Financial Infidelity and I'm just broken

[ImSoAngry]

I read here for years and years and once in a while felt like joining for some prob or other because you all are so freaking smart.  I quit reading when the pandemic started (at least a hundred and fifty years ago now) and switched to books. I did learn tons through. I’m completely stumped right now and have come out of hiding for a little support. I think I’m numb.  Here’s the story. 
any advice or insight or anything to help at all will be appreciated.  

Dear Wise People,

My husband has been lying to me for 2+ years about our money. (I gave him control about 7 years ago because I developed really bad stress from my job and the physical and mental consequences of that.). I don’t know how long he’s been lying yet because he’s trickle truthing this to death.  I found out last summer that we had zero savings because he had to give it to my daughter over time for her mortgage.   He didn’t confess, I dragged it out of him. I asked him to help her, but instead of telling me we had no savings (and it wasn’t chump change either) he opened a credit card. I found out last night it has $7,000 on it.  So he says. He blamed everyone else the first time I caught him for spending the money. Even me. He makes a fair amount and we only had the basic bills at that time. I hardly ever buy anything for myself  

I had found out again two weeks ago the basic truth when I insisted he tell me what he’s hiding, again. I never thought in a million years that it was all this. I finally knew though, cause apparently he’s a very good liar, that something was up.  I told him he needed to do a lot of reading about financial infidelity and lying and figure out how to make me understand how badly he’s hurt me. He lied hundreds of times as we talked about future things and when I asked about the savings account. I just trusted him, but now I look like a f’ing fool because everyone knew about this but me.  He’s done nothing, zero, ziltch. He just tried to slide back into his life. 

I got my bank info to sign in. He told me it was quiet screwed up and would require a big ta-do to fix it. Not even close. I just needed a new password. So I gave him a week to come all the way clean and he didn’t. Then I got a call our mortgage wasn’t paid.  We had the money. He said he forgot.  Then I saw the credit card payment on the checking account. Total shock. 

For perspective on how shitty my life already was, my daughter and son in law had to move in last fall.  It was a nightmare but because they had my 2 yo granddaughter, what could I do. It was so stressful to live with them and their dysfunction. Also because I was stuck at home with them because I don’t have a car.  Now I know why. He just didn’t care that I was a prisoner. 

Daughter is not a good mom.  I had to make sure the baby had everything.  Now mind you, this is after I found out the first time about his lies and my daughter had been giving me problems for a while before that so I was already a mess. I guess while with us, they ramped up their heroine addiction and moved out angrily and suddenly in May and I had a literal breakdown from worry for the baby.  When I got out of the hospital, my daughter decided mostly because of her husband that I couldn’t see her ( the baby). I was devastated.  I was extremely fragile mentally so I decided to go camping for a month. I didn’t know we didn’t have any money and he didn’t say anything. I would say it was money well spent though.  It helped immensely.  

They went by his sisters to live and  with whom they left the baby for a week or something. She turned them into CPS and really pushed the case. She got temporary custody and I even got to see her after five weeks while camping. She loves me and I her. It was awesome  

It’s been a even bigger nightmare since then. My daughter is so mad and I worry so much about her. The child stays with me three nights a week and by her aunts and sister the rest of the time. She’s a wonderful kid, but she is exhausting.  And it’s not going to end anytime soon. With this latest bombshell, I sometimes feel like I should just bow out and take off.  But I’m trapped, I can’t go any where. I just can’t give her as much as the other people can. 

I will be taking over finances completely. I’m good at it I guess. I thought no one could be as stupid as him.  We have one daughter together who is almost 18 and she’s cut off also. Thankfully she just got a job and I think she understands the gravity of things. 

During all this time he’s been distant quite a bit and our marriage is basically nothing now.  Any plans we had are gone with his lies. 

I have a little money saved and have means to make a little more right now. First thing is to have a talk about how he wants to do things.  I would prefer not to divorce. He’s not a bad guy but all the lying has made it impossible to even look at him. I keep thinking of all the lies he told me. I’m so stupid but I was doing the best I could. But if he sticks with his current BS, we have to get everything under control and figure out who is responsible for what so the separation papers can be swiftly filed.  At least I’d be protected then. I then need a car. I’ve been wanting to get back into working at a paying job for a while, but my 20 yo car was gone to my daughter.  It was literally rusting apart but he keeps bringing up that I had a car I gave away.  I didn’t actually do that but they needed transportation.  So I feel really stupid about trusting them also. Screwed us over big time. But again, H made all the decisions for us. 

