Break up/unavailability/confusion

[Shipshape45]

Hi all, I appreciate this issue I have might cause some eye rolls, but I really need to get a few things off my chest as I'm feeling very confused and blindsided.

I was recently dating a man who I liked very much (I had known him casually for a few years just for clarity). He's 1+ year out of a lengthy marriage of 20+ years (separated but not divorced yet). Our first date went really well, but during that date he stated he wasn't sure about 'where he was at' with relationships and that he was functioning as a single person/living alone for the first time in his life. I wondered why on earth he was on a date, but I accepted this. At the end of the date he instigated a kiss, great, but confusing for me. He stated he wanted to see how things went as he has liked spending time with me. I agreed figuring this was 'taking it slow' and stated that I wasn't into casual liaisons as I find that feelings get involved so a fwb was not what I wanted.

Over the following couple of months we had a lovely time, good connection, great conversation...it felt 'right'. Eventually we did become intimate both physically and also in terms of behaviours, like sleeping over, attending events, going on dates etc. He was very affectionate, very caring, holding my hand in the street etc. He felt like a boyfriend, it was going in the right direction, and where I'd been clear that I wasn't a fwb I started to trust we were on the right track (I know, I know, a conversation should have been had). There were however times when he would state that he was still not sure what he was doing re: learning to live alone, feeling 'winning at life' some days and at other times not. It was like he'd get close to me, then make a statement like that, which would put me off balance and make me feel a little anxious.

I stayed at his a few weeks ago and we had a great time, we cooked together, talked, spent lots of time being affectionate and were also physically intimate. We smiled so much in each others company, you know, beaming like teenagers...sweet, playful fun. No weird tension, a good time! It felt very 'coupley'.

Then...the other shoe drops. A week or so later we have a phone conversation where he tells me that he knows we're a good match but he can't give me the stability I'm looking for (he works away a little at weekends as well as having a full time job). He explained that after a decades long marriage he has now got the opportunity to say 'yes' to friends, do things on the spur of the moment, to not have to answer to anyone. He explained that I deserve better than what he can currently offer...and I am broken up over it 😭

I think if our last date had been awful I could understand it, but it wasn't, it was lovely, we were happy/laughing/smiling. He clearly wanted me to be happy, made me super welcome at his home, doing all the 'on best behaviour stuff', checking in with me that I was happy etc. The connection felt just right. He has been open about his difficulties and history, openly 'vulnerable' (as I was with him), listened well, talking like really close friends. Please be gentle with me, I'm very upset right now...I just don't know what went wrong/what I did? I know I likely should have walked away...😭

[elaine567]

As you said it felt very couple-y and whilst to you that was  good thing to him it wasn't.
He is not ready to be couple-y again, he wants his freedom...

[elaine567]

12 minutes ago, Shipshape45 said:

during that date he stated he wasn't sure about 'where he was at' with relationships and that he was functioning as a single person/living alone for the first time in his life.

This was when you should have walked away...
Newly separated divorced people alone for the first time in their lives want "freedom".
Those that don't want freedom, would never give you the "I don't really want a relationship" spiel.
They are desperate to get couple-y again.
You assumed too much and you didn't listen to what he told you from day one.

Relationships are hard enough without getting involved with guys who don't want one and tell you so.

[Alpacalia]

I'm sure he enjoyed spending time with you and thinks fondly of you but he was pretty open about "where he was at" from day one.

Unfortunately, you made things way too easy for him.

He set his cards on the table from day one regarding this relationship but you chose to ignore it.

That's okay. Now you just have to focus on moving on.

 

 

Edited November 17, 2021 by Alpaca

[Shipshape45]

16 minutes ago, elaine567 said:

This was when you should have walked away...
Newly separated divorced people alone for the first time in their lives want "freedom".
Those that don't want freedom, would never give you the "I don't really want a relationship" spiel.
They are desperate to get couple-y again.
You assumed too much and you didn't listen to what he told you from day one.

Relationships are hard enough without getting involved with guys who don't want one and tell you so.

