Searching for Answers (Long)

[AlmostOverIt]

3 minutes ago, JRabbit said:

alright well I think you answered my question. I can not imagine how you talk throughout your posts here is not how you are in real life. Be honest with yourself. You have done exactly that throughout the thread....you have an ex model gf who modeled, you hang out with "ex pros".  There are lots of us on the forum who have all done the same but we don't include it in almost every story. Look, I'm not trying to beat you down but clearly there is some issue here you are not aware of.

You have said the women you have dated see you how you see yourself, then why are you here?  More of them must be out there? Do they really, or are they just being nice? Are just trying to not hurt your feelings or get involved?

None of this makes sense. This isn't some paranormal effect you are having. Either you aren't aware of how you really are to others or you are blowing your dating failures over proportion.

JMO

I deal with a lot of shyness. I hide it well in person. I don't toot my own horn with women, I am shy or embarrassed to talk about myself, in fact I think I probably don't sell myself enough. Again, I am not getting to opportunity to engage except rarely. And when I do, I have moderate success and that's the frustrating part, it's not anything i am saying because i haven't said anything. I can make conversation, I ask about them and hold back about myself quite a bit. But it's just even being noticeable to begin that's the issue. 

What I put on the internet is no indicator of how I am. I am sure you have met someone from online dating, or met them from work after emailing a year and they are never how they appear on the internet. So if I am being brutally honest in my assessment anonymously on the internet, it's not like I go around broadcasting that assessment. A perfect example is of the celebrities. I met through my ex. The last time that I have even thought of it was around 2016 when my ex was here.

I know you are not trying to beat me down and I am just trying to say if I internalize, in real life I am so far from going around and saying I have this car, I met XXX...

One of the things that embarrasses me most is if a friend is at a party and says, "Hey, XXX, tell them about that time..." because they find the stories funny. I would too if it wasn't me. I'll get a flush feeling, I get it just typing this generic example, and I'll typically say it's probably not an appropriate story for this crowd. My feeling is especially with women around, if I tell the story it's 100% a deal killer and would not paint me in a good light. So the things I am saying here, just no. I don't say them in real life. So between that and not mentioning celebrities or even thinking about that situation in half a decade and knowing the people I have met is a best a little anecdote nobody else would really care about, I would say I a not this open in real life and not running around saying any of those things.

You have an ex model gf who modeled, you hang out with "ex pros".  There are lots of us on the forum who have all done the same but we don't include it in almost every story. Look, I'm not trying to beat you down but clearly there is some issue here you are not aware of.

Same as above, if I haven't said a word because I do not get the chance to, so it's like where am I saying this to them and not knowing? If I go out and 0 people engage me or allow me to approach them, where would I say I hang out with ex pros or anything about my ex? In fact, my ex was bad enough I typically pretend it didn't happen. I most certainly do not bring up exes with women I am interested in. A female friend asked me recently about my ex and my pat answer is I like to leave the past in the past and I don't think about it, I mean I don;t bring it up or say much about it.

This is a forum and I told a story and then I was defending the same story and the specific story was discussed so I mentioned those details again. So it was questioned that I have an ex model gf, I said yup and explained.  

You have said the women you have dated see you how you see yourself, then why are you here?

I have stated this a couple of times, the entire intent of posting here: How can I go from having success at times and everything normal to 2-3 years of not getting a glance, a hello, any attention? Take out all the stories, the very base is I get a relationship about once every 3-5 years. Stated simply, how am I only getting an opportunity, a glance, a look or a "hi" or a positive response if I approach ever 3rd year and inbetween be a complete ghost? I am not acting differently that I am aware of. 

I am not saying I have no success and then saying I have success. I have tried to be clear, I have random success then long periods of absolutely, nothing, 0,, zilch success. If it wasn't so perplexing to me, I definitely would not be here in the first place.

None of this makes sense. This isn't some paranormal effect you are having.

That's what I am saying, none of it makes sense to me either! However, the best way I can explain it is it does feel like some paranormal effect, like the universe is teasing me. Like I win the lotto for $10 million and get sued for $15 million the next day.

