BaileyB Posted November 19, 2021 Share Posted November 19, 2021 9 minutes ago, TamBuktu said: Maybe, but more so because: - I find a quorum vs opinion of one individual - I don't have the time to build a relationship with a therapist - just logistically it will take a few tries to find one i click with, then we have to discuss many other things first, it's generally an hour per week - And rational or not, I fear he/she will disclose in some way that might be harmful. I can't go to a therapist anonymously The quorum here has been universal, this relationship is not going to be what you want and this man is not a good choice of partner - given your goal of marriage and family. As for the possibility of disclosure, that statement shows a fair bit of ignorance about therapy. What you share in a therapy session is confidential - there would be professional consequences should the therapist disclose personal information. Beside - who would they disclose to and why would anyone care? 1 2 Link to post Share on other sites
BaileyB Posted November 19, 2021 Share Posted November 19, 2021 Just now, TamBuktu said: I need to got through shady route once again. It makes me sick in the stomach thinking of the potential consequences What consequences? Hire a PI, you get your information, you pay the individual. Why are you creating such drama - 6 1 Link to post Share on other sites
BaileyB Posted November 19, 2021 Share Posted November 19, 2021 2 minutes ago, TamBuktu said: Would I do it, if I was a mother/grandmother and knew this will stop my partner from experiencing this, even if he say he'll cope? Nope, I wouldn't. Would you dot it? Again, we’re you present for this discussion at the time they got together? Perhaps he told her that he didn’t want to have children? Given the situation, it would appear that he has not actually changed his mind - Why are you blaming the woman for not “doing the right thing” by him when he is a grown man, capable of making his own decisions and directing his own life. 6 1 Link to post Share on other sites
elaine567 Posted November 19, 2021 Share Posted November 19, 2021 1 minute ago, TamBuktu said: I need to got through shady route once again. It makes me sick in the stomach thinking of the potential consequences Why is hiring a PI shady? Is it any more shady than what your bf is doing? Keeping his real life a secret from you. You need to know as your future may depend on it. Though some would say if you have to resort to this degree of snooping then save your time and money by just ending it... 2 Link to post Share on other sites
Author TamBuktu Posted November 19, 2021 Author Share Posted November 19, 2021 10 minutes ago, elaine567 said: Why is hiring a PI shady? Is it any more shady than what your bf is doing? Keeping his real life a secret from you. You need to know as your future may depend on it. Though some would say if you have to resort to this degree of snooping then save your time and money by just ending it... I don’t want to do it through a legitimate place for tracking reasons. I was going to use an acquaintance. In fact- as for the therapist, you’re right I might be best off hiring a real professional. I don’t consider it snooping on him, I just need few details to build a full picture… Link to post Share on other sites
elaine567 Posted November 19, 2021 Share Posted November 19, 2021 13 minutes ago, TamBuktu said: Would I do it, if I was a mother/grandmother and knew this will stop my partner from experiencing this, even if he say he'll cope? Nope, I wouldn't. Would you dot it? It depends very much on the partner as to whether they had expressed a desire for children. Not every man wants children. He doesn't seem in much of a hurry to have them with you either... does he? He was not 17 when he met her, he was a grown man. Grown men know older women cannot have children so it was hardly a secret she kept from him. Stop demonising the wife, it will do you no good. 4 2 Link to post Share on other sites
Author TamBuktu Posted November 19, 2021 Author Share Posted November 19, 2021 16 minutes ago, BaileyB said: Again, we’re you present for this discussion at the time they got together? Perhaps he told her that he didn’t want to have children? Given the situation, it would appear that he has not actually changed his mind - Why are you blaming the woman for not “doing the right thing” by him when he is a grown man, capable of making his own decisions and directing his own life. I’m not blaming anyone. I’m just stating the fact that it’s easy to take advantage of someone at a low spot, with long term consequences. I have been in these shoes too and kind of breaks my heart thinking that the vast majority of people would have said “she’s an adult and deserved it” Link to post Share on other sites
elaine567 Posted November 19, 2021 Share Posted November 19, 2021 2 minutes ago, TamBuktu said: I don’t want to do it through a legitimate place for tracking reasons. I was going to use an acquaintance. In fact- as for the therapist, you’re right I might be best off hiring a real professional. I don’t consider it snooping on him, I just need few details to build a full picture… A professional will not gossip or let slip, an acquaintance might. Who is tracking you? Link to post Share on other sites
