Dating a new lady (combined thread)

[Helicon5]

1 hour ago, Sabrina1990 said:

I am sorry but this is not how an interested woman behaves.  Maybe this, maybe that, you're making excuses.  A woman's interest and attraction are instinctive.  It's nothing we have to ponder, think about or 'take slow.'    It's been six weeks, that is more than enough time for her to determine if she likes you, desires you and to be affectionate towards you.

You mentioned earlier she wouldn't be accepting dates if she were not interested.  I beg to differ.  There are many women who accept dates but are not attracted or romantically interested.  They date for attention and validation.   Some enjoy a night out, or a free meal.  That might not the case with her since you said she doesn't eat, but as mentioned earlier she sounds like the type of woman who enjoys being fawned over so she dates men for attention and validation but places restrictions on it.

Again I am sorry but it's very clear at least to me that this woman is not into you the way she should be.   She's placing boundaries on your situationship that no interested woman would be placing.  

I'd be moving on if I were you or pull back.  Stop fawning over her and giving her attention.  See if she steps up and begins taking some initiative.  I don't suggest you say anything to her, because anything you say will come across as needy and desperate, no matter how hard you try to disguise it.

Pull back, live your life and pursue your purpose.  The way I see it you are much too focused on this lady and frankly she doesn't deserve it.  Aim higher.

 

 

I don't know. She would have to be seriously screwed up in the head to do all that just for attention. She didn't have to bring me in her house both times after our last 2 dates, especially to meet her daughter. It could be that she doesn't want to get me going sexually because we were coming back to her place and she didn't want to mess around with her daughter there, which is perfectly understandable. I'm going to invite her over this weekend for dinner at my house. If she doesn't want to or isn't more affectionate when she gets here then I'll start to believe that may be the case. 

Edited May 16, 2022 by Helicon5

[Sabrina1990]

19 minutes ago, Helicon5 said:

I don't know. She would have to be seriously screwed up in the head to do all that just for attention. She didn't have to bring me in her house both times after our last 2 dates, especially to meet her daughter. It could be that she doesn't want to get me going sexually because we were coming back to her place and she didn't want to mess around with her daughter there, which is perfectly understandable. I'm going to invite her over this weekend for dinner at my house. If she doesn't want to or isn't more affectionate when she gets here then I'll start to believe that may be the case. 

I think you misunderstood me.  She is not using you, she enjoys dating you, that much is clear.  She enjoys your company BUT her attraction level is not where it should be in my opinion, not where YOU should want it to be.  She is 50 years old, she knows what it feels like to be attracted to a man.   There is physical affection, there is her desiring to see you more than once a week.  There is her texting, initiating.  There is no taking six weeks to decide what she wants and where she wants things to go.

She is moving at a snail's pace because although she likes you, again her attraction level is not where it should be, not by a long shot.

If that is okay with @Helicon5then keep going.  I know many men who would not.  They want a woman who is as highly attracted to them as they are to her.  As well they should.  We should all want that from our partners otherwise it's unbalanced.

I realize physical attraction and intimacy are not all there is BUT it's where you start and build from there.

It's not happening here and there is a reason for that in my opinion.  She is just not that into you and again if that is okay with you, then that's okay, continue forward and best of luck.

Edited May 16, 2022 by Sabrina1990

[introverted1]

2 hours ago, Helicon5 said:

I'm going to ask her if she wants to come over my place for dinner on Friday night.

I think this is a good idea. 

I am in your target age group for dating and I can't imagine being so stand-offish after 5 dates with a guy.  I don't necessarily act on it right away, but I know right away if I am interested romantically/sexually. And certainly by date 5 I would have organized at least one and more likely 2 dates myself, including a dinner at my house....  not necessarily (although possibly) for sex, but to at least give us an opportunity for a more intimate evening than could be had listening to a band at a noisy bar.  Alternately, if I am not interested, then I don't go on 5 dates.

 

[Wiseman2]

22 minutes ago, Helicon5 said:

 I'm going to invite her over this weekend for dinner at my house. If she doesn't want to or isn't more affectionate when she gets here then I'll start to believe that may be the case. 

