Should I inititate the 2nd date?

[chillii]

Who knows hope l'm wrong but he sounds like a very odd duck to me. Who sends bloody poems to a total stranger for a wk or two or whatever it was and this wanted you to show equal interest bs, l'd actually call that very try hard myself. You don't need to play all that bs and games and testing just to find that out.If a woman is really interested along the way in person and growing is usually very very obvious and so is respect. His description, l dunno the whole box , might take a few mths or God forbid a yr or two for the bs to wear off but somethings very not right with this one.

Mind you , could be wrong not trying to be a kill joy, no harm in spending some time with him l suppose but sorry l'd be really expecting some issues with him as time goes on.Buttttt, maybe not , who knows.

 

 

 

 

[Gaeta]

Men complain all the time on here how they take the ladies out on dates, invest time and money and then on 3rd date the lady says: meh, not feeling it. The guy goes back online, catch another one, rince repeat. This odd duck simply wanted his interest to be reciprocated. An equal, I treat you, you treat me. I have no problem with that. If I had not been confused by the poems I would have asked him on that second date much earlier. 

I'm not defending everything about this guy but I'm not ready to throw rocks at him for being 'different'. There were little things here and there that made me wonder if this is the man for me. I don't get swept away that easily. After what happened with my ex, my guards are way up. 

Meanwhile I am setting up a first meeting with number 10, I am still online, still getting messages, still taking interest in other men. 

[Alpacalia]

Just take your time with it Gaeta.

It's your second date.

You seem to enjoy him so see how it goes.

Maybe bring him a fortune cookie with a little poem in it.

[Happy Lemming]

3 hours ago, poppyfields said:

It would be nice to hear some male perspectives about this...

 

Ask and you shall receive... Male here.

I've never used this type of "Game"/approach with a woman. 

I'm probably about the same age as "poet guy" and I've never heard of waiting for the woman to ask me out for the second date.  If I had a nice time on the first date, I would tell the woman "I'll call you next week", which I did (with date #2 plans/activity).

I would call on Wednesday for a Friday night date and Thursday for a Saturday night date.  If the woman called be before I called her, I would tell her I'm working on planning our next date, and which evening works better for her (Friday or Saturday), then craft a date around her response.

If she mentioned something that she was quite interested in... (Example... if she said "Hey... one of my favorite Garage bands is playing at this "hole in the wall" bar, downtown.) I'd craft a date around that suggestion.

None of my male friends ever waited for the woman to call and set up a second date.

Personally (my opinion, here) I don't think much of this wait for her to plan date #2 plan.  It's almost like he is scared to date, and he needs to be 100% sure that the woman is interested before going out with her again.  If I planned date #2, asked the woman out and she said "no", where is the harm.  Other than a little bit of planning, I've lost nothing.  There is still time for me to reset my plans for the weekend to do something else.

[lana-banana]

This is a long thread so I may be confusing men, but is this the same guy who sent you 13 lines of poetry to ask how your evening was and whose poetry your daughter described as "cringe"? 

[Gaeta]

16 minutes ago, lana-banana said:

This is a long thread so I may be confusing men, but is this the same guy who sent you 13 lines of poetry to ask how your evening was and whose poetry your daughter described as "cringe"? 

Yes, but any teen would cringe at poetry lol

[Cookiesandough]

4 hours ago, Gaeta said:

You have not read the poems, you cannot judge them as anything. They are not written in English so the cheesiness you've detected could come from my translation of 2 words out if it.

How do you know my level of interest? Why not ask me?

Wasn’t trying to offend. I am just reacting with my opinion on a guy who behaves as you’ve described he has and sends ANY kind of “love poetry” after 1 date 

 

& also just add ( not related to this ) my friend is still with that guy lol…. After she found out he was playing her, he managed to convince her that his gf was crazy and sent her more stuff.  

 

So I’m well aware of how other’s neg input about someone we like mean jack

[norealusername]

Honestly, it seems like the opposite of a smooth operator to me. He sent poems instead of trying to have a conversation and he sat there waiting for the woman to make a move. This sounds like very timid behavior. 

I'm not trying to rain on your parade, just being honest. It doesn't really matter, everybody's behavior is different. I always thought you should keep talking to the guy and not cross him off. 