Author TamBuktu Posted November 19, 2021 Author Share Posted November 19, 2021 1 minute ago, elaine567 said: It depends very much on the partner as to whether they had expressed a desire for children. Not every man wants children. He doesn't seem in much of a hurry to have them with you either... does he? He was not 17 when he met her, he was a grown man. Grown men know older women cannot have children so it was hardly a secret she kept from him. Stop demonising the wife, it will do you no good. He wasn’t. He was exactly my age and buried the two most important people in his life at about that time. I’m not demonizing her. She had a fresh ex husband to one up, I guess it’s only natural to do it.. People are inherently selfish. Link to post Share on other sites
Author TamBuktu Posted November 19, 2021 Author Share Posted November 19, 2021 6 minutes ago, elaine567 said: A professional will not gossip or let slip, an acquaintance might. Who is tracking you? Lol you’re right I’m projecting too much. I’ve never done anything like this so it feels more horrible than what it really is Link to post Share on other sites
BaileyB Posted November 19, 2021 Share Posted November 19, 2021 8 minutes ago, TamBuktu said: I’m just stating the fact that it’s easy to take advantage of someone at a low spot, with long term consequences. Who says that she took advantage of him? That’s quite an assumption to make, considering that he was an adult man when they got together. Was he vulnerable because of the loss of his first love? Is that when she swooped in and took advantage of him? 3 Link to post Share on other sites
elaine567 Posted November 19, 2021 Share Posted November 19, 2021 4 minutes ago, TamBuktu said: He wasn’t. He was exactly my age and buried the two most important people in his life at about that time. I’m not demonizing her. She had a fresh ex husband to one up, I guess it’s only natural to do it.. People are inherently selfish. We all do what we think is best., Don't you think monopolising a married man and taking him away from his wife every evening isn't inherently selfish? You could stop it tomorrow... 6 Link to post Share on other sites
BaileyB Posted November 19, 2021 Share Posted November 19, 2021 (edited) 10 minutes ago, TamBuktu said: People are inherently selfish. You are proving that point by involving yourself in their marriage, attempting to guide and support this man to divorce so that he can be with you and you can have the family you want, all the whole passing judgment on his wife - no? Not to be unkind, but pot - meet kettle. Edited November 19, 2021 by BaileyB 3 3 Link to post Share on other sites
Author TamBuktu Posted November 19, 2021 Author Share Posted November 19, 2021 2 minutes ago, BaileyB said: Who says that she took advantage of him? That’s quite an assumption to make, considering that he was an adult man when they got together. Was he vulnerable because of the loss of his first love? Is that when she swooped in and took advantage of him? Yes that and also another loved one in his family But yes, you’re right is a big assumption. From all his relationship stories that’s the only one that we haven’t spoke about Link to post Share on other sites
Author TamBuktu Posted November 19, 2021 Author Share Posted November 19, 2021 2 minutes ago, BaileyB said: You are proving that point by involving yourself in their marriage, attempting to guide and support this man to divorce so that he can be with you and you can have the family you want, all the whole passing judgment on his wife - no? Not to be unkind, but pot - meet kettle. We all are, aren’t we.. By not bringing any of this up until much later in the relationship I though I have been doing the right thing (let him decide). Also I though that’s the most gentle way for anyone involved- gradually with no shocks. I’m not excusing myself just sharing my thought process Link to post Share on other sites
elaine567 Posted November 19, 2021 Share Posted November 19, 2021 4 minutes ago, TamBuktu said: Lol you’re right I’m projecting too much. I’ve never done anything like this so it feels more horrible than what it really is A PI could also look into his affairs too. How much does he actually own? Does his wife own half or even more, who knows? Is he being straight down the middle or is he feeding you a load of BS... Younger men often get with older women for financial gain, maybe he did the same... 2 Link to post Share on other sites
BaileyB Posted November 19, 2021 Share Posted November 19, 2021 7 minutes ago, TamBuktu said: But yes, you’re right is a big assumption. Do you think so little of the man that you believe he is not capable of making his own decisions such that he is so easily led into a marriage that he does not want? This is a common fallacy on this site - she wanted the marriage, she wanted the baby - he wasn’t sure or didn't want either but he felt that he had no other choice but to go along… Men don’t marry without their consent. Even if it was a poor decision, a woman is not able to force a man to the minister and say I Do without his consent. If he married the woman, it was because he made the decision to chose this for himself. 2 Link to post Share on other sites
RebeccaR Posted November 19, 2021 Share Posted November 19, 2021 21 minutes ago, TamBuktu said: People are inherently selfish. 21 minutes ago, TamBuktu said: He wasn’t. He was exactly my age and buried the two most important people in his life at about that time. I’m not demonizing her. She had a fresh ex husband to one up, I guess it’s only natural to do it.. People are inherently selfish. You really don’t come across in a good light when you say these things. And not because you’re being cruel, though you are. The “pick meisha” look isn’t attractive. Maybe MM has noticed. You are just doing a disservice to yourself. 4 Link to post Share on other sites
