GF sent flirty/sexual messages to guy at work, am I overreacting?

[dramafreezone]

3 minutes ago, elaine567 said:

And they tend to be the cheaters...

Well, I guess my point is that if you cheat once, are you a cheater?  A person can be great about decision making and have a singular lapse in judgment that one night, and bam, they're a cheater.  I don't look at anyone and think that they're incapable of cheating, that includes my family, my mom, by father, my sister.  We're people and we make mistakes.  Some just make them more often.

[elaine567]

I don't think you get a pass just because you cheat once, but if you are very young then I do believe youth can give you a pass.
A fully grown adult knows what they are doing...

[PotatoHead]

I guess I think of there being a set of values and a level of integrity that each person holds themselves to.  Those can certainly change over time, for example having an eye-opening close call like this situation my GF went through, where she could have ruined our relationship.  Maybe that could cause someone to make sure they don't get into those situations and hold themselves to a higher standard from then forward.  Her integrity also could have been lower than normal at that time due to being depressed, not thinking highly of herself, etc.

There is also a person's inherent value of honesty that comes into question though.  Obviously she felt bad about those messages and didn't want it to go any further because she ended it, but she had no intention of telling me about it either.  This tells me there is a way of thinking that, what they don't know won't hurt them.  But the truth almost always comes out, and when it did, she certainly regretted it and felt bad about it then.  Those feelings should have come right when the situation happened though, or prevented it from ever happening in the first place.

Edited October 21, 2021 by PotatoHead

[Lotsgoingon]

4 hours ago, PotatoHead said:

.... we already did have a break for a while this summer while I figured things out.  I was even less happy during that break, and worried even more about what she might be doing. 

This is not the sign of a good relationship. Sorry--not even close. And it makes no sense that while separated (I guess a planned separation?) you are worried about what she's going to do. If you don't trust her, you should not be dating her. 

[PotatoHead]

27 minutes ago, Lotsgoingon said:

This is not the sign of a good relationship. Sorry--not even close. And it makes no sense that while separated (I guess a planned separation?) you are worried about what she's going to do. If you don't trust her, you should not be dating her. 

Fair enough.  I was still reeling with hurt from what she did and questioning whether more had happened, so I thought we needed some space.  At the same time, still loving her and not being able to move on.  So being on a break, yes I worried about what she might do, she was in emotional turmoil and could have acted rashly.  But she didn't.

I struggle with trust issues now, yes.  But I would like to think that this is something we can recover from.  I know that we can given enough time, but I worry about things being hidden, the lying and the possibility of something happening again.

[spiderowl]

I get the impression that there are various things going on:

- She got lonely and anxious because you and she were living apart, you still had your wife and family with you (albeit until separation), and you were taking it slow

- She is genuinely upset at being found out and obviously does not want to lose you.  By offering her phone up, she is taking some steps to regain your trust

- You have both been unfaithful instead of trying to resolve problems in your marriage or separating if you could not resolve them

- You have been 'going slow' (as you say) and that may have frustrated your partner and made her doubt your commitment to her

- She may be more impulsive by nature than you, hence concerns about 'going slow' - she knows what she wants and she goes for it.  You know what you want and go for it, but are rather more cautious

- I suspect if you react to this breach of trust by going even slower, the relationship will run into the same kind of trouble again as she will feel your hesitancy

- If you go ahead with the relationship as you had planned, she may fall into infidelity again, especially if she is an impulsive, instant gratification type of person

I don't think you feel you can 'trust' her as such but she might be genuinely remorseful and dedicated (as far as she is consciously able at the moment) to convincing you she can be trusted and making it work.  What happened was a breach of trust in a relationship that she purports to want against all others.  Yes, she may have just enjoyed the attention, but she was responding to it positively too and maybe encouraging more.  With most people, their problems 'leak' out in some form or another: some turn to alcohol, some turn to social media, others have affairs

I think if you go ahead, it would be best to get on with it and not to keep 'going slow' but to keep financial affairs separate and not to involve your children at this point.  How you can convince her you were all 'in it' whilst keeping one foot out for safety, I don't know, but it may be better than regretting too much financial involvement and further emotional upset for the children.

As you say, you really don't know her history, whether this was the first affair like you or not.  When you and she were chatting initially, who was driving the efforts to get together and then to become more involved?  Was it mutual or was one of you pushing things more than the other?