Relax and take a deep breath and breathe. Invite her for dinner. That's fine at this point and is better than noisy bars. How old is her daughter?

[Alpacalia]

1 hour ago, Helicon5 said:

I'm just going to call her later tonight and ask her if she still wants to do a day trip to go guitar shopping this Saturday. If she doesn't want to do that I'm going to ask her if she wants to come over my place for dinner on Friday night. She said she doesn't like going to bars. I think the only reason she did on our last date was to meet up with her friend that she hardly sees. My sister-in-law agrees that if she wants anything serious she has to give me some day dates or some alone time to be together. What happens this weekend will tell the tale.

Yes, I agree that this sounds like a good plan on your end.

You can't let one negative thing overpower 1000 positive things.

The positive signs at the moment are that she's responsive to you and wants to spend time with you. The buying signals she sends are what I regard as more important than the ones she initiates right now.

The last dating relationship may have rattled her a bit, so maybe she's hesitant to initiate in some areas, but you don't want the outcome to be that you'll never feel good enough.

If things are only limping along with one party's active involvement, then she's too consumed by those issues and other people end up in a relationship with said issues, rather than with her.

Take charge, but don't completely lean towards her at the expense of your own feelings.

[Helicon5]

I just texted her a little while ago asking if she had a good day letting her know I'll call her later if she's not busy. Here's her response:

Oh, thanks, you too. Okay, great....ttys 🙂

 

[Helicon5]

1 hour ago, Alpacalia said:

Yes, I agree that this sounds like a good plan on your end.

You can't let one negative thing overpower 1000 positive things.

The positive signs at the moment are that she's responsive to you and wants to spend time with you. The buying signals she sends are what I regard as more important than the ones she initiates right now.

The last dating relationship may have rattled her a bit, so maybe she's hesitant to initiate in some areas, but you don't want the outcome to be that you'll never feel good enough.

If things are only limping along with one party's active involvement, then she's too consumed by those issues and other people end up in a relationship with said issues, rather than with her.

Take charge, but don't completely lean towards her at the expense of your own feelings.

Well said. I won't. I've learned a lot over the years, especially being a lead singer, but as you know, no two people are alike. Every woman was/is different. It doesn't matter how old you are, just when you think you've seen and know it all you come across a situation that makes you scratch your head. This lady is one of them, but she's also one of the cutest, sweetest, sexiest ladies I've ever went out with. Not only is she sweet, but she doesn't like to live at the bars and is more of a home girl, which is rare considering her looks. Usually ladies that look like her live at the bars, have 10 gf's that they're party animals with, overly flaunt their sexuality and chase after only the muscle dudes with money. She doesn't do any of that. I can see why this famous guy is attracted to her. When I bring her to the bar where my band friends play all the band members are my new best friends. LMAO....😂

They're all really good people though. She likes to see that I'm popular and well loved by so many. She even commented on it one night.

[Helicon5]

2 hours ago, Wiseman2 said:

Relax and take a deep breath and breathe. Invite her for dinner. That's fine at this point and is better than noisy bars. How old is her daughter?

Early 20's

[Helicon5]

2 hours ago, introverted1 said:

I think this is a good idea. 

I am in your target age group for dating and I can't imagine being so stand-offish after 5 dates with a guy.  I don't necessarily act on it right away, but I know right away if I am interested romantically/sexually. And certainly by date 5 I would have organized at least one and more likely 2 dates myself, including a dinner at my house....  not necessarily (although possibly) for sex, but to at least give us an opportunity for a more intimate evening than could be had listening to a band at a noisy bar.  Alternately, if I am not interested, then I don't go on 5 dates.

 

She doesn't want to live at the bar. I mentioned to her about getting in the band, but I told her part of the reason that stops me from doing that is I'm very considerate because I know how stressful it is on relationships and relationships are important to me, and she said having a good relationship is more important than music to her as well. I think she hasn't been forward is for a few reasons.

