Am I Crazy or No?

[AmICrazyOrNo]

My (41m) partner (36f) and I have been together for 14 years. Living together 11. We have 2 kids, 4 1/2 (m)& 2 (f). Million dollar family. 

I have an embarrassing concern that has kept me up random nights for about 2 years and 9 months  

About a year and a half after our first, I had a very painful and sudden job loss. My partner had just gone back to work full time and was already out earning me when this happened. She is also from a wealthy family.  While this mitigated our financial concerns, our relationship suffered.

She was very unsympathetic and shortly after became downright contemptuous most of the time we were speaking.  We had been through a lot together and I felt awful that I could no longer contribute, but was hurt by her lack of care. During this time, we had almost no sex. She rarely said anything other than snarky criticism. I had been training for a career upgrade when I was let go so a few months into looking for work, I was stunned to hear her accuse me of losing my job on purpose to sit around and spend her money. She still doesn’t know this but that night a call back from a friend was the only thing that stopped me from taking my own life. I was full of self loathing and felt like her and our son would be better off without me as a burden, especially before my beautiful boy was old enough to miss me. 

Things were not good but I realized how sad and pitiful I’d become. She wasn’t helping (my state, or my ability to look for work) but I felt like I was lucky she hadn’t just kicked me out of our house, and kept me from our son. I had become extremely angry, depressed and probably quite unpleasant to be around.

Her and I had discussed another baby when times were better and the clock was ticking so to speak, so in spite of our situation, with her income and wealthy family to support us, we decided to try for number 2. 

Our first try that time was not successful and we were going to try for the next month. 

Before that day came, we were invited to a hallowe’en party. She dressed like she’s never dressed before. Her costume seemed to necessitate a tight satin mini dress and lots of time on hair and makeup. When we walked in she was turning heads. I felt thrilled with her with me. Her friend’s husband invited a lot of loud, boisterous, coke fueled, cocky grown-up frat boy types who I’ve long since grown unthreatened by. She seemed to know some, but nothing suspicious caught my eye.

The next week was halloween and other than taking our son trick or treating, she was more or less contemptuous the entire time. She would never go out normally and that week she went out at least 3 times, usually after some fuss in the bathroom to get ready. The last time she came home, dropped her phone on the table, brushed me off and jumped in the shower. 

I had grown so suspicious that I did the no-no. I flipped over her phone and scrolled through her call history. None from her friend.  Texts. No messages. Emails. No emails. Insta DMs. No insta dms. Unless she communicated with these women by effing raven, I had to  concede that I would never know how she was contacted or how those plans were made.

I felt sick and worried but pushed that away. I hadn’t been insecure like that since we’d first dated and it felt weird. I assumed I was losing my mind, or that she deleted messages to her friends complaining about how much she disliked me. I confronted her and she was dismissive and accused me of being paranoid and insecure, and managed to eye-roll her way out of questions I felt weren’t unwarranted.

A few days later, with her unenthusiastic, mechanical participation, we conceived our second. 

This pregnancy was during COVID. There was not contact with much of anyone and I somehow managed to find work, getting promoted quickly. As my confidence improved, so did our relationship. I have done a lot of work on myself for my family and my own sake since that time. I also spent the pandemic renovating our house which gave me a lot of pride at home and I began asserting myself in our relationship like I never had before.

By the due date all fear was behind me. I was over the moon when our daughter was born.  

But as I’d read so much about why and when wives cheat, what it looks like, why a wife might be mad at you all the time by this time, I couldn’t shake that week off.

Many articles stated that wives are likely to cheat when the relationship is bad. Check.

When they are over 30. Check. Withholding sex from their partner. Double check outside of scheduled baby making. 

When they have a one year old. Check.

And most painful:

when they are ovulating.

Since that time I feel many aspects of our relationship have improved and I can’t imagine that my partner of 13 years would destroy or family and put us all through that sort of pain because I was laid off and struggled to find work for a few months, but I also know that every man who has been in that situation thought the same thing. 
 

