What is the average love relationship like

[Wiseman2]

On 4/29/2022 at 11:44 AM, Mysterio said:

.  I wonder if we are not really designed to be long term with each other.  

Barely half of all adults in the United States—a record low—are currently married, and the median age at first marriage has never been higher for brides (26.5 years) and grooms (28.7), according to a new Pew Research Center analysis of U.S. Census data.

Of course you can be in a long term loving relationship without marriage. 

[chillii]

Funny but l would've thought is would be far later than that these days , especially in say the States.

[Alpacalia]

4 hours ago, Weezy1973 said:

No. Generally speaking relationships breakdown because one or both people have become poor partners. The qualities that make someone a good partner don’t tend to play a role in initial attraction. You can be attracted to someone’s looks, sense of humour, intelligence, ambition, personal style, etc. but none of those things means someone is going to be a good long term partner. 
 

Similar core values is pretty important, but that takes time to establish. And one of those core values should be the desire to be a good partner. So each person genuinely wants to be a good partner because that’s one of their core values. Instead of wanting to be a good partner because you find your partner attractive. 

Right.

Several cognitive variables seem to be positively correlated with success or failure of close interpersonal relationships, perhaps we should do some statistical analyses (smiles).

What I am trying to say is that sometimes, when you're going through a rough patch, it's what initially drew you in (whatever that was) that reminds you why you fell in love and helps keeps those rosy embers burning. Your partner still holds a special place in your heart. Those most content "might" describe how passionate they are about them and how much they enjoy spending time with them because of some of those initial characteristics/ qualities (again, whichever they may be). 

Also, in response to the OP's question "I wonder if we are not designed to be long-term partners" is that there seems to be a close connection between appreciation and how well you handle conflict. 

In a long-term relationship or married, you may be not necessarily fulfilled, however, rather in order to maintain the status quo or because it is better than being single and/or alone.

The point you raise @Weezy1973about a desire and willingness to be a good partner is great. 

So in one aspect - can we be close to someone who doesn't share a lot of our interests, provided we can acknowledge and respect how much those interests matter to us and the other? Just as a rough example - as I remember - my ex-fiancee was a huge football fan, while I myself am not a "huge" fan of the game. Every time he saw a live game, however, he wanted me along. So I'd go with him as much as possible and freeze my fanny off in the stadium. Is that a good thing? I dunno.

A big part of it for me is a feeling that they are feeling they have not been heard, that something very important to them has been ignored and that their viewpoint has not been acknowledged and respected on a fundamental level. The unbearable part is not the presence of differences, but feeling unheard because of our differences is what makes this unbearably difficult. I would say that in those instances it is better to be single than unseen since the unseen are alone no matter what their ostensible relationship status might be. 

It's encouraging to know that these various components of long-lasting relationships can be improved.

There's nothing irremovable - all factors are attainable.

How cool is that? Tell your friends and family!

Edited May 3, 2022 by Alpacalia

[Weezy1973]

6 hours ago, Alpacalia said:

What I am trying to say is that sometimes, when you're going through a rough patch, it's what initially drew you in (whatever that was) that reminds you why you fell in love and helps keeps those rosy embers burning. 

I think what is the most important is how each partner behaves during the rough patch. Again it goes back to being a good partner; part of that is conflict resolution. Being able and willing to compromise. Keeping your partners happiness in mind even in areas where you disagree. Those sorts of things. I find if my wife and I are having a disagreement, even just the simple act of holding hands while we discuss things can make the point that despite disagreeing, we’re still in this together. It’s actions during the marriage that will have the largest impact on its happiness. 

 

6 hours ago, Alpacalia said:

Those most content "might" describe how passionate they are about them and how much they enjoy spending time with them because of some of those initial characteristics/ qualities (again, whichever they may be). 

I think this is falling into the trap of hoping feelings (in this case passion) will propel a marriage through the bad times. They won’t. Actions will. And during rough patches sometimes that involves acting in ways you don’t feel like. Opening lines of communication when you feel like shutting down. Being vulnerable when you feel like protecting yourself. A genuine apology instead of getting defensive. We are our actions, not our feelings.

 

6 hours ago, Alpacalia said:

So I'd go with him as much as possible and freeze my fanny off in the stadium. Is that a good thing? I dunno.

It depends. Were you happy to go? If you were going for him and suffering through it than, no, I’d say it’s not a good thing. That why effective communication and compromise is so vital. But yes, certainly you don’t need to share every interest in common. I think what’s important is that you genuinely like your partner and enjoy spending time with them. But I’m not going to my wife’s book club anytime soon. 