I know, I totally appreciate that, and your reply. I think I just saw the increase in 'coupley stuff' as an indication that he was moving in the same direction...that perhaps he'd had some reservations initially, but was coming round to the idea? It wasn't 'booty call territory'...he was very attentive and kind... just what I'd been looking for...I thought he may be scared of getting involved again. He'd told me he'd done a rebound relationship already, so I thought that perhaps he was just a bit scared...😞

[Shipshape45]

15 minutes ago, Alpaca said:

I'm sure he enjoyed spending time with you and thinks fondly of you but he was pretty open about "where he was at" from day one.

Unfortunately, you made things way too easy for him.

He set his cards on the table from day one regarding this relationship but you chose to ignore it.

That's okay. Now you just have to focus on moving on.

 

 

Thanks Alpaca, I do know this stuff, I'm just very upset. I wonder why on earth someone would be dating in the first place if they're not ready? I don't know if the increased coupley stuff freaked him out...it was like it was all good, then this sudden U-turn! 

[elaine567]

2O+ years married and not divorced was a huge red flag in itself.
Why would you assume he was ready for a relationship?
He was FWB or fling material, not someone you give your heart to.
The old saying is NEVER EVER  try to seriously date guys who are separated, YOU will get hurt...

Whose idea was it to end the marriage?

[Shipshape45]

4 minutes ago, elaine567 said:

2O+ years married and not divorced was a huge red flag in itself.
Why would you assume he was ready for a relationship?
He was FWB or fling material, not someone you give your heart to.
The old saying is NEVER EVER  try to seriously date guys who are separated, YOU will get hurt...

Whose idea was it to end the marriage?

My mistake, I know. I think because he'd already done a 'rebound', I thought he might be ready? The marriage ended because he found out that his now estranged wife had a one night stand...it hasn't been an easy relationship as she had issues with alcohol and MH issues. He rebounded in a few months at the start of the pandemic and moved in with that person, but then it crashed and burned quickly...he only moved in to his first place on his own not quite a year ago.

[glows]

What was the conversation about working away on weekends about? He might have sensed your disappointment at not seeing him on weekends or often enough. He's telling you that this is due to his circumstances and not having to answer to anyone. It can also point to a romance that is moving too quickly and incompatible in the long run.

Regardless of the flowery things he said about you or the relationship, breaking it off does suggest incompatibility. What you are looking for at this time and what he is preferring don't align and he doesn't want to have lengthy conversations about why. I think he also senses you becoming more emotionally attached and he's not on the same page as you. That's why the reason for breaking it off is his current situation. 

I married someone who was separated from his ex-wife at the time and it wasn't a good idea. I also witnessed the end of a marriage which was difficult to see, not because the parties made it difficult or that it was a lengthy divorce. It was just heartbreaking to see that. He has a long road of recovery and healing. That he's telling you or sensing in part that he needs more time is quite decent actually and points to someone who has some conscience. 

I suggest respecting his stance, don't overthink it or look too deeply into what he said and absolutely do not internalize it as if you have done something wrong or are unworthy of love. You need time too, to reflect and ask yourself again what you prefer or require in a relationship. When you're ready get back up and meet others. I do not suggest staying in contact with him. As far as you are concerned, he is not available.

[Wiseman2]

2 hours ago, Shipshape45 said:

separated but not divorced yet. A week or so later we have a phone conversation where he tells me that he knows we're a good match but he can't give me the stability I'm looking for

Sorry this happened. A separated person can not offer commitment. He's got his single-life training-wheels on so can not offer much.

It's not about you or how well things were going. 

You dodged a bullet because you really don't want to hold someone's hand through their divorce.

[Shipshape45]

6 minutes ago, Wiseman2 said:

Sorry this happened. A separated person can not offer commitment. He's got his single-life training-wheels on so can not offer much.

It's not about you or how well things were going. 

You dodged a bullet because you really don't want to hold someone's hand through their divorce.