1. She is kind of shy at first and maybe a bit self-conscious. I can see her shyness in getting to know my friends. 

2. As cute as she is she may have a body flaw that she's worried about me seeing (I e. a scar from a C section, etc).

3. Shte wary of turning me on on dates because then I might push for sex at her house where her daughter is and she doesn't want to do that.

4. She has trouble trusting because of her recent dating experience and doesn't want to be sexual just yet and risk being let down and hurt.

All off these can be confused as a lack of interest on her or that she's just not that into me. I don't think that's how it is. I think one or more of the reasons above are why.

Edited May 16, 2022 by Helicon5

[Uruktopi]

10 hours ago, Helicon5 said:

...why he keeps pursuing her. It's because he likes to thrill of the chase he's not able to get. He's been with gorgeous Hollywood women, but he can't get this simple cute woman he desires, so he keeps trying.

This MAY be true but to know what others have in mind is frequently an excercise of futility EVEN when you get it right.

"The Truth is Out There". IMO also the deep meaning.

By the way I have long time female good friends. But no "orbiters".

And my partners (when there was one) also had male friends. And "orbiters" were dropped in the right time.

But as complex as we humans may be I don´t enjoy ambiguity. And do not entertain ambiguous relationships.

I value friendship too much to make it the scenario of emotional / power games.

Being that way, I would not date someone with "orbiters", not even those with only one sided motivations if they are kept once knowing that. 

 

Edited May 16, 2022 by Uruktopi

[chillii]

Hi op

1st up , l can well see why mr famous likes her so much as apposed to the fakes probably in his world, and why you do to. They kissed once in 10 yrs, so what, nothing else happened she knows she's not interested but she does like him as a friend, wouldn't worry about any of that, too soon. On other notes along those lines, we don't go changing our lives and habits and friends and family patterns around when we've only seen somebody new 4 or 5 times, that's nothing as yet blood is much much thicker than water. And of course she's not going to be comfortable messing about with her daughter in the house.

She welcomes you calling though and if she does wants to have dinner at yours and keep seeing you, for now nice. She might be this might be that just stop worrying and enjoy or you'll for-fill the wrong prophecy before it even plays out, go with what comes naturally. The next few times you see her much will fall into place either way it goes and reveal along the way and dinner at yours, that's gonna show you a lot. She may be holding back and cautious, or maybe she's just not over the line yet, we can't know for sure but if it were me given the way you feel about her l'd def' be finding out though and letting it play out myself.  Good luck anyway.

[Helicon5]

3 hours ago, chillii said:

Hi op

1st up , l can well see why mr famous likes her so much as apposed to the fakes probably in his world, and why you do to. They kissed once in 10 yrs, so what, nothing else happened she knows she's not interested but she does like him as a friend, wouldn't worry about any of that, too soon. On other notes along those lines, we don't go changing our lives and habits and friends and family patterns around when we've only seen somebody new 4 or 5 times, that's nothing as yet blood is much much thicker than water. And of course she's not going to be comfortable messing about with her daughter in the house.

She welcomes you calling though and if she does wants to have dinner at yours and keep seeing you, for now nice. She might be this might be that just stop worrying and enjoy or you'll for-fill the wrong prophecy before it even plays out, go with what comes naturally. The next few times you see her much will fall into place either way it goes and reveal along the way and dinner at yours, that's gonna show you a lot. She may be holding back and cautious, or maybe she's just not over the line yet, we can't know for sure but if it were me given the way you feel about her l'd def' be finding out though and letting it play out myself.  Good luck anyway.

Okay, so I spoke with her tonight and we had a long conversation. Here's the scoop. She IS attracted to me. She said she didn't mind when I made advances (meaning she liked it). She just likes when guys take charge. She's just cautious about letting people in too fast to do that because she's concerned about weirdos. Partly because of her past experiences and because she's VERY picky about who's she's attracted to. She said I'm the first guy in a long time that she let know where she lives, let alone be in her house to meet her daughter. She said when she meets someone she usually gives them her Google number so they can't track her down. She gave me her real cell number.