If I could prove infidelity, I would just leave, but that would be crazy ona weird hunch.

if the timing wasn’t so critical, I’d just let it go and assume the worst but acknowledge my part in her feelings at that time. But with our relationship improving and me falling more in love with my daughter every day this little shred of doubt is tearing me apart.

is this worth a paternity test?

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

[Wiseman2]

11 hours ago, AmICrazyOrNo said:

About a year and a half after our first, I had a very painful and sudden job loss. My partner had just gone back to work full time and was already out earning me when this happened. She is also from a wealthy family.  While this mitigated our financial concerns, our relationship suffered.

 I had been training for a career upgrade when I was let go so a few months into looking for work, I was stunned to hear her accuse me of losing my job on purpose to sit around and spend her money. She still doesn’t know this but that night a call back from a friend was the only thing that stopped me from taking my own life.

Sorry this is happening. Are you working? See a physician about your physical and mental health. Discuss the suicidal ideation, lassitude and malaise. Get some texts done. Ask for a referral to a qualified therapist for ongoing support.

Suggesting a DNA test when there is zero evidence of infidelity except a Halloween costume and your imagination, suggesting DNA testing is outrageous and will further erode your relationship. Since you are not married you may end up on the street. There is so much contempt and resentment as it is. Why fuel this? Start with a check up and individual therapy.

[Wiseman2]

On 9/1/2022 at 11:01 PM, AmICrazyOrNo said:

 Many articles stated that wives are likely to cheat when the relationship is bad. Check.

When they are over 30. Check. Withholding sex from their partner. Double check outside of scheduled baby making. 

When they have a one year old. Check.

when they are ovulating.

None of this is scientific or realistic. It would be best to acknowledge that your failure to participate financially and around the house and in the relationship are much bigger factors than the remote possibly of cheating leading to a pregnancy outside the relationship.

It's unclear why you're blaming her for the relationship problems when her hard work and family's help is the only thing keeping things together

Before you launch into wild accusations, consider what the real issues are and how to get back on track.

[AmICrazyOrNo]

Well to answer questions this was over 2 years ago. As mentioned in the post I found work at a difficult time and was promoted quickly. I now contribute almost as much on a lower salary. I bought a home gym with the money I made so I could get back in shape during the pandemic and over the last 2 years or so, other than my suspicions things have been getting better. 
Also as mentioned, my job loss was due to a layoff. I didn’t quit or f*** up and get fired. I have sought individual therapy but I didn’t get much out of it compared to having obtainable goals and then running them down. 
While there are power struggles still we have much more give and take and sex has improved. 
I probably take charge of little family emergencies more than I ever have. 
I still have a lot of work to do, but I think your moniker is deceptive if you think a few months of hard times due to involuntary job loss, causing minimal financial hardship, followed by a recovery to an improved position to paying half the bills in 2 years with a spouse who out earns is worse than lying about wanting a baby with your spouse, then forcing him to raise someone else’s. The damage I did is recoverable and has been recovered. If she did that it could mess up our family forever. 
I would rather she’d left me if that was the case. 
thanks for the reminder to ignore random internet advice tho. 
 

[Wiseman2]

9 minutes ago, AmICrazyOrNo said:

 lying about wanting a baby with your spouse, then forcing him to raise someone else’s. 

How is she forcing you to raise someone else's child when you two agreed to have more children and specifically planned to conceive through sex with each other?

[AmICrazyOrNo]

Also this assumption I didn’t contribute around the house is an unwarranted one. 
After the first few months of unemployment I pulled my son out of daycare to save on costs and did the SAHD thing until her mat leave started and did a perfectly good job taking care of things around the house, and have made more money at work, moving up faster than I have before. I am continuously looking to improve my position. 
By all accounts (including partner/her family) I’m a fantastic father. 
The way she was treating me was somewhat justified which I also said in my post, if all it was was being disappointed in me. It would have been nice if it was tempered with a few days of compassion, understanding or reassurance.
It’s another story if I got duped into raising a kid that isn’t mine. 
Call me progressive, but I think women have a little more personal/sexual agency than you give them credit for. 
Also:

Tell me your not a father without telling me your not father 

there were more details that made me suspicious, but I didn’t hire a pi or anything, just found in the past that in many people’s eyes there is no knife edge to balance on between being seen as silly for being sus with no evidence  and being accused of obsessive paranoia over every detail you remember. 
 