He’s also just been so distant. So so distant. I really feel like an idiot. And I’m scared to start over with nothing, especially having to deal with everything else. And I have no one to talk to. No one.  I don’t really want to make him look like a bad guy to everyone. Except his parents so he doesn’t get away with blaming everyone else. We have no relationship. I feel bad for bringing it back up, he’s trying   I don’t think he wanted to screw things up so bad, but regardless, the damage is done.  I can’t just go back to normal, which is what?  We’ve only lived in Lie Ville forever.  

Sorry this is so long. Felt good to write it. I really think he thinks it’s no big deal. Well, I’ll show him I’m 100% serious.  Mostly I’m calm, but I know it’s because I’m stuffing it all down. I feel it coming up from time to time but I can’t handle getting upset anymore. I’ve literally developed vitiligo this summer from stress. Finally made an appointment for next week. All over my body. Life sucks. I wish he would of had an affair.  That would have been more cut and dry. 

If you got through this, thank you. I don’t know the last time someone listened to me 

 

[FMW]

Wow, that's  a lot to deal with.  When things are so overwhelming I think you have to break things down into pieces and start dealing with the piece that can most likely bring you the most relief.  It seems like you're doing that, taking over the finances.  It's  hard to focus on anything else when the basics (food, shelter, transportation, etc) are not stable.

I'm sure in part your husband is so distant because he's embarrassed and feels humiliated that you now know the truth about where things stand financially.  I'm  sure he very much feels the revulsion you have for him right now, and that of course will also keep him distant.

Just take things step by step and day by day.  Don't take on more than you can handle right now.  Definitely think about your options, including divorce, but don't jump into anything immediately.  You can likely find a divorce attorney who will give you an initial free consultation.  That might provide useful information whether or not you do chose to divorce now or in the future.

Don't  beat yourself up.  We live and learn.  Just focus on moving forward.

Edited September 2, 2021 by FMW

[Cersei]

I have no words of wisdom really, but hang in there.

[Wiseman2]

Yes. Keep an eye on the finances. As a married couple your assets and debts are a joint situation.

Check your credit scores and his. Shut down unnessary credit cards,etc. Start the financial clean up process. 

You need a CPA. You need a financial advisor.

Most of all you need marriage therapy since you refuse to divorce.

However consulting an attorney about the risks of staying with him financially would be a much better idea.

Edited September 2, 2021 by Wiseman2

[d0nnivain]

First things 1st.  If your daughter is a heroin addict, no more money to her until she is clean or if you are paying for rehab.  Second serious consider calling child protective services & getting your grand-daughter away from her permanently.  

Now that you have addressed the life & death stuff, lets look at the financials.  

It's time for you to take charge of your money again.  I'm going to be optimistic & hope that your DH kept all these secrets from you because he didn't want to stress you more.  Ask him about why things got like this. Try not to yell or scream about the present mess.  Give him reasons not to lie.  I hope it was because he was protecting you & trying to balance / maintain while your addict daughter & SIL were bleeding you dry.  I really think he's embarrassed that things are this out of control.  It started spiralling down & he didn't know how to stop it.  

You say DH is a good earner.  Great!  It's time to make a budget.  Sit down with him & do it together.  Get yourself that new to you car & a new job.  I think you can find a path forward if he's willing to walk it with you. It sounds like he's embarrassed that things got so screwed up on his watch.  He has to be stressed over your daughter's addiction too.  Be mad at your daughter not your husband.  He didn't do this intentionally with malice.  He made mistakes & then handled it badly.  

[Crazelnut]

Please consider going to Al Anon to learn how to let go of your feelings of responsibility and guilt toward your daughter. It's an alcohol-centric program but applies to families of any kind of addiction. And no more helping your daughter in any way. You literally can't afford to even feed them, much less house and support them. 

Then GET A JOB. You can't afford to do nothing. 

Next: (1) Get your mental health under control. Medicate if necessary.  You also can't afford to avoid situations because of stress, anxiety or depression. You need to be able to face your challenges head on. (2) See a lawyer to discuss your options. You may be better off filing bankruptcy and/or divorcing him.  It may not be what you want to do, but it may be what you NEED to do to protect yourself. 

Good luck. I'm so sorry you're in this situation. He really screwed you over.

Edited September 2, 2021 by Crazelnut

[mark clemson]

If you were not married he would be guilty of committing fraud. Something to consider...

[S2B]

Where is his money he was earning?

if you had heroin users in your home - it’s likely that anything worth $5 got pawned for their drugs.

if he can’t get it together and become predictable, honest and responsible then divorce him.

he stole your money and peace of mind. If he’s not willing to do everything he can to repair that damage he caused then leave him.

ifyou aren’t doing what’s best for taking care of yourself - there’s nothing you can do to help others…but first your H has to stop being a lousy partner.