Author TamBuktu Posted November 19, 2021 Author Share Posted November 19, 2021 1 minute ago, RebeccaR said: You really don’t come across in a good light when you say these things. And not because you’re being cruel, though you are. The “pick meisha” look isn’t attractive. Maybe MM has noticed. You are just doing a disservice to yourself. The only caveat is that this is something I never, ever discussed with him. Not even implicitly Link to post Share on other sites
Author TamBuktu Posted November 19, 2021 Author Share Posted November 19, 2021 3 minutes ago, BaileyB said: Do you think so little of the man that you believe he is not capable of making his own decisions such that he is so easily led into a marriage that he does not want? This is a common fallacy on this site - she wanted the marriage, she wanted the baby - he wasn’t sure or didn't want either but he felt that he had no other choice but to go along… Men don’t marry without their consent. Even if it was a poor decision, a woman is not able to force a man to the minister and say I Do without his consent. If he married the woman, it was because he made the decision to chose this for himself. All I can say is I almost did it myself once out of desperation… If the circumstances were different, I’d have run the hills but I fell for it. And I’m not exactly a weak person Link to post Share on other sites
RebeccaR Posted November 19, 2021 Share Posted November 19, 2021 2 minutes ago, TamBuktu said: The only caveat is that this is something I never, ever discussed with him. Not even implicitly Well, you two hardly discuss anything explicitly, but you seem to have a great deal of knowledge of his thoughts. Maybe he has picked up on your inner thoughts too. 4 Link to post Share on other sites
Author TamBuktu Posted November 19, 2021 Author Share Posted November 19, 2021 11 minutes ago, elaine567 said: A PI could also look into his affairs too. How much does he actually own? Does his wife own half or even more, who knows? Is he being straight down the middle or is he feeding you a load of BS... Younger men often get with older women for financial gain, maybe he did the same... So that I researched already, it’s public records.. most of his wealth is on real estate and she’s not a coowner on anything. I know how it sounds from the side but he’s a honorable person. He’s the type that you’d have liked in an instant in real life. He’s not a villain, far from it. Link to post Share on other sites
Author TamBuktu Posted November 19, 2021 Author Share Posted November 19, 2021 1 minute ago, RebeccaR said: Well, you two hardly discuss anything explicitly, but you seem to have a great deal of knowledge of his thoughts. Maybe he has picked up on your inner thoughts too. He doesn’t know I know half of the things that I know;) But sure it’s possible he’s picking vines from me Link to post Share on other sites
BaileyB Posted November 19, 2021 Share Posted November 19, 2021 10 minutes ago, TamBuktu said: We all are, aren’t we.. Sure, we are all selfish. I was selfish last night, I told my partner that I wanted some time to myself and I had a bath rather than spend time with him. When you argue that we are also selfishly pursuing our own best interest - there is that kind of selfish best interest and then there is the selfish entitlement that allows you to feel justified when you have sex with another woman’s husband, intrude on their marriage, and develop aspirations/plot to encourage him to file for divorce and live happily ever after with you… 14 minutes ago, TamBuktu said: By not bringing any of this up until much later in the relationship I though I have been doing the right thing (let him decide). You are not doing the right thing by involving yourself in his marriage. If you want him to decide, end your relationship and tell him to make a decision related to the future of his own marriage on its own merit. Give him the time and space to make his own decision. If he wants to be with you, he will chose to be with you. 2 1 Link to post Share on other sites
Author TamBuktu Posted November 19, 2021 Author Share Posted November 19, 2021 5 minutes ago, BaileyB said: Sure, we are all selfish. I was selfish last night, I told my partner that I wanted some time to myself and I had a bath rather than spend time with him. When you argue that we are also selfishly pursuing our own best interest - there is that kind of selfish best interest and then there is the selfish entitlement that allows you to feel justified when you have sex with another woman’s husband, intrude on their marriage, and develop aspirations/plot to encourage him to file for divorce and live happily ever after with you… You are not doing the right thing by involving yourself in his marriage. If you want him to decide, end your relationship and tell him to make a decision related to the future of his own marriage on its own merit. Give him the time and space to make his own decision. If he wants to be with you, he will chose to be with you. Yes but it’s done already. If I do what you’re suggesting, to me that feels like a coercion. I’d have to think about it Link to post Share on other sites
Recommended Posts