Thanks Wiseman...I read it this way too. It's just when you feel a good connection with someone y'know? I miss him and it sucks. The worst of it is that my last relationship involved supporting someone through an extremely acrimonious divorce...I certainly wouldn't want to do it again, that's for sure

[Shipshape45]

59 minutes ago, glows said:

What was the conversation about working away on weekends about? He might have sensed your disappointment at not seeing him on weekends or often enough. He's telling you that this is due to his circumstances and not having to answer to anyone. It can also point to a romance that is moving too quickly and incompatible in the long run.

Regardless of the flowery things he said about you or the relationship, breaking it off does suggest incompatibility. What you are looking for at this time and what he is preferring don't align and he doesn't want to have lengthy conversations about why. I think he also senses you becoming more emotionally attached and he's not on the same page as you. That's why the reason for breaking it off is his current situation. 

I married someone who was separated from his ex-wife at the time and it wasn't a good idea. I also witnessed the end of a marriage which was difficult to see, not because the parties made it difficult or that it was a lengthy divorce. It was just heartbreaking to see that. He has a long road of recovery and healing. That he's telling you or sensing in part that he needs more time is quite decent actually and points to someone who has some conscience. 

I suggest respecting his stance, don't overthink it or look too deeply into what he said and absolutely do not internalize it as if you have done something wrong or are unworthy of love. You need time too, to reflect and ask yourself again what you prefer or require in a relationship. When you're ready get back up and meet others. I do not suggest staying in contact with him. As far as you are concerned, he is not available.

Thank you for your considered reply, Glows. Yes, we couldn't get together often. He's a musician, and this part time part of his life is really taking off 'post pandemic'. This involves gigs 2-4 times per month, mostly at weekends and often all over the country. After I saw him last I'd asked if he was free the following Friday, and he was not...I felt like that's when the energy changed? Maybe the penny dropped then? This is really the first time in his life that he's been able to be essentially 'responsibility free'...his kids are young adults now, he has no partner with 'issues'... he's free. I understand that he needs this, and I respect that. We had a brief exchange where we stated our care/respect for each other and there's been NC since. I just really liked him an awful lot and let it blind me...I worry I'll not meet anyone quite like him again, that's getting me down a bit too. Personality and attraction wise it was spot on

[Alpacalia]

2 hours ago, Shipshape45 said:

Thanks Alpaca, I do know this stuff, I'm just very upset. I wonder why on earth someone would be dating in the first place if they're not ready? I don't know if the increased coupley stuff freaked him out...it was like it was all good, then this sudden U-turn! 

You're welcome!

I don't think it was a sudden u-turn.

Sometimes people can just live in the moment and it not necessarily be indicative of wanting a deeper commitment.

He might have been dating initially just to get his feet wet coming out of a 20 year marriage I think that's to be expected.

[stillafool]

2 hours ago, Shipshape45 said:

Thanks Alpaca, I do know this stuff, I'm just very upset. I wonder why on earth someone would be dating in the first place if they're not ready? I don't know if the increased coupley stuff freaked him out...it was like it was all good, then this sudden U-turn! 

Woman here -I can attest to this because in my 1st marriage, and after divorce; I met a great guy and enjoyed myself immensely in his company.  After 3 months I started thinking what am I doing here?  I don't want to be in the tied down or settled down to another person so soon and having to give acount of my comings and goings.   I, like your friend, loved being free.  This went on for 5 years after the divorce and eventually I met my now husband.  I was ready for a relationship and more by then and had gotten the joy of being alone out of my system.  I just think you met this guy at the wrong time in his life but the right time in yours.  I'm sorry.

[glows]

53 minutes ago, Shipshape45 said:

I just really liked him an awful lot and let it blind me...I worry I'll not meet anyone quite like him again, that's getting me down a bit too. Personality and attraction wise it was spot on

Don't worry about this. Truly. There will always be others. Keep your mind open and stay positive. Consider being with people who are compatible with you in the long run. Personality and attraction are bare minimums only, enough to get to the second date. There should be much more to sustain a longer term relationship and you deserve that if that's what you're looking for. 

