Do God hate samesex relationships?

[jaye]

As everyone knows their sin i have commited some but TMW, Sunday if i was to goto Church and pray and ask for guide, would i be okay to go?

i mean i just keep on doin whatever i think is right in this regard and keep on seeking still, it'll be fine?

I don't know how else can i ask

[augur]

First a quick response in regards to post 76 Jaye,

I see no issues in regards your first question.

I see nothing wrong with your second question in regards

to doing what you think is right and continuing to seek J.

 

Now, from my view of things you seem to be “data mining”

in this topic – attempting to gather as much information as

possible in the attempt to pull things together for yourself

on a personal level.

 

Would that be a fair assumption?

[jaye]

First a quick response in regards to post 76 Jaye,

I see no issues in regards your first question.

I see nothing wrong with your second question in regards

to doing what you think is right and continuing to seek J.

 

Now, from my view of things you seem to be “data mining”

in this topic – attempting to gather as much information as

possible in the attempt to pull things together for yourself

on a personal level.

 

Would that be a fair assumption?

You know what i just realize. in another post i sorta made a racial comment, and i don't know why i didn't quite mean it that way, but what i realized was how much difference little words can make, what i also realized was that it was my mistake in first place to even start this post, i am sorta catagorizing maybe trying to be one like moose believe in what i believe and hate the rest because once i made my mind ill be taking one side or another but i will believe the rest are wrong and God hates them and so should I. It's not me and i think that i should just respond with love and peace to even those who hate me. and i'll just leave it with that

[whichwayisup]

You know what i just realize. in another post i sorta made a racial comment, and i don't know why i didn't quite mean it that way, but what i realized was how much difference little words can make, what i also realized was that it was my mistake in first place to even start this post, i am sorta catagorizing maybe trying to be one like moose believe in what i believe and hate the rest because once i made my mind ill be taking one side or another but i will believe the rest are wrong and God hates them and so should I. It's not me and i think that i should just respond with love and peace to even those who hate me. and i'll just leave it with that

 

I think you're on the right track there Jaye. Don't stoop to others who don't like you. The most important people are the ones who know you, love you and are in your life. They are the ones who opinion matters!

 

Hang in there and I hope you're having a good weekend.

[jaye]

Thank you

[whichwayisup]

Thank you

 

Anytime, I mean that.

[augur]

Sounds good, Jaye.

 

whichways beautiful post sums up anything else I would have to

say.

 

I wish you well.

[Chris777]

I am lost, no really, I am litterly lost.

Seek and ye shall find

 

Look around you, and I am talking to everyone reads this post.

All the problems in the world occur because of the holy book and believing it in different ways.

Began with 1 Adam, Everyone is Adam’s Family; we’re suppose to be like brothers and sisters, me, wichwayisup, Outcast, Lindya, moose and all of us. Now we have Christians, Muslims, Jewish, Buddha, and so many more. And not just all that, we break them down.

We have Catholics, Orthodox, Christians, Mormons and more.

What was Adam’s religion? What purpose did he have on this planet?

In Christians today we have so many sects and different believes, of course Jesus didn’t want this to happen.

One Jesus, One Bible, One God and so many believes. I am really lost.

Did God wanted us to be lost, In his name kill each other? Judge and hate each other?

I mean I think we have no right to judge and hate or to kill anyone in his name, that’s not why we are here, Its God’s Job, I leave that to him, he is strong enough to change people and turn them and twist them which ever way he wants.

Why can’t we just have one answer that fits all, Of course not. That’s impossible. I feel bad looking at these posts, and I’m saying to myself, who I should believe and at what base?

And based on Moose’s Believes I think not many people God really loves now a day.

May God forgive all of you and me too.

this is a very perplexing issue, I have faced it, others have also faced it, and now you are facing it.

we can offer advice, but obviously their are many widly variant, and opposing views.

 

Ever wonder why that is?

 

the Bible states that "God is NOT the author of confusion"

 

think on that one.

the world is in chaos, make no mistake about it, all you have to do is look around.

Now if God is not , causing the sects, divisions, and other religions, just who exactly do you suppose is?

 

Every religion, and belief cannot possibly be true, especially when they are at war with each other, by being at polar opposites. abortion is a good example.

 

many people get all huffy about God and his view on homosexuality, and sin.

but have you considered, that God is not the only one interested in the choices you make?

 

Satan, by definition is the enemy of God. In direct polar opposition to his own creator.