 

[AmICrazyOrNo]

She isn’t forcing me to raise someone else’s since we agreed to conceive with each other. 
That’s my concern. If we agree to raise a baby we have together, and she had one with someone else and I agree to stick around under the false pretence that it is mine, which would be enforceable by law where I live would be pretty close to forcing me to raise someone else’s kid. 
maybe force is the wrong word and I should have said “tricked”. 
I can’t believe I have to explain this. 

[Wiseman2]

Just now, AmICrazyOrNo said:

. If we agree to raise a baby we have together, and she had one with someone else and I agree to stick around under the false pretence that it is mine.

Are you legally married? Is your name on the birth certificate?

You have no proof of cheating no less a pregnancy from a lover.

However since you are so suspicious of this consult an attorney and see what they say about it.

[AmICrazyOrNo]

Yes. Common law here is legally married. 
yes. My name is on the birth certificate. 

[AmICrazyOrNo]

How would an attorney be a cheaper path to paternity certainty than a paternity test?

 

[Wiseman2]

2 minutes ago, AmICrazyOrNo said:

Yes. Common law here is legally married. 
yes. My name is on the birth certificate. 

Then you'll need an attorney. It's not about cheaper. It's about you're legally on the hook regardless of some DNA test.

You'll need advice from an attorney on many fronts. To dissolve the common law marriage, to divide up assets, to disown your supposedly illegitimate child, etc. To figure out child support and custody/ visitation.

In fact that she was texting someone is quite irrelevant in the grand scheme of what you're suggesting.

Edited September 3, 2022 by Wiseman2

[AmICrazyOrNo]

WHY DO I NEED AN ATTORNEY IF THERE IS NO EVIDENCE OF CHEATING LET ALONE PREGNANCY WITH ANOTHER MAN??

A paternity test works to confirm or extinguish both concerns. It costs $250. Takes a few days and can be performed discretely enough to cause no stir. If nothing comes of it, then I stop worrying. Maybe she strayed while I was at my most pathetic, but I’ll never know, and my kids are mine, so who cares?

If one of them isn’t mine, it confirms worst fears, but I have proof of both.

You’re telling me to hire an attorney at $250 an hour? To do what? I have no evidence and asked if I should seek some for peace of mind. 
I think she might have some evidence of a problem when I’m out thousands of dollars in family lawyer fees.

it’s like saying “don’t trust but verify, that’s too extreme. Instead advertise your intent for mutually assured nuclear destruction”

 

[AmICrazyOrNo]

I think that I should be clear here:

My handle and post indicate a fear that I may be crazy for thinking there is a chance of this. 
I am asking if I should allay my fears as discretely as possible or move on with a toxic little shard of doubt eating away at me. 
 

Thanks for your replies but I think I know what I need to do. 

[Wiseman2]

6 minutes ago, AmICrazyOrNo said:

If one of them isn’t mine, it confirms worst fears, but I have proof of both.

Well you're putting yourself in a lose-lose situation. If it is not yours, you'll want a divorce and if it is and you've made these accusations, she will. So get your test and prepare for the divorce.

[basil67]

I'll bite.  One week of having a unusual nights out nights out does not necessarily indicate a baby of uncertain parentage.  

That said, if you are seriously doubting and can have DNA testing done without your partner's knowledge, then just get it done.   But even if it shows the child to likely be yours, will you be satisfied that she wasn't cheating?

[Wiseman2]

7 minutes ago, basil67 said:

 if it shows the child to likely be yours, will you be satisfied that she wasn't cheating?

Exactly. A lot of these infidelity-specific sites poorly advise everyone to routinely do DNA testing on their children either to humiliate a known cheater, intimidate a suspected cheater into a "confession" or to falsely "disprove'" cheating. In fact it's sad because now an innocent child is being used for this purpose which serves no purpose.