[Els]

6 hours ago, Alpacalia said:

What I am trying to say is that sometimes, when you're going through a rough patch, it's what initially drew you in (whatever that was) that reminds you why you fell in love and helps keeps those rosy embers burning. 

Yes, 100%. While attraction alone does not a good LTR make, IMO it is an essential component in the equation - for me it ties everything together, makes it all feel worth it during difficult times, and triggers my brain to desire him sexually, which is rather important for our sex life.

Honestly, if someone's goal is to be in a happy marriage, they should not neglect attraction. But if their goal is to just be in a marriage full stop... then yes it probably doesn't matter. What matters more in that case is that both people share the same opinion on divorce (or rather, that they both feel strongly against it no matter what).

Personally I can't even imagine being married to someone you're not attracted to. Like, unless you're aromantic AND asexual, you are most definitely going to be meeting other people whom you're actually attracted to. Most of us who are already attracted to our partner can ignore this. But if you're NOT attracted to your partner and you are meeting this person whom you're attracted to every day... I just don't see that ending well for anyone involved.

[Foxhall]

Youngsters tend to be all wrapped up in their boyfriends and girlfriends- young love and all that, in workplaces and so on- they love sharing their love stories and supposed infatuation with other

I dont know is probably my answer to your question,

as a bit of a drifter finding my way with women late 30s, early 40s, 

do I regret not getting into that scene earlier- ah not really although I could have fared better in hindsight, I was probably better with women or could have been better than what I originally thought

I just look on it now go with the flow see where this relationship goes- Im probably willing to adjust myself more than most to suit the other person (not saying that is necessarily a good thing),

making compromises and being happy with what one has got- thats probably my take on it.

 

[Alpacalia]

15 hours ago, Elswyth said:

Yes, 100%. While attraction alone does not a good LTR make, IMO it is an essential component in the equation - for me it ties everything together, makes it all feel worth it during difficult times, and triggers my brain to desire him sexually, which is rather important for our sex life.

Honestly, if someone's goal is to be in a happy marriage, they should not neglect attraction. But if their goal is to just be in a marriage full stop... then yes it probably doesn't matter. What matters more in that case is that both people share the same opinion on divorce (or rather, that they both feel strongly against it no matter what).

Personally I can't even imagine being married to someone you're not attracted to. Like, unless you're aromantic AND asexual, you are most definitely going to be meeting other people whom you're actually attracted to. Most of us who are already attracted to our partner can ignore this. But if you're NOT attracted to your partner and you are meeting this person whom you're attracted to every day... I just don't see that ending well for anyone involved.

I'm with you.

There is a major role for attraction in my view, because ... well, well, desire drives desire and fuels physical and emotional intimacy with one another, along with being able to find the right way to touch and be touched physically, emotionally, etc., in an atmosphere that is healthy, fulfilling.

Often metaphorical snoring is the harbinger of the end of intimacy in the form of housemates, colleagues, or acquaintances who have lost their desire. To ensure a lasting and flourishing relationship between us each needs a protective framework of that type, so that we can grow and sustain our relationship together as we live out our lives by each other.

While we still share an emotional bond and there is still a lot of affection and love in our relationship, I would hope to remain reassured that there is always going to be a sex component in the relationship as well. It is the lack of attraction driving it that will eventually change how I feel about myself and how I perceive myself, and in the end the effect will be felt and seen by the other person. 

[poppyfields]

LTRs including marriage ebb and flow, experience peaks and valleys, and in order to survive a couple should understand that and have the ability and emotional tools to weather it. 

Attraction is an absolute MUST, but it will also ebb and flow, and to what @Alpacaliawrote, during times of conflict, a couple can remind themselves and each other of those early days when they couldn't take their hands off each other or stand to be away from each other for more than 5 minutes! 

OK that's an exaggeration but my point is, that the energy/chemistry /high attraction you felt early on can (and should) be revisited throughout the entire span of the relationship otherwise it will turn into a friendship-only type relationship and end up dying unless both are content with a mere friendship.

But what oftens happens, eventually one or both will end up seeking "attraction and romance" with another person (i.e cheat).

It does take a concerted effort, stepping out of your comfort zone sometimes, doing things you may not feel like doing at that particular moment but you do anyway. 

It can serve to reignite the passion and keep things alive and well, hot!