[Shipshape45]

50 minutes ago, stillafool said:

Woman here -I can attest to this because in my 1st marriage, and after divorce; I met a great guy and enjoyed myself immensely in his company.  After 3 months I started thinking what am I doing here?  I don't want to be in the tied down or settled down to another person so soon and having to give acount of my comings and goings.   I, like your friend, loved being free.  This went on for 5 years after the divorce and eventually I met my now husband.  I was ready for a relationship and more by then and had gotten the joy of being alone out of my system.  I just think you met this guy at the wrong time in his life but the right time in yours.  I'm sorry.

Thank you for your message. It's pretty much this, that's what he said, 'right person, wrong time'. I've worried I've blown any future potential, and that if I'd said no in the first place we might have a chance...but it could be months/years until he's ready, and I can't wait around. We live in an isolated community and have a lot of mutual friends, so I really do find myself in a horrible situation...I sometimes wish I lived in a big city...🤢

[Shipshape45]

49 minutes ago, glows said:

Don't worry about this. Truly. There will always be others. Keep your mind open and stay positive. Consider being with people who are compatible with you in the long run. Personality and attraction are bare minimums only, enough to get to the second date. There should be much more to sustain a longer term relationship and you deserve that if that's what you're looking for. 

Absolutely, I'm ready for 'big love'...there is something special about him, and for this reason I'd hoped I'd found my 'person'... I've never felt like that about anyone before, and as I'm in my 40s I worry that my time is running out. This has damaged me a fair bit, despite the shortness of our 'relationship'...like, it has burned. I feel at this stage like really throwing the walls up to save myself from further pain. I haven't made great choices in the past and have had relationships with troubled men/addicts... I've now witnessed this very lovely man and it's shown me what qualities I want to see in a person...but they seem sadly rare. I don't think I'll be looking around any time soon...need some down time to lick my wounds 😢

[Alpacalia]

13 hours ago, Shipshape45 said:

Absolutely, I'm ready for 'big love'...there is something special about him, and for this reason I'd hoped I'd found my 'person'... I've never felt like that about anyone before, and as I'm in my 40s I worry that my time is running out. This has damaged me a fair bit, despite the shortness of our 'relationship'...like, it has burned. I feel at this stage like really throwing the walls up to save myself from further pain. I haven't made great choices in the past and have had relationships with troubled men/addicts... I've now witnessed this very lovely man and it's shown me what qualities I want to see in a person...but they seem sadly rare. I don't think I'll be looking around any time soon...need some down time to lick my wounds 😢

I’m sorry. I know what you’re going through and it really does hurt.

It's quite difficult when something appears to be promising at first but turns out not to be.

Even more so if it seemed to come out of nowhere and with someone you genuinely liked.

Here you knew from the start, but perhaps because all of the previous men you were dating were "not good men," you were ready to overlook that because this guy appeared so amazing and straightforward?

Maybe you can take away from it that there are lovely men out there, but the next time he seems uncommitted, run, if you're ever in a scenario like this, even though it's so difficult to get out of.

[glows]

On 11/17/2021 at 9:56 AM, Shipshape45 said:

Absolutely, I'm ready for 'big love'...there is something special about him, and for this reason I'd hoped I'd found my 'person'... I've never felt like that about anyone before, and as I'm in my 40s I worry that my time is running out. This has damaged me a fair bit, despite the shortness of our 'relationship'...like, it has burned. I feel at this stage like really throwing the walls up to save myself from further pain. I haven't made great choices in the past and have had relationships with troubled men/addicts... I've now witnessed this very lovely man and it's shown me what qualities I want to see in a person...but they seem sadly rare. I don't think I'll be looking around any time soon...need some down time to lick my wounds 😢

Rejection can feel like that. A time out doesn't mean giving up or losing yourself and wasting away. Find meaning outside of 'big love', other reasons meaningful to you in life/living. There are different ways to think about love but I don't think it's healthy as the be all and end all or ultimate goal. Try balancing this out with other interests and hobbies.  

