Is trying to save my marriage the right thing?

[BaileyB]

20 hours ago, lou65198 said:

I was with him in the room when he called her to end it originally. I needed to know he’d done it. She wasn’t on speaker phone but from what he was saying it was clear she suspected it wasn’t ‘him’, ie I think she guessed he was being overheard and wasn’t buying it. It was a few days after I found out but they had been in contact in the interim.

Of course they had been in contact. It’s unlikely to stop because you forced him to make a call and tell her that it was “over.” Where there is a will, there is a way. 

20 hours ago, lou65198 said:

I made sure he deleted her number but in all honesty I guess he could have saved it somewhere or contacted her since from work, I wouldn’t know that even if I have access to everything else.

Of he has her number memorized. Or he got a separate phone. Or, they use secret messaging apps. The options are limitless - you are foolish to think they have not been in contact because you asked him to delete her number. Again, when there is a will, there is a way. 

20 hours ago, lou65198 said:

I don’t think he’s actually seen her as he’s been home a lot

You have no idea the number of affairs that happen at work - during work hours. There are several women on this board who meet their affair partners for sex at work, and only at work. You are being naive. 

If he’s giving her diamond necklaces, it’s unlikely that they will be satisfied with a workplace affair. That said, they have likely gone underground for a while until this blows over… 

22 hours ago, glows said:

“Bimbos” were still putting your family at health risk for STDs. Each “bimbo” had the potential to become financial risks. And each “bimbo” he had a fling with took time and attention away from your marriage and violated your marriage vows. 

“Bimbos” could become pregnant - again, there are multiple stories on this board of men who have had affairs and their affair partner has become pregnant. 

Edited May 31, 2022 by BaileyB

[BaileyB]

You remind me of another poster on this board OP, she has convinced herself that her husband is entitled to extramarital affairs because he is “good looking” and she has made her peace with his affairs because it is “just sex.” But, there is one woman he has been chasing with whom she believes he has more of an “emotional connection” and this, presents a threat to her marriage. Ten years this has been going on - she has bargained and rationalized her decision to stay with her serial cheat of a husband for 10 years… I hope that you don’t do the same.

I know, it hurts that she is beautiful and that he has lavished attention on her in more ways than one… but, she is not your problem. You have no need to compete with her of feel threatened by her. The problem here is that your husband doesn’t respect you or the boundaries of your marriage. As in the example above, that’s unlikely to change - a person does not change his character when he is caught and forced to call and end the relationship/delete her number from his phone. You may have just discovered this truth but it has been the basic truth throughout your marriage. The foundation of your marriage has been built on sand and the ground has shifted - 

Edited May 31, 2022 by BaileyB

[stillafool]

6 minutes ago, BaileyB said:

You remind me of another poster on this board OP, she has convinced herself that her husband is entitled to extramarital affairs because he is “good looking” and she has made her peace with his affairs because it is “just sex.” But, there is one woman he has been chasing with whom she believes he has more of an “emotional connection” and this, presents a threat to her marriage. Ten years this has been going on - she has bargained and rationalized her decision to stay with her serial cheat of a husband for 10 years… I hope that you don’t do the same.

I was thinking the exact same thing Bailey.  It might help OP to read her thread. 

 

[Wiseman2]

On 5/29/2022 at 12:32 PM, lou65198 said:

It’s probably something I would discuss with a lawyer if I go down that route in terms of what I would get maintenance wise and whether I’d need to work again. 

Consulting an attorney for accurate information about your particular situation is not filing for divorce, the same way going to a doctor for an ache is not having surgery.

Living in fear and the unknown will increase your distress and the notion that you are helpless to have a happy life for yourself and your children.

Your happiness is not contingent on what his mistress looks like, how many other sexual escapades he'll have, whether he will file for divorce first and marry this woman etc. Unless you want to remain in this situation.

The first step is going to a physician for STD testing and asking for a referral to a qualified therapist. Then getting valuable information about your options in divorce and the consequences of waiting until files first. Your husband is checked out of the marriage. Information is your friend right now.

[Will am I]

There's one thing I didn't want to write in my previous reply, but after some debate I have chosen to speak my mind.

 

OP is putting effort and significant emotions into making the affair stop. I think it's primary response: "it hurts, it must stop". 

 

The questionon my mind is: should she even bother to stop the affair at this time?

