Toxic husband, toxic inlaw & Boundaries

[livingalife2009]

My husband is extremely toxic (NPD) but fortunately, he has changed for the last 2.5 months. He is now a much better partner in parenting our pre-teens. He has a strong connection with our son and our son worships him.
We have been married for almost 20 years, he admits that I have made him a better person. Working on him is the most exausting thing I have ever done in my life, I experienced deep depression a few times. For almost 20 years I was very confused about all the rollercoasters in our marriage until about 5 months ago, when I remembered the word 'Narcissim' he had mention to me about 15 years ago that some women said he was a narcissist. (He used to be extremely promiscuous prior to meeting me)

I researched 'Narcissim' According to the 3 world's famous psychologists who dedicate their research to narcisism, my husband is a true narcissist.

He sided with the children every time I tried to coach them, he called me names in front of them, he yelled and demanded that I apologize to our kids in front of them - Our family was so dysfunctional that I asked him to move out, which he did for 3 months!

The day I knew he was a narcissist and the day I found out his sister told him 'You gave her children' (she 'lectured' him for having children with me except that she felt, he only had them to give them to me) I began to separate myself from their toxicity and I became an observer of how they live their life in an ocean full of their own poison. The view is very interesting!
The day he confessed that his sister was his priority, my feelings for him changed. That warm feeling that a spouse had for a spouse went away.

But I stay in the marriage because he has changed and he has become an asset in co-parenting. He backs me up when I discipline the kids and I no longer feel like a severely abused maid to my children and to him.

He now wants to visit his sister who has asked him to divorce me many times. The problem is I do not want him to spend a week with her and then come back home directly.

Ideally, I would want him to return to a hotel or a rented house from his sister's, spend a month alone, detoxing mentally and emotionally, reset his button and then come home.
He just started changing about 2.5 months ago and I feel that he can be easily contaminated by his toxic sister when he goes visit her and I am fearful that he will go back to his old ways.
What would you do if you were in my situation?

[stillafool]

Well given that you can't keep him away from his relatives forever, I would let him visit her.  If he returned with a toxic and abusive attitude again I would leave and file for divorce.

[vla1120]

It sounds like her disdain for you is no secret. I would not ask him to spend a month alone to detox after visiting his sister. If there is no secret about the situation, just tell him when he comes home, there will be no discussion about her, or her feelings about you. Remind him how well you've been co-parenting for the past few months and tell him you would like your successful relationship to continue without the outside influence of toxic people. If he cannot do that for you, then you have to rethink your relationship. Tell him he can pack his bags and go live with her.

[S2B]

Someone as toxic as him is better off alone. Since he is still prioritizing his sister over your marriage he hasn’t changed. 
a very short period of change does NOT offset 20 years of consistent narcissism. 

as someone that was with a narcissist for 27 years - you’ll be happier without him. Don’t be afraid to live without him - it’s pure freedom! Rules of engagement are critical with any narcissist - the first rule being “do NOT engage!”

don’t believe a short period means he’s a changed man - narcissists manipulate and lie to get what they want. They will always need a victim - don’t let that be you!

especially… if he goes to his sisters place - that’s the end of the marriage. That’s a healthy boundary!

Edited October 20, 2021 by S2B

[glows]

You might feel better not fighting over this man anymore. Stopping him from seeing his family members will only increase the resentment between the both of you and puff up his ego. Decide whether this is something you can tolerate or end the marriage. The pushing and pulling, one direction to another, and pitting yourself against his sister just has to stop. He's not worth that. Focus on your kids and your own wellbeing.

[stillafool]

Was he actually diagnosed with NPD?

[basil67]

If he is a diagnosable as a narcissist, there is no "reset" button.   He may learn some new social/parenting skills to help him function, but he will always be a narcissist.   This is a personality disorder, not bad behaviour. 

 

[Wiseman2]

5 hours ago, livingalife2009 said:

I researched 'Narcissim' According to the 3 world's famous psychologists who dedicate their research to narcisism, my husband is a true narcissist.

You're 47? He's 77? Has he been to a physician regularly?  Is it possible he has early signs of neurocognitive dysfunction?

He sounds abusive and a 10 week abuse-free interval is not uncommon for abusers. What you are dreading is that you know the abuse cycle is merely in a honeymoon stage and the abuse, as always, will return.

 Rather than look up personality disorders, research "cycle of abuse" and "abusive relationships".

 This isn't about his sister indoctrinating him against you. It's about how an abuser operates. 

[livingalife2009]

4 hours ago, S2B said:

"especially… if he goes to his sisters place - that’s the end of the marriage. That’s a healthy boundary!"

I love this and I need to read it multiple times it's an inspiration.  I want to do this but I need the strength.

[livingalife2009]

3 hours ago, Wiseman2 said:

You're 47? He's 77? Has he been to a physician regularly?  Is it possible he has early signs of neurocognitive dysfunction?

He sounds abusive and a 10 week abuse-free interval is not uncommon for abusers. What you are dreading is that you know the abuse cycle is merely in a honeymoon stage and the abuse, as always, will return.

 Rather than look up personality disorders, research "cycle of abuse" and "abusive relationships".

 This isn't about his sister indoctrinating him against you. It's about how an abuser operates. 

It's interesting that you ask if he had gone to a physician recently.  Back in May when I saw some changes in his mental state of mind I took him to a psychologist for an extensive cognitive screening. The test result says that his memory is spectacular.  As soon as his sister knew about the result, she emailed to tell him that the reason I asked him to get that test done was because I wanted to intimidate him. 

