RebeccaR Posted December 10, 2021 Share Posted December 10, 2021 When he suggests a course of action that makes you uneasy, do you sit down and have an adult discussion or do you just comply so as not to rock the boat? Link to post Share on other sites
stillafool Posted December 10, 2021 Share Posted December 10, 2021 5 hours ago, Pumpernickel said: She didn’t want this. OP, do you know for sure that his wife doesn't want the divorce? Link to post Share on other sites
Pumpernickel Posted December 10, 2021 Share Posted December 10, 2021 4 minutes ago, stillafool said: OP, do you know for sure that his wife doesn't want the divorce? Obviously I don’t know his wife 😂😂 - but Occam’s razor ….. he has an affair, W is in the dark - he is still trying to hide it & support & accommodate the W (which he should). I mean, we can assume all kinds of things, but based on OP’s story, I don’t see husband and wife to be in agreement WRT the divorce. 3 Link to post Share on other sites
Author Karla88 Posted December 10, 2021 Author Share Posted December 10, 2021 7 hours ago, IrinaM said: is his wife his employee in some manner? he has her on payroll? Yes but the business is being dissolved so she won’t be within the next few weeks. It was just dividends or something, I’m not too clued up on it all but she didn’t actually do anything Link to post Share on other sites
Author Karla88 Posted December 10, 2021 Author Share Posted December 10, 2021 41 minutes ago, RebeccaR said: When he suggests a course of action that makes you uneasy, do you sit down and have an adult discussion or do you just comply so as not to rock the boat? We discuss, argue and get upset for hours sometimes days. He says I’m not being understanding etc. Link to post Share on other sites
Author Karla88 Posted December 10, 2021 Author Share Posted December 10, 2021 Just now, Karla88 said: We discuss, argue and get upset for hours sometimes days. He says I’m not being understanding etc. I always end up agreeing based on his next promises and next timelines Link to post Share on other sites
stillafool Posted December 10, 2021 Share Posted December 10, 2021 23 hours ago, BaileyB said: I feel for you Karla, I do. I just feel like you woefully underestimated how easy it would be to ditch your marriages and get together with this man. His situation is obviously different than yours. He didn’t understand/represent that to you well and you failed to head the warning signs and believed it when he said everything will be fine… What is so interesting about these scenarios is the OW's separation and divorce always seems to go smoothly and quickly whereas the MM's drags on, and on and on until suddenly, the divorce just doesn't happen leaving the OW divorced and alone. I wouldn't be surprised it that's what happens with this one too. 2 2 Link to post Share on other sites
Wiseman2 Posted December 10, 2021 Share Posted December 10, 2021 1 hour ago, Karla88 said: but she didn’t actually do anything Who told you this? 1 1 Link to post Share on other sites
Author Karla88 Posted December 10, 2021 Author Share Posted December 10, 2021 1 hour ago, Wiseman2 said: Who told you this? I know she doesn’t for a fact. 2 Link to post Share on other sites
Author Karla88 Posted December 10, 2021 Author Share Posted December 10, 2021 1 hour ago, stillafool said: What is so interesting about these scenarios is the OW's separation and divorce always seems to go smoothly and quickly whereas the MM's drags on, and on and on until suddenly, the divorce just doesn't happen leaving the OW divorced and alone. I wouldn't be surprised it that's what happens with this one too. A few people have said this, I wonder why it seems the be the case for some 🤔 Link to post Share on other sites
RebeccaR Posted December 10, 2021 Share Posted December 10, 2021 5 minutes ago, Karla88 said: A few people have said this, I wonder why it seems the be the case for some 🤔 Because there are exceptions to every rule Link to post Share on other sites
Author Karla88 Posted December 10, 2021 Author Share Posted December 10, 2021 51 minutes ago, RebeccaR said: Because there are exceptions to every rule I meant more along the lines of why the woman’s goes smoothly but the mans doesn’t. I think it’s because they just don’t have the backbone sometimes. Link to post Share on other sites
RebeccaR Posted December 10, 2021 Share Posted December 10, 2021 2 minutes ago, Karla88 said: I think it’s because they just don’t have the backbone sometimes. Ultimately, the reason doesn’t matter. Yes, the man could have weaknesses, but you stated that you immediately went all in, and he didn’t. Maybe he was more conflicted than you all along. Maybe his marriage wasn’t particularly bad. Maybe he was comfortable in his life overall even if his wife wasn’t a perfect soul mate. There are lots of reasons. 2 Link to post Share on other sites