[Gaeta]

2 minutes ago, norealusername said:

This sounds like very timid behavior. 

He's also expressive on text, but in person he doesn't use grand romance. 

[Cookiesandough]

Also want to add a very important thing that I know I could very well be wrong about it and happy to be. Said same thing to my friend. It could work out beautifully. So far things have turned for the better it seems?  Just  wanted to offer another  perspective that might be heeded/given  some consideration . Ty 

[cleverusername]

Here's the deal G straight from a man (I'm not reading all 13pages tho):

This guy is unique, he's a flower, and he's probably insecure about himself or something he did. It may be he is insecure about the poetry, and not sure how you took it, or the poetry is a symptom of the insecurity and he chooses to express himself that way, either way doesn't matter. The man is insecure.

There are 2 reasons he's not asking for a second date but did a first,

A) He's no longer interested

B) He's insecure and you need to coax him out of his shell by reciprocating

Either way, it's on him. Make it explicitly clear you enjoyed the poetry and explicitly clear you would like to see him again. If he doesn't take the bait, then this relationship will go nowhere. 

Edit: Read that you went on a second date and the reasoning. This guy is extremely insecure and will be in constant need of validation. He's not expressive in a confident and bold sense, he's expressive in the sense of a flower that will need to be protected and sheltered, but is nice to look at sometimes. Are you trying to grow a garden?

Edited July 6, 2021 by cleverusername

[Gaeta]

@cleverusername: You're making a good point.

It probably did mean something to him that I initiated that 2nd date. Before last night he sent 1 message a day and today he contacted me at 3 different time in the day and we're only 4 pm. It's never long just to touch base.

[Allupinnit]

On 7/1/2021 at 11:38 AM, Gaeta said:

No I have not heard from him since yesterday morning. I deleted him, did not block him. If he writes back I'll have to ask who is this?. 🙂

Why would a man contact a woman on a Thursday without inviting her out? Just to waste her time.

 

Do you remember this just a few days ago?

I mean, at least you passed his sh*t test.  I just find that so ungentlemanly, waiting as long as it took for YOU to do the asking - puh-leeze.  But hey, you have to date him, we don't.

[chillii]

10 hours ago, Gaeta said:

Men complain all the time on here how they take the ladies out on dates, invest time and money and then on 3rd date the lady says: meh, not feeling it. The guy goes back online, catch another one, rince repeat. This odd duck simply wanted his interest to be reciprocated. An equal, I treat you, you treat me. I have no problem with that. If I had not been confused by the poems I would have asked him on that second date much earlier. 

I'm not defending everything about this guy but I'm not ready to throw rocks at him for being 'different'. There were little things here and there that made me wonder if this is the man for me. I don't get swept away that easily. After what happened with my ex, my guards are way up. 

Meanwhile I am setting up a first meeting with number 10, I am still online, still getting messages, still taking interest in other men. 

 

Yeah right, wouldn't know about any of that never spent money on a women in my life expecting anything or counting dates or wetf else bs they all seem to do round here. Anyway hope l'm wrong didn't wanna dampen anything for ya just thought some wariness might be better put out there.

 

 

 

[CaliforniaGirl]

7 minutes ago, Allupinnit said:

Do you remember this just a few days ago?

I mean, at least you passed his sh*t test.  I just find that so ungentlemanly, waiting as long as it took for YOU to do the asking - puh-leeze.  But hey, you have to date him, we don't.

I was thinking the same thing...S-test? And now she won the brass ring, she gets to go out with him as the reward? Hard pass.

I personally think it's telling that he's incredibly wordy on his poems but in person he seems different. Again...this is just me. I'm not there, I'm not talking to the guy.

 

[poppyfields]

Gaeta, what do you think would have happened if you never initiated the second date?  Would he have let you go? 

A woman he was attracted to and connected with?  

The first date was actually the first "meet" was it not?

You had not even met each other yet, so to me that's bit different from initiating a date because he was interested in you, after having met you.

So his requirement that you initiate the second date, with the excuse he needs "equal effort," seems a bit off to me.

You made plenty of effort, you responded very positively to all his poetry, and I recall your mentioning you initiated a phone call and he was very happy you did so!