 

There's a huge concensus here that OP needs to file for divorce. There are major doubts about whether OP's husband was ever truly committed to the marriage. Even in younger years. The facts speak a grim testomony about his commitment and about his trustworthyness. The trust seems permanently broken, the marriage seems unsalvageable. 

If OP files for divorce, there's a big chance that her husband will almost immediately move in with his affair partner. As wrong as that would be, It would be a reality that OP couldn't really do anything to prevent.

So I wonder, should she still be fighting the inevitable? Or should she forfeit that fight and push the husband out the door quickly and file for divorce equally quickly?

 

[stillafool]

21 minutes ago, Will am I said:

So I wonder, should she still be fighting the inevitable? Or should she forfeit that fight and push the husband out the door quickly and file for divorce equally quickly?

 

IMHO she should let go and file for divorce so she has some chance at happiness in her life.  She's actually sitting on a time bomb because more than likely if she stays her husband will continue to chase this young woman and if that ends he will chose another.  It's doubtful he's ever going to become the faithful husband OP dreams of, at least not with her.  I think if she stays she will be in this same situation for the duration of the marriage.

[Will am I]

The need for divorce seems widely supported among the participants in this conversation.  Divorce seems an uneviteable reality.

The question on my mind: given an impending divorce, should OP try and stop her husband from seeing OW anymore? Or should she (figuratively speaking) pack his bags and give him a ride to OW's place just to get rid of him quicker?

 

I imagine this is one of those considerations where the emotions don't always line up with the best practical results. When you make your spouse call the affair partner, you're exercising power over the situation (albeit very limited power in reality). But you're also burning through emotions.

Sending your spouse away to his afair partner might feel so powerless, but at the same time  be the more empowering step to take.

 

 

[glows]

OP, if you're still reading consider speaking to a lawyer only regarding your options. Do not go by what you think of the other woman or speculate about what your husband is doing. 

Please protect yourself and your children, and think of your futures. It's wasted time and resources not gathering the correct information you need. 

[lou65198]

I'm grateful for the support of everyone who has taken the time to post here. It's really helped.

 

Edited May 31, 2022 by lou65198
too much identifying info

[Wiseman2]

2 minutes ago, lou65198 said:

I messaged her myself. From his number. Shouldn't have done it, she knew it wasn't him. 

I am also fairly sure they are now NC because she got pretty irate in the end and said she wasn't engaging in any communication and was keeping the jewellery. She suspected I was involved. Angry he was allowing it. I guess in reality his loyalties weren't to me.  DH knew I'd done it and was furious. 

What was your message to her? Your husband's loyalty is to her. Some people are anti-divorce, but  you need to contact an attorney as soon as possible.

[lou65198]

Sorry I had to edit the previous post as it would have made me potentially identifiable. In regards about making DH call her to end it - I just wanted to make sure he'd done it. But I know I've made things worse for myself because I now just feel even more insecure, that he only ended it because I made him. I did message her myself. Shouldn't have done it. But also they had been NC up until that point, which I could tell from her replies. DH knew I'd done it and was furious. I can't go into detail about what was said there were just some things I felt I needed closure about.

We had several blazing rows over it. But I've made things a million times worse. 

I am also fairly sure they are now NC because she got pretty irate in the end and said she wasn't engaging in any communication. Angry he was allowing it. But yeah, ultimately, he didn't end it because he wanted to. And he certainly didn't want to upset her in any way. I know it wasn't the best thing to do, but I feel like his loyalties should be to me, particularly given what's happened. But then, I guess in reality his loyalties weren't to me. So it's pointless. Just feel like such an idiot.

I thought in some way it would give me closure but it's done the opposite. I know that there is probably no way forward from this. It's just admitting it. I will seek legal advice in any event just to see where I stand. In any case, the constant worrying about whatever has gone on with AP is exhausting. She was the last, but not the first. Or the only!

The objective views have helped, so thank you. 

Edited May 31, 2022 by lou65198
identifying info

[Will am I]

Your actions are very understandable. Your marriage is slipping from your hands, your natural response is to try and take back some control over the situation.

As an outsider I see that the situation has spiraled totally out of control and is your marriage is damaged beyond repair. The simple observation is that there is no reasonable way in which you can ever trust your husband again. Most of the time you were together, he wasn’t committed as you were. He was living a double life for so long that you doubt if you even knew him. The infidelity has broken your future but also invalidated your past. You can’t be expected to step over that.

