LD affair looks like turning into a real relationship and I'm having a lot of anxiety

[ScientificThoughts]

6 minutes ago, BaileyB said:

He does care, or he would have given her an honest answer when she asked him a direct question. 

He says that he is lying to her and sneaking around because he doesn’t want anyone to think badly about you. If that was really true, he would not put you in a position where he has to lie and sneak around to see you. He would give you a legitimate and go to able position in his life - but to do that, he has to be honest with his partner and end his relationship.

But, he is leaving her for you - is he not? Don’t think that you will be able to hide this, people are not stupid. They usually figure these kinds of thing  out…

Well then, he should file for divorce and deal with the end of his marriage in an honest and respectful way. 

ST, does a man of character involve himself with another woman while married, lie to his wife about this relationship, sneak around and plan to leave/divorce without telling his wife his intentions, and then expect you to lie to others about your relationship - because it’s “for your benefit” (ie. he doesn’t want others to think badly if you). Is this really a man that you should trust? Is he a man who has integrity, is honest, trustworthy, responsible? 

Also - he was unhappy before I even came back into the picture. I think I was just the "push". She already told him she wanted to work it out but still did not want to give him any affection. She just wants someone there I think for monetary reasons and to do husbandly duties, without having to love the person or care about their needs. She's admitted that. I've seen the texts. 

Do I think he is leaving her for me? Not necessarily. I think he may have been more apt to try to work it out if I wasn't there though or try counseling... but you can't force someone to love you. 

[BaileyB]

You are talking like you are near the finish line - you are not. He is still married and when his wife asked if what was going on - he said “nothing honey.”

The day that he actually files for divorce is just the beginning of this journey. You would be wise to proceed very cautiously until he has those divorce papers in hand - 

[BaileyB]

53 minutes ago, ScientificThoughts said:

They know the situation and they also know the love we've shared over the years.

What “love” was shared. You had never actually met the man until recently. 

Quote

We have talked off and on through phone, text and email throughout our whole lives and really love and respect each other although we'd never met in person.

You have had a pen pal for years - a stranger with whom you have communicated for years. If my friend or family member told me they were planning a future with a man who she had emailed for years but never met - I would be seriously concerned for her. Not saying that the relationship couldn’t develop if she spent time with him in person and they were able to get to know each other and let their relationship grow - in person. You have fast forwarded the development of this relationship in much the same way that you are attempting to fast forward the end of his marriage/divorce. Let’s just jump to the “happily ever after” aspect of this relationship - not the fact that you have developed a relationship with a married man that you have literally never met until very recently. 

[SouthernIslander]

A man who shows private text messages between him and his wife is trashy.  Be prepared to come to the realization that he is either lying on his wife or he gave her reason to act “irrationally” because stuff like that is always a red flag.   

I definitely would  not get to wrapped up in this guy.  

 

[Wiseman2]

12 hours ago, ScientificThoughts said:

I am going to see him in his new place in a month or so and spend a week with him. 

Ok. So he's married and setting up a lovenest for trysts. 

The important thing is to make sure you are not setting yourself up for years of headaches and heartaches.

Of course it would be best to free yourself from this and find decent honest single men to date.

[glows]

If you have the time and stamina by all means, stay for the next couple of years while they divorce and work out shared custody. He’s at a euphoric high right now gaining courage from you to leave his family but other emotions haven’t had time to set in. His family will always be in his life. Him moving out is no guarantee that he won’t change his mind about you later on when he realizes that he doesn’t need you anymore.

Are you eventually planning on moving closer? Take care with your plans going forward or have a plan B. I say this for anyone making a move to be with someone at a distance. Talking is very different from living that reality. Leave room to unstick and adjust to any changes later on.

[HowToQuit]

Even if he is moving out, I bet it is positioned as trial separation.. time to spend apart and think about it. As far as I remember, there is also a large distance between the two of you so logistically, it is also very challenging to be together with the kids on both sides. 

[HowToQuit]

Also, ask him for the the address of the apartment and check if it’s a weekend AirBnB rental…

[Crazelnut]

The elephant in the room -- why doesn't he just get a lawyer and file??

There is no excuse for not filing by now. What you have here is the typical codependent, conflict-avoidanant, selfish cheater. Sorry, hon, but he's no real prize. 