 

Now I know that people will be offended when I ask. If the bible is 100% complete and absolute truth. Then what exactly would that make any and all other religions, holy books, sects, views, and behaviors, By definition?

 

All I know about you is what you have stated on here.

you are seeking, because you feel lost and confused.

you feel that your homosexual behavior is ok

you are apparently open minded to other possibilities.

 

Question.

Have you ever looked at youself from a perspective that you might possibly be evil? Whether you are or aren't.

 

When I was researching religions, For most of my life , I had always viewed things from the perspective that I was a "good person", and because I had never done any of the really evil things (sins), that I would probably end up in heaven ,because i was too "good" to go to hell.

 

But my attitude, and soon my entire world view was obliterated, when I began to question, that if the bible was true, then I had been wrong my whole life. I had been duped for 25 years, I had been a fool.

Now obviously this view comes from a christian biblical perspective.

 

But you can test it, for yourself, and for your own benefit.

I bought quite a few competing challengers to the bible, Mythology, astrology, book of mormon, comparitive religion, the list goes on and on.

I noticed quite quickly that many had similar themes, and ideas, on the surface.

 

And mistakenly at first I assumed they all had portions of the truth like a giant jigsaw puzzle. the problem was (and is) that their are waaaayy too many pieces that dont belong together for them to all be a part of the same puzzle. and no matter how badly I wanted them to work together , it would never happen. now if the pieces didnt fit, then that meant their was more than one puzzle. and if their was more than one, then one or more of them was wrong. So I began to test them. I started out with verses that I felt were just plain wrong, and that I suspected, had been altered.

 

now keep in mind I personally had absolutely no evidence that they were wrong, only what other people claimed , and suggested, along with my own personal opinions on them, which were in fact based on what I had been taught in school, and by friends and family my whole life.

 

the first verse I had issue with was to fear God.

 

this was very peculiar to me considering the goal of christianity is to shepherd believers for Jesus Christ. and the Idea of fearing God at first appeared bizzare, and incorrect, if in fact the goal was to draw people to him.

 

I began to notice things though. like I am sure you have already noticed yourself. that many people who claim to be Christians, have views so far in opposition to each other that none could be right . Then I ran across a verse that stated not to add anything, or take anything out of the scriptures themselves. Or else you would receive a horrible punishment. It got me thinking what If i was wrong about the bible being altered, after all I had no evidence it had actually been tampered with. and it dawned on me I had been opposing its authority over me, as well as diminishing the importance of it.

think about it

God almighty sacrificed his son to live, and die as a lowly man. to suffer, be rejected and spat upon by the very people he had come to redeem.

and here i was questioning the importance , or correctness of it.

 

You hear many people on here say that Christ was all love , and forgiveness, and tolerant.

YET Jesus himself stated

 

matt 10:

28And fear not them which kill the body, but are not able to kill the soul: but rather fear him which is able to destroy both soul and body in hell.

Jesus said to fear God rather than anyone else

 

and here is part of the reason why

29Are not two sparrows sold for a farthing? and one of them shall not fall on the ground without your Father.

30But the very hairs of your head are all numbered.

31Fear ye not therefore, ye are of more value than many sparrows.

32Whosoever therefore shall confess me before men, him will I confess also before my Father which is in heaven.

33But whosoever shall deny me before men, him will I also deny before my Father which is in heaven.

 

34Think not that I am come to send peace on earth: I came not to send peace, but a sword.

35For I am come to set a man at variance against his father, and the daughter against her mother, and the daughter in law against her mother in law.

36And a man's foes shall be they of his own household.

37He that loveth father or mother more than me is not worthy of me: and he that loveth son or daughter more than me is not worthy of me.

38And he that taketh not his cross, and followeth after me, is not worthy of me.

39He that findeth his life shall lose it: and he that loseth his life for my sake shall find it.

I dont know of any way that this could be "translated" or "interpreted"

as lovey dovey cotton candy, marshmallowy . Tolerance or whatever the current buzz word fad is.

 

Jesus Said to REPENT. He never said that "poof" it didnt matter what you did because everything should be tolerated, so you will be saved anyway.

 

Not everything should be tolerated.

Tolerance has become an EXCUSE to SIN

 

When someone tells you something, for example: quit smoking because it will screw you up, or you can do what ever you want to its your body.