I don’t think there is much you can actually do about the affair. They’re in love, and I strongly suspect he will attempt to marry her (if they do, the structural infidelity is her problem. i expect him to be unfaithful to her too.).

The smart thing to do is to rid yourself from him and rebuild your own life and your own dignity. It’s a better shot at future happiness than investing any more of your energy into this marriage.

[lou65198]

17 hours ago, Will am I said:

Your actions are very understandable. Your marriage is slipping from your hands, your natural response is to try and take back some control over the situation.

As an outsider I see that the situation has spiraled totally out of control and is your marriage is damaged beyond repair. The simple observation is that there is no reasonable way in which you can ever trust your husband again. Most of the time you were together, he wasn’t committed as you were. He was living a double life for so long that you doubt if you even knew him. The infidelity has broken your future but also invalidated your past. You can’t be expected to step over that.

I don’t think there is much you can actually do about the affair. They’re in love, and I strongly suspect he will attempt to marry her (if they do, the structural infidelity is her problem. i expect him to be unfaithful to her too.).

The smart thing to do is to rid yourself from him and rebuild your own life and your own dignity. It’s a better shot at future happiness than investing any more of your energy into this marriage.

I also eventually found out he’d called her again after he ended it - after the phone call he did in front of me. 
 

I don’t know exactly what was said, they were NC after that, so I don’t think it was to carry anything on. But yeah. Says he wanted to do it in the way he would have wanted, so she wasn’t confused and then would have been less likely to initiate contact after that. 
 

I don’t see why it would have mattered how she felt about things but it tells me a lot. 

[Starswillshine]

8 minutes ago, lou65198 said:

I also eventually found out he’d called her again after he ended it - after the phone call he did in front of me. 
 

I don’t know exactly what was said, they were NC after that, so I don’t think it was to carry anything on. But yeah. Says he wanted to do it in the way he would have wanted, so she wasn’t confused and then would have been less likely to initiate contact after that. 
 

I don’t see why it would have mattered how she felt about things but it tells me a lot. 

It may have been a phone call to explain that you forced his hand and to ask her to lay low and figure out alternative means of communication. I hate to tell you this but it is exactly what my xH did. It never ended, he just figured out how to take it further underground. Which meant I never felt safe. I lost 20 lbs in a couple of months.... and I was already really tiny to begin with. The anxiety nearly killed me. When I could eat, I usually just ended up vomiting it all up.

[BaileyB]

1 hour ago, lou65198 said:

I don’t see why it would have mattered how she felt about things but it tells me a lot. 

But, it clearly does matter how she feels - assuming they ended it (which I think is doubtful), it tells you that his feelings matter more than yours. It tells you that he is going to do what he wants to do - he did not respect your requirement that he end all communication with his affair partner. It shows you that he does not respect you - his needs and his interests come ahead of yours. How can you have a marriage with this? 

Edited June 1, 2022 by BaileyB

[Wiseman2]

1 hour ago, lou65198 said:

I also eventually found out he’d called her again after he ended it - after the phone call he did in front of me. I don’t see why it would have mattered how she felt about things but it tells me a lot. 

Of course. He wanted to tell her it's not over and you were standing over him. You were right to confront her, but you can't ask for his gifts back. At least this will create turbulence in their relationship, but it's not over. 

[BaileyB]

3 hours ago, BaileyB said:

But, it clearly does matter how she feels - it tells you that her feelings matter more than yours.

Oops, missed a little error this morning. 

[Starswillshine]

11 minutes ago, BaileyB said:

Oops, missed a little error this morning. 

Your original assessment is correct though. Because it is really about neither of them. Because he did not drop his wife, he placated his wife and hurt his OW in the original ending call, and then he did the reverse when he called the OW... to placate her. All in all, the only feelings he cares about is his own. 

Edited June 1, 2022 by Starswillshine

[lou65198]

17 minutes ago, Starswillshine said:

Your original assessment is correct though. Because it is really about neither of them. Because he did not drop his wife, he placated his wife and hurt his OW in the original ending call, and then he did the reverse when he called the OW... to placate her. All in all, the only feelings he cares about is his own. 

Yes he clearly couldn’t bear the thought of her being upset with him irrespective of what was said.

All a bit cowardly and pathetic. 

[stillafool]

5 hours ago, lou65198 said:

I also eventually found out he’d called her again after he ended it - after the phone call he did in front of me. 
 

I don’t know exactly what was said, they were NC after that, so I don’t think it was to carry anything on. But yeah. Says he wanted to do it in the way he would have wanted, so she wasn’t confused and then would have been less likely to initiate contact after that. 
 