Don't keep beating yourself up over the past. Move away from all that and only change. Break old habits. Change the way you think and the way you seek new company. In honesty, this man doesn't sound very lovely, as an outsider. He sounds preoccupied and unavailable. You can do better than this.

 

[Shipshape45]

On 11/18/2021 at 8:20 AM, Alpaca said:

I’m sorry. I know what you’re going through and it really does hurt.

It's quite difficult when something appears to be promising at first but turns out not to be.

Even more so if it seemed to come out of nowhere and with someone you genuinely liked.

Here you knew from the start, but perhaps because all of the previous men you were dating were "not good men," you were ready to overlook that because this guy appeared so amazing and straightforward?

Maybe you can take away from it that there are lovely men out there, but the next time he seems uncommitted, run, if you're ever in a scenario like this, even though it's so difficult to get out of.

I think this is very close to how I felt....I have a very 'Disney' way of looking at love... like 'love conquers all' etc. I just thought it was so promising that it was worth the risk and that we would take that journey together... even if it was slowly. I have my own life and lots of hobbies and friends, so thought not seeing each other too often would be perfect for me too...it would stop either of us from getting 'lost' in the relationship. I certainly didn't want to rush any big ticket commitments, and didn't see us doing anything like living together etc, but absolutely wanted to be with him, no doubt. Decent men who share my world view seem in short supply where I live...but yes, I would run like hell given my time again... really struggling with the depth of sadness I feel 😞

[Shipshape45]

16 hours ago, glows said:

Rejection can feel like that. A time out doesn't mean giving up or losing yourself and wasting away. Find meaning outside of 'big love', other reasons meaningful to you in life/living. There are different ways to think about love but I don't think it's healthy as the be all and end all or ultimate goal. Try balancing this out with other interests and hobbies.  

Don't keep beating yourself up over the past. Move away from all that and only change. Break old habits. Change the way you think and the way you seek new company. In honesty, this man doesn't sound very lovely, as an outsider. He sounds preoccupied and unavailable. You can do better than this.

 

Thanks Glows. I think that he and I both have work to do for sure. I have lots of friends, great hobbies (I'm a performer also), a hectic full time job etc...a very full life, it's just missing that special someone. It's important to me to be aligned with another person in terms of world view, politics, morals etc, and we seemed very similar on this. Most guys around here of my age are quite old fashioned, a bit set in their ways, and I can't get good conversation from them...but he was all these things, ticked the boxes...apart from as you say being 'not available'. I'm so sad at the moment... it's amazing how such a short 'relationship' can cause such a feeling 😢

 

16 hours ago, glows said:

Rejection can feel like that. A time out doesn't mean giving up or losing yourself and wasting away. Find meaning outside of 'big love', other reasons meaningful to you in life/living. There are different ways to think about love but I don't think it's healthy as the be all and end all or ultimate goal. Try balancing this out with other interests and hobbies.  

Don't keep beating yourself up over the past. Move away from all that and only change. Break old habits. Change the way you think and the way you seek new company. In honesty, this man doesn't sound very lovely, as an outsider. He sounds preoccupied and unavailable. You can do better than this.

 

We just had such a lot in common though...he ticked a lot of boxes for me. I have lots of friends, great hobbies (I'm also an entertainer), and a hectic full time job... I'd just like that special s

Edited November 19, 2021 by Shipshape45
Double replied

[spiderowl]

I'm sorry to hear what happened, shipshape45.  It sounds like this guy was recently out of a long marriage, looking for friends and fun, and found a delightful companion in you.  While you were looking to develop something, he was probably enjoying your lovely company and finding out what life was like without the commitment of a serious relationship.  Unfortunately, although there was a great deal of overlap in desire and needs there, he wasn't looking long term, he was wanting to enjoy freedom.

You haven't done anything wrong, so don't blame yourself.  You may not have taken his comments about not knowing where he stood too seriously, because after all, how many of us do know where we stand at first?  It is easy to miss signs that someone is less committed than you are.