 

Who do you suppose is offering the most sound advice?

the harsh truth (quit smoking, or it can kill you)

or the fluffy puffy ego stroking, ear scratching, (do whatever you want as long as no one else gets hurt)

 

If you have a map and someone tells you that it doesnt matter how you get to your destination, so you could choose to go any way you want.

 

then you could end up lost or dead, after all if they say it doesnt matter why not drive off a cliff?

 

same thing with a recipe for chocolate chip cookies, just because somone suggest that you go ahead and add onions, and jalapenos. Doesnt mean you should do it.

Test their words.

The Bible tells us to test all things to see if they are of God,

sometimes seemingly innocent behaviors and advice can be deadly.

 

The problem with Propaganda, be it Hitlers, or Satans, is that it doesn't stand up to the light of scripture. Again anything opposed to the bible by definition is satanic. (and yes it can be satanic without worshipping satan directly)

 

See for yourself, take a look at something in the bible you doubt, and look at it from the opposing perspective, and by all means test it.

 

I have heard many state that jesus never called homosexuality a sin.

however

in

matt 19:

3Some Pharisees came to him to test him. They asked, "Is it lawful for a man to divorce his wife for any and every reason?"

4"Haven't you read," he replied, "that at the beginning the Creator 'made them male and female,'[a]

5and said, 'For this reason a man will leave his father and mother and be united to his wife, and the two will become one flesh'? 6So they are no longer two, but one. Therefore what God has joined together, let man not separate."

7"Why then," they asked, "did Moses command that a man give his wife a certificate of divorce and send her away?"

8Jesus replied, "Moses permitted you to divorce your wives because your hearts were hard. But it was not this way from the beginning. 9I tell you that anyone who divorces his wife, except for marital unfaithfulness, and marries another woman commits adultery."

10The disciples said to him, "If this is the situation between a husband and wife, it is better not to marry."

11Jesus replied, "Not everyone can accept this word, but only those to whom it has been given. 12For some are eunuchs because they were born that way; others were made that way by men; and others have renounced marriage[c]because of the kingdom of heaven. The one who can accept this should accept it."

their is al lthis talk about no condemnation of homosexuals, but the fact that marrage is never ever defined as anything other than a man and woman , and that anyone that does otherwise is in contradiction to the bible.

 

therefore if homosexuals, are no more cantidates for marrage than the beast of the fields. Then homosexuality is also Fornication just exactly as adultry is . sex out of marrage.

 

Test it yourself if you doubt it.

 

the sin of homosexuality is no better or worse than adultry and fornication, both of the latter I have been guilty of committing, even though at the time I tried to justify my sins.

 

Just food for thought

[Outcast]

It's always interesting to read a lengthy, convoluted pile of words which eventually boil down to someone rationalizing that which he has chosen to believe.

 

I could find a few hundred equally lengthy and equally convoluted texts ending in very different conclusions than the one you've come to, Chris.

 

You know what i just realize. in another post i sorta made a racial comment

 

Yeah I was wondering about that.

 

i am sorta catagorizing maybe trying to be one like moose believe in what i believe and hate the rest because once i made my mind ill be taking one side or another but i will believe the rest are wrong and God hates them and so should I.

 

Oh please don't become yet one more person filled with hate in the mistaken belief that God wills people to hate each other.

 

It's not me and i think that i should just respond with love and peace to even those who hate me. and i'll just leave it with that

 

And remember that's what Jesus said: You have heard that it was said, "An eye for an eye and a tooth for a tooth." But I say to you, Do not resist one who is evil. But if any one strikes you on the right cheek, turn to him the other also; and if any one would sue you and take your coat, let him have your cloak as well; and if any one forces you to go one mile, go with him two miles.

 

Matthew 5.38-41

 

Now if you want to see something interesting, see how different world faiths dealt with the same issue of how to deal with persecution:

http://www.unification.net/ws/theme145.htm

It comes from Moon's church which would ordinarily make it suspect but I can't imagine that the concordance itself is incorrect.

[jaye]

I'm Standing By In Going To Church.

[lindya]

the first verse I had issue with was to fear God.

 

this was very peculiar to me considering the goal of christianity is to shepherd believers for Jesus Christ. and the Idea of fearing God at first appeared bizzare, and incorrect, if in fact the goal was to draw people to him.

 

Agreed

 

Then I ran across a verse that stated not to add anything, or take anything out of the scriptures themselves. Or else you would receive a horrible punishment

 

Seems a sensible clause to add in, if you're writing the definitive text on how other people should live their lives and you're doing your best to avoid future challenges.