 Again, I appreciate all the answers. I am just trying to explain. It's just hard to explain when something that seems unbelievable to everyone else is what I deal with daily. If I could be like, "Well, I did A,B,C and I had success" or I failed, I could deal with it. Instead I feel like I failed with "A,B, and C" for 3 years and then it worked suddenly. The I failed with it for another 3 years. So do I stop A, B and C?

I apologize, I don't articulate things well so I use too many dumb examples I guess. I really do appreciate the feedback though, maybe I am just not able to internalize it yet.

[Yosemite]

1 hour ago, AlmostOverIt said:

I may not be self-aware but nobody has ever really said anything critical that I didn't agree with that I recall or harped on personality flaws. Like I have never been put in my place where I felt I didn't deserve it.

You can't be serious. Your posts are filled with story after story of women putting you in your place for (according to you) absolutely no reason.

You've finally admitted that you're shy and reserved. You'll probably say that no one can tell that about you...all I'll say is that's very unlikely. Your main complaint seems to be that you're not the "ladies man" that your friends are. You'll probably deny that too, but go reread your posts; you want to be able to date as easily as your friends can. The truth is that's just not your life path, it's highly unlikely that that will ever happen to you. Easily getting date after date with this woman and that woman is very rare for shy, reserved, and quiet men. So, the next time a woman who's interested in dating you comes along, date her seriously and forget about casual.

Edited February 9, 2022 by Yosemite

[Yosemite]

40 minutes ago, AlmostOverIt said:

How can I go from having success at times and everything normal to 2-3 years of not getting a glance, a hello, any attention? Take out all the stories, the very base is I get a relationship about once every 3-5 years. Stated simply, how am I only getting an opportunity, a glance, a look or a "hi" or a positive response if I approach ever 3rd year and inbetween be a complete ghost? I am not acting differently that I am aware of. 

Because different women like different things. Just because one woman liked you doesn't make it surprising that the next woman you meet doesn't. Each woman is an individual and success with one woman doesn't mean that you'll have success with the next. 

 

 

[AlmostOverIt]

Just now, Yosemite said:

You can't be serious. Your posts are filled with stories of women putting you in your place for (according to you) absolutely no reason.

You've finally admitted that you're shy and reserved. You'll probably say that no one can tell that about you...all I'll say is that's very unlikely. Your main complaint seems to be that you're not the "ladies man" that you're friends are. You'll probably deny that too, but go reread your posts; you want to be able to date as easily as your friends can. The truth is that's just not your life path, it's highly unlikely that that will ever happen to you. Easily getting date after date with this woman and that woman is very rare for shy, reserved, and quiet men. So, the next time a woman who's interested in dating you comes along, date her seriously and forget about casual.

You can't be serious. Your posts are filled with stories of women putting you in your place for (according to you) absolutely no reason.

Panning, rejecting or being invisible unless it's negative attention. I am not sure I would say putting me in my place because I didn't insult them or whatever but sometimes a negative reaction that feels like I ran over their puppy but I didn't know. It feels like a pre-disposition to view me negatively despite no direct interaction if that makes sense. I am not saying for absolutely no reason, I am saying I absolutely cannot figure out the reason 

You'll probably say that no one can tell that about you...

That's kind of where I was saying I have gotten feedback initially they get one impression and after meeting them 2-3 times they get another impression. I mentioned it takes me longer for people to warm up to be and vice versa. The shyness can be a problem if I don't know someone but I try to combat it remembering to smile, if I get a conversation, ask them non-interview questions about what they say and ask them to elaborate. I do know and have been working on that I often don't focus on what they say and I am thinking of the next thing I am going to say and that can be tough for me to control, so when they are talking my mind drifts a bit instead of listening and will be thinking things like, ok ask this next...that is a problem for me until I am comfortable and the more comfortable I am with someone the less I do it.

However, I would be happy to just get to that point. I don't get there to where that can be a problem is the main issue I am trying to figure out.

I don't know of anyone from outside of being a kid telling me they thought I was shy. In fact, I found people take shyness as being stand-offish and rude. My job now it's not an option to be like that so I have a lot of experience forcing myself to be cognizant of that and make sure I don't clam up. So I feel I hide it well but I can't say what other's perception of me is, I just know nobody has ever told me they knew I was shy. I opened up to someone about that and made the comment that I have fought sometimes crippling shyness and they said they never would have guessed, but I had know them for a while so maybe it was their first impression but not at that point.

