Boyfriend wants to sleep in separate rooms

[stillafool]

41 minutes ago, MomInHer40s said:

So he started dating just to open himself up to future possibilities, and when we met he felt that he was ready for something more serious and he wanted that to be with me

This really makes no sense.  How can a married man be looking for something more serious with another woman when he's still tied to another one.  Most healthy adults separate, divorce, heal and then go on to another relationship.  You're already talking about couples therapy and putting his name on the home title.  Have you thought about what will happen if you two break up, he's still your tenant upstairs and he starts dating and bringing another woman around?  Can you handle that as his Landlady?

[stillafool]

1 hour ago, MomInHer40s said:

I told him that I fear a loss of intimacy and connection; his take on it is that once we both get used to the situation, things should naturally rebalance. And if they don't, that should be brought up in 6 months as a major issue with the sleeping arrangment. I personally find 6 months a long time. If loss of intimacy and connection occurs for a 6-month period, things might get to the point that they are unsalvagable. He seems to disagree and doesn't think 6 months is such a long time. 

You're absolutely right to feel this way.  I'm so sorry to tell you this but he is setting you up to pull away from you.  It's too obvious.

[S2B]

I’m willing to bet this was his pattern in his marriage as well.

be cautious. Do not set up anything permanent with him.

[stillafool]

1 minute ago, S2B said:

I’m willing to bet this was his pattern in his marriage as well.

Yes, or he may also still have feelings for his ex wife just as she does for him and that is why he's loss interest in sex with you.  Sex relieves tension and I would think he'd want to try that to help with his insomnia as well as his stress; but mostly to be close to you.  I don't know many men who want to put a 6 month hold on sex with a woman they desire and love.

[Tullyseptember]

Please keep keeping your children a priority.  You parent as you have been and do not change how you do things for him.

Consider him a tenant and don't entertain a relationship with him for six months!

[BaileyB]

2 hours ago, MomInHer40s said:

And also proposed we don't discuss the new sleeping arrangement until our reevaluation date.

I told him that I fear a loss of intimacy and connection; his take on it is that once we both get used to the situation, things should naturally rebalance.

I personally find 6 months a long time. If loss of intimacy and connection occurs for a 6-month period, things might get to the point that they are unsalvagable. He seems to disagree and doesn't think 6 months is such a long time. 

What do you think?

I think you you moved in too soon, there is unfinished business to take care of, you have a very anxious attachment style, and he is pulling back because of all of the above.

That said, if his plan to deal with issues that arise in your relationship is to not “not talk about it for six months,” that would be unacceptable to me. This from a woman who does sleep in the spare bedroom often because my partner can’t sleep. Problems in a relationship do not heal themselves miraculously by taking time apart and not talking about it. 

That said, you shouldn’t have to attend couples counselling with a man to discuss the lack of intimacy in a new relationship. If you do, that is a sure sign that you got BIG problems. In this case, you are trying to build a serious relationship with the a man who is still very much dealing with the fact that he is still married and coparenting with another woman. And while he enjoyed the support and distraction that you have offered, he now finds himself in not only one stressful and conflict-ridden relationship but two. Which is why he is moving out and slowing things down…

This is obviously increasing your anxiety and causing an emotional reaction, which is why I would suggest that you talk with an individual counsellor - not couples counselling.

Edited September 24, 2022 by BaileyB

[Wiseman2]

2 hours ago, MomInHer40s said:

He wanted to talk with her to solve some of their issues in person and not through lawyers. he says that despite the conflicts in their final years, it was a great relationship but that he's over it.

That is really the crux of this. He reluctantly moved in as your renter but is still on the fence about whether to end his marriage or not. This has you quite worried that he is pulling back. However he also doesn't want to belabor the point and claims he will reconsider in 6 months. The complication is you're his landlady and he needs to find somewhere else live or buy time until she takes him back.

[stillafool]

1 hour ago, Wiseman2 said:

That is really the crux of this. He reluctantly moved in as your renter but is still on the fence about whether to end his marriage or not. This has you quite worried that he is pulling back. However he also doesn't want to belabor the point and claims he will reconsider in 6 months. The complication is you're his landlady and he needs to find somewhere else live or buy time until she takes him back.

I'm sorry to say this OP but ^^^^This sounds like exactly what is happening.  And, this can cause sleepless nights.

Edited September 24, 2022 by stillafool

[Acacia98]

On 9/24/2022 at 6:29 PM, MomInHer40s said:

He proposed this morning that we try his proposed sleeping arrangment for 6 months and then reevaluate. He even proposed setting a date now for this reevaluation to happen. He wants me to give it an honest chance and be open to the possibility of it working out. And also proposed we don't discuss the new sleeping arrangement until our reevaluation date. 