Good luck!

 

Edited October 21, 2021 by spiderowl

[Lotsgoingon]

3 hours ago, PotatoHead said:

I struggle with trust issues now, yes.  But I would like to think that this is something we can recover from.  I know that we can given enough time, but I worry about things being hidden, the lying and the possibility of something happening again.

I'm assuming your worries and insecurities don't lead you to be violent and controlling. I hope I'm right there. So pushing those tendencies aside, you're getting relationships wrong. You need a partner who calms your insecurities, and that's for people who are highly confident all the way to people who are not confident. If your worries of her cheating are intrusive, then you're with the wrong person. It's that simple. Doesn't matter if you're insecure. 

[elaine567]

There is a tendency to label people as "insecure" as if it is a negative personality trait, but whilst some are indeed chronically insecure over little or nothing, more are "insecure" as something in their life is making them insecure.
Here you have every right to be insecure, as your gf is acting in a way that very few would be secure about.
She has  violated your trust and that is a huge deal.

[Lotsgoingon]

Totally agree @elaine567 and I have  been on both sides of the "I'm feeling insecure" thing. The times I've felt insecure--my gut was totally right, picking up that the women I was dating had one leg out of the relationship and weren't that into me. During the insecure times, I would work hard to reassure myself, doubt the alarms going off, try to find evidence that my fears weren't true (there's always some evidence you can conjure up if you are really motivated).  I mean, I really worked hard to reassure myself--only find out end the end that these women weren't into me. My gut fear was right all along to feel "insecure." 

Then on the other side, my ex was in many ways objectively insecure. Could compliment her once and five minutes later, she'd forgotten about it. She was raised in abusive family, always feared abandonment, got hypervigilant at times. All the same, it turned out she was right to be insecure about me. I was so ambivalent. I didn't know I was ambivalent. I was in the phase of "it's time to be serious and committed" and so I tried to hide the ambivalence from her and from myself. I didn't realize then that it's really hard to hide ambivalence. It sneaks out in your body language and in lots of little ways. 

My ex, because she had all these alarm systems from growing up, was actually excellent at noticing my body language changes signaling that I was exhausted, tired around her and not excited and so on. I realized this partly at the time--I think her accuracy frightened me and shamed me. But quickly I hid behind "I'm here, I'm treating you well." Looking back,  I don't think she ever felt deeply insecure when I was feeling strongly positive about her and relaxed around her. She was often mildly insecure (but this was tolerable).  But when when got deeply insecure, she was absolutely on the money in picking up that I was not feeling her.

I only figured this out and admitted this in retrospect. Quite humbling. 

[PotatoHead]

Lots to respond to here.  First, @spiderowl thank you, you made so many good points that I feel are very reasonable and things for me to think about.  To answer your final question, when we first started talking, she was a little more into me and wanting to move things faster than I was.  I had most of the work to do, being the one that travelled to see her and ultimately moved.  But she initially wanted to move in together as soon as possible.  I haven’t slowed things down much as far as her and I are concerned, but am holding off on any bigger steps such as moving in together, getting the kids involved, etc.  She seems okay with it now and understanding, just happy to have me.  She always does her best to reassure me when I have concerns, but I don’t think she fully understands that every night after work when she’s telling me about her interactions with other men, despite them being innocent it makes my stomach turn.  It’s hard because I want her to stay open with me and tell me these things, not expect a bad reaction. 
 

@Lotsgoingon no, I would absolutely never turn to being violent or controlling. Quite the opposite, when I am feeling the anxiety or jealousy I generally shut down or become distant, until we get a chance to talk it out.  And as I said, she is always happy to reassure me as much as she can try to.  Although having these talks wear on her as well and I feel bad bringing it up at times.  She once told me, it’s just hard talking about the worst thing she’s ever done in her life over and over again. 

Edited October 22, 2021 by PotatoHead

[Lotsgoingon]

Since you are not controlling, there's a 99 percent chance that all your "insecurities" are quite accurate and helpful--telling you that the relationship is not secure. 

[Wiseman2]

How long ago did your ex-wife move out? How is the co-parenting going?

Don't be rushed into living together, blending families or marriage. You're not ready.

Even though you knew each other as lovers while still with your respective spouses, you really don't know each other.

Affairs are based on lies and snippets of stolen time.

Who you see in front of you now is a strange mixture of who she really is and what you thought she was when you were lovers.