It's like fight club, the first rule of shyness is the last thing you can ever make yourself do it talk about your shyness. 

So yes I feel nobody can tell that about me but no I can't say if I am right or wrong about that feeling.

you're not the "ladies man" that you're friends are. You'll probably deny that too,

I do deny the implication I expect to be a ladies man. I am not talking about being a ladies man or getting 8 numbers everywhere I go or having everyone in the room after me. I am talking about more than every 3 years getting some kind of sign of interest, not women throwing themselves at me. I never claimed to be a ladies man or wanting to be one, in fact I have detailed here exactly how much I am not a ladies man. I am not asking how do I become a ladies man, it's about what things I guess apparently turn women off before any engagement or conversation. 

Of course everyone would love to be the end all be all that women throw themselves at, who wouldn't. But here I am more talking about how not to be the one guy at the table that nobody cares is in the conversation or not. So to level set, if I go to a 5 parties, I don't think it's crazy to think I could maybe draw a second look or get a signal or two that's inviting. 

[chillii]

 

Yeah you are right about so called well to do crowds or classes , whatever yjeu call themselves. They can be more prickly than any for sure, not to mention the fake. But those types seem to know how to work all the bs l suppose. You def' sound far more earthy, which is a really nice quality.

Edited February 9, 2022 by chillii

[lonelyplanetmoon]

18 hours ago, AlmostOverIt said:

That is one thing I have kind of leaned to is a self fulfilling prophecy. I *try* to not be like that, at least at times as in basically I go somewhere social and just don't think about it and focus on not going in negative. It seems like it finds me though. Like minding my own business sitting with my friends and someone comes over talks to the group and I am in the conversation. They'll ask what's my favorite movie and I'll say 'Happy Gilmore' and her reaction would be, "Oh, I would never date you. That movie is awful and if you like that you are definitely not my type, we could NEVER date", in a condescending, definitely not flirty, way. That's a gut punch, I didn't ask for it, I didn't flirt, I didn't indicate I wanted to date her, I didn't approach her, I didn't ask the question, I didn't ask her to come over, in short I didn't ask for any of it and she had no earthly reason to reject me, let alone so loudly and publicly.

Well what you are forgetting in all of these interactions is this.  Listen carefully.  All feedback is neutral.  Usually the person providing the feedback is providing information to you about them and not about you.  Feedback only becomes negative or positive by your reactions to it.  Her comments was about her and her mood at the time.  She was a stranger so how could she rate you as good or bad?  In this example you could have replied back with some humor to make her smile or draw out that she probably had a bad day and was grumpy…continue the conversation…. taken some actions to turn the situation around.  That is what they call charisma.  I think you let things get stuck in your craw too easily and so you let thing die there instead of turning things around to your benefit.

I still think you would benefit a lot from some therapy.  You are your own enemy in this.  I feel bad for you but you need to take steps to help yourself break the cycle.

 

[basil67]

18 hours ago, AlmostOverIt said:

Like minding my own business sitting with my friends and someone comes over talks to the group and I am in the conversation. They'll ask what's my favorite movie and I'll say 'Happy Gilmore' and her reaction would be, "Oh, I would never date you. That movie is awful and if you like that you are definitely not my type, we could NEVER date", in a condescending, definitely not flirty, way. That's a gut punch, I didn't ask for it, I didn't flirt,

And it also didn't happen.

I believe that you're having problems, but I also believe you're prone to exaggeration.  Like this above ^   First of all, asking what people's favourite movie is when chatting to a new group just isn't a question one would ask.  But even if they did, even the rudest of women would simply hear that you liked Happy Gilmore and give you a side eye or eye roll with no verbal response.    It just doesn't make sense that someone would a) ask the question of a bunch of guys they are getting to know and b) someone who has zero interest in you would waste all those words on you.

Likewise the $100 bill thing.  If you open with "excuse me, you dropped this money", she will not think that you're trying to solicit sex. 

People in general aren't as rude as you describe and it makes no sense that you get all the rudeness and the rest of us don't even witness this kind of behaviour delivered to others in our whole lives.