Hope it works out but the bottom line is still a lot of discord, resentment and contempt for a long time before and after the child is question.

[AmICrazyOrNo]

Because a week of indiscretions at a difficult time if you’re safe and used protection or considered cheating and backed out you are light years from intentionally stepping out to get inseminated by someone outside of the relationship. 

[Wiseman2]

On 9/1/2022 at 11:01 PM, AmICrazyOrNo said:

I flipped over her phone and scrolled through her call history. None from her friend.  Texts. No messages. Emails. No emails. Insta DMs. No insta dms.

So you have no evidence of cheating? Work on the relationship to improve the resentment, contempt, etc.. Running down this "not my child because she cheated" theory is not helping.

[RebeccaR]

23 minutes ago, Wiseman2 said:

So you have no evidence of cheating? Work on the relationship to improve the resentment, contempt, etc.. Running down this "not my child because she cheated" theory is not helping.

OP assumes his wife deleted all messages and was not even in communication with the female friends she was using as her cover.

 

OP, even if you find out the child is yours, you won’t be satisfied. Does your child have physical features that make you assume she’s not yours? We don’t have enough information to weigh in on paternity.

[AmICrazyOrNo]

Me: 5’8, dark hair, light brown eyes - lots of light hair and blue eyes on my side tho

Mrs: 5’6, blonde, blue eyes - all blue eyes/light hair on her end

son: shorter end on height, sandy hair, blue eyes. Face looks like mine

daughter: 95th % of height (projected my height or taller), light blonde, blue eyes, mommy’s face with none of my features 

I did eventually hear from her in a lighter convo after daughter was born about a friend of the party host’s husband who is tall and fair compared to me. I guess around time she was back to going out after 1st was born he had met her at a stag & doe I couldn’t attend and he’d asked the host if she was single after they “hit if off”, but they “only hung out a couple of times… like in a group… like when I was just hanging out with my friend and he was there. He’s married and has a daughter on the way now.” 
he came up again when watching a show with her celeb crush and she again mentioned this guy in the context of how much he resembled this guy. 

[RebeccaR]

3 minutes ago, AmICrazyOrNo said:

Me: 5’8, dark hair, light brown eyes - lots of light hair and blue eyes on my side tho

Mrs: 5’6, blonde, blue eyes - all blue eyes/light hair on her end

son: shorter end on height, sandy hair, blue eyes. Face looks like mine

daughter: 95th % of height (projected my height or taller), light blonde, blue eyes, mommy’s face with none of my features 

I did eventually hear from her in a lighter convo after daughter was born about a friend of the party host’s husband who is tall and fair compared to me. I guess around time she was back to going out after 1st was born he had met her at a stag & doe I couldn’t attend and he’d asked the host if she was single after they “hit if off”, but they “only hung out a couple of times… like in a group… like when I was just hanging out with my friend and he was there. He’s married and has a daughter on the way now.” 
he came up again when watching a show with her celeb crush and she again mentioned this guy in the context of how much he resembled this guy. 

If she had a child from an extramarital tryst, or was considering one, she probably wouldn’t mention the guy. You are being paranoid 

[AmICrazyOrNo]

I might still do the test but your reply is the first one that made me laugh in relief. 

3 minutes ago, RebeccaR said:

If she had a child from an extramarital tryst, or was considering one, she probably wouldn’t mention the guy. You are being paranoid 

 

[AmICrazyOrNo]

Also the first one that more or less answers the question in the titles. 

7 minutes ago, RebeccaR said:

If she had a child from an extramarital tryst, or was considering one, she probably wouldn’t mention the guy. You are being paranoid 

Whatever message you meant to send I interpret as trust but verify. 

[RebeccaR]

7 minutes ago, AmICrazyOrNo said:

Also the first one that more or less answers the question in the titles. 

Whatever message you meant to send I interpret as trust but verify. 

Unless you want to end your marriage, don’t ask for the test

[AmICrazyOrNo]

I don’t have to ask her for a test. I can just do one and not tell her. 
 

Also, note in an earlier post I mentioned there isn’t much room between “you have no evidence” and “you’re being paranoid”