LD affair looks like turning into a real relationship and I'm having a lot of anxiety

[ScientificThoughts]

1 hour ago, S2B said:

He doesn’t intend to change a thing. He intends to stay married to her and keep an OW on the side to stroke his ego.

don’t fool yourself - he is a typical cheater with the same old story.

why do you want to continue being his secret? Why waste your time with this cheater?

Well, it's only been 1.5 months since we reconnected... Shouldn't I give him some time to actually make a move? 

[Myabee]

25 minutes ago, ScientificThoughts said:

Well, it's only been 1.5 months since we reconnected... Shouldn't I give him some time to actually make a move? 

Take it from me..... after 16 months.... they don't leave!!!!

[elaine567]

5 hours ago, ScientificThoughts said:

He does need to file his separation papers still, yes.

So he isn't even actually separated... 
Take everything he has told you with a big pinch of salt.
You may think he is the love of your life, but he is a common and garden cheater...
You could waste  a lot of time here to no good effect...

Also think ahead, if he does leave, how do you think your life will be with his "crazy" wife in your face all the time.
She is the mother of his child, she will be in your life forever....
Do you really think she will want to play happy families with you?
History has a habit of repeating, it may be you who is the "crazy" wife further down the line, whilst he is "entertaining" another...
Be careful what you wish for....

[BaileyB]

7 hours ago, ScientificThoughts said:

I feel bad about abandoning him. 

You are not abandoning him. 

You are telling him to end one relationship before starting another. Nothing wrong with that. He has a whole lot of stuff that he needs to get in order before he is ready to be in another relationship. If he was serious about this relationship and he had your best interest at heart, he would do what is required without involving you in his marital drama.

Know this, a healthy relationship requires two healthy people. Weak, codependent people cling to others and monkey branch from one relationship to the other. You want more than that for yourself. 

So, get this notion that you are “abandoning” him out of your head. He is a grown man and this is his problem to solve. You can support him by giving him the time and the space to deal with the end of his marriage. Full stop.

[BaileyB]

2 hours ago, ScientificThoughts said:

Shouldn't I give him some time to actually make a move? 

He can take all the time he needs…
You should not wait for him. 
Again, this is his marriage and it’s his divorce. How exactly do you think you belong in this situation? 
IF he wants to be with you, he will make that happen. He will file for divorce and settle the things he needs to settle in his life such that he can be a good and healthy partner for you. 
You wanting to support him through his divorce is as codependent and enabling as him wanting to branch from his marriage to a relationship with you. 

And I still say, you have absolutely no evidence that he is actually planning to separate and divorce. All you have right now are some words that frankly, mean nothing without any definitive action.

[BaileyB]

7 hours ago, ScientificThoughts said:

To be fair - he said he wasn't sure if she was joking or not when she said it. 

Would you stay with a man who threatens to take your life while you sleep? 

[jwi71]

There is an unfortunate pattern of events to these - certain commonalities that persist across the globe when it comes to being an affair partner.

And, to echo what has been previously said by others, what you present fails perfectly in line with what has been told be oh so many others in your shoes.

Do you remember dating others in a more "normal" fashion?  A single unattached man in your case?  Can you recall ever wondering:

1) when he would leave?

2) why does he stay with an abusive spouse (and to be threatened with physical harm IS abuse)?

3) whether he has filed separation?  and why not divorce?  why this interim step if "he's done"?

4) Can you recall thinking, were he single, if he was "making excuses"?  And excuses for what again?

5) How many of his friends have you met?

Tread carefully.  Look after yourself.  Be wary.  

But forget what we say....what do your friends and family advise?

 

[elaine567]

7 hours ago, ScientificThoughts said:

To be fair - he said he wasn't sure if she was joking or not when she said it. 

Many MM set up a competition between their OW and the wife.
The terrible mentally ill psychotic wife versus the angel of an OW.
The loveless sexless boring plain wife versus the sexually adventurous beautiful OW.
He is not some cheating scoundrel, he is some poor downtrodden abused soul who has done his best for his dreadful  crazy and afflicted  wife... cue the violins...
He lays it on thick and the OW is swept up in the fantasy. She basks in the compliments and doles out the sympathy.
"Oh you poor poor man, I will kiss you all better and defend you from that horrible harridan of a wife..."

If the wife  did  indeed seriously threaten to kill him, why is he not worried in the slightest about her finding evidence of his cheating?
He is not worried because he knows she doesn't have a clue... she is more concerned no doubt about her new bathroom renovation... and getting her kid to bed...
It was just nonsense drama on his part to keep you on side...