Edited February 9, 2022 by basil67

[AlmostOverIt]

44 minutes ago, lonelyplanetmoon said:

Well what you are forgetting in all of these interactions is this.  Listen carefully.  All feedback is neutral.  Usually the person providing the feedback is providing information to you about them and not about you.  Feedback only becomes negative or positive by your reactions to it.  Her comments was about her and her mood at the time.  She was a stranger so how could she rate you as good or bad?  In this example you could have replied back with some humor to make her smile or draw out that she probably had a bad day and was grumpy…continue the conversation…. taken some actions to turn the situation around.  That is what they call charisma.  I think you let things get stuck in your craw too easily and so you let thing die there instead of turning things around to your benefit.

I still think you would benefit a lot from some therapy.  You are your own enemy in this.  I feel bad for you but you need to take steps to help yourself break the cycle.

 

i appreciate it, this is a good point.

I think you let things get stuck in your craw too easily

Definitely. Things never used to bother me that much a few years ago. But things like this do really stick with me. Like maybe it was the build up over time but I think my default is to let it bother me rather than roll off, for sure. In the past I noticed it but forgot about it easier. 

Thanks for the thought, don't feel bad for me, I am generally happy but could be happier, I'm sure but I don't depend on someone else for happiness. I'm probably more frustrated than anything but it does not consume my day to day really.

[AlmostOverIt]

40 minutes ago, basil67 said:

And it also didn't happen.

I believe that you're having problems, but I also believe you're prone to exaggeration.  Like this above ^   First of all, asking what people's favourite movie is when chatting to a new group just isn't a question one would ask.  But even if they did, even the rudest of women would simply hear that you liked Happy Gilmore and give you a side eye or eye roll with no verbal response.    It just doesn't make sense that someone would a) ask the question of a bunch of guys they are getting to know and b) someone who has zero interest in you would waste all those words on you.

Likewise the $100 bill thing.  If you open with "excuse me, you dropped this money", she will not think that you're trying to solicit sex. 

People in general aren't as rude as you describe and it makes no sense that you get all the rudeness and the rest of us don't even witness this kind of behaviour delivered to others in our whole lives.

Maybe, but they are not far off, that I can guarantee.I hesitate to give any specific examples especially recent ones, because the stories get brought up at parties and stuff. 2 real examples I could give you would say I was full of it and would be pretty recognizable to people I know.

People in general aren't as rude as you describe and it makes no sense that you get all the rudeness and the rest of us don't even witness this kind of behaviour delivered to others in our whole lives.

That's really my point and the part that gets me, you said it never happens to people their whole lives, it happens to me 4-5 times a year. If it didn't, I would be be posting here.

These things find me, that's all I can say. Now if you said something like that happened to you once or twice a year or once every few years, I'd say, ok, I don't feel so bad. Maybe it's just normal because sometimes people suck and I am hypersensitive to it and others just let it go. But you apparently have never seen something like that happen which blows my mind, like is that how the other half lives? lol. All I can say is most people I know don't believe it until they see it and then they say, you weren't lying, were you?

I appreciate your opinion though, I may need to work on not over analyzing or making it worse in my mind than maybe it was, after the fact.

[chillii]

3 hours ago, basil67 said:

And it also didn't happen.

I believe that you're having problems, but I also believe you're prone to exaggeration.  Like this above ^   First of all, asking what people's favourite movie is when chatting to a new group just isn't a question one would ask.  But even if they did, even the rudest of women would simply hear that you liked Happy Gilmore and give you a side eye or eye roll with no verbal response.    It just doesn't make sense that someone would a) ask the question of a bunch of guys they are getting to know and b) someone who has zero interest in you would waste all those words on you.

Likewise the $100 bill thing.  If you open with "excuse me, you dropped this money", she will not think that you're trying to solicit sex. 

People in general aren't as rude as you describe and it makes no sense that you get all the rudeness and the rest of us don't even witness this kind of behaviour delivered to others in our whole lives.

l think your being very very naive, and you don't live in the US either right. But even just reading around this place should give you some idea.

[Wiseman2]

Sometimes it's less tangible. Perhaps you are worried women aren't falling all over you moreso than actually interested in dating anyone.

