he cheats = he will keep cheating. You have choices and this is what you’ve chosen.

she will stay in his life and so will you. There’s no reason for him to eliminate her. Or you. So get used to it - three in the marriage since you won’t leave him.

you seem to have loads of arguments… what are all those arguments about?

[heartwhole2]

The OP hasn't responded to any of my posts, so maybe I'm the one who is off base, but I really feel a lot of these posts are too harsh towards someone who is experiencing a great trauma. I've dealt with other big/hard things in my life, but there's nothing like having your lift partner gaslight you and try to pin his outrageous decision to have a secret girlfriend on your supposed flaws. As I've told my husband, even though we've got the "best case scenario" where we stayed together and are happy, healthy people in a happy, healthy relationship, we still had to deal with a big huge trauma that was entirely his fault. It's just horribly unfair and scary and gut-wrenching to suddenly find yourself in this position. And it is not your fault if you don't know how to respond with perfect femme fatale vengeance the second you find out. It is not on you. You are just trying to keep your head about water, and you have the kids to worry about. Wouldn't it have been nice if your husband had done all this worrying on the front end and avoided the big, stupid trauma? 

HC has not said she's OK with cheating, just that she's not ready to confront yet. So what can we do to help her get ready?

 

[RebeccaR]

9 minutes ago, heartwhole2 said:

HC has not said she's OK with cheating, just that she's not ready to confront yet.

She has consistently argued that his living at home proves there’s nothing to worry about. We are just telling her otherwise. No one is being harsh or insisting she confront him. In fact by not confronting him she gains more information from his messages. As soon as she confronts him she’ll lose access to this spigot.

[glows]

You’re still in shock, OP. Undoing decades of marriage seems unbelievable compared to the seeming frivolity of their side business (your husband and OW). I don’t blame you that you’re in denial or stuck or feeling immobile and wanting to observe. The worst case scenario is he has children with her and leads a more involved and complicated double life while remaining legally your husband. It’s a sham marriage, one only on paper but not out of active/ongoing mutual respect or loyalty. Have you talked with a lawyer yet? 

[DaisyFlor]

OP this relationship will end when the OW decides to end it. You can confront your H about it but I suspect that either one of 2 things will happen.

1. He will choose her. He well leave you and choose her. 

2. He will tell you he has ended it and go underground. He may even call her in front of you tell you it is over agree to marital counseling etc. But he will not end it. He will just make everything that much more secure that you will no longer have access to see anything. 

You are so certain about the M. But the thing is YOU have the M you want. You have this idea in your head about your H, that you've probably had since you were 12, and you have stuck to it. You have this great life that you are happy about with kids and vacations and he proclaims how much he loves you to all of SM. And that makes you happy. And he is happy, now he is happy because of her. He has the stable happy home life and he now has all his needs met. You may be the wife, and woman of the house. But she is the one who holds, his secrets, his passion his heart. He may love you. I don't think that he doesn't, but don't for one minute think that means, he does not love her. You say you would never want to be her. And you cannot possibly comprehend how she can go days without talking to him. There is a saying "married people do what married people do". That means he will go on vacation with you, celebrate bday and anniversaries and occasionally have sex. Doesn't matter, because she knew this going into it. The fact is after all your vacations, your anniversaries etc he goes to see her. To be with her. 

You are surprised that she knows details about your life and what he is doing. Why? They are intimate. They are in a relationship. You can try to minimize it all you want. But that is what it means to him.  He has made that clear, by sharing that with his brother. She doesn't need to talk to him everyday, because she knows how it works. She has by nature accepted that. And you can keep trying to belittle her by saying you would not want to be her, but she probably thinks the same thing about you. I would not want to be Her, his wife who he stays with out of obligation. 

IT IS NOT SEX AND IT IS NOT A MIDLIFE CRISIS

So you can keep telling yourself that, but that is not what is going on. The longer you do keep thinking that, the longer he can keep pretending. 

So I suspect as long as she accepts it, and you don't say anything this will continue to go on for a very long time. Unless he is like other posters have pointed out, planning a way to get out once he has all his ducks in a row. 

Of course he is telling you the house you are looking for is for both of you. Why would he tell you differently? You seem to base his decisions and actions on what it means to you. What is important to you. What is important to HIM is sex, intimacy, independence, maturity. He gets that with Amanda not with you. No one here can tell you that what he has with you is also not important to him. Or that he doesn't love you. The mistake you are making is minimizing what She and their relationship mean to HIM, because it is an inconvenience to you. Because you believe he values what you value. He may, but you do not value what he values. And that is why you are where you are. 

He will not give her up. He has made that clear. 

So you're choices are blindly accept it. Ignore and go on with your secure life. 

Or talk to a lawyer and figure out what your options are. But her not being in his life that is not one of your options. 

[S2B]

He likes the control and power to have two women. Why would he give it up?

he knows you are weak and won’t leave. He thinks it’s a perfect scenario.

[elaine567]

8 hours ago, husbandcheating said:

@elaine567 I don't believe this and I do think she sees me as a threat given some text messages I have read. I
would if I was her as I am his wife.
The one that is his real life partner.

The one he is cheating on...
The one he is lying to...
The one he is disrespecting...

If Amanda saw you as a real threat, she likely would have thrown in the towel a while back.
As it is, I think she can smell blood in the water...

