do you think I should only take paying jobs in this case from now on?

[ironpony]

I help the filmmaking community where I live in film projects since I want to be in the community and keep learning new things and I will almost always do non-paying ones.  However, I have to book time off my job, to help them make the movies, and a lot of times, they change shoot dates around and ask me to book off other times, and it turns out those work days I booked off were all for nothing, especially if I have to book off more and more workdays to compensate them.

So I wonder if I should just take paying jobs from now on, and forget about the free ones, especially since my friends tell me I am always getting the s%$t end of the stick it sounds like.  But at the same time, I want to remain in the community though, and not miss out on a lot of the more opportunities, which are non-paying ones.  What do you think, based on that dillemma of keeping to have to book days off when changes are made?

[Wiseman2]

What's wrong with volunteering, especially since you have a regular job?

[basil67]

If you're happy doing what you're doing and you're not complaining to your friends, why are they giving you their opinions?

[FMW]

4 hours ago, ironpony said:

However, I have to book time off my job, to help them make the movies

As long as taking time off from your paying job doesn't cause problems (either with your employer or for you financially), you should spend your time doing what you enjoy.  Unpaid volunteer work can be very useful for development, especially in artistic fields.

[ironpony]

6 hours ago, Wiseman2 said:

What's wrong with volunteering, especially since you have a regular job?

Oh well it's just the more days I book off that regular job to volunteer, the more money I lose if I am not doing something to get paid, on those days booked off if that makes sense.

[basil67]

9 hours ago, ironpony said:

Oh well it's just the more days I book off that regular job to volunteer, the more money I lose if I am not doing something to get paid, on those days booked off if that makes sense.

So if volunteering is causing you financial problems, stop doing it.

If volunteering is not causing you financial problems, then keep at it.  

 

 

Edited September 11, 2022 by basil67

[Foxhall]

the volunteering with the film making hopefully will pay dividends in the long term, building up all the experience you can

I would not let some mundane job with annoying bosses hold you back from your dreams,

you can find the necessary money somehow.

[S2B]

You should be paid for any work you do! That’s called valuing your time!

how do you support yourself if you mainly take unpaid jobs?

[Wiseman2]

On 9/11/2022 at 1:19 AM, ironpony said:

, I have to book time off my job, 

Volunteering is for your spare time not for time your employer expects you to be at work. Be careful not to lose your day job. You've already been reprimanded a few times there for various reasons.

[ironpony]

2 hours ago, Wiseman2 said:

Volunteering is for your spare time not for time your employer expects you to be at work. Be careful not to lose your day job. You've already been reprimanded a few times there for various reasons.

That makes sense.  well so far they are letting me have the days off, if I booked them off, so is that a good sign?

[ASG]

I work in the entertainment industry, and, apart from when I was just starting out, I wouldn't work for free. 

I DEFINITELY would not be booking time off work to work for free, regardless of how much enjoyment I get. 

I am not sure what kind of level of film community we're talking about here, I'm going to assume nothing too high level or professional, but even independent films have a bit of budget, and you should at least be getting expenses. 

And definitely should not be messed around with shoot days changing, when you've booked time off work. 

This isn't volunteering. This is not the same as helping out at a soup kitchen. 

I would say that I would help on days off, but if I had to book time off work, then I'd have to be paid something for it. 

The thing with doing things for free is that your time is less appreciated.

[ironpony]

 

16 hours ago, ASG said:

 

Oh I see, thank you for your input there.  Well I would like paying jobs, but a lot of times they are almost always booked up and don't need one, compared to non-paying projects where they seem to be looking for a lot more help.

As for helping on days off only, they almost always shoot on work days, so I have to book those days off, if I want to get any experience on set.

Edited September 13, 2022 by ironpony

[S2B]

I’d say always be at the job that pays you.

then book other projects around your paying job.

don’t work for free - they won’t value you.

and it’s a matter of respecting your own time too. 
 

[ironpony]

That makes sense, but movie productions like to shoot from 8am usually to throughout the day and I work 8-5 so the times are conflicting and thus I have to book time off whenever a movie shoot is happening.

[basil67]

@ironpony what are your own thoughts on the topic?  What others think is irrelevant to the decision.

I for one don't like the phrase "volunteering" for what you're doing.  Volunteering generally involves giving your own time for the benefit of others and this is not the case.  Instead, I see what you're doing as gaining experience in something you want to learn more about - so that's interning.   However, if you're going to intern, make sure to aim to be working places where you can learn more and improve your contacts.   If you're doing the same stuff for the same people and you're no longer learning, then it's a hobby.

You need to choose whether to continue taking time off to intern (or pursue this as a hobby), assuming your boss is OK with you taking time off.  Then, when you make a decision, own it.  Don't be asking others for their opinions because YOUR opinion is the only one that counts.

 

[ASG]

On 9/14/2022 at 12:32 AM, basil67 said:

@ironpony what are your own thoughts on the topic?  What others think is irrelevant to the decision.

I for one don't like the phrase "volunteering" for what you're doing.  Volunteering generally involves giving your own time for the benefit of others and this is not the case.  Instead, I see what you're doing as gaining experience in something you want to learn more about - so that's interning.   However, if you're going to intern, make sure to aim to be working places where you can learn more and improve your contacts.   If you're doing the same stuff for the same people and you're no longer learning, then it's a hobby.

You need to choose whether to continue taking time off to intern (or pursue this as a hobby), assuming your boss is OK with you taking time off.  Then, when you make a decision, own it.  Don't be asking others for their opinions because YOUR opinion is the only one that counts.

 

This is a really good take. 

Work experience (what we call it in the UK) should be done seldomly. Not as a main way to be involved. The aim is ALWAYS to start being paid. 

Whether you carry on doing this unpaid work or not is completely up to you, but if you REALLY want to work in the industry, you need to step up your game. Unpaid interns/work experience people are NOT viewed well in the industry, even when they rely on those people. Value your time and money and people will value you as well. 

[ironpony]

On 9/15/2022 at 4:11 AM, ASG said:

This is a really good take. 

Work experience (what we call it in the UK) should be done seldomly. Not as a main way to be involved. The aim is ALWAYS to start being paid. 

Whether you carry on doing this unpaid work or not is completely up to you, but if you REALLY want to work in the industry, you need to step up your game. Unpaid interns/work experience people are NOT viewed well in the industry, even when they rely on those people. Value your time and money and people will value you as well. 

That's a good point.  It's just I want to stay in the community, and they are not doing a lot of paid work, at least where I am.