I don’t see why it would have mattered how she felt about things but it tells me a lot. 

The call was a "clean up on isle 6" so to speak.  He called her to tell her you made him make the other call to end it.  He probably told her nothing has ended and they set up another way to be in touch with each other.  Also to make sure she was okay and not hurt over what he said on the call in front of you.  This is so standard in affairs.

[lou65198]

6 minutes ago, stillafool said:

The call was a "clean up on isle 6" so to speak.  He called her to tell her you made him make the other call to end it.  He probably told her nothing has ended and they set up another way to be in touch with each other.  Also to make sure she was okay and not hurt over what he said on the call in front of you.  This is so standard in affairs.

Well I know they were NC after that because of her replies when I messaged her. 
But I think ultimately it comes down to weakness. He is doing what he thinks he needs to do keep me happy, but what he genuinely wants lies elsewhere. He‘s demonstrated that. The affair had nothing to do with obligation and was pure (selfish) desire. As we’ve discussed he was obviously never truly committed to me. Too weak to end the relationship so had multiple affairs. Too weak to tell the truth. 
I suspect given everything he does love her. As much as that hurts beyond belief. But he’s being too weak to even go for that in any kind of real way, and is probably just going through the motions to placate me on that front. And probably same for her. 
I mean I do just think that you don’t do something like this unless you want out, so probably his, again, weak way of trying to blow up the marriage so the decision is made for him. 

I’ve had my eyes opened put it that way. 
 

I know I can’t be with someone like this. But it’s all been such a blow on every level. I think I just need to build up some strength. 

 

[stillafool]

2 hours ago, lou65198 said:

Too weak to end the relationship so had multiple affairs. Too weak to tell the truth. 

Weakness yes, but more about having his cake and eating it too.  He had you at home, holding down the fort and taking care of the kids and a side piece.  He thought he was sitting pretty and didn't want to lose either.

[BaileyB]

6 hours ago, stillafool said:

Weakness yes, but more about having his cake and eating it too.  He had you at home, holding down the fort and taking care of the kids and a side piece.  He thought he was sitting pretty and didn't want to lose either.

As Starswillshine has said in previous discussions about her exhusband - different women served different purposes. He has a wife who was home caring for the children. He had a girlfriend, who was the object of his affection. He has another girlfriend with women he travels. I’m paraphrasing here, but on it goes… and it seems to be a reasonable assertion here. Different women and different relationships to serve very different purposes. 

8 hours ago, lou65198 said:

But I think ultimately it comes down to weakness.

Affairs are all too often for the weak and cowardly. So many other women come on this site and proclaim - “His wife is a terrible woman, but he just can’t ask her for a divorce. He doesn’t want to be the bad guy - he doesn’t want his wife to hate him, he doesn’t want his kids to think badly of him, he doesn’t want their family to think badly of him, he doesn’t want his neighbours to think badly of him, etc…” So, the plan is to cheat and stay away from home and make life so miserable for the wife that SHE will ultimately file for divorce. It’s ridiculous really, who would ever say of such a weak, cowardly, and passive aggressive man - “that’s the guy for me!!” Unfortunately, so many other women believe his tale of woe that his wife is a terrible person, there is no love lost in their marriage, and he doesn’t want to hurt his children that they fail to assess the basic logic of the plan and how it reflects on the character of the man. 

Personally, I don’t believe that here. If this was his only affair - maybe. But this guy has done whatever he wants throughout your entire marriage with little regard for the consequences - that, to me, speaks of a selfish and entitled human being… not a weak, cowardly, passive aggressive man. 

[Wiseman2]

16 hours ago, lou65198 said:

 Too weak to end the relationship so had multiple affairs. Too weak to tell the truth. 

He's not "weak". He's been getting away with cheating for years. "Weak" is the wrong word. He's having his cake and eat it too. It's that simple. He doesn't want an expensive divorce and doesn't want to give up chasing skirts or his latest mistress.

Consult an attorney. That's a show of strength on your part to put your future and happiness back in your own hands rather than whatever he and his mistresses decide.

 

[Starswillshine]

32 minutes ago, Wiseman2 said:

He doesn't want an expensive divorce and doesn't want to give up chasing skirts or his latest mistress.

I wouldn't even say that it is about not wanting the expensive divorce. He wants a wife. But he also wants the side chicks.