She's coming over for dinner Friday. At first she was a little shaky on the idea, but then said yes after I made her feel comfortable. I thought she'd insist on driving over here herself, but she agreed to let me pick her up because she'd like to have a drink or two and she doesn't want to drive. I told her I'd make her this Mediterranean pasta dish she'll love and we can just relax. "No pressure".

At first I mentioned about us going to the music store to shop for guitars on Saturday and she said we could do that. I also mentioned about dinner at my place on Friday and she asked me if I wanted to do one or both. I told her either or both. It's up to her and whatever she feels comfortable doing. So yes, we're doing dinner at my place on Friday.....and we may end up hanging out on Saturday as well. We'll see. The main thing is she feels comfortable having me picking her up to bring to my home and that's good.

She may be a bigger over-thinker and worrywort than I am. LOL. She said she's went on a few dates online because she got lonely, but she wasn't interested. She rarely goes out. Hard to believe anyone as cute, sexy and down to earth as she is could be lonely. She can have so many guys, but I'm the one she's choosing to let in. 🙂🙂🙂 She said she doesn't know much about me, but I told her the only way for her to get to know me is to allow herself to come into my life a little bit so she could see who I am. I asked her, "aren't you curious to see where I live? I could be living in my car for all you know". She started laughing and said....true, you're right. 🤣🤣 I mentioned to her that I was unsure about how she feels about me her because she's not forward at all and she doesn't initiate communication. I told her I don't mind taking the lead most of the time, but not all the time. She said she understands, we'll see how much that changes.

I'm optimistic about things and it sounds like she is as well. 

 

Edited May 17, 2022 by Helicon5

[Helicon5]

4 hours ago, Uruktopi said:

This MAY be true but to know what others have in mind is frequently an excercise of futility EVEN when you get it right.

"The Truth is Out There". IMO also the deep meaning.

By the way I have long time female good friends. But no "orbiters".

And my partners (when there was one) also had male friends. And "orbiters" were dropped in the right time.

But as complex as we humans may be I don´t enjoy ambiguity. And do not entertain ambiguous relationships.

I value friendship too much to make it the scenario of emotional / power games.

Being that way, I would not date someone with "orbiters", not even those with only one sided motivations if they are kept once knowing that. 

 

She may decide he's not worth holding onto or risk a great relationship for, not that she would have to. I'm pretty easy going about it unless I feel there are things going on between them that are kept hidden. There shouldn't be any hiding opposite sex friends (especially if they've ever shared an intimate moment) or having to delete text messages, phone call logs, etc. I don't hide anything. I don't mind her meeting my bf gf or having her on speaker phone when I talk to her.

We'll see how it goes. 

Edited May 17, 2022 by Helicon5

[chillii]

2 hours ago, Helicon5 said:

Okay, so I spoke with her tonight and we had a long conversation. Here's the scoop. She IS attracted to me. She said she didn't mind when I made advances (meaning she liked it). She just likes when guys take charge. She's just cautious about letting people in too fast to do that because she's concerned about weirdos. Partly because of her past experiences and because she's VERY picky about who's she's attracted to. She said I'm the first guy in a long time that she let know where she lives, let alone be in her house to meet her daughter. She said when she meets someone she usually gives them her Google number so they can't track her down. She gave me her real cell number.

There ya go , none of that surprises me one bit it's all actually all along the lines l'd suspected, just go with it things will play out, just enjoy.

As for the rest , much the same to actually. As for her being gorgeous and lonely man, there are millions of women and men out there like that it doesn't matter who she could have. They haven't been right as yet , it's simple stuff man especially as we get older. Some of us know better than to just chase our tails in circles shoot blindly at fish in a barrel and sleep with everyone we meet for yrs on end. Anyone l've ever gone for has her smarts and self assurance and my partners no different, l'm the same to actually.

Anyway, enjoy and stop worrying, she's open to you she likes you and this early that's all we can know it's no guarantee but it's a great start. Good luck.

Edited May 17, 2022 by chillii

[Wiseman2]

7 hours ago, Helicon5 said:

Early 20's

So you are both in your 50s? Are you both divorced? Do you have kids at home or grown?