So many couples I see get so lazy with each other, take the relationship and each other for granted, which is the absolute kiss of death! 

It will be hard sometimes for sure, but so worth it, cause with each conflict you experience and resolve together, the more emotionally bonded as a couple you become AND attracted as well.

Speaking from experience.

[Alpacalia]

21 hours ago, Weezy1973 said:

I find if my wife and I are having a disagreement, even just the simple act of holding hands while we discuss things can make the point that despite disagreeing, we’re still in this together. It’s actions during the marriage that will have the largest impact on its happiness. 

This is super sweet.

21 hours ago, Weezy1973 said:

I think this is falling into the trap of hoping feelings (in this case passion) will propel a marriage through the bad times. They won’t. Actions will. And during rough patches sometimes that involves acting in ways you don’t feel like. Opening lines of communication when you feel like shutting down. Being vulnerable when you feel like protecting yourself. A genuine apology instead of getting defensive. We are our actions, not our feelings.

No, that is not what I am suggesting (that feelings alone will propel a marriage through bad times). It is ONE component.

We choose how we are going to behave. 

Having said that -> are you saying that emotions don't drive actions in the least?

Edited May 4, 2022 by Alpacalia

[Alpacalia]

4 hours ago, poppyfields said:

But what oftens happens, eventually one or both will end up seeking "attraction and romance" with another person (i.e cheat).

Some people have certainly had that experience, I'm sure.

There is a great deal to this, including agreeableness and conscientiousness, as a person who ranks low in the two areas will be more likely to cheat :
https://www.brides.com/why-do-people-cheat-5112047

[SumGuy]

On 4/29/2022 at 11:44 AM, Mysterio said:

So in your life experience. What do you think the average relationship is like?  Do you think that we that are single are making it way too much of a big deal?  Why does it seem to me its like a single person who wants to have a relationship has lots of obstacles.  Mainly I think its looks.  

I turned 51 on March [ ] and my idea of relationships have changed.  I feel like 75% of us are going to go in and out of relationships.  Planned or not outside of death.  25 % of us will hit one romantic relationship for life and stay with that person.  Half are going thru the motion.  The other half basically don't have major issues or problems within the relationship.  

I see a lot of my ex school mates breaking up.  Same with Co-Workers.  I wonder if we are not really designed to be long term with each other.  Something does not feel right.  I can only speak as a man.  If feels like women can slide from relationship to relationship a bit smoother than men can. 

Whats everyones take?

I believe the good news for you is you are in the prime age where people are single again.  That is, they divorce after the kids hit 18.  As they have already gone through a lifetime with someone and (hopefully) learned what went wrong, what they want, and how to recognize it, you are well positioned to be the beneficiary of that.

I found dating at 45+ and 50+ to be very easy if you are not interested in having kids, and have no problems with divorced women who likely have kids, but likely older and mostly away from home.

As to what an "average relationship" is like have no idea.  Don't believe I'd be considered average, and have enough expereince to realize that what you see of other couples on the outside may not be what is really going on. 

My own "average" relationship has been pretty intense (in a good way) but it is of course self selective and certain filtering out those who want something else.   

So wouldn't worry about average, rather focus on who you are interested in, attracting them and being able to discern/filter for them.

[SumGuy]

10 minutes ago, Alpacalia said:

Some people have certainly had that experience, I'm sure.

There is a great deal to this, including agreeableness and conscientiousness, as a person who ranks low in the two areas will be more likely to cheat :
https://www.brides.com/why-do-people-cheat-5112047

Agreed.   Cheaters have always been incredibly rare in my social circle, in other social circles it seems to be common.  

[Els]

5 hours ago, Alpacalia said:

I'm with you.

There is a major role for attraction in my view, because ... well, well, desire drives desire and fuels physical and emotional intimacy with one another, along with being able to find the right way to touch and be touched physically, emotionally, etc., in an atmosphere that is healthy, fulfilling.

Often metaphorical snoring is the harbinger of the end of intimacy in the form of housemates, colleagues, or acquaintances who have lost their desire. To ensure a lasting and flourishing relationship between us each needs a protective framework of that type, so that we can grow and sustain our relationship together as we live out our lives by each other.

While we still share an emotional bond and there is still a lot of affection and love in our relationship, I would hope to remain reassured that there is always going to be a sex component in the relationship as well. It is the lack of attraction driving it that will eventually change how I feel about myself and how I perceive myself, and in the end the effect will be felt and seen by the other person. 

Absolutely.