[stillafool]

14 hours ago, ScientificThoughts said:

But I get why he doesn't. He is obviously afraid of the consequences of doing that. 

What consequences?  That his wife will file for divorce?  Isn't that his goal to divorce?  He's lying to you.

[elaine567]

I get the romantic fairy story and the great sex, but what sort of a stepfather will this man be to your child?
He has just apparently ran out on his own child at only 3 years of age.
Are you prepared to be a stepmother?

Step parent=hood is not easy, try not to get too hung up on the exciting chemicals of "love". 

[stillafool]

On 10/20/2021 at 11:22 AM, ScientificThoughts said:

You're right about MM and what they say.

It wasn't that it was done so easily though, he was scared about it. He cancelled the night before and then changed his mind the day of. I feel like I'm making excuses...lol 

Now why would a guy who is divorcing his wife be scared to go away for a weekend for fear his crazy wife will find out?  He's divorcing her so what difference would it make if she found out if he's actually going through with the divorce?  You should have never had sex with this guy until you saw divorce papers. He's lying to you.

[stillafool]

On 10/25/2021 at 5:55 PM, ScientificThoughts said:

Well, he's going to see an apartment tonight... I definitely do wish, hope, think and feel a lot of things but he is taking some action. So far, at least. 

Has he actually asked his wife for a divorce and what was her response?

[BaileyB]

On 10/19/2021 at 4:48 PM, ScientificThoughts said:

I know most of you will probably tell me to wait until he's left his wife but I want to give him a chance first.

I went back to reread your initial post. 

What is your rush? You have been in communication with this man for 20 years - it comes and it goes, as you say it usually “fades out.” It had been 10 years since you spoke when you contacted him. 10 years of no contact. What’s to say this won’t fade out again in much the same way that it has previously? 

Are you star crossed lovers who were always meant to be together but it just never happened because the timing and distance prevented it? I don’t know. 

What do we know - this man is married. You proclaim yourself to be in long distance relationship with a married man. You claim he is separated, wants to leave his marriage, sleeps in a separate room but you don’t know the state of his marriage or his intentions because you are not in the marriage, you are not present in the home, you should not believe words that are easily said. 

Despite all logic, you have decided to take this risk - you want to believe what he he says about his plan to separate/divorce and you want to give him a chance. Waiting  to see if he follows through with his stated intention is not an option - you have already told your family, you have agreed to meet him (for the first time), you had sex with a married man because why? You wanted to know if this was a relationship worth pursuing? You want to try to secure this man for yourself? You are hoping if you present another alternative that he will move out and file for divorce? 

As has been said, divorce is a long and drawn out process. There is much to settle and you should be really leery of any man who says he stays because it’s convenient for him to do so because it would also be convenient for him to want to hop from her home to yours…

You want a man you can trust, right? Someone with integrity, who is dependable, and honest, and able to deal with the challenges of life in a mature and responsible and respectful way - right? If so, you need to cool your jets and allow this man to demonstrate to you that this is who he is - Anybody can complain about their marriage, throw out some promises, jet off for a weekend of sex with another woman but is he really serious about doing what is required to actually end his marriage and be in a legitimate relationship with you? We don’t know. He hasn’t demonstrated anything of the sort yet - and as such, you should be very cautious here. 

You have this fantasy going through your mind right now of a love fate in the stars, decades old pen pals that finally meet and discover that they were always intended to be together… The kind of story that you call in to share in a radio show and everyone listening sighs and says “ah, isn’t love wonderful.” But, that’s not reality. In truth, you are sneaking around with a married man who lied to his wife when she asked him if you even existed. In your mind, you are already planning a life with a man who is married to another woman! Further, IF he decides to leave and files for divorce, it will be years of stress ahead as he settles his affairs, recovers financially, and supports his children. 