[AlmostOverIt]

5 hours ago, Wiseman2 said:

Sometimes it's less tangible. Perhaps you are worried women aren't falling all over you moreso than actually interested in dating anyone.

I would say this is very possible although I am looking to date. The older I get I do tend to cringe at everything involved in dating because I am pretty straightforward and dating is always a bit of a dance I find fun but a little frustrating at times. But I could see if I am approaching like that, that maybe I am sending those signals and not working towards dates.

Based on all the empirical evidence I have from my experiences it seems to me at least, like it is something intangible I can't put my finger on rather than something overt where my whole presentation is flawed or chasing women away at a base. So this is an interesting though, that subconsciously maybe I am looking for interest rather than a relationship or something along those lines that works against me.

[JRabbit]

Still, I feel you don't have an accurate view of yourself.  When this is suggested you deny it and list off a hundred reasons why it's not true, however, it is the only explanation for this.  Time for some deep dive into your true self, perhaps some counselling for a professional opinion?

[Yosemite]

On 2/9/2022 at 1:43 PM, AlmostOverIt said:

I mentioned it takes me longer for people to warm up to be and vice versa.

That's exactly what shyness is. And you admit that people can see it because their first impression of you is that you're standoffish or rude (because you're being shy). They sometimes change their opinion after they talk to you 2 or 3 more times (because you're being less shy.) So, I don't think that believing that no one can tell that you're shy is a very logical conclusion and I will say that it's very likely that you are wrong:

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So yes I feel nobody can tell that about me but no I can't say if I am right or wrong about that feeling.

 

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I do know and have been working on that I often don't focus on what they say and I am thinking of the next thing I am going to say and that can be tough for me to control, so when they are talking my mind drifts a bit instead of listening

This is an issue with your social skills, I wouldn’t call it shyness. It's good that you recognize that you need to work on this. Women are generally more intuitive than men and I'm going to guess that most men are more intuitive than you. People can tell when someone is going through the motions, not really listening, focused on themselves, and trying to impress. So being genuine, authentic, and really listening to everyone will help you be a better conversationalist the next time that you're speaking to an attractive woman.
 

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I never claimed to be a ladies man or wanting to be one, in fact I have detailed here exactly how much I am not a ladies man. I am not asking how do I become a ladies man, it's about what things I guess apparently turn women off before any engagement or conversation. 

I said that your main complaint is that you're not the ladies man that your friends are and can't date as easily as they can. In other words, you're complaining about not getting the same amount of attention or interest that your friends get. If you hadn't cut off my sentence halfway through, that would be clear.
 

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But here I am more talking about how not to be the one guy at the table that nobody cares is in the conversation or not. So to level set, if I go to a 5 parties, I don't think it's crazy to think I could maybe draw a second look or get a signal or two that's inviting.

I do. You're a regular, ordinary, middle-aged guy. And on top of that you're shy and reserved with average or below average social skills. Why do you expect at least 1 woman to be interested/flirtatious/giving you a glance at almost every party or bar that you go to? That's ridiculous. You need to come down to earth. I seriously doubt that you were getting that much attention at age 25, so why would that occur now that you're almost 50? I'm not trying to deflate your ego, but being realistic about your dating life/options would help you a lot.

If you won't give up your goal to get as much attention from women as your friends do, the best option for you is a dating coach.

[chillii]

He doesn't sound regular at all, his pretty well off, tall, flash car, really nice home.Sounds like an anxiety op, part of shyness anyway but yeah people can see that and the AH's of the world men or women will bully it, sounds like there's a bit of that going on too. Like l said somewhere, the picker, can't be too nice or timid with people like that they'll just run straight over it.

Not saying that's everything , but def' sounds like a big part of some of these encounters you get. Maybe you could work on just being a bit more self assured within and around people, and relax too , very important.

Edited February 11, 2022 by chillii

[Wiseman2]

18 hours ago, AlmostOverIt said:

 maybe I am looking for interest rather than a relationship or something along those lines that works against me.

Yes, exactly. Your writing indicates that attention seeking is the goal rather than actually having any interest in the women or wanting to date. 