elaine567 Posted December 10, 2021 Share Posted December 10, 2021 28 minutes ago, Karla88 said: I meant more along the lines of why the woman’s goes smoothly but the mans doesn’t. I think it’s because they just don’t have the backbone sometimes. Fundamentally they cheat for different reasons, men often cheat for "extra", women often cheat because they are unhappy. Women are usually looking for a replacement husband, men are not usually looking for a replacement wife. Women are happy to move on and divorce, men do not want to leave their marriage or leave the perfect set up of having a wife, and another woman on the side. Keeping the wife in place means they get to see their kids every day. The OW may be great fun and whilst the sex is welcome, they may not want to actually marry her... Divorce is also usually very expensive for men. 6 Link to post Share on other sites
Milly May June Posted December 10, 2021 Share Posted December 10, 2021 I also think that women who leave often leave for them selves even if the affair may be a catalyst. If they don't end up with the affair partner most think they made the right decision to leave anyways. Most men who leave do it because they are in a affair fog and monkey branch onto a new relationship often involving a younger model. I heard once a statement that is vulgur but so true 'stoke a mans d**k you get him for one night. Stroke his ego you get him for a lifetime' 🤣. Whoever, wife or AP, provides most ego kibbles wins. In my experience men don't want to end up alone while woman can find joy and happiness being single. I also think men in general regret divorce more than women. Would be interesting to learn more about the subject. 2 Link to post Share on other sites
IrinaM Posted December 10, 2021 Share Posted December 10, 2021 Well this "dissolving business" will be even more drama and entanglement. What are the odds that dissolving this business will go down without a hitch over the next few weeks? What if he decides that he just can't bear to do it, and he needs more time, and you have to be patient about it? What if he decides to keep her on as staff, giving her even more of a constant presence in your life? He already has children with her and she is on his payroll. Even on the very small chance that he files for divorce, she will be part of his life forever. Between the children and the business, they will text and talk daily. When you complain about that, guess who gets to be the new "insecure nagging wife"? I've noticed that OW seem to be blind to the mountain of a "to-do list" that this man needs to accomplish before he can be theirs, along with the improbability of it getting done. You have literally built a life on a foundation of someone else's promises. That's why you are worried. 3 Link to post Share on other sites
BaileyB Posted December 10, 2021 Share Posted December 10, 2021 1 hour ago, elaine567 said: Divorce is also usually very expensive for men. I certainly believe that men and women cheat for different reasons - and I believe that many women make the rather foolish assumption that the MM thinks/feels/wants the same things that she does. They usually don’t. Basically, he expresses his interest, she is unhappy and love starved, she builds a beautiful romantic fantasy about the MM and doesn’t hesitate long to leave her unhappy married, except… He said he felt the same, or did he… And, I believe the above is the bottom line for men. Money and reputation - not many men want to be exposed to family and friends as an unfaithful husband who left his wife and children to go in search of another woman… the world tends not to look favourably on men who do this. 5 Link to post Share on other sites
BaileyB Posted December 10, 2021 Share Posted December 10, 2021 (edited) 24 minutes ago, Milly May June said: In my experience men don't want to end up alone while woman can find joy and happiness being single. I also think men in general regret divorce more than women. Absolutely agree. Men don’t generally divorce and find happiness as a single man. They are usually looking for another relationship pretty quickly… While, women will more often leave their unhappy relationship and sometimes swear off men for a long time - 24 minutes ago, Milly May June said: I heard once a statement that is vulgur but so true 'stoke a mans d**k you get him for one night. Stroke his ego you get him for a lifetime' 🤣. I love it! Edited December 10, 2021 by BaileyB Link to post Share on other sites
Author Karla88 Posted December 10, 2021 Author Share Posted December 10, 2021 (edited) 2 hours ago, RebeccaR said: Ultimately, the reason doesn’t matter. Yes, the man could have weaknesses, but you stated that you immediately went all in, and he didn’t. Maybe he was more conflicted than you all along. Maybe his marriage wasn’t particularly bad. Maybe he was comfortable in his life overall even if his wife wasn’t a perfect soul mate. There are lots of reasons. He has been honest in saying that overall she wasn’t that bad but they were just friends living together, he wasn’t in love with her and doesn’t believe he ever was. 16 is an extremely young age to be falling in love with a woman close to 30 at that time. I am around that age now and I couldn’t even begin to imagine giving a 16 year old boy the time of day under any circumstances. That being said, each to their own and I feel she was very lucky for him, at that age to take on 2 of her children, give her 2 more and provide financially right up until now and continuing