I need some clarity!

[EndlesslyLost]

1 hour ago, spiderowl said:

I am sorry you are feeling so sad about this.  It seems you slipped into an affair without intending to.  You needed comfort and he was there.

I very much doubt that he was worried about crossing boundaries.  He has been crossing boundaries for some time now.  My suspicion is that he thought you were getting too emotionally involved with him and he didn't want to leave his wife so he thought he would stop things there.  No doubt you are feeling hurt because HE made this decision not you.  Even if you know you have no claims on someone, it still hurts when they make decisions for you.

I think you really need to wean yourself off this guy as quickly as you can.  He has shown he is not serious about a relationship.  He is probably hoping you will lose interest in him and his fears of you getting too attached and intruding on his marriage will be quieted.

You don't have to remain friends with him.  That would be very hard for you because you will always want more with him as long as you see him as this wonderful guy who was there for you when you needed him.  He has pulled the plug.  It hurts but don't let him have the pleasure of your company on an occasional basis, as and when he wants.  Why should you?  

This has been forced on you and you will go through a kind of withdrawal.  It is painful, no doubt about it, but hopefully you will come through this and see the relationship for what it was, temporary.  It is instinct to want more from our beloved partner/friend and normally a relationship progresses but this one was not going to progress because he was married.

You need to look after yourself now, maybe find a counsellor if you can afford it to help you through this loss.

 

The relationship was definitely unexpected, and I did absolutely struggle with the fact that he suddenly called it quits. He did ask me to make the decision together but to me that was pointless; if the guilt is too much then it can’t continue & I certainly wasn’t going to beg.

It’s been a rough few weeks but getting easier as the days go by. I miss him a lot and the fact that I had something to look forward to every week but it’s actually given me the opportunity to focus on myself which is where it needs to be. 
I’m sure I would have just continued with it even if it was causing me some hurt so it’s probably a good thing he ended it. 
 

Thanks for your thoughts!

 

 

[ExpatInItaly]

4 hours ago, EndlesslyLost said:

I miss him a lot and the fact that I had something to look forward to every week

Consider exaclty what you miss. Do you miss the attention? The flattering feeling of being desired? The company? 

Because I have a feeling you don't really miss him as a person. He's a dumpster fire, a serial cheat. He lies, disrespects his wife, is selfish. What's to miss about an individual like this? 

[EndlesslyLost]

1 hour ago, ExpatInItaly said:

Consider exaclty what you miss. Do you miss the attention? The flattering feeling of being desired? The company? 

Because I have a feeling you don't really miss him as a person. He's a dumpster fire, a serial cheat. He lies, disrespects his wife, is selfish. What's to miss about an individual like this? 

 

I’ve thought about this a lot actually and I do genuinely miss him as a person & his company.

Yes, he lies, cheats etc but it doesn’t make him an entirely bad person, he has some great qualities and he obviously has some sort of a conscience if he ended it due to guilt. 

My ex partner on the other hand lies, cheats and doesn’t give a toss about who (his kids included) he destroys in his self serving pursuit of pleasure. He’s an absolute shite person.

Same crime but world of difference in who they are as people. 
 

 

[Amethyst68]

1 hour ago, EndlesslyLost said:

 

I’ve thought about this a lot actually and I do genuinely miss him as a person & his company.

Yes, he lies, cheats etc but it doesn’t make him an entirely bad person, he has some great qualities and he obviously has some sort of a conscience if he ended it due to guilt. 

My ex partner on the other hand lies, cheats and doesn’t give a toss about who (his kids included) he destroys in his self serving pursuit of pleasure. He’s an absolute shite person.

Same crime but world of difference in who they are as people. 
 

 

I wonder if his wife would feel the same way? Somehow I don't think finding out your husband's a serial cheat is going to be made better because his OW thinks he has a better character than her cheater ex!

On another note, don't fool yourself, you're still in an affair, you've merely moved more to an EA than a PA. To be honest it sounds like the minute this man suggests being physical again (and it's likely he will), you'll be all in. This will only stop when you go full NC.

Meeting every week for a year? So much for covid and lockdown etc....

[EndlesslyLost]

7 minutes ago, Amethyst68 said:

I wonder if his wife would feel the same way? Somehow I don't think finding out your husband's a serial cheat is going to be made better because his OW thinks he has a better character than her cheater ex!