So he knew you liked him, he knew you would accept a second invite, so not quite sure I understand his rationale about requiring you to initiate it.

In any event, I am not judging, when we really like someone, it's not uncommon to make all sorts of justifications for behavior we might otherwise feel uncomfortable about.

My advice is go on this third date, and play it out.  

Have fun and good luck!

Edited July 6, 2021 by poppyfields

[Gaeta]

So where is the harm in all this?

Because l initiated the 2nd date a future relationship is now doomed?

He's nice, he's a total gentleman in his language and behavior around me. No sexual innuendoes and that's like a record for me to not hear it for 2 weeks. (My #10 started asking sex questions after 24 hours.). He doesn't give me the go around, he's there, he texts, he replies within minutes. 

At the restaurant yesterday he was excited to show me his iphone accounting software. His phone was in my hands, he was not in a hurry to get it back, he was relaxed. 

So what he's insecure a bit with women and needed a push. We advise insecure people every day here, they're not ill intent for that. I don't know his dating history, i'm carrying some heavy stuff myself that makes me guarded. 

Now, my dear LS friends. I'm not infatuated, l like him the way l like raspberry ice cream it's nice in the moment. I'm not even sure l can develop feelings for anybody at this time.

I think if l had not invited him he would have eventually, or maybe not. It doesn't matter. 

Edited July 7, 2021 by Gaeta

[poppyfields]

On 6/27/2021 at 11:37 AM, Gaeta said:

He did the pursuing, made the invite for the first date....

Gaeta, sorry to ask again but I am confused about this "effort" he supposedly made such that he required you to make "equal effort" by initiating a second meet/date.

The quoted above, this was a first meet between two strangers.

Okay I get he was the one who suggested it, but that's pretty standard, I don't really see that as "effort" necessarily.  I mean it was a first meet between two strangers, he didn't even know you at that point.

But yet after the meet, he intentionally chose to sit on his ass (sorry) knowing you were interested in seeing him again as evidenced by your responses to his poetry and you initiating a phone call...

I dunno, I hate to sound negative but it all sounds quite manipulative and calculating to me.

I mean who does that?  Intentionally does nothing as some sort of "shyt test" to see if you step up and make "equal effort"?

Equal to what?  His suggestion for a first meet?

And what if you had not stepped up?  That's it?  You failed the shyt test, so CYA?

Anyway, again apologies for sounding negative but this seems very off to me.

Very manipulative and calculating on his part.

I hope I am wrong because I know you really like him; my only advice is stay aware and don't allow chemistry to blind you to possible manipulation and shyt tests.

Best of luck...
 

 

Edited July 7, 2021 by poppyfields

[poppyfields]

18 minutes ago, poppyfields said:

Gaeta, sorry to ask again but I am confused about this "effort" he supposedly made such that he required you to make "equal effort" by initiating a second meet/date.

The quoted above, this was a first meet between two strangers.

Okay I get he was the one who suggested it, but that's pretty standard, I don't really see that as "effort" necessarily.  I mean it was a first meet between two strangers, he didn't even know you at that point.

But yet after the meet, he intentionally chose to sit on his ass (sorry) knowing you were interested in seeing him again as evidenced by your responses to his poetry and you initiating a phone call...

I dunno, I hate to sound negative but it all sounds quite manipulative and calculating to me.

I mean who does that?  Intentionally does nothing as some sort of "shyt test" to see if you step up and make "equal effort"?

Equal to what?  His suggestion for a first meet?

And what if you had not stepped up?  That's it?  You failed the shyt test, so CYA?

Anyway, again apologies for sounding negative but this seems very off to me.

Very manipulative and calculating on his part.

I hope I am wrong because I know you really like him; my only advice is stay aware and don't allow chemistry to blind you to possible manipulation and shyt tests.

Best of luck...
 

Apologies Gaeta, I posted this before I read your last response.   Have fun with it, play it out.  You're smart, if he is manipulating and calculating, those colors will show their face in due course, and if they do, you will know what to do.