[d0nnivain]

5 hours ago, Crazelnut said:

Please consider going to Al Anon to learn how to let go of your feelings of responsibility and guilt toward your daughter. It's an alcohol-centric program but applies to families of any kind of addiction. 

Good idea in theory.  Take it a step further @ImSoAngry  Find a narc-Anon meeting. Same thing except for it helps the families of drug addicts.  

[Caauug]

On 9/2/2021 at 7:34 AM, ImSoAngry said:

My husband has been lying to me for 2+ years about our money. (I gave him control about 7 years ago because I developed really bad stress from my job and the physical and mental consequences of that.)

For 2+yrs you have just ignored all the family finances and didn't know what he was doing with it? I think you have to take some blame..... You and your H should be partners, partners work together and keep each other in check...

I made the same mistake as you did and blind trusted my wife.... Major mistake!!! My finances didn't sound as bad as yours.... but still heaps of money missing. Never again will I make that mistake...

On 9/2/2021 at 7:34 AM, ImSoAngry said:

I will be taking over finances completely. I’m good at it I guess.

No, never say you are good at finances... What ever happens someone can always come up where you failed to make a good investment. Just do the best you can with the knowledge you have. Never gamble (opportunity to loose some or all) money you can't afford to loose. Research any investments with more than one view. 

Remember, your 401, super, RRSP's or what ever your country has, people gamble (opportunity to loose some or all) with your funds. They play the stock market etc. to try to increase your wealth while taking nice income for themselves in fees.... You can likely do this yourself better with a little knowledge and a trading account. You can not just forget about it for years like you did with your H....

Good Luck and never make this mistake again....

[spiderowl]

I am sorry to hear what happened, OP.  It sounds like a heck of a lot to deal with.

I think it's good that you are taking control of the finances.  I know it must seem to you like you can't take time off, like the whole family depends on you to keep things sorted.  It must feel like a terrible responsibility.

I have not heard of financial infidelity before but it seems to me it is more like lying.  Once the trust has gone it is very hard to regain it.

I know you are thinking of separation but please consult a lawyer and ensure you have proper financial separation, otherwise you will be liable for any debts your husband runs up.  You are already liable, as you know, and that must be incredibly painful.  Basically, I am saying, do what is necessary to avoid any further liability from his actions.

I hate to say this but if he lies about this, what else has he lied about?  Are there other debts you are not aware of?  It would be wise to go through the spending on all the accounts you are aware of, see where the money went and if it tallies with income.  Maybe checking your credit score is another place to start because that will reveal any other problems that have got as far as the credit checkers.  I loathe these companies, by the way, they have more information about us than they should have and then try to draw us in further by offering this 'wonderful' credit score.  Hmm.  But, that's by the by, at the moment it is a tool for you to see if there is something else your husband has kept quiet.

I can imagine this is really stressful for you.  Are there any support organisations locally, maybe free counselling?  I know it's a long shot and it depends where you live.

You need to find out where your husband's salary has been going.  If you haven't used it up for bills or anything, what explanation does he have?  You also need to legally separate your finances as soon as possible.

 

Edited September 8, 2021 by spiderowl

[ImSoAngry]

September 15th- Dear Kind People,  I guess I can only deal with this in doses, but I’m ready again.   This is also very long. Just warning you. 

 

I read Donnivan’s response and I had to stop and think.  I mean it’s not that simple, but I contemplated it for a while and decided the money wasn’t the important thing.  It is the lying.  When he knows he’s hurting me and continues to lie, it’s too much to wrap my brain around. He also got both my kids involved and really created some huge issues in everyone’s life. Long lasting consequences for everyone.  Yes he was generous with everyone, but also very resentful of it.  Especially when he got caught.  He just couldn’t say no. 

 

Either way, I wrote him a letter stating how I was feeling and that I was willing to try and rebuild our marriage differently, so it’s satisfying for both of us.  I just have some questions about what he all did, because I’m sick of finding things one at a time.  I also asked for a sincere apology because I haven’t even gotten any kind.  I just need all this to show he is committed to working on us. 

 

He won’t do it.  I’ve asked him several times and he says he will, but doesn’t know when. He’s never responded when I try to talk about stuff. He just waits till I blow and dump it all on him. He listens and then apologizes.  Or else he gets mad and then says mean things that really have nothing to do with anything at the moment. All it does is show me what he’s really thinking.  

 

So now what?  I can’t leave now and I hate to just bide my time planning.  He knows though I’m on my way out because he won’t talk. I’m packing my personal stuff up to clear up some space for toys, but it’s also so I can grab all the stuff I want at one time. 