On another note, don't fool yourself, you're still in an affair, you've merely moved more to an EA than a PA. To be honest it sounds like the minute this man suggests being physical again (and it's likely he will), you'll be all in. This will only stop when you go full NC.

Meeting every week for a year? So much for covid and lockdown etc....

You’re probably right, but going off the little I’ve written about their characters, I don’t expect you would have any idea as to the difference in their personality type.

As for covid and lockdown, I’m lucky enough to be living in Western Australia so it’s not really an issue. 

[solostand]

I can share my own experience with being friend zoned, in 2013, by the MM I was oh so stupidly deeply in love with.

We were seven months into a very hot affair with alleged love and all the love talk future faking etc. involved with that. He actually said he was going to leave her for me, and I believed him if you can imagine how naive I was back then!

Then one weekend he took a trip away with his wife and his family and I lost my mind with rage and jealousy and made that all very very clear to him. I think he thought I was turning psycho. When he returned from his trip, he took me for a drive to the beach, then cried while he told me that he could not leave his wife, he owed her loyalty et cetera et cetera. But he wanted EVERY SINGLE thing to be exactly the same, except, no sex. Long and deep phone calls, sometimes seven a day, seeing each other daily, confiding in each other, he was financially supporting me at the time as I recall. Ha ha.

I did not agree, but I was broken hearted and lasted NC two days. Then we were having sex daily again and this lasted for two more years, except, now I had been informed he was Never Leaving Wife and I had tacitly accepted that.

My story gets worse and ended with criminal charges and a restraining order.

So there was no contact for six years and last month, who do I walk right into, but him! And what does he expect the very moment he sees me? You fill in the blanks.

Now I am damaged again and in no contact again. It truly truly is not worth it. 

[Amethyst68]

15 minutes ago, EndlesslyLost said:

You’re probably right, but going off the little I’ve written about their characters, I don’t expect you would have any idea as to the difference in their personality type.

As for covid and lockdown, I’m lucky enough to be living in Western Australia so it’s not really an issue. 

You're right I don't know either man or their personality but you're fooling yourself if you think his wife won't feel the same way about him as you feel about your ex. Remember, he's portraying a character with you, putting up a facade or playing KISA to get him what he wants. The wife gets the real him, the one that probably doesn't make that much of an effort!

[EndlesslyLost]

1 minute ago, solostand said:

I can share my own experience with being friend zoned, in 2013, by the MM I was oh so stupidly deeply in love with.

We were seven months into a very hot affair with alleged love and all the love talk future faking etc. involved with that. He actually said he was going to leave her for me, and I believed him if you can imagine how naive I was back then!

Then one weekend he took a trip away with his wife and his family and I lost my mind with rage and jealousy and made that all very very clear to him. I think he thought I was turning psycho. When he returned from his trip, he took me for a drive to the beach, then cried while he told me that he could not leave his wife, he owed her loyalty et cetera et cetera. But he wanted EVERY SINGLE thing to be exactly the same, except, no sex. Long and deep phone calls, sometimes seven a day, seeing each other daily, confiding in each other, he was financially supporting me at the time as I recall. Ha ha.

I did not agree, but I was broken hearted and lasted NC two days. Then we were having sex daily again and this lasted for two more years, except, now I had been informed he was Never Leaving Wife and I had tacitly accepted that.

My story gets worse and ended with criminal charges and a restraining order.

So there was no contact for six years and last month, who do I walk right into, but him! And what does he expect the very moment he sees me? You fill in the blanks.

Now I am damaged again and in no contact again. It truly truly is not worth it. 

Oh my gosh, your story sounds absolutely painful and I’m so sorry you ran into him again.

It’s quite scary how deeply we can feel and how twisted these relationships can be.

I hope you’re doing well and staying strong. Thanks so much for sharing 😊

 

[EndlesslyLost]

1 minute ago, Amethyst68 said:

You're right I don't know either man or their personality but you're fooling yourself if you think his wife won't feel the same way about him as you feel about your ex. Remember, he's portraying a character with you, putting up a facade or playing KISA to get him what he wants. The wife gets the real him, the one that probably doesn't make that much of an effort!

I don’t disagree at all that she wouldn’t feel the same. I understand that I don’t get the real him in fact I always wondered who he was outside of our little bubble but I just can’t put both men in the same box, there is just too much of a difference. 

 

 

[solostand]

2 minutes ago, EndlesslyLost said:

Oh my gosh, your story sounds absolutely painful and I’m so sorry you ran into him again.

It’s quite scary how deeply we can feel and how twisted these relationships can be.