 

It got me thinking what If i was wrong about the bible being altered, after all I had no evidence it had actually been tampered with.

 

Does this mean that your attempts to adhere to the bible's word stem primarily from fear and self preservation? Are those purer motives than faith, compassion and humanitarianism?

[Outcast]

after all I had no evidence it had actually been tampered with.

 

It's not a question of being 'tampered with' and that you have 'no evidence' doesn't mean it doesn't exist. The issue is the game of 'post office' where one person saying something can be badly misinterpreted by a hearer who then misinterprets it to the next listener. Do that for a few thousand years and you can't have faith that the original text has been rendered correctly.

[augur]

Jaye – I think your plan in regards to going to church sounds

good for you.

 

the Bible states that "God is NOT the author of confusion"

 

think on that one.

 

To add to outcasts comment, in regards to interpretation, let me use your above

quote from 1 cor 14 (first half of verse 33), Chris. Taken at face value, the way

that you quoted it seems strait forward, until one looks at the whole of the

14th chapter of Corinthians (Being from one of Pauls books, I have found that

full chapters shed more light on the rambling points he attempts to make).

For myself personally, when I read the full chapter, the comment does not

seem to be one that states God is not the author of (all) confusion, but that

He is not the author of the confusion that Paul addresses in whole of the

chapter. That, in my opinion, Paul digresses into a subject that seems

completely outdated in our times right after this statement further makes

me suspect in regards to the works of Paul.

[jaye]

Jaye – I think your plan in regards to going to church sounds

good for you.

Yeah i'm not going to church untill i'm sure, because looking at it, A church is nothing more then just a building, its the faith, respect and teaching and a good leader who knows whats he doing makes it a church.

And i don't think anyone needs to goto church in order to pray, God is everywhere he is watching and listening, he'll here me anywhere i am.

But going to church is important, so that you can share knowledge.

[augur]

Agreed, Jaye – mind you, I do not think that you *need* to go,

but in your quest of self discovery, it may give you more data

in regards to working things out for yourself.

[basscatcher]

Yeah i'm not going to church untill i'm sure, because looking at it, A church is nothing more then just a building, its the faith, respect and teaching and a good leader who knows whats he doing makes it a church.

And i don't think anyone needs to goto church in order to pray, God is everywhere he is watching and listening, he'll here me anywhere i am.

But going to church is important, so that you can share knowledge.

 

Church is where we go to learn, worship, give thanks and praise.

 

"Where two or more come together in my name I shall be present."

He joins us in our praise and units the prayers of the faithful.

 

He is everywhere and with us always no matter where or whom we are with. We don't need to go to church to pray. I pray no matter where I am at.

 

Here's a funny for you:

I attended a conference one weekend and when I returned to work that Monday I was so much into prayer that when I answered the phone I said "Hail Mary" and stopped and laughed out loud at myself. It's a good thing it was only my VP that had called. He finished my sentence and said "full of grace." and we had a good laugh at it. I had been praying deeply in my mind and heart and wasn't focused on work..

 

Don't ever feel threatened about going to church. It's good to hear God's word and be in unity with others in worship. Hearing the interpretations of the scripture readings is good food for thought. Don't let peoples opinions and ideas stop you from hearing.

 

I do beleive that the best thing for you to do is to go to different denominational Pastors, Preachers and Preists and get their view points about the questions you have. Asking those of us (in LS) is only the different ingredients to your cake. You need to go to the icing to find the finished product. From the responses you get from the different leaders you can find a common ground and the differences of beliefs. I think then you will find a path you can walk down.

 

I have stated before I am a cradle Roman Catholic. I was raised with traditional Catholicism. I am fairly open minded to a degree and I beleive all persons need to make their own decisions. It is our free will. But don't make decisions based out of a lack of knowledge.

 

I know here in the twin cities there is a group in the Catholic Church for gay/lesbian persons who seek support, understanding and guidance in their confusion of their lifestyle and choice. They are like you: seeking and confused. NO matter where you go you will face oppositions. Don't let them detour you away from God. Thse who reject and rebuke you are the ones who need to seek understanding that God loves all people and he won't turn away from us. He is always seeking us (our hearts)!! Even when we run from him and try to hide from him.

 

Adam and Eve tried to hide from him in the Garden but he knew where they were.. He always sees us and is always pining for our hearts to love him and serve him..