It could be that the couply weekend triggered something in him that reminded him he wanted freedom at the moment - hard to say.  He would almost certainly have realised that you wanted to be part of a loving couple - which you truly deserve.  He suddenly decided to stop things developing any further on your part.  You could argue this is good, in the sense that he was trying to prevent you from being hurt if he decided he wanted to be more a single guy, or you could say that he should not have been so couply.  Whatever he did, you are now feeling very hurt and upset and that is natural.

I think if you try to get this guy to change his mind in any way, you will only hurt yourself and waste time.  You deserve someone for you, not someone uncertain who wants to see what is out there.  It may be that after all his adventures, he realises he missed the best woman in his life, but that's his problem now.  Don't wait for him.  Distance yourself and resign yourself to this not going anywhere.  You don't want to be in an uncertain 'waiting for' place.  It is important to cut him out of your life so that you know it is over.

I know it is easy to give advice and it means very little when you are hurting.  I am sorry you met a guy who was not ready for a serious relationship.  Despite what some might think, it is not always easy to tell when people behave in a loving, cosy couple way.  Be kind to yourself and treat yourself.  A better, available guy will come along when you are ready and hopefully you will look back on this as being a sad experience but one in which you learned what to look out for.

Having read through more of your responses, shipshape45, I see that he is a musician.  I have a musician in my family and I know that through several lockdowns, musicians have had to stop work and stop doing what they love.  It has been a very difficult time for them.  It is likely that he is keen to take up the opportunities to develop in bands/orchestras or whatever, that are starting to arise now.  I think you are unfortunate in that you also happened to get involved with a musician in 'down time'.  These have been unprecedented times and ordinarily you would have experienced the musician commitments and been able to judge whether that was the life for you or whether he was capable of settling down with one person at this point.  Instead, he is keen to get out there and see what life as a musician without marriage has to offer him.  I do sympathise with you.

 

Edited November 26, 2021 by spiderowl

[Lauriebell82]

I made this mistake right after my divorce too. I met MANY newly divorced men who sang a similar tune. They weren't ready for a real relationship, liked the single life. Blah blah, they just wanted to get in my pants! This is what I learned...when you first meet a man HE will flat out tell you he is looking for a long term relationship, serious committed relationship, marriage/remarriage, ect. These are all key words. If you hear anything such as "I'm not sure where I'm at" or "I'm looking for the potential for a relationship" (another red flag I learned) then move on fast! This is one thing guys are usually sure about when they start dating. Yes, there are those rare situations where you can turn a casual relationship into a more serious one but 9 times out of 10 it doesn't happen. And besides, why would you want to put yourself through that hell anyway if it's not what you really want? 

I think he never wanted a relationship with you from the very start and you tried to turn it into one unfortunately. He just couldn't get there. You have a find a man who is already looking for a relationship right from the start! Trust me they are out there. When you recover and are ready to date again, look for those key phrases. Don't date any man who tells you otherwise! This I'm sure of. I'm really sorry. But I have every faith you will find what you are looking for. 

Edited November 30, 2021 by Lauriebell82

[stillafool]

On 11/17/2021 at 8:52 AM, Shipshape45 said:

I wonder why on earth someone would be dating in the first place if they're not ready?

Not everyone dates to enter a relationship.  People still need companionship and sex.  You have to believe them when they say they aren't looking for a relationship and act accordingly.

[Lauriebell82]

On 11/17/2021 at 8:52 AM, Shipshape45 said:

Thanks Alpaca, I do know this stuff, I'm just very upset. I wonder why on earth someone would be dating in the first place if they're not ready? I don't know if the increased coupley stuff freaked him out...it was like it was all good, then this sudden U-turn! 

I don't think he got freaked out. I think he realized you weren't okay with him being more casual and he did the right thing by ending it because he saw you weren't going to rather then just string you along. But also I truly truly believe if a guy really cares about a girl enough (and vice versa) then whether timing is off or whatever for him then he will figure it out and want the relationship. Because to me I think he probably wasn't interested enough to give up his "bachelor lifestyle." That's totally not your fault at all! It just wasn't the right fit. But I believe it's best to look from the very start for someone who wants a relationship rather then gamble on being the "right person."