Invite her for dinner. Keep it simple. She's not a college kid, so of course she's not a party animal or barfly or into random hookups.

Try to relax. This is dating. You need to get to know each other better so all this angst and speculation won't sabotage things.

Edited May 17, 2022 by Wiseman2

[Amanda92]

Would it be better to meet more often, but not so long? Sitting till 4 am seems to be exhausting! I also think you should contact more between dates. At least for me it's important to become closer to a guy.

[Helicon5]

37 minutes ago, Amanda92 said:

Would it be better to meet more often, but not so long? Sitting till 4 am seems to be exhausting! I also think you should contact more between dates. At least for me it's important to become closer to a guy.

Meeting more often is what I'd prefer, but it isn't up to me. I can only reiterate to her that I would be nice to get together more often. Twice per week would be reasonable. She said she really doesn't know me yet, well that's because we only see each other for 6 hours per week. It's not a lot of time to get to know someone, especially when you go to superficial places like a bar. 

I'm gathering that you're younger? The thing thing is the older people get, the more jaded and cynical they become from being through multiple relationships in their life and lose trust and faith and keep people more at arm's length. I feel the same way you do. You can drag things out taking in slow forever, but if it's not meant to be you're only prolonging the inevitable. I'd rather get to know who someone is sooner rather waste months or years of my time. I've done enough of that already

[Helicon5]

4 hours ago, Wiseman2 said:

She's not a college kid, so of course she's not a party animal or barfly or into random hookups.

I don't know how old you are, but you'd be surprised how many people my age are still party animal bar flies who are into random hookups, at least their are where I live. 

[Wiseman2]

17 minutes ago, Helicon5 said:

She said she really doesn't know me yet, well that's because we only see each other for 6 hours per week. It's not a lot of time to get to know someone, especially when you go to superficial places like a bar. 

You don't have to go to bars, do you? Is she busy? Is it a distance situation? 

[Helicon5]

5 hours ago, chillii said:

There ya go , none of that surprises me one bit it's all actually all along the lines l'd suspected, just go with it things will play out, just enjoy.

As for the rest , much the same to actually. As for her being gorgeous and lonely man, there are millions of women and men out there like that it doesn't matter who she could have. They haven't been right as yet , it's simple stuff man especially as we get older. Some of us know better than to just chase our tails in circles shoot blindly at fish in a barrel and sleep with everyone we meet for yrs on end. Anyone l've ever gone for has her smarts and self assurance and my partners no different, l'm the same to actually.

Anyway, enjoy and stop worrying, she's open to you she likes you and this early that's all we can know it's no guarantee but it's a great start. Good luck.

Thanks. It isn't perfect though. Not yet. I get a sense there's some things she's holding back from. She had mentioned about me coming over to her place to meet her band members, so I mentioned about if she still wanted to do that and all I got were excuses why she couldn't or didn't want to. First she said they wouldn't be practicing for a month, then she said they may practice this week, but if I came over I would just have to sit there and listen and not be involved. Why she would say that I don't know. She knows I have a great voice. We were doing harmonies together her place. She also said it would make her uncomfortable if I just sat and listened to her sing. I don't know why she said that either because she has a beautiful voice. At first she said her band only plays gigs once or twice per month, but now she's saying they only play at open mic shows. I can't find her band on social media anywhere either or her two guy band members, one of which she told me is dying of stage 4 prostate cancer. She said he's not on social media. She gave me the full name of the other guy. I know a lot of musicians in this area and I told her I may know him, but don't see him on social media either. I'm starting to wonder if she even has a band or she's even ever played out, especially since she's so timid and self-conscious about her singing. I can't picture her entertaining a crowd. Something's fishy about what she's telling me, but I'd like to find out and why.

Edited May 17, 2022 by Helicon5

[Alpacalia]

Gently, you've had suspicions about several things about her behavior. Even though it isn't wrong to have concerns especially if they are well-founded, if you continue to have them and she is cautious, it could be problematic.