You are not lost Jaye. You never were. God knows where you are and he is with you, ALWAYS! Even the non-believers whether they want to believe it or not!

[Moose]

Oh please don't become yet one more person filled with hate in the mistaken belief that God wills people to hate each other.

Where are you people getting off saying I hate other religions? Or that I'm filled with hate? Or even that I said God wills people to hate each other?

 

Just because I said my beliefs are my own, and the rest, to me, are wrong, wrong, wrong doesn't mean I hate other religions or any person, be he gay or not.

 

I've said nothing that would put these assumptions in anyone's head.

 

God hates sin. That's the only time I've said anyone hates anything.

 

This is exactly the kind of twisting and bending I'm talking about, and some people on here use it to the fullest.......

 

On a different note, Chris.....that was an excellent post.

[FIORDALIZA]

Right, I don't know why i let people get on my nerds, they make me feel like "

OH, MY GOD. I feel that i'm in the middle of a maze, witha torch in my hand, looking for a way outta this, and can't."

 

 

 

 

thats because you need jesus to get you out of that maze not a torch

listen god does not hate the sinner, he hates the sin, god loves you, he

loves you so much he send his only son to pay for yours as well as my sin jesus pay on that cross with his own blood , he was mutilated almost tourtored for all the sin of this world if you knew what he went through for you and me you would know that no matter who you are what you do god loves you, but it is sin that seperates us from him, remember god is holy and he will have nothing to do with sin, god is a jelous god you shall only serve one god not two gods for if you live in darkness you serve the devil not god because jesus is the light of the world so all darkness can be brought to light

if you feel that you are in a maze trapped running with a torch

is because you know deep inside that there is something wrong something that is not right with god, first of all there is no way out of it neither the thief, fornicator, lier, adultrer will make it to live with god because god is a holy god no one but no one will see god the father without holyness, i can asure you that....... listen people will make any excuse to run away from the truth and not have to deal with the reality that there is a god that oneday we will some day have to give an answer to all the choices we made here on earth. people dont want to deal with the truth cause it bring them fear of where they will end up one day. the diffrent kind of fear that keeps me connected to god is the kind of fear that keeps me respecting and doing right infront of god and not wanting to do anything that will hurt my lord and my love and honor to him, that kind of fear, like the one you have with your dad when yo were a child that you loved him respected him but you knew that if you messed up he would probebly spank you, but you knew deep inside he loves you. well my friend there you have it, so why dont you repent and ask jesus to come into your heart and be your savior and help you deal with what you are going through to change you inside out..... just trust in him and he will deliver you..........

[amerikajin]

Oh my, this thread was reopened after 3 months of dormancy.

 

Okay, Jaye, if you're still reading, understand one thing: there are untold different ideas about what God is, what God thinks.

 

I think that most of those who are telling you that same sex marriages are sinful in your case are probably of the Christian persuasion. Now I have to admit that I am not up on the Bible, but a lot of people who claim to be followers of the Christian faith, say that homosexuality is a sin. The irony of that is, many (not all opponents, but many) draw from the explicit passage of Leviticus in the Old Testament; however, that was rendered moot by the books in the New Testament. Jesus wanted to preach what he thought was a more updated version of God's word, and the passages I've read in the Bible appear to be much more moderate than the Old Book. I admit, though, I am not a Biblical scholar. But scholar or not, even the most erudite students of Christianity disagree over what the Bible passages mean. It is natural for humans to come to their own conclusions based on their own experiences.

 

Let's say for the sake of argument that the Christian religion expressly prohibits homosexuality...what makes Christianity the final word on what's moral and immoral? How can Christianity claim to be any more representative of God's intentions than Buddhism or Hinduism or the Sikh and Krishna religions; what makes Christianity more infallible than the B'Hai faith or even animistic religions for that matter? No person on earth can prove that their interpretation of God's word is the final word on God. Nobody can even prove God's existence. We can speculate, but that's up to the individual to do in private, based on their own experiences.

 

My own view is that a gay relationship isn't exactly 'normal' but I don't necessarily consider it sinful. And even if I did...what makes me the last word on God? I think we have to look at sin in human terms first. We have to follow the basic rule that applies universally: do unto others as you'd have others do unto you. Do no harm. If you two are comfortable with your lives together, then screw what anyone else thinks. Your relationship only injures others by virtue of their own intolerance. That's their problem, not yours.

 

My own opinion? God looks at the big picture. A person's sexual preference is really a small part of who he is as a person, I think.