And, for the record, I don't really buy the myth that "attraction always fades". H and I have been together for 14 years now and I still feel as attracted to him as I did on our first date, if not moreso. If it ever fades, I'll let y'all know... but I'm not holding my breath.

I think the only issue with attraction is that some people prioritize it to the extent that they'll ignore red flags or poor behaviour, etc. Which is, for obvious reasons, a bad idea.

[Weezy1973]

1 hour ago, Alpacalia said:

Having said that -> are you saying that emotions don't drive actions in the least?

Emotions do drive actions, however what should drive our actions is our core values. I want to be a good partner, and my actions should reflect that regardless of how I’m feeling. People seem to want to take the easy route, which is to let your feelings drive your actions. I guarantee that conscious or subconscious desire is the cause of practically every problem discussed on this site. And people fall into that trap of allowing their feelings to drive their actions. At the end of the day, that’s actually the reason people cheat. They let their feelings drive their actions. Having solid core values, and letting you actions flow from those values, regardless of how you’re feeling, is the key to a full, rich, healthy life. And marriage.

[Weezy1973]

10 minutes ago, Elswyth said:

I think the only issue with attraction is that some people prioritize it to the extent that they'll ignore red flags or poor behaviour, etc. Which is, for obvious reasons, a bad idea.

I agree, but would also add the more superficial one’s attraction drivers are, the more likely that attraction is to fade over time. Like if you’re only attracted to a beautiful face, and then your partner is in a car accident and their face is disfigured, is that the end of the relationship? If, however you’re attracted to deeper qualities, then for sure that can go on forever. 

Edited May 4, 2022 by Weezy1973

[Els]

8 minutes ago, Weezy1973 said:

Emotions do drive actions, however what should drive our actions is our core values. I want to be a good partner, and my actions should reflect that regardless of how I’m feeling. People seem to want to take the easy route, which is to let your feelings drive your actions. I guarantee that conscious or subconscious desire is the cause of practically every problem discussed on this site. And people fall into that trap of allowing their feelings to drive their actions. At the end of the day, that’s actually the reason people cheat. They let their feelings drive their actions. Having solid core values, and letting you actions flow from those values, regardless of how you’re feeling, is the key to a full, rich, healthy life. And marriage.

Feelings (namely: love, care, companionship, attraction and desire) are literally the main reason why some of us even are (or want to be) in a long term relationship or marriage. What is the point of marriage otherwise, especially if you don't intend to have kids? Tax breaks?

This isn't the 1800s where women had to get married in order to survive, and men had to get married in order to have sex. Everyone in this day and age can be single and not really experience any practical disadvantages, except for missing out on some of the best feelings that life has to offer.

[Els]

29 minutes ago, Weezy1973 said:

I agree, but would also add the more superficial one’s attraction drivers are, the more likely that attraction is to fade over time. Like if you’re only attracted to a beautiful face, and then your partner is in a car accident and their face is disfigured, is that the end of the relationship? If, however you’re attracted to deeper qualities, then for sure that can go on forever. 

Yeah, for sure. I think physical attraction can be part of the package, but if that's the ONLY thing they are attracted to, I definitely think the couple will struggle as time passes.

Edited May 4, 2022 by Elswyth

[Alpacalia]

On 5/4/2022 at 12:27 PM, SumGuy said:

Agreed.   Cheaters have always been incredibly rare in my social circle, in other social circles it seems to be common.  

Indeed.

Love your family, choose your friends... 

Edited May 6, 2022 by Alpacalia

[Mysterio]

My take on a Romantic relationship for me is this.  We have commonalities that come together.  In my head.  I am a Extrovert.  I love to talk and pick people brains about various topics.  Personal to Social.  I also would like more physical affection in my life.  Dating really does not do that.  The Dating world is very fickle at best.  

I asked my question to get a baseline of what the scoop is on average relationship in a heterosexual context.  I look at stats, but I go by observation.  I am not expecting to be in a happy high as a kite bliss, but more like a Male/Female friendship, where their is romantic affection.  

I see more people in my life breaking up, than getting together.  Singleness is more of a thing when I meet most people.  Even Dating seems scarce.  I do have a technically cushy life.  I have my own Condo.  I am close to work.  I have various friends I go out with at least on a weekly basis if I want.  I do things on my own and its not a big deal.  

I think if one can make it to 90.  One will be with many romantic partners.  Rare its going to be one and done.  Maybe from 1900 to 1970's that would have been the case.  Not now.