I hope you’re doing well and staying strong. Thanks so much for sharing 😊

 

I am staying strong and angry too!

But I believed probably right up until three months ago that this man was the love of my life. I believed deeply that he loved me too. 

But so the f*** what? Now here he is, all these years later, trying to drag me back in to a relationship that almost killed me and almost destroyed his marriage? The first time he saw me he touched me sexually!!! I was told last week that his wife is now searching his phone for my number!!! (It will not be there, I guarantee that, so I hope she can relax). All those years ago I sent the wife an hour long tape of her husband telling me he loved me, and disparaging her. Because he denied it.

Thank God I don't have to live there anymore nor do YOU!!!! You are worth more!!

[EndlesslyLost]

1 minute ago, solostand said:

I am staying strong and angry too!

But I believed probably right up until three months ago that this man was the love of my life. I believed deeply that he loved me too. 

But so the f*** what? Now here he is, all these years later, trying to drag me back in to a relationship that almost killed me and almost destroyed his marriage? The first time he saw me he touched me sexually!!! I was told last week that his wife is now searching his phone for my number!!! (It will not be there, I guarantee that, so I hope she can relax). All those years ago I sent the wife an hour long tape of her husband telling me he loved me, and disparaging her. Because he denied it.

Thank God I don't have to live there anymore nor do YOU!!!! You are worth more!!

I don’t blame you being angry, I honestly can’t imagine how you must be feeling. 
The cheek & entitlement is unbelievable! 

I feel like I’ve been seeing my situation clearly but maybe I’m not being as smart as I should be especially after reading your story.

I do appreciate you sharing, it’s given me plenty to think about. 

 

 

[stillafool]

On 8/18/2021 at 10:45 AM, Myabee said:

I liked writing down what I was feeling. xx 

Then start a journal.  It really helps.

[Starswillshine]

Is he really better character or is he just better at hiding it? Beware of the wolf in sheep clothing. Don't get stuck in the mindset of "at least he isn't as bad as my husband."

Let me tell you, my xWH was gentle, caring, spoke nothing but my praises..... he was also a serial cheat and when I found out became physical, his eyes changed, said the most disgusting words ever... 

I rather know what I am dealing with. And well, you have the evidence he is not a good man. Good men don't use people. He is a serial cheat, he is using all the women in his life. 

[EndlesslyLost]

21 minutes ago, Starswillshine said:

Is he really better character or is he just better at hiding it? Beware of the wolf in sheep clothing. Don't get stuck in the mindset of "at least he isn't as bad as my husband."

Let me tell you, my xWH was gentle, caring, spoke nothing but my praises..... he was also a serial cheat and when I found out became physical, his eyes changed, said the most disgusting words ever... 

I rather know what I am dealing with. And well, you have the evidence he is not a good man. Good men don't use people. He is a serial cheat, he is using all the women in his life. 

I’m sorry you had to deal with that. I do see your point, he could very well be hiding his true character and I’m probably still wearing my rose coloured glasses.  

But it does feel like night and day between them, probably because my ex is a gaslighting, nasty narc type person with no empathy whatsoever. 

Aside from his obvious cheating I just find it hard to accept that MM is not a good person especially when he has been so supportive. Gosh, it all sounds so ridiculous, lol. 

Thanks for replying! 



 

[stillafool]

By entering an affair this is the risk one takes.  The man is cheating on his wife, lying to her and probably gaslighting her to.   OW know it's wrong to involve themselves with someone else's spouse but are happy to engage - until, they find out the same man who is lying to his wife has lied to her.  Now she's so hurt because she felt she was different and more special than his wife, who he has no intention of leaving; and would rather move on to a new OW who will look at him like a hero again.  This is pretty much karma coming back to bite.

[mark clemson]

Cheating is extremely common. All kinds of people cheat, and for a variety of different reasons. Painting them all with the same brush is, IMO, irrational and essentially stereotyping. Some who cheat may have tried all manner of things to improve their marriages and, while it IS inherently unethical, may well consider it "gentler" than e.g. divorcing. Perhaps their spouses would also see it that way, perhaps not, but I'm speaking of their perspective specifically.

Your MM has told you what he intends. In your specific case I think there is little point in trying to make it more or worrying about what he does next. Let him go - "closure" will eventually come from within, it may take a while longer than you like, but when you are "there" you will be free to move on to a presumably more healthy relationship.