to do so, I admire him for that. I believe he made a mistake at his young age and still stood by her all these years as the right thing to do, to keep his kids in a united home and putting his feelings and desires aside until his children were older, I believe he may have also stood by her for a few more years and then in time done something for himself to be happy inside, but I came along unexpectedly. My marriage was the same, very young but he was also my age too. I probably would of stayed with him, not because I was in love with him but out of habit and comfort, that wasn’t fair on him in my opinion at that time however now he has thrown my daughter under the bus, I couldn’t care less about how he feels now or felt at the time. Edited December 10, 2021 by Karla88 1 Link to post Share on other sites
Author Karla88 Posted December 10, 2021 Author Share Posted December 10, 2021 37 minutes ago, Milly May June said: I also think that women who leave often leave for them selves even if the affair may be a catalyst. If they don't end up with the affair partner most think they made the right decision to leave anyways. Most men who leave do it because they are in a affair fog and monkey branch onto a new relationship often involving a younger model. I heard once a statement that is vulgur but so true 'stoke a mans d**k you get him for one night. Stroke his ego you get him for a lifetime' 🤣. Whoever, wife or AP, provides most ego kibbles wins. In my experience men don't want to end up alone while woman can find joy and happiness being single. I also think men in general regret divorce more than women. Would be interesting to learn more about the subject. I agree and it would be great to have some male input on this thread. I also agree with the ability that we have to repair and recover from such things. I have thought various times throughout this last couple of years that no matter what happens, I done the right thing because I wasn’t in love with him and it is such a waste of life for 2 people. If it took a wandering eye for me to see it then so be it. Not the best way but it’s better than staying when you aren’t happy surely…. Link to post Share on other sites
Author Karla88 Posted December 10, 2021 Author Share Posted December 10, 2021 32 minutes ago, IrinaM said: Well this "dissolving business" will be even more drama and entanglement. What are the odds that dissolving this business will go down without a hitch over the next few weeks? What if he decides that he just can't bear to do it, and he needs more time, and you have to be patient about it? What if he decides to keep her on as staff, giving her even more of a constant presence in your life? He already has children with her and she is on his payroll. Even on the very small chance that he files for divorce, she will be part of his life forever. Between the children and the business, they will text and talk daily. When you complain about that, guess who gets to be the new "insecure nagging wife"? I've noticed that OW seem to be blind to the mountain of a "to-do list" that this man needs to accomplish before he can be theirs, along with the improbability of it getting done. You have literally built a life on a foundation of someone else's promises. That's why you are worried. Without going into too much detail, the business is just a virtual thing to be hired by companies, it’s being dissolved due to the new tax implications of IR35 - there is no money in this business or the business account. There will be other obstacles with the separation of course but the business is not one of them. They have a house they own and that he has already said he will give his half to her for his children to live in. There’s no further financial concerns surrounding their separation. Link to post Share on other sites
Author Karla88 Posted December 10, 2021 Author Share Posted December 10, 2021 (edited) 30 minutes ago, BaileyB said: I certainly believe that men and women cheat for different reasons - and I believe that many women make the rather foolish assumption that the MM thinks/feels/wants the same things that she does. They usually don’t. Basically, he expresses his interest, she is unhappy and love starved, she builds a beautiful romantic fantasy about the MM and doesn’t hesitate long to leave her unhappy married, except… He said he felt the same, or did he… And, I believe the above is the bottom line for men. Money and reputation - not many men want to be exposed to family and friends as an unfaithful husband who left his wife and children to go in search of another woman… the world tends not to look favourably on men who do this. Do you think that the world treats women who leave their marriage differently then? I mean, his family all know about me, I have met his brother in law and his Dad, his Dad is quite the king in his family and he most certainly will be discussing me to everybody else. I know his Dad was quite fond of me too and has asked after me several times. I think all his side of the family was never too keen on her and her side. (I guess if you have a 16 year old son who wants to move in with a woman close to 30 who already has 2 kids you would probably see him