[blind_otter]

I read this whole thread. I kept thinking - what if I were gay and I was told to reject my self-concept. Or, what if (in a context that I understand better) heterosexual sex was considered a sin (since I am for the most part heterosexual)?

 

I would spend my life denying who I am. Never accepting myself or the divinity within. I would spend my life repressing the joyous celebration of what I contribute to the universe. I would never feel joyous and free. I would never feel like it was ok to be what I knew I was.

 

I was just thinking that. It would be a major bummer to be like that.

 

What is it about Christianity that glorifies guilt and shame? Says the girl who went to 9 years of Catholic school.

[Chris777]

I read this whole thread. I kept thinking - what if I were gay and I was told to reject my self-concept. Or, what if (in a context that I understand better) heterosexual sex was considered a sin (since I am for the most part heterosexual)?

 

I would spend my life denying who I am. Never accepting myself or the divinity within. I would spend my life repressing the joyous celebration of what I contribute to the universe. I would never feel joyous and free. I would never feel like it was ok to be what I knew I was.

 

I was just thinking that. It would be a major bummer to be like that.

 

What is it about Christianity that glorifies guilt and shame? Says the girl who went to 9 years of Catholic school.

 

Did you also ask yourself, what if you were, serial killer, a nazi "scientist", or a pedophile, all of whom could also pose the exact same questions?

[Outcast]

Did you also ask yourself, what if you were, serial killer, a nazi "scientist", or a pedophile, all of whom could also pose the exact same questions?

 

There's a difference which should be simple enough for anyone to understand.

 

Try to follow.

 

If you are gay and having sex with another gay person, it's by MUTUAL CONSENT.

 

Your 'nazi scientists, serial killers and pedophile' DO THINGS TO PEOPLE WITHOUT THEIR CONSENT.

 

Do you get it yet? The same answer goes for every nutjob who will come along and say 'well next people can marry goats' - NO -- DUH - THE GOAT CAN'T CONSENT.

[Apex]

I would spend my life denying who I am. Never accepting myself or the divinity within. I would spend my life repressing the joyous celebration of what I contribute to the universe. I would never feel joyous and free. I would never feel like it was ok to be what I knew I was.

I’ll pick this apart carefully.

 

Your identity seems to begin and end with your sexuality.

Is sex the only thing you can contribute? Is your lackluster libido going to upset the planetary alignment?

Because you think it may “feel good” doesn’t make it good.

 

Is sex your only purpose and goal in life?

1 Cor 6:12-20

12"Everything is permissible for me"—but not everything is beneficial. "Everything is permissible for me"—but I will not be mastered by anything. 13"Food for the stomach and the stomach for food"—but God will destroy them both. The body is not meant for sexual immorality, but for the Lord, and the Lord for the body. 14By his power God raised the Lord from the dead, and he will raise us also. 15Do you not know that your bodies are members of Christ himself? Shall I then take the members of Christ and unite them with a prostitute? Never! 16Do you not know that he who unites himself with a prostitute is one with her in body? For it is said, "The two will become one flesh." 17But he who unites himself with the Lord is one with him in spirit.

18Flee from sexual immorality. All other sins a man commits are outside his body, but he who sins sexually sins against his own body. 19Do you not know that your body is a temple of the Holy Spirit, who is in you, whom you have received from God? You are not your own; 20you were bought at a price. Therefore honor God with your body.

What is it about Christianity that glorifies guilt and shame? Says the girl who went to 9 years of Catholic school.

I think pain, whether it comes from guilt or shame, is a pretty good indicator that change is needed. You can deny it, but you would only be fooling yourself.

[bluetuesday]

Okay, Jaye, if you're still reading, understand one thing: there are untold different ideas about what God is, what God thinks.

 

I think that most of those who are telling you that same sex marriages are sinful in your case are probably of the Christian persuasion. Now I have to admit that I am not up on the Bible, but a lot of people who claim to be followers of the Christian faith, say that homosexuality is a sin. The irony of that is, many (not all opponents, but many) draw from the explicit passage of Leviticus in the Old Testament; however, that was rendered moot by the books in the New Testament. Jesus wanted to preach what he thought was a more updated version of God's word, and the passages I've read in the Bible appear to be much more moderate than the Old Book. I admit, though, I am not a Biblical scholar. But scholar or not, even the most erudite students of Christianity disagree over what the Bible passages mean. It is natural for humans to come to their own conclusions based on their own experiences.