[Prudence V]

17 hours ago, husbandcheating said:

I did read about slit self affair, possibly. I can't really wrap my head around it because I never saw my husband as marrying me out of doing the "right thing" we had love between us. We love each other. He loved what we were building. 

Gently, this isn’t about how *you* see it. It’s about how *he* sees it. And you have it in his own words, to his brother, right here:

 

On 6/22/2021 at 3:51 AM, husbandcheating said:

He told his brother how he feels that him and that woman have a connection he has never felt and how with me he was doing what was right when I got pregnant as teenagers.

You provide him with the moral space to show he’s a “good person”, doing what’s right by sticking it out despite his unhappiness, for the sake of the kids.

Amanda provides him with intimacy, passion, love and connection. 
 

ATM he needs both. Split self affairs can run for a very long time - we had one on these boards that ran for about 7 years IIRC before the MM finally left the BW and married the OW. Usually they only resolve after the MM does the work needed in counselling to heal the “split”, which is a big if. 

[Prudence V]

17 hours ago, husbandcheating said:

@Prudence V I will never accept Amanda, she is not our marriage, she is not a part of our commitment. I will eventually tell him I know, and I know from that we can work on our marriage and she will be a distant memory.

OK, you’re just choosing a different colour unicorn here. That wasn’t one of the here actually possible choices you have. Let me try again: 

On 7/16/2021 at 5:07 PM, Prudence V said:

So let me ask again - of the actually possible futures (you accepting Amanda in your life, long-term / you giving him an ultimatum and being prepared for him to choose her / you making the decision to cut your losses and leave…), what are you working toward, here? 

1) you accept that he has a second “wife”, Amanda, and a second R running in parallel to your own (as you’re currently doing); 

OR

2) you give him an ultimatum - tell him it’s you or Amanda, he must choose, and you’re not willing to accept things continuing as they are (this involves you leaving if he chooses her, or tells you he chooses you but continues with her anyway - whether blatantly or secretly. If you don’t leave, you’re back to choosing (1)) 

OR

3) you make the choice for him, by calling quits on your fake marriage yourself. 
 

Most people here are nudging you towards (2), and some towards (3), but I think both you and I know that despite your protestations that you will never accept Amanda, you have, and continue to - and that this is the choice you will carry on making.
 

Hoping _he_ will make a different choice doesn’t change your own choice, which is essentially to tolerate his love and investment in a LTR with Amanda, so long as he posts affirmatory things about you on FB and sleeps in your bed at night. It’s a choice many BWs make (you’ve seen edith’s thread, and LaurenEliz, on these boards, as examples) and it’s a valid choice if you’re concerned about surviving financially, as you clearly are. But please don’t underestimate the impact it is having on your mental health, and the impact that will also have on your sons - you’d do well to speak to a counsellor, as I’m not sure your choices are sustainable long-term, in that regard. 

[Prudence V]

16 hours ago, husbandcheating said:

As I have seen in the OW thread, if they aren't leaving at around the 2 year mark, they won't leave so I suppose she was chosen within that time frame. My husband, this is 4 years so I assume he is stringing Amanda along. Just wish he would cut the string already.

That is a myth. 
 

If you’re actually interested, there is an old thread on these boards (maybe 8-10 years ago?) which looked at those OWs on these boards whose MMs had left (they were together in LTRs, fMM and fOW) and the average was about 3 years. Yes, some left quickly, but others left after much longer, balancing out the mean at 3 years or so. The “split self” type affairs tended to last longer, and the “exit affairs” were shorter. 
 

As for him “stringing Amanda along”, from what he’s saying (to Amanda, to his brother, etc), it’s *you* he’s stringing along. Wishing he “would cut the string already” might just backfire. 

[Prudence V]

10 hours ago, husbandcheating said:

The house thing was only in an argument years ago, I had said plenty of things I did not mean either. A lot of posters are putting more weight on that. That was years ago and we have fought after and he has never mentioned again.Fights happen and terrible things are said. 

This sounds to me like a very volatile R. You’ve been M 14 years, you say? My M of a similar length of time has never had an argument where “terrible things are said”. We’ve had a couple of disagreements about inconsequential matters (how often the kitchen floor needs scrubbing 🤣, for example) but no fights, no arguments of the kind you describe and nothing hurtful ever said. 
 

I wonder if part of Amanda’s attraction is that they’re more compatible, that there’s no need for these “fights and arguments” all the time, and no vicious things bubbling below the surface that get spoken out loud when the veneer of niceness gets scratched. 

[introverted1]

If I can summarize the past 24 pages, the list looks like this:

• Your husband cheated when you were pregnant with your first child
• He cheated after your first child was born
• He married you out of obligation (pregnancy)
• He's cheating now with Amanda
• He offered to buy you a house if you would agree to let him leave with the boys (and NO, this is not the type of thing said in anger during an argument)
• He's told his brother and family that he loves Amanda
• He's invested significant amounts of money into a business venture with Amanda
• He's looking into buying land/house with Amanda
• You and he argue and say "terrible things"
• He does not engage in intimate conversations with you and your sex life is minimal
• He shares intimacy -- physical and emotional -- with Amanda.
• He has never put you on the deed to his house that he jointly owns with his mother
• He's trying to buy a new house "with" you that many here believe he will not live in with you

It doesn't look good.

 

 

Edited July 26, 2021 by introverted1

[HadMeOverABarrel]

14 hours ago, husbandcheating said:

Three days is significant don't you think? It shows volumes! 

Maybe you should check his phone again before doing your victory dance.