[Weezy1973]

21 hours ago, AlmostOverIt said:

I am pretty straightforward and dating is always a bit of a dance

It doesn’t have to be. Making dating a “dance” implies that you’re more interested in trying to attract someone than being yourself and just letting things happen. Which could be a fear of rejection and that falls in line with your shyness. 

 

21 hours ago, AlmostOverIt said:

that subconsciously maybe I am looking for interest rather than a relationship or something along those lines that works against me.

My guess is you suffer from low self worth. So interest from women temporarily gives you a feeling of being worthy. The subconscious part are the defense mechanisms. Like how at your current age do you still not have any idea what you’re looking for? Casual dating / sex is very different from a long term relationship/ marriage etc. and you don’t seem to have any idea what you want. Exploring that and coming up with something concrete will give you some direction moving forward.

[IrinaM]

You're asking the wrong question OP. With all respect, I think your vision of how things "should" be is skewed and you just won't accept reality. You are approaching 50. Most women in the age bracket to be interested in you aren't single. You describe what a hot prospect you are, in terms of looks and money, but you also desire to have lots of attention from women. Think about that. Women don't want men who have the goal of getting lots of attention from women.

You say you do manage to get into a relationship every few years. Have you thought about how you can make your next relationship last, so you wont be back on the dating market again? Is that something you're interested in?

[IrinaM]

On 2/8/2022 at 9:02 AM, AlmostOverIt said:

I have done dating apps in the past and I think I went on 3 dates, all were good dates, I met nice, attractive women. I hate dating apps though. Frankly I have to meet someone in person to know if I am attracted, to read body language and get a true indication if we click. It's like the whole dynamic doesn't work for me in general though. I find it extremely frustrating to come up with "something interesting" to say to someone I have only seen a picture of who's profile is, "Don't just say hi, wow me with something that sets you apart" because whatever I come up with is a line or something funny, etc. Not really judging but it just rings lame and feels like, be a "generic" different from other guys. In general I feel dating apps are a lot of work for little potential payoff.

Compared to how you describe your success with women irl, your success with women online is solid. Three dates with attractive women, all the dates went well? Sounds good to me. Sure, it took some work,  but success takes work, in fact, success takes a lot of work.

[AlmostOverIt]

4 hours ago, IrinaM said:

Compared to how you describe your success with women irl, your success with women online is solid. Three dates with attractive women, all the dates went well? Sounds good to me. Sure, it took some work,  but success takes work, in fact, success takes a lot of work.

I don't disagree, I just don't like the whole set up I guess. There is something about meeting someone in person and seeing how they say things, how they react, the look in their eyes, etc. I am considering doing the again, It's just not exactly a thrilling process for me.

[AlmostOverIt]

15 hours ago, IrinaM said:

You're asking the wrong question OP. With all respect, I think your vision of how things "should" be is skewed and you just won't accept reality. You are approaching 50. Most women in the age bracket to be interested in you aren't single. You describe what a hot prospect you are, in terms of looks and money, but you also desire to have lots of attention from women. Think about that. Women don't want men who have the goal of getting lots of attention from women.

You say you do manage to get into a relationship every few years. Have you thought about how you can make your next relationship last, so you wont be back on the dating market again? Is that something you're interested in?

 

You describe what a hot prospect you are, in terms of looks and money, but you also desire to have lots of attention from women.

Never claimed I was a hot prospect but I feel I am not a bad prospect. I have a good job and stability in a house, active, in decent shape etc. So even if I am butt ugly, it would be at least a lukewarm prospect to some I think. 

I am not seeking or expecting LOTS of attention from women. I do desire some attention from women occasionally, like any single guy, and I am wondering why it goes 0-60 then 60-0 over periods of time. If it was always 0, I could just say oh well. But when it is 60, I can't help but wonder why it goes well for short periods then nothing for a long time. I don't think it's out of line to want someone to be interested in you. The interest I have had in those rare times is on par with what I am looking for. So while not every woman will be interested in me, I tend to think if a handful that are interested in me are on par with what I am looking for, there are others out there that would be.  

As far as looks, I only tried to get across I felt I was at least average looking, I mean average is the average for a reason. I am not bad looking from the perspective of insta-rejection or being off-putting I feel.