 

Let's say for the sake of argument that the Christian religion expressly prohibits homosexuality...what makes Christianity the final word on what's moral and immoral? How can Christianity claim to be any more representative of God's intentions than Buddhism or Hinduism or the Sikh and Krishna religions; what makes Christianity more infallible than the B'Hai faith or even animistic religions for that matter? No person on earth can prove that their interpretation of God's word is the final word on God. Nobody can even prove God's existence. We can speculate, but that's up to the individual to do in private, based on their own experiences.

 

My own view is that a gay relationship isn't exactly 'normal' but I don't necessarily consider it sinful. And even if I did...what makes me the last word on God? I think we have to look at sin in human terms first. We have to follow the basic rule that applies universally: do unto others as you'd have others do unto you. Do no harm. If you two are comfortable with your lives together, then screw what anyone else thinks. Your relationship only injures others by virtue of their own intolerance. That's their problem, not yours.

 

My own opinion? God looks at the big picture. A person's sexual preference is really a small part of who he is as a person, I think.

 

this is a beautiful post, amerikajin.

 

jaye, if you're still reading, please try not to be confused. i know that's tough, but try.

 

god loves you, and wants you to be the truest jaye you can be. that is how you honour him, by being the man he created you to be.

 

no-one here can truthfully tell you who to be, or which set of rules to follow. everything we know about god, or think we know, every book, every scripture, every biblical lesson, has been interpreted by humans as the way they think best describes god and his wishes. we can be pretty sure god never put pen to paper. at least not in this world.

 

there is no black and white where god is concerned. there is no sin too heinous, no road deviated too far. we are specks of divinity searching for the route home. how we get there isn't important. THAT we get there, is. god's love and power and wisdom are infinite. they are not contained in any book. they are written on your heart. take the time to uncover them.

 

the vast speculation about the higher being we refer to as god should show you something. that god is many things. he is open to interpretation. i suspect he designed it that way.

 

our tiny brains cannot comprehend god. the concept is too massive. so we have tended to humanise him - and not just in the form of jesus christ. most religions claim to know what god thinks in human terms.

 

now either one religion is totally right and if you happen to pick the wrong one you're f***ed, or none are totally right. meaning, they're partially wrong.

 

do you think god, the all-loving creator of the universe, the power who created you just because knowing you was such a pleasure, do you think that god would abandon you because you make the wrong choice when he didn't provide you with any irrefutable guidance about which way to jump?

 

neither do i.

 

if the many world religions are simply interpretations of god speaking to his people in different ways, if they are different versions of the ultimate truth, what the religions share is a sense of the almighty and a will that humans should love one another. trust in that.

 

don't be concerned if god chooses to speak to you in a different way than he has spoken to everyone else. you are his unique child, he knows you best. he knows how to guide you.

 

you're on a good path, jaye. you're asking questions, you're seeking answers. i am sure god takes pleasure in this. i don't believe any conclusion you finally draw is what will define your relationship with him.

 

and i don't believe who you love defines that relationship either. the important thing is that you love. physical intimacy is an expression of that love. mutual, nurturing, soul-shaking lovemaking, whoever you share it with.

 

i am sorry there is no definite answer to your question. i cannot tell you this is right, that is wrong. no-one can. all you will get is opinion, not fact. to say that homosexual sex is a sin is a guess, at best. at worst it's a failure to understand not only the will, but the very heart of a god who defies understanding to us simple souls.

 

because maybe god doesn't want to be understood? ever thought of that? maybe he just wants to be loved. leave the judgement, if there is any, to him and instead go and be an expression of him. go and love peacefully.

 

see, this isn't confusing. this god is what he always said he was. love.

 

if you want answers, jaye, make your life a life filled with love. make it one of understanding, of hope, of tolerance, of good example. do unto others as you would be done by.

 

and i promise you, god will hold your hand through it and the angels will rejoice that one soul, at least, did his best.

[penkitten]

there is nothing in the bible that says you can not be homosexual.

 

http://www.postfun.com/pfp/homosexual.html

The Bible does not speak of gays. Nor does it speak of the earth orbiting the sun. Sexual identity was not a concept of biblical times.

 

It speaks of homosexual acts only when they are part of sacred prostitution, idolatry, promiscuity, seducing children, rape, or violating hospitality. It condemns all such acts, whether heterosexual, homosexual, or having nothing to do with sex.