[BaileyB]

1 hour ago, elaine567 said:

"Oh you poor poor man, I will kiss you all better and defend you from that horrible harridan of a wife..."

What’s more, “I will support you through your difficult divorce because… you should never be expected to go through this on your own. Let me ease your burden.”

The wife is described either as: controlling, negligent of his needs/focused on the kids or her phone or her own life, so checked out that she does not even care anymore/sexless marriage, they sleep in separate bedrooms, she doesn’t love him and agreed to a divorce except for the kids/finances/a planned vacation, she has already ordered their Christmas cards, etc…, or bat$#!^ crazy. Sometimes, as in this case, it’s any combination of the above. 

We see it time and time again on these boards. It’s a standard routine - these men offer the same tired excuses and women fall for it every time… 

And yet, it’s the husband who is lying and sneaking around having sex with another woman. 

Edited October 22, 2021 by BaileyB

[HowToQuit]

9 hours ago, ScientificThoughts said:

He does need to file his separation papers still, yes. I don't feel like I should be the one to tell him to do that though? 

 

I am in Canada. Separation papers include all aspects of custody /child support / spousal support and matrimonial home division.. filing (and filing is not mandated), is easy… but the road to negotiating the separation agreement with lawyers is costly and lengthy. Especially when there are yonger kids involved. It’s often is a painful, long and emotionally draining process. 
From what I read, I do not think he has even started the process of separation. When he gets a lawyer, it would be the first really good sign of his intent to leave. Until then, I wouldn’t have my hopes up.

Re real estate / rents in Canada … rents have come down quite a bit with the pandemic, so it’s not a bad time to rent. There is always a buyout option - she can choose to keep the house and buy him out… he will then have the money to buy. 

 

[Milly May June]

One thing that stood out to me in one of your posts is that he decided he was done with his marriage during the same time he reconnected with you. He is monkey branching onto a new relationship. I would say most people who do this don't do it out of love (in your case you have spent a weekend with this guy physically) but because they can't be alone. 

[ExpatInItaly]

14 hours ago, ScientificThoughts said:

He has every intention of being with me I think. He just has a lot on his plate... I feel bad about abandoning him. 

He isn't yours to abandon, OP. 

He has a wife. That's her role. He's also a big boy who is making his own mess, and he can handle it. I am quite sure he has closer friends and family who are in a better position to support him than you, in the event that he splits from his wife. Because apparently he's not actually even separated from her: 

14 hours ago, ScientificThoughts said:

He does need to file his separation papers still

I think you need to realize you are being played, OP. He's your run-of-the-mill cheater. Nothing special or unique here. 

Time to wake up, @ScientificThoughts. 

[Wiseman2]

9 hours ago, ScientificThoughts said:

, it's only been 1.5 months since we reconnected... 

It's the perfect time to cut your losses. .

[BaileyB]

6 hours ago, Wiseman2 said:

It's the perfect time to cut your losses. .

Very kindly, tell him that you realize he has a lot that he needs to deal with and you are going to give him the time and the space to make those decisions and settle things with his divorce.

[ScientificThoughts]

You all make very good points... Last night while we were talking he said "I should just start talking to 15 women and get their nudes and leave my phone open so she sees it". 

I got pretty jealous and upset. He apologized and said he shouldn't have said that, it was a d*ck thing to say he just wants to make her mad so she leaves. That he loves me. But it really made me second guess everything. Like why not just tell her to leave? There are so many other ways than just doing something like that? 

I really don't want to think I am just a side fling to him, considering we've known each other since we were teens. Would he really do that to me? The monkey branch thing seems accurate. I am feeling defeated today  

[stillafool]

10 minutes ago, ScientificThoughts said:

You all make very good points... Last night while we were talking he said "I should just start talking to 15 women and get their nudes and leave my phone open so she sees it". 

I got pretty jealous and upset. He apologized and said he shouldn't have said that, it was a d*ck thing to say he just wants to make her mad so she leaves. That he loves me. But it really made me second guess everything. Like why not just tell her to leave? There are so many other ways than just doing something like that? 

I really don't want to think I am just a side fling to him, considering we've known each other since we were teens. Would he really do that to me? The monkey branch thing seems accurate. I am feeling defeated today  

Why 15 women?  All he has to do is leave his phone open to see the messages between the two of you.  That would tell her all she needs to know.  Did you suggest that?