 

I just don’t understand. He says he wants me in his life and he’s very supportive of my ambitions, but that seems to be it. I really don’t want a divorce, but I guess that’s different then wanting to stay with someone. He just has me over a barrel right now because I need a stable home for my granddaughter, plus I need his help in keeping her busy. I can only do so much. 

 

I have been sharing with him though when I’m upset about what he did and that he won’t talk about it. Why should I have to deal with this all my self?  I’m really starting to doubt myself. Could he really be pushing this so far because he wants a divorce but wants me to be the bad guy?  I know you can’t answer that but it’s something I have to seriously think about. 

 

Also, the child is doing good. Guardianship is in place.  She has visitation with my daughter, but her dad left the state and is at visitation via zoom. I think that’s hard on her because she is a daddies girl and just doesn’t understand. It breaks my heart. It’s probably hard on her to go between a couple places to live, but both are full of love for her. I just feel bad that my house is a hovel compared to there’s.  

 

So there’s my update.  I’m not good at asking for help because very few people have ever helped me when I did ask.  And I’ve never belonged to a forum. Bare with me. I appreciate all of you. 

 

Update to my update-  As for your advice, I do think narc a non meetings are a good idea.   I also had my meds changed at the hospital when I had my breakdown. I have to go up slowly, but I think it’s working good. While I’m nowhere near happy or even content, I am feeling like taking care of myself better.  It’s getting my anxiety under control.  Plus I try to paint most days, even for at least a bit.  Im getting some little but important things taken care of of that just stick in my mind. I will get a job, I’ve just been really sick with abdominal issues the past 6 years where I couldn’t work. That was the gift of the worst job ever. It was a good job and I loved it, but stayed too long under a lunatic because I loved it.   I did start a little plant business that’s a lot of work. I do make a little money at that, plus I get to interact with many people who think I’m so smart about succulents.  

 

It is fraud what he did and I thought I read that in no-fault states, anything he does himself is his responsibility. I know I wasn’t paying attention, I had a lot going on. I’m an extremely highly sensitive person and things just really get to me and I didn’t have a team player husband. That’s what I crave.  I’m great as a team leader.  I also have tons of family problems because I can’t tolerate bad behavior towards me anymore. I am often misunderstood, but I watch what I say and do to people as to not put them down or hurt them.  I’m learning that it isn’t always the best way to go about things. I just usually don’t want to hear lame excuses or denials anymore because I’m now certain that these people will never understand or change. But I guess my husband needs to hear my truth right now. He may not be talking about it because he still blames everyone else and knows I will not accept that.  Plus, I agree entirely that “what else is he hiding” is entirely valid. He’s clearly a pretty good liar. 

 

For now I will just have to bide my time, because as much as I feel the pull of his rug sweeping, I can’t see myself just forgetting about this.  

 

We are already saving much more money. I told him he needs to figure out how to pay that credit card off.  Otherwise I’ll have to see the payment every month. That’s what will make it a life sentence for him, I know myself too well to deny that it will piss me off every month for the rest of my life if he makes minimum payments. I also don’t want to save money just to pay that off.  Though I guess if I have a good chunk saved, by then I’ll know if it’s going to work here or if I’m hitting the road. Then I’ll use it for a lawyer and moving. I have a great lawyer who’s awesome. 

 

My daughter seems to be doing a little better. Being apart from her loser husband is good for her. She found what seems like a decent person to help her. Shes got a long way to go though. 

 

Thanks for listening.  You can tell I have no one to talk to about these things. 

-Angry. 

[S2B]

You take charge of all the money and don’t allow your husband to spend/pay for things.

if it’s that important to you - then take care of this area yourself.

[Caauug]

20 hours ago, ImSoAngry said:

I thought I read that in no-fault states, anything he does himself is his responsibility.

Financially while married, (not separated) is normally joint. Debt should be paid first, then split the assets. Unless a private agreement can be reached and refinancing can happen to clear the other person of the debt. You can't expect to take half (Some places can be up to 70% for the wife) the value of the assets and leave him with 100% of the debt, as his part of the assets may not pay that debt. The assets may also be because of the debt.

Seek local legal advice.

21 hours ago, ImSoAngry said:

I told him he needs to figure out how to pay that credit card off.  Otherwise I’ll have to see the payment every month. That’s what will make it a life sentence for him, I know myself too well to deny that it will piss me off every month for the rest of my life if he makes minimum payments. I also don’t want to save money just to pay that off.

What??? You are saving money in an account earning <5% interest and still paying a CC that is charging you >10% interest and your money is common as you are still together? How does this add up? Cut the CC up, take savings and pay the highest % interest debt first. 

To have more money: There are only two ways I know of, unless you are going to knock off a rich rellie.... Earn more or reduce spending. Pay the debts that are charging you the highest interest rates first, this reduces your spending.