Edited December 15, 2021 by BaileyB

[ScientificThoughts]

Thanks for the replies. You all make such good points and I am going to bring up a couple of them with him... Like why is he afraid if he is divorcing her anyway? I think he just doesn't want to fight with her. For example -  His wife tried to punch him in the face yesterday when he ate something of hers. When he said he would call the police on her, she said "Who do you think they will believe" as in she would lie to the police. So I kind of get why he wants to keep the peace.... The part that annoyed me was afterwards he took their son out for ice cream and while he was out he got gas in her car for her and gave her ice cream. He said "I don't know why I am like this" after he told me. As in being nice to her after she's so awful to him. It reminds me of an abusive relationship and needing to gain back the persons approval. When I said this he said he doesn't need her approval he just doesn't want to fight with her. 

He has so many toxic women in his life. His family is all narcissists and I honestly think he is used to being treated badly. Maybe that is why he has clung to me... Because I make him feel like an actual person whose feelings and opinions matter. I have also thought about the "not needing me anymore" as well. Like I am the crutch to get him over this. Maybe I am, maybe I'm not. The long distance will be the true test in this. 

Also he said he will still be seeing his son everyday after work and taking him every other weekend. So he isn't abandoning his son. The apartment isn't an AirBNB. I will be staying there for a week when I go next month and I am sure all his stuff will be there because the place is empty right now. 

I will be pushing for him to file separation papers once he is settled in his new place. There won't be any excuses not to then. 

[ScientificThoughts]

4 minutes ago, BaileyB said:

I went back to reread your initial post. 

What is your rush? You have been in communication with this man for 30 years - it comes and it goes, as you say it usually “fades out.” It had been 10 years since you spoke when you contacted him. 10 years of no contact. 

Are you star crossed lovers who were always meant to be together but it just never happened because the timing and distance prevented it? I don’t know.

What do we know - this man is married. You proclaim yourself to be in long distance relationship with a married man. You claim he is separated, wants to leave his marriage, sleeps in a separate room but you don’t know the state of his marriage or his intentions because you are not in the marriage, you are not present in the home, you should not believe words that are easily said. 

Despite all logic, you have decided to take this risk - you want to believe what he he says about his plan to separate/divorce and you want to give him a chance. Waiting  to see if he follows through with his stated intention is not an option - you have already told your family, you have agreed to meet him (for the first time), you had sex with a married man because why? You wanted to know if this was a relationship worth pursuing? You want to try to secure this man for yourself? You are hoping if you present another alternative that he will move out and file for divorce? 

As has been said, divorce is a long and drawn out process. There is much to settle and you should be really leery if any man who says he stays because it’s convenient for him to do so because it would also be convenient for him to want to hop from her home to yours…

You want a man you can trust, right? Someone with integrity, who is dependable, and honest, and able to deal with the challenges of life in a mature and responsible and respectful way - right? If so, you need to cool your jets and allow this man to demonstrate to you that this is who he is - Anybody can complain about their marriage, throw out some promises, jet off for a weekend of sex with another woman but is he really serious about doing what is required to actually end his marriage and be in a legitimate relationship with you? We don’t know. He hasn’t demonstrated anything of the sort yet - and as such, you should be very cautious here. 

You have this fantasy going through your mind right now of a love fate in the stars, decades old pen pals that finally meet and discover that they were always intended to be together… The kind of story that you call in to share in a radio show and everyone listening sighs and says “ah, isn’t love wonderful.” But, that’s not reality. In truth, you are sneaking around with a married man who lied to his wife when she asked him if you even existed. In your mind, you are already planning a life with a man who is married to another woman! Further, IF he decides to leave and files for divorce, it will be years of stress ahead as he settles his affairs and recovers financially. 

You make very good points. I think we are both on the "star crossed lovers" train and believe w are meant to be together. I have been pretty patient with him and probably will continue to be. I do not know everything that goes on with them or in their house you're right and I definitely don't assume anything that goes on. We've had many conversations about his situation and his wife. 

I am going to be cautious about everything. It's just hard when you want something to happen so badly. I do believe he is going to divorce her it's just going to take time. I am not going to wait forever for him to do that either. I know he is in love with me, and if he truly wants us to have a life together he will do what he needs to. 

[BaileyB]

17 minutes ago, ScientificThoughts said:

I kind of get why he wants to keep the peace....

Don’t make excuses for him. If what you have shared is try, this is an abusive marriage. They are raising their child in an abusive home and the solution to that problem is for him to leave. 

17 minutes ago, ScientificThoughts said:

I honestly think he is used to being treated badly. Maybe that is why he has clung to me...