Since he is apparently a serial cheat, his spouse will likely eventually discover it and whatever consequences there are to be for him will at that point ensue. Since you won't have anything to do with him at that point, you won't appreciate how lucky you are to NOT be a part of the (probable) severe sh*tshow.

[stillafool]

1 hour ago, mark clemson said:

Cheating is extremely common. All kinds of people cheat, and for a variety of different reasons. Painting them all with the same brush is, IMO, irrational and essentially stereotyping.

So is stealing, homicide, domestic violence and pedophila; but no matter what brush you paint them with or the reasons why, it's wrong!  You can say it's irrational and sterotypical to think that way but it still doesn't change the fact that it's wrong.

[mark clemson]

^^ that's fine if you feel that way, but WRT to cheating, lumping it in with the crimes you mention is in actuality, just your opinion, not some fact about the world. There are those who feel that e.g. divorce is just as wrong or more wrong in some cases. Sure it's unethical. So are the oversize packages you see at any grocery store. That's life.

There are all sorts of situations in the world that some will see as much more "unjust" than others, CEO salaries, really almost any "controversial" issue - even eating meat is a "crime" to some (many, in fact). That's all that's going on here. Speaking generally, I think there are many people who see their own personal biases as "facts" when quite simply they are not.

[Starswillshine]

3 hours ago, EndlesslyLost said:

Aside from his obvious cheating I just find it hard to accept that MM is not a good person especially when he has been so supportive. Gosh, it all sounds so ridiculous, lol. 

Yes. It is quite ridiculous. Anyone can be supportive. My ex was quite supportive... IS quite supportive. To anyone and everyone. He would give the shirt off of his back to anyone. He would move heaven and earth to make things happen for just about anyone. I have no doubt I could call him at 3am for anything and he would come running (much to the dismay of his live in girlfriend). He SEEMS like an amazing person, until that one day when it all slips and you realize it is all fake. 

A good man doesn't cheat on his wife multiple times with various women. It doesn't matter what ridiculous explanation that some other posters may come up with that might have someone saying yes of course that is so much better than divorce... <insert eyeroll>. There may be good people who have made certain choices that led them down the path of an affair and realize their ways..  but good people do not go on the hunt for affairS. Plural. 

[stillafool]

16 minutes ago, mark clemson said:

just your opinion,

Exactly and I orginally gave my opinion which you didn't agree with and I don't agree with yours.  We can agree to disagree.

[spiderowl]

17 hours ago, EndlesslyLost said:

The relationship was definitely unexpected, and I did absolutely struggle with the fact that he suddenly called it quits. He did ask me to make the decision together but to me that was pointless; if the guilt is too much then it can’t continue & I certainly wasn’t going to beg.

It’s been a rough few weeks but getting easier as the days go by. I miss him a lot and the fact that I had something to look forward to every week but it’s actually given me the opportunity to focus on myself which is where it needs to be. 
I’m sure I would have just continued with it even if it was causing me some hurt so it’s probably a good thing he ended it. 
 

Thanks for your thoughts!

 

 

I do feel for you.  I do not feel for him, however.  I think he is using the excuse of feeling guilty to end it.  He hasn't felt guilty until now has he?

At what point should one feel guilty in an affair?

Edited August 24, 2021 by spiderowl

[IfWishesWereHorses]

13 hours ago, EndlesslyLost said:

I’m sorry you had to deal with that. I do see your point, he could very well be hiding his true character and I’m probably still wearing my rose coloured glasses.  

But it does feel like night and day between them, probably because my ex is a gaslighting, nasty narc type person with no empathy whatsoever. 

Aside from his obvious cheating I just find it hard to accept that MM is not a good person especially when he has been so supportive. Gosh, it all sounds so ridiculous, lol. 

Thanks for replying! 



 

Do you know when narcs portray empathy and being a caring person??? When they’re chasing their next narcissistic supply! They can be the most charming and most despicable people in the world depending on which side you’re on at the moment. Could you fall for that twice??? Because they definitely have a type! 

[EndlesslyLost]

36 minutes ago, IfWishesWereHorses said:

Do you know when narcs portray empathy and being a caring person??? When they’re chasing their next narcissistic supply! They can be the most charming and most despicable people in the world depending on which side you’re on at the moment. Could you fall for that twice??? Because they definitely have a type! 

I understand the love bombing & the discard. I’ve been to hell and back multiple times with my ex and I did not feel anything remotely similar with MM to what I experienced with my ex.