I am not really posting here about making relationships last, I am not worried about that. The relationships were good with one exception, other than that, people die, people have to move for various reasons, etc. Sometimes it's logistics, timing and fate and not the relationship not working. If it was possible for them to last, 2 out of the 3 would have lasted and we had no personality issues that split us up, it was something else. I was with a female friend on Saturday that is as outspokenly honest as one can be, anything on her mind she will say. We were talking about this, she said she is working on finding someone for me. She knew the women from 2 of the relationships longer than I had and said she felt I put them on a pedestal and treated them really well and was good in relationships, so it's not the relationship, it's getting there. 

 

[AlmostOverIt]

On 2/10/2022 at 10:23 PM, chillii said:

He doesn't sound regular at all, his pretty well off, tall, flash car, really nice home.Sounds like an anxiety op, part of shyness anyway but yeah people can see that and the AH's of the world men or women will bully it, sounds like there's a bit of that going on too. Like l said somewhere, the picker, can't be too nice or timid with people like that they'll just run straight over it.

Not saying that's everything , but def' sounds like a big part of some of these encounters you get. Maybe you could work on just being a bit more self assured within and around people, and relax too , very important.

Could be anxiety and shyness coming through. It's just foreign to me that it is so pre-emptive and not based on any direct interaction. I make eye contact, I smile, I am not a wallflower, etc. I would say a lot of times I am hesitant to approach without a welcoming signal but it depends. If I am in a group and another group of women joins us, I can tend to get ignored but usually after a while, a warm up period I guess, they'll be more engaging after I have said a few things. The initial things I say are pretty general, asking about them, nothing too deep, nothing offensive. I just get short answers. Usually after a while I find they'll open up and ask me questions. So initially I think it seems like they are all that interested in talking to me directly but after a while they warm up. With the group they are around for a while talking with others but when it is just me one on one, I don't get that warm up period.

[chillii]

Women in a group are often into the group rather than some one guy around , don't worry about it l never bother with women in groups.

l haven't read everything there's some pretty long ones in there but it doesn't even matter what women think , only matters of what that one your interested in thinks, or of whether she takes to you or not l should say.

Edited February 14, 2022 by chillii

[basil67]

6 hours ago, AlmostOverIt said:

I would say a lot of times I am hesitant to approach without a welcoming signal but it depends. If I am in a group and another group of women joins us, I can tend to get ignored but usually after a while, a warm up period I guess, they'll be more engaging after I have said a few things. The initial things I say are pretty general, asking about them, nothing too deep, nothing offensive. I just get short answers. Usually after a while I find they'll open up and ask me questions. So initially I think it seems like they are all that interested in talking to me directly but after a while they warm up. With the group they are around for a while talking with others but when it is just me one on one, I don't get that warm up period.

Remember how I said "it didn't happen"?   Now THIS ^^  is fully believable.  Here is where the truth lies.   

So let's get real:

Waiting for a welcoming signal is much more respectful, so I think you're doing the right thing there.   Of the guys who do approach random women in public, they have a massive fail rate.  Sure, they can get lucky, but there are also a lot of rejections.  The guys who do this need to have massive levels of confidence to cope with all the rejections...and so there are a hell of a lot of men who don't do this.   You are actually very normal in this respect.

You apparently do well with OLD.  Yes, OLD isn't ideal, but it seems that women do like you if you approach them in a manner they are comfortable with.  In this case, via social media. This is good. 

I think you're pinning far too much on shallow attributes.  You're over 6ft? Meh. You're fit? Meh. You've got a flash house?  Meh.   Sure, I'd like a guy to be employed, be healthy and have a roof over his head, but it's mostly about the person, not the possessions or the the luck of the draw of genetics.  To me, it's about vibing well, about having great conversations, similar goals in life, a positive outlook, an ability to overcome adversity, a ready smile, a sense of humour which works with mine.  

I'd advise you lead with the positives.  Look at what you can do and build yourself up from there. 

[chillii]

Nicely said Bas.

Can l just add also though one more angle about approaching strangers- women. When l was young and single , it wasn't even about confidence. What it was really about for me and l've heard this form other guys a lot to over the yrs , was that they always had bf's or were married or something anyway. Or they just plain weren't interested but whichever you just began to realize 99.9% of the time it was just gonna be a waste of time.