It may be time to step back and reflect on all this rather than continuing in this limbo of not married lovers but not single and ready to commit.

Instead of perseverating on this text exchange. Tell her it's not working out because you are not ready to be in a relationship.

[PotatoHead]

Ex-wife moved out 5 months ago.  My GF has been living on her own for over a year.  It was definitely hard on her waiting for me to get rid of the ex, but these things take time.  The co-parenting is going okay, despite most of her messages to me being emotionally charged.  She is not the happiest about how quickly I have moved on to this new relationship

I am no longer allowing myself to be rushed into anything.  However the GF seems to have calmed now on pushing for those next steps, ever since the ex has moved out we are able to maintain a somewhat normal relationship and see each other daily.  I would say that we are still committed to each other, I've been telling her that I want to work through this and I genuinely hope that we can.  There was certainly a period of adjustment, going from being long distance and secretive to being real.  I did step back and note the differences in who I had imagined her to be vs reality.

[vla1120]

11 hours ago, PotatoHead said:

....when I am feeling the anxiety or jealousy I generally shut down or become distant, until we get a chance to talk it out.  And as I said, she is always happy to reassure me as much as she can try to.  Although having these talks wear on her as well and I feel bad bringing it up at times.  She once told me, it’s just hard talking about the worst thing she’s ever done in her life over and over again. 

Think long and hard about whether you want to pursue this relationship. Regardless of how much you may love her, relationships shouldn't be THIS hard, especially in the beginning. When you start the relationship off on the wrong foot, you really have to think about how long (months? years? decades?) you want to spend "working" on the relationship, worrying about loyalty and fidelity, hoping it will all turn out well. 

[PotatoHead]

36 minutes ago, vla1120 said:

Think long and hard about whether you want to pursue this relationship. Regardless of how much you may love her, relationships shouldn't be THIS hard, especially in the beginning. When you start the relationship off on the wrong foot, you really have to think about how long (months? years? decades?) you want to spend "working" on the relationship, worrying about loyalty and fidelity, hoping it will all turn out well. 

That is exactly the internal debate I have been struggling with.  The hard part is that, 95% of the time when we're together, everything is great.  My worries are eased and it feels right.  We don't get an exorbitant amount of time together though, and the rest of the time my mind starts to wander.

Edited October 22, 2021 by PotatoHead

[PotatoHead]

This thread has given me a lot to think about, I truly appreciate the responses here.  It has confirmed things I already knew deep down but didn’t want to admit.  It has made more clear the reality of the choices I have to make, although I’m still not sure which way to go from here. 
 

I believe that the ability to cheat and lie is part of who she is.  I thought her doing it with me was different, we were no longer in love with our spouses and wanted out.  But she proved that isn’t the case when she cheated on me as well.  I’ve learned that these things don’t just happen by accident, she was open to it and wanted it too. 
 

She did put an end to it though and didn’t let it get too far, as far as I know.  So maybe she is trying to change and wants to be better for me.  She should have come to me and told me right away, and found another job.  Seems like she wants to do what she can to make things right with me, but only to an extent.  Maybe because we aren’t married yet, although we did plan on getting engaged.  I also wouldn’t feel right asking her to change jobs. 
 

I don’t know if I’ll ever be able to trust her 100% if we stay together and I think I will always struggle with this.  Outside of that, our relationship is great and I am happier with her than I’ve ever been.  I believe she is committed to me and wants to do right.  It feels right when we’re together, but now it is always clouded with this doubt and I’m keeping my defenses up somewhat, which limits our relationship.  Sometimes I feel like I am not being the best I can be for her because of that. 

 

I am not sure whether I should keep going like this, giving her more time to try an earn my trust back even though it may never happen.  I won’t be willing to move in with her or get engaged if I don’t trust her.  We may be stuck like this for a long time until eventually one of us decides to end it. 

Or I could just end it now and try to start the healing process.  Although I worry that is going to weigh on me heavily and detract from my ability to focus on my family and their adjustment to our new life.  We have already been on a break once because of this and it was hard, she is my best friend and really the only person I spend time with and talk to apart from my family.  It feels empty without her and I don’t want to lose her completely, but I know she doesn’t want to just be friends.  So we got back together and I told her I was committed to trying to make things work because I don’t want to lose her.  Now if I pulled back yet again and said I was ending things I would feel like I was playing with her emotions and being kind of a dick. 
 