And to answer your last question - YES!, that's exactly what you are to him.

Edited October 22, 2021 by stillafool

[ScientificThoughts]

2 minutes ago, stillafool said:

Why 15 women?  All he has to do is leave his phone open to see the messages between the two of you.  That would tell her all she needs to know.  Did you suggest that?

And to answer your last question - YES!, that's exactly what you are to him.

I don't think he wants her to know about me specifically. So there's no ill will/hard feelings/hate between us when we actually have an out in the open relationship. 

[vla1120]

2 minutes ago, stillafool said:

...he just wants to make her mad so she leaves.

This is a total cop-out. If he's not happy in his marriage and he is determined to be with you, then he just needs to do it. These excuses about the finances, the kids, etc., are going to continue (if you allow it.) Tell him you're not going to be a third party in his marriage and he can contact you when he is single and available.

[vla1120]

2 minutes ago, ScientificThoughts said:

I don't think he wants her to know about me specifically. So there's no ill will/hard feelings/hate between us when we actually have an out in the open relationship. 

Cop out number 2.

[ScientificThoughts]

Just now, vla1120 said:

Cop out number 2.

What do you mean by cop out? He never said that, I am just assuming it because I told him I didn't want anyone finding out about me this way and have his family hate me in the future. 

[Starswillshine]

There are some valid reasons for him not wanting her to know who you are or that you are involved. 

While the my wife is crazy she threatened to kill me story seems just like a typical MM story, I do want to remind people that many people stay in relationships that abusive often, sadly.

That being said, OP, I would just tell him that you will give him some space to properly end his marriage. That you cannot guarantee that you will be there waiting for him when he finally does come around, but you hope that he makes the decision that is best for him. 

Give some distance for awhile. Let him pull the plug on his marriage. A divorce takes a long time (mine took far over a year), but he needs to make concrete steps to separate before you get too invested that this relationship will turn into the real deal.

Also, have you guys discussed how this will work post divorce? (Maybe I missed it). You live long distance away, has someone decided to move to be closer? 

[vla1120]

8 minutes ago, ScientificThoughts said:

What do you mean by cop out? He never said that, I am just assuming it because I told him I didn't want anyone finding out about me this way and have his family hate me in the future. 

Sorry. I misunderstood. I thought that was the reason he gave you. That makes sense. I still think you should tread carefully. 

[stillafool]

5 minutes ago, ScientificThoughts said:

What do you mean by cop out? He never said that, I am just assuming it because I told him I didn't want anyone finding out about me this way and have his family hate me in the future. 

His family is going to hate you regardless.  My uncle cheated on his wife and 6 little girls over 40 years ago and the family still have not accepted my uncle's wife, the OW, who broke them up.   It's just part of the deal when you're an OW.  Some families will accept you but others won't.  Don't make your decisions based on that.  Make him tell her the truth about you two to prove to you that what he's telling you is the truth.

[ScientificThoughts]

3 minutes ago, Starswillshine said:

There are some valid reasons for him not wanting her to know who you are or that you are involved. 

While the my wife is crazy she threatened to kill me story seems just like a typical MM story, I do want to remind people that many people stay in relationships that abusive often, sadly.

That being said, OP, I would just tell him that you will give him some space to properly end his marriage. That you cannot guarantee that you will be there waiting for him when he finally does come around, but you hope that he makes the decision that is best for him. 

Give some distance for awhile. Let him pull the plug on his marriage. A divorce takes a long time (mine took far over a year), but he needs to make concrete steps to separate before you get too invested that this relationship will turn into the real deal.

Also, have you guys discussed how this will work post divorce? (Maybe I missed it). You live long distance away, has someone decided to move to be closer? 

We have discussed it to some degree. We both have a small child so we don't want to exactly leave them but there is an option to move "closer" to each other. We just said we would come to that bridge when it's time to cross it. 

[ScientificThoughts]

4 minutes ago, stillafool said:

His family is going to hate you regardless.  My uncle cheated on his wife and 6 little girls over 40 years ago and the family still have not accepted my uncle's wife, the OW, who broke them up.   It's just part of the deal when you're an OW.  Some families will accept you but others won't.  Don't make your decisions based on that.  Make him tell her the truth about you two to prove to you that what he's telling you is the truth.

Hi family is toxic so I honestly wouldn't care a lot if they didn't like me. I just don't want to be that hated member of the family I guess...