In the meantime, enjoy and have fun.  Continue keeping options open.  😄
 

Edited July 7, 2021 by poppyfields

[Gaeta]

4 minutes ago, poppyfields said:

Gaeta, sorry to ask again but I am confused about this "effort" he supposedly made such that he required you to make "equal effort" by initiating a second meet/date.

The way I understood it is: He let himself be vulnerable in a way, he expressed in many words and gestures he liked me,  he spoke about personal things like his hopes and fears (not related to me)  On my end, I had a great time BUT I'm guarded, I may not have reciprocated the way he hoped. I'm bubbly and chatty but I don't open up. 

It's not about keeping counts of the invites. It was more about me making a statement gesture. 

[poppyfields]

Just now, Gaeta said:

The way I understood it is: He let himself be vulnerable in a way, he expressed in many words and gestures he liked me,  he spoke about personal things like his hopes and fears (not related to me)  On my end, I had a great time BUT I'm guarded, I may not have reciprocated the way he hoped. I'm bubbly and chatty but I don't open up. 

It's not about keeping counts of the invites. It was more about me making a statement gesture. 

Okay fair enough.  Again enjoy and have fun, and hope the third date goes as well as the first two!

[poppyfields]

1 hour ago, Gaeta said:

The way I understood it is: He let himself be vulnerable in a way, he expressed in many words and gestures he liked me,  he spoke about personal things like his hopes and fears (not related to me)  On my end, I had a great time BUT I'm guarded, I may not have reciprocated the way he hoped. I'm bubbly and chatty but I don't open up. 

It's not about keeping counts of the invites. It was more about me making a statement gesture. 

Gaeta, I hesitated posting this, but re the bolded, after only ONE meet, you behavior was perfectly appropriate.  You were bubbly and chatty, which is normal and healthy for a first meet, and afterwards.

I am curious what he (or you) felt you should you have opened up about? Again it was ONE meet.

HIS behavior was not appropriate.  No one should be expressing their vulnerabilities, their hopes and fears after only one meet, that is over the top and suggests someone who lacks proper boundaries.

And then for him to use that as justification as to why YOU should be initiating the second meet?   To show equal effort?

Equal to what, HIS inappropriateness for spilling his feels during and after the first meet?

I am sorry, I am back to thinking this man is manipulative and he's got you hoodwinked into believing you did something "wrong" by not spilling your feels and being vulnerable the way he was, and punished you for it by sitting on his ass, intentionally not taking initiative, waiting for you to step up and "prove yourself."  

What a load....

I think it's important to put this in proper perspective, this all took place after ONE meet.

Be careful.
 

 

 

Edited July 7, 2021 by poppyfields

[cleverusername]

1 hour ago, Gaeta said:

So where is the harm in all this?

Because l initiated the 2nd date a future relationship is now doomed?

He's nice, he's a total gentleman in his language and behavior around me. No sexual innuendoes and that's like a record for me to not hear it for 2 weeks. (My #10 started asking sex questions after 24 hours.). He doesn't give me the go around, he's there, he texts, he replies within minutes. 

At the restaurant yesterday he was excited to show me his iphone accounting software. His phone was in my hands, he was not in a hurry to get it back, he was relaxed. 

So what he's insecure a bit with women and needed a push. We advise insecure people every day here, they're not ill intent for that. I don't know his dating history, i'm carrying some heavy stuff myself that makes me guarded. 

Now, my dear LS friends. I'm not infatuated, l like him the way l like raspberry ice cream it's nice in the moment. I'm not even sure l can develop feelings for anybody at this time.

I think if l had not invited him he would have eventually, or maybe not. It doesn't matter. 

I'm like 90% sure it was you that told me in an older topic of yours, you are tired of men that are "projects"..... guess what you have here? 

[Eternal Sunshine]

I see no red flags here. He didn't misrepresent himself, lie, been aggressive in words or actions. The fact that he didn't promptly initiate 2nd date is a yellow flag at most. And the worst case scenario is that one day, he will not initiate another date and/or dump Geata. Meh, she will be fine. There is much more to gain than to lose here.

[Eternal Sunshine]

Also to add: when I was younger, I initiated a lot of dates. It is by no means true that most men will go along with going on dates as long as you invite them, even if they are not into you. Especially without sex involved. Men were very quick to fade, cancel, not reply etc regardless of my initiation.