You are so deep in the believe that he is a poor soul that has been so long victimized by all the women in his life - you have positioned yourself as his saviour and he is more than happy to let you do so. Boy, are you going to learn these lessons the hard way - if he stays with this woman, it’s because he chooses to stay. Patterns of behavior like this are not easy to change. It’s going to take a lot for this man to stand up for himself and do what is required to leave this marriage. And - as you are responsible for your own life, he is also responsible for himself. 

Prepare yourself for disappointment here, this is far from the fantasy relationship you have created for yourself.

Edited December 15, 2021 by BaileyB

[BaileyB]

Just now, ScientificThoughts said:

I definitely don't assume anything that goes on.

Oh, but you do.

Everything you say is an assumption you have made based on the words he has said which may or may not be true - you don’t know because you have only ever met the man once and you do not ever see him in person! 

[ScientificThoughts]

3 minutes ago, BaileyB said:

Don’t make excuses for him. If what you have shared is try, this is an abusive marriage. They are raising their child in an abusive home and the solution to that problem is for him to leave. 

You are so deep in the believe that he is a poor soul, so long victimized by all the women in his life - and you are going to be his saviour. Boy, are you going to learn these lessons the hard way - if he stays with this woman, it’s because he chooses to stay. Patterns of behavior like this are not easy to change. It’s going to take a lot for this man to stand up for himself and do what is required to leave this marriage. And - as you are responsible for your own life, he is also responsible for himself. 

Prepare yourself for disappointment here, this is far from the fantasy relationship you have created for yourself.

I don't believe he is a poor soul. He hates being or looking like a "victim" as he puts it, but I think I have definitely given him some strength to stand up to these people and set boundaries with how they treat him. He told me he felt completely alone before we started talking again and I believe that 

[elaine567]

11 minutes ago, ScientificThoughts said:

His family is all narcissists

Be very careful.
If true, few people emerge from such a background unscathed...
You want to "save" him, but the biggest narcissist may indeed be him...
Something to consider...

[BaileyB]

1 minute ago, ScientificThoughts said:

I don't believe he is a poor soul. He hates being or looking like a "victim" as he puts it, but I think I have definitely given him some strength to stand up to these people and set boundaries with how they treat him. He told me he felt completely alone before we started talking again and I believe that 

If you don’t have a counsellor, I would strongly advise you to find a counsellor - someone with whom you can discuss this relationship and these very unhealthy, codependent tendencies that appear to be really clouding your judgment and decision making. I’m actually really concerned for you. 

[ScientificThoughts]

1 minute ago, BaileyB said:

Oh, but you do.

Everything you say is an assumption you have made based on the words he has said which may or may not be true - you don’t know because you have only ever met the man once and you do not ever see him in person! 

We've spent a total of 6 days together and talk for hours everyday. LOL okay I realize how stupid that sounds but I am spending a week there next month. I know it's only a week but it's not just a weekend of sex and fun. We actually want to spend time together without it feeling rushed. 

And you're right they are assumptions on the things he has told me. I just don't think he lies to me. I know, I know... if he is lying to his wife then he is probably lying to me... Maybe I am in denial then. I have not caught him in any lies so far at least 

[ScientificThoughts]

3 minutes ago, BaileyB said:

If you don’t have a counsellor, I would strongly advise you to find a counsellor - someone with whom you can discuss this relationship and these very unhealthy, codependent tendencies that appear to be really clouding your judgment and decision making. I’m actually really concerned for you. 

I am fine with being alone. I was single for years at one point. I can recognize everything you're saying and I do agree with most of it. I think it's just because it is him and he means so much to me. If it was someone else I would have peaced out a long time ago. I have rejected many married men in my life. But maybe you're right... Maybe there is something wrong with me. 

[ScientificThoughts]

9 minutes ago, elaine567 said:

Be very careful.
If true, few people emerge from such a background unscathed...
You want to "save" him, but the biggest narcissist may indeed be him...
Something to consider...

We've talked about him being a narcissist a few times. I don't think he is, but I've been fooled before. 

[elaine567]

16 minutes ago, ScientificThoughts said:

We've talked about him being a narcissist a few times. I don't think he is, but I've been fooled before. 

"We" as in you and him or you and others?