Try to "just make sure" your suspicion or uneasiness isn't clouding your thinking enough that you're just looking for ways for her to be guilty, i.e., that you're more looking to pounce on the mistake rather than assess things objectively.

Having concerns, while some people may argue, can be perceived as "needy" when it comes to sharing them, at some point you will need to be able to gently communicate them in an open and honest way with each other. It may be that you fear that she will reject you for your "irrational ideas," but the alternative is that you are growing suspicious and at some point may become emotionally distant in a budding relationship.

[glows]

Enjoy the dinner and upcoming time together this week/weekend. Try not to break everything down being overly suspicious about her. She does seem to be a combination of neurotic and naive/sheltered. It's ironic because you both share similarities in the way you think.

That's good that you had the conversation with her. 

Edited May 17, 2022 by glows

[Helicon5]

6 hours ago, glows said:

Enjoy the dinner and upcoming time together this week/weekend. Try not to break everything down being overly suspicious about her. She does seem to be a combination of neurotic and naive/sheltered. It's ironic because you both share similarities in the way you think.

That's good that you had the conversation with her.

How can I not be suspicious of this? Should I not see this as a red flag? She's the one who suggested doing it to begin with, now she's coming up with every reason not to. Why even suggest it in the first place? Which is the truth, she's embarrassed about me listening to her sing (to which doesn't make sense because I already have) or are they not practicing? 

[glows]

25 minutes ago, Helicon5 said:

How can I not be suspicious of this? Should I not see this as a red flag? She's the one who suggested doing it to begin with, now she's coming up with every reason not to. Why even suggest it in the first place? Which is the truth, she's embarrassed about me listening to her sing (to which doesn't make sense because I already have) or are they not practicing? 

I think you're judging her quite harshly because she may have changed her mind. When others guide you to ending this you jump in again with the opposite thought that you'd have her over for dinner and there's nothing to be suspicious about until new events prove otherwise. Each time people offer you advice about her, you change the goalposts and assert a different perspective, overall very distrusting of others in general even what others say in response to you. 

In regards to meeting her band members, so what if she changed her mind? She may think you're a little shifty or changeable and doesn't feel too comfortable all of a sudden. I suggested to slow down a little with your thoughts some pages back and not get too far ahead with yourself. You have to be a little flexible with others this early with dating. If you don't feel good about it, then end the misery and constant secondguessing. 

This early you're too overinvested about what she says and what she thinks. Step back a bit and let her show her true colours. 

[Helicon5]

1 hour ago, glows said:

I think you're judging her quite harshly because she may have changed her mind. When others guide you to ending this you jump in again with the opposite thought that you'd have her over for dinner and there's nothing to be suspicious about until new events prove otherwise. Each time people offer you advice about her, you change the goalposts and assert a different perspective, overall very distrusting of others in general even what others say in response to you. 

In regards to meeting her band members, so what if she changed her mind? She may think you're a little shifty or changeable and doesn't feel too comfortable all of a sudden. I suggested to slow down a little with your thoughts some pages back and not get too far ahead with yourself. You have to be a little flexible with others this early with dating. If you don't feel good about it, then end the misery and constant secondguessing. 

This early you're too overinvested about what she says and what she thinks. Step back a bit and let her show her true colours. 

What makes it confusing is she feels comfortable enough for me to pick her up and bring her to my house where we'll be alone and have a few drinks and she let me meet her daughter, but she doesn't feel comfortable enough for me to meet her band members? I'm not saying we do all this in one week, but the longer we move at a snails pace, the longer it's going to be to see her true colors if there is something she doesn't want me to know. All I'm saying is I'd like to know who I'm dating as much as she does. It's ironic that when ladies want to know more about who they're dating it's okay to "investigate", but if a guy wants to know he's needy, rushing things, psychotic, paranoid, distrusting.....

It's funny that all the people who know my ex's told me, you should've got away from them sooner, but me being the trusting guy I am always chose to look past the red flags and gave them the benefit of the doubt. I don't know what her motive is behind changing her mind, but it's okay.

Edited May 17, 2022 by Helicon5