throwing his life away at that age) my family and his family are of a similar class, that being a working class type of family, my partner and I suffered quite a bit in our childhood and so did our parents yet we managed to make something of our lives. Whilst her family are quite middle class and she has never had to work or had any trauma in her life (up until this separation I guess) I think that the best way to put it is that she never understood his issues and the things he went through, she would look down on this aspect of him quite a lot and look down on his family too. I went off on a tangent there but my point is that his family will not perceive him the way you may think so I don’t think that is a worry. Perhaps my partner is more concerned with how her family might perceive him, as they have always looked down on him, and he’s always felt he had something to prove, perhaps they will say things like “we knew he would do this” “we expected him to be just like the rest of them” “that’s a trashy family for you” or things along those lines. Edited December 10, 2021 by Karla88 Link to post Share on other sites
RebeccaR Posted December 10, 2021 Share Posted December 10, 2021 It’s a bit presumptuous saying she never had any trauma before. No? She was a single mom, either divorced or widowed, I’m sure there was some suffering involved. And one could say she took on a third child in her 16 year old boyfriend - how exactly did a 16 year old support the family either emotionally or financially until he got older? I’m sure she helped him at least as much as he helped her. You seem to dislike the wife, despite the fact she hasn’t harmed you at all. This man has you both fighting over him. As a woman, I find this unappealing. Never fight over a man. He’s just a man! 8 Link to post Share on other sites
BaileyB Posted December 10, 2021 Share Posted December 10, 2021 (edited) 36 minutes ago, Karla88 said: his family will not perceive him the way you may think so I don’t think that is a worry. No, his family are likely to support him - after all, they are his family. But what of her family, his extended family, their friends, his children, their teachers, etc… 36 minutes ago, Karla88 said: Do you think that the world treats women who leave their marriage differently then? Women tend to be treated rather sympathetically when they are “stuck” in an unhappy and unhealthy marriage and they find the courage to leave, yes. Unless they cheat on their husband/children - then, they can are often treated brutally. As per the quote above, men tend to be more ego driven and they are often seen as the providers for the family, the protectors. When a man leaves their marriage, it costs them dearly financially. If they cheat and their wife walks away or they leave the family for their affair partner, their reputation is damaged - quite suddenly, he is not the husband/father they trusted, not the man that they thought he was… Edited December 10, 2021 by BaileyB Link to post Share on other sites
SouthernIslander Posted December 11, 2021 Share Posted December 11, 2021 1 hour ago, Karla88 said: I meant more along the lines of why the woman’s goes smoothly but the mans doesn’t. I think it’s because they just don’t have the backbone sometimes. The first mistake is thinking a man who behaves like this actually has a backbone in the first place. 44 minutes ago, Karla88 said: Do you think that the world treats women who leave their marriage differently then? I mean, his family all know about me, I have met his brother in law and his Dad, his Dad is quite the king in his family and he most certainly will be discussing me to everybody else. I know his Dad was quite fond of me too and has asked after me several times. I think all his side of the family was never too keen on her and her side. (I guess if you have a 16 year old son who wants to move in with a woman close to 30 who already has 2 kids you would probably see him throwing his life away at that age) my family and his family are of a similar class, that being a working class type of family, my partner and I suffered quite a bit in our childhood and so did our parents yet we managed to make something of our lives. Whilst her family are quite middle class and she has never had to work or had any trauma in her life (up until this separation I guess) I think that the best way to put it is that she never understood his issues and the things he went through, she would look down on this aspect of him quite a lot and look down on his family too. I went off on a tangent there but my point is that his family will not perceive him the way you may think so I don’t think that is a worry. Perhaps my partner is more concerned with how her family might perceive him, as they have always looked down on him, and he’s always felt he had something to prove, perhaps they will say things like “we knew he would do this” “we expected him to be just like the rest of them” “that’s a trashy family for you” or things along those lines. If they didn't like her, why did they allow their son to move in with her instead of pressing charges? 4 1 Link to post Share on other sites
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