I wanted to vomit at her comment.  😪 

 

[Wiseman2]

6 hours ago, livingalife2009 said:

 I took him to a psychologist 

Step out of the catfight with the sister. Your marriage and your husband are the problem,so when you sidestep that to find an external scapegoat, you're allowing the abuse and dysfunction to continue because you're not addressing the real problem.

Your husband needs to see a physician MD for an evaluation of his overall physical and mental health.

However, his declining health and his pattern of abuse are unrelated. You never "fixed him", abuse is just cyclical.

You may want to check with an attorney to see if you will fair well in the event of death or divorce. 

You make it sound like you or he are from a culture where you could be shut out and certain spousal laws don't apply.

Focus on exiting the marriage, not on your displaced rage and catfight. Use logic and common sense to determine your future. Speak with an attorney about your situation.

 

Edited October 21, 2021 by Wiseman2

[livingalife2009]

On 10/21/2021 at 3:19 AM, Wiseman2 said:

Step out of the catfight with the sister. Your marriage and your husband are the problem,so when you sidestep that to find an external scapegoat, you're allowing the abuse and dysfunction to continue because you're not addressing the real problem.

Your husband needs to see a physician MD for an evaluation of his overall physical and mental health.

However, his declining health and his pattern of abuse are unrelated. You never "fixed him", abuse is just cyclical.

You may want to check with an attorney to see if you will fair well in the event of death or divorce. 

You make it sound like you or he are from a culture where you could be shut out and certain spousal laws don't apply.

Focus on exiting the marriage, not on your displaced rage and catfight. Use logic and common sense to determine your future. Speak with an attorney about your situation.

 

My husband takes great care of his physical health, he eats extremely healthy, he sees the doctors/dentists at least every 3 months. He does acupuncture once each week. The one thing that he doesn't/can't take care of, is his mental and emotional health. He admits that his behavior affects others negatively but he won't change unless it benefits him. He doesn't feel that being empathic, non-condesceding and being humble benefit him because to him they are probably a sign of weaknesses since most of what he had to do when he was a child was  defend himself.

The only reason he changes his attitude towards parenting is because he takes pride in being a father and wants to appear like a perfect one. He would hate it so much if I told the world I divorced him because he was damaging our kid's mental and emotional health. 

My husband wants to be a better father than his own dad; According to him, his father cheated on his mother, the marriage ended, his older brother died and his mother committed herself to a mental institution and my husband was put under the care of a sweet older great aunt who cared deeply about him. (on his mother side). That was the happiest time in his childhood but unfortunately the great aunt's husband died, great aunt couldn't take care of my him in her old age so he was sent to live with the father and the stepmother. His father remarried soon after the divorce.

I am so grateful that I didn't have to commit to a psychiatric ward being in this abusive marriage. I believe things will only get better for me as I now clearly understand my husband's personality disorder and the dysfunctionality of the family that raised him. They say knowledge is power and it empowers me to pull away from being an active part of a toxic group and becomes a spectator instead.

My husband is very protective of his dead stepmother but did mention many times that his father never stood up for him to his step mother. His relationship with his stepmother was a very bumpy one, there were times that they didn't talk to each other.  His stepsister (they share a father) was the golden child and my husband was the scapegoat in the family while growing up. His stepmother punished him severely for making silly mistakes as a child. He got spanked many times but not his stepsister.

He and his stepsister share a very similar personality. They both care so much about the facade and will do anything to look better than the other people, they will backstab and trash their friends and loved ones behind their back just to look better,  yet low self-esteem, insecurity and the excessive need for outside validation play a big role in their unhappiness and how they treat other people. I hear them backstabbing people on the phone so I ask my husband to take the phone outside or in his car because even his phone conversation with her brings bad energy to our space.

His stepsister is NOT a scapegoat but an abuser just like my husband - she backstabbed me and called me all kinds of names. The second time we visited her, not too long after my husband and I tied the knot, she told me straight at my face 'I am jealous of you that you marry my brother, he doesn't have much time for me nowadays, ' but I brushed it off because I thought she was joking.  My husband admits that his stepsister is a doubleface, he even asked if I wanted her to apologize to me and my answer was 'NO'. I made the choice to not ever see that person again. It took me 20 years to understand the dysfuntionality and the toxicity in their family I just don't want to go back and pretend that I am ok with that. His stepsister is also an enabler - She was completely fine when my husband yelled at her in front of me and the kids. When I apologized to her for his rudeness, her response was 'Oh, it's totally fine, I have forgotten about it already'. Yikes.

You are right, I don't/can't fix him. He will never stop being toxic and I will never be able to pull him out of the bottomless pit of toxicity. Although he has been nice to me I am still not happy that he's celebrating his toxicity each time he's condesceding. In fact when he displays affection it makes me want to vomit because it doesn't feel genuine.

I want to get a divorce but now that he's being helpful in parenting I want him to enjoy the kids as much as possible. If we live separately he will get the kids maybe 50% of the time or less. He is almost 77 years old and I feel that it's extremely important that he spends as much time with the kids as possible. When the kids go off to college I am very sure I will be free of this man.

Financially we will be fine regardless of our marital status.

Edited October 22, 2021 by livingalife2009

[Wiseman2]

2 minutes ago, livingalife2009 said:

he's being helpful in parenting I want him to enjoy the kids as much as possible. If we live separately he will get the kids maybe 50% of the time or less.

Are they his children or from a previous union?  If you divorce him, you'll divorce his family.

[livingalife2009]

1 minute ago, Wiseman2 said:

Are they his children or from a previous union?  If you divorce him, you'll divorce his family.

They are 100% his. LOL and these are the only children he has and that he knows of.