Is it normal to go back and forth so much after having these kinds of issues?   Is there any chance of us pulling through and being happy together long term?

Edited October 24, 2021 by PotatoHead

[BaileyB]

On 10/22/2021 at 8:10 AM, vla1120 said:

Think long and hard about whether you want to pursue this relationship.

Agree. What do you know about her - she has shown no respect for a relationship not only once, but twice. As Maya Angelou so famously said, “when people show you who they really are, believe them.”

This story makes me very sad, you uprooted not only your children but also your former spouse for a woman who can not even show you the respect to be honest and faithful to you less than a year into your relationship. The dust hasn’t even settled on your move and she is lying to you, secretly and inappropriately communicating with other men. I would say that you owe more to your ex spouse and your children at this point than your new love interest…

[PotatoHead]

30 minutes ago, BaileyB said:

Agree. What do you know about her - she has shown no respect for a relationship not only once, but twice. As Maya Angelou so famously said, “when people show you who they really are, believe them.”

This story makes me very sad, you uprooted not only your children but also your former spouse for a woman who can not even show you the respect to be honest and faithful to you less than a year into your relationship. The dust hasn’t even settled on your move and she is lying to you, secretly and inappropriately communicating with other men. I would say that you owe more to your ex spouse and your children at this point than your new love interest…

We were together over a year when it happened, long distance anyway.  But you’re right, after all that time I finally managed to move and if anything, things should’ve been looking up for our relationship.  I don’t know how long she had been inappropriate with that guy before then, as she deleted the message history, but I know they were work friends for several months before I moved.  I’m sure she had her worries and doubts about me every actually moving or leaving my ex for her.  I would’ve been able to understand it more if it had happened before I moved while she still had doubts and I wasn’t here to fulfill her needs.  Maybe what I saw was just the tail end of something that had gone on for much longer?

[Wiseman2]

1 hour ago, PotatoHead said:

I am not sure whether I should keep going like this, giving her more time to try an earn my trust back even though it may never happen.  Is it normal to go back and forth so much after having these kinds of issues?   Is there any chance of us pulling through and being happy together long term?

It's normal to deliberate before involving her more in your home, with your kids and especially a commitment. There's just too many doubts on too many levels.

True you can't stall indefinitely and at some point you may feel freer simply telling her it's not working out rather than trying to force-fit such a tenuous situation.

[ShyViolet]

If you feel in your gut that you can't trust her, you shouldn't be with her.  And you definitely shouldn't be up-ending your children's lives for this woman.

 

[ExpatInItaly]

On 10/21/2021 at 3:27 PM, PotatoHead said:

believe she is truly remorseful and wouldn't let it happen again.  After I found out about it, she was physically sick for a week because she thought I was going to end it.

That is beside the point. (and frankly, designed to manipulate you, I have to say) 

The point is that she was engaging in this behaviour to begin with, which speaks to her overall lack of commitment to you. Sorry man, but this relationship sounds like a dysfunctional mess. Started as an affair,  had to have a break, back together, gets caught playing footsie with another man...

If you genuinely feel this is somehow going to morph into something healthy and thriving, you are in for a very unpleasant wake-up call. 

[PotatoHead]

I am definitely starting to question things a bit more and view our future chances a bit more realistically.  Thank you for all of the insights.

[glows]

Spending time daily with each other will cloud your thoughts. You have only been dating for five months. It's too much too soon. 

[PotatoHead]

10 minutes ago, glows said:

Spending time daily with each other will cloud your thoughts. You have only been dating for five months. It's too much too soon. 

We have been in a relationship for almost 2 years.  Despite being long distance for over a year at first, we saw each other often and talked all day every day.  But yes we have only been able to see each other daily for the past 5 months.  It isn't all that much though, we work opposite shifts and just spend the nights together.

If we hadn't built such a strong connection over this time, it wouldn't be such a difficult situation for me.

Edited October 25, 2021 by PotatoHead

[elaine567]

1 hour ago, PotatoHead said:

If we hadn't built such a strong connection over this time, it wouldn't be such a difficult situation for me.

But you haven't built a strong connection, maybe you feel you have, but she has been preoccupied with her work colleague... 
 

On 10/22/2021 at 1:59 PM, PotatoHead said:

  However the GF seems to have calmed now on pushing for those next steps,

Maybe because she s having second thoughts...