It doesn't sound like either of you was being realistic about his situation when you decided to introduce your kids to each other and ultimately move in together. He is not done tying up the loose ends of his marriage. And the fact that he didn't give himself time and space to do so first suggests that he does not have the greatest relationship skills and emotional intelligence. So it shouldn't come as a surprise that he's come up with a solution to your current problem that involves avoiding the elephant in the room for 6 months. You're not making the best decisions in the world either. It was a mistake to let him move in so soon. You should have just dated him and taken the time to assess him and your relationship and figure out whether he would make a good long-term partner without the complication of your living together making it difficult to see things objectively. I think you should give him the space he's asking for. And if things don't work out, then they aren't meant to work out and you shouldn't be together. Remember, you're supposed to be assessing this relationship objectively and determining whether you're compatible. So, ideally, you should be okay with the relationship ending if it turns out you're not a good match.

On 9/24/2022 at 6:36 PM, MomInHer40s said:

He wanted to talk with her to solve some of their issues in person and not through lawyers. She's refusing to even go see a mediator, so everything will need to be settled through court. He feels that an honest conversation would be more productive. She is clearly not over him. That much is clear. I wouldn't be surprised that she secretly hopes he'll go crawling back. We've discussed it honestly, and he says that despite the conflicts in their final years, it was a great relationship but that he's over it.

You've got to appreciate the irony here. He wants so much to talk to his wife about specific issues that are bugging him, but she's refusing to do so and making him wait until the court date. And you want so much to talk to your boyfriend about specific issues that are bugging you, but he's refusing to do so and making you wait until six months have elapsed. 

Like many, I think you would benefit from counselling to help you deal with your anxiety in healthier ways. But I think it's also worth your while to take a huge step back from your present circumstances and ask yourself whether his way of dealing with problems is what you want in a long-term partner.

Edited September 26, 2022 by Acacia98

[BaileyB]

3 hours ago, Acacia98 said:

You've got to appreciate the irony here. He wants so much to talk to his wife about specific issues that are bugging him, but she's refusing to do so and making him wait until the court date. And you want so much to talk to your boyfriend about specific issues that are bugging you, but he's refusing to do so and making you wait until six months have elapsed. 

Either that, or she is getting his side of the story which may or may not be true. This to me is the equivalent of the MM/OW dynamic where the MM is the poor, besotted husband who wants to be reasonable and settle the divorce by talking but the cruel ex-wife insists that they settling things in court through their lawyers (which is a wise decision, BTW). I’m not saying that she is always reasonable, but there is a feeling of competition between the two of you - insisting that she is not over him - which is common in these kind of relationship where there are two women involved with the same man at the same time. 

Something is definitely going on with him if he chose to jump from one difficult relationship to another, very serious and very complicated relationship. The fact that he did not take any time to himself, to establish himself and his family in a new normal shows a certain codependent y that speaks, as was said above, to not the best emotional awareness. The fact that you failed to heed all the warning signs, pushing forward into this relationship to meet your own emotional needs, speaks to your own issues… Yes, you need to take some time and distance, get some counselling (individual, couples, eventually maybe family counselling), and really assess whether this is the partner/relationship for you. This is not an easy or quick fix, it will take years for things to settle here. Are you prepared for that? Because, everything you’ve shared so far says that you want things to be happy and settled now! 

[MomInHer40s]

On 9/24/2022 at 12:23 PM, stillafool said:

This really makes no sense.  How can a married man be looking for something more serious with another woman when he's still tied to another one.  Most healthy adults separate, divorce, heal and then go on to another relationship.  You're already talking about couples therapy and putting his name on the home title.  Have you thought about what will happen if you two break up, he's still your tenant upstairs and he starts dating and bringing another woman around?  Can you handle that as his Landlady?

On the topic of divorce: I know everyone feels differently about this, and there is no wrong or right answer as this is a matter of values. For me, I don't really care about mariage (and therefore divorce). I think that mariage is an antiquated social construct that doesn't really make sense in our society today anymore. I was married in the past, but that happened because my ex-husband was a student in Canada and would have had to go back to the US at the end of his studies if we didn't marry. So mariage was necessary. Of course, mariage (and divorce) is accompanied by some legal constraints. That being said, I do agree that it's important for people to take sufficient time to go through the grieving process post separation, reflect on what went wrong and what their part in it was, then rebuild a life by themselves before moving on to a new relationship. My guy definitely did all of these things and would have been divorced already when we met if the process hadn't been slowed down by their custody disagreements. 

And we did discuss before he moved in what would happen if we broke up. He would then start looking for something else, but make sure that the move out isn't at an inconvenient time of year, and delay it if necessary so that I can re-rent without issues. 

[MomInHer40s]

6 hours ago, BaileyB said:

Either that, or she is getting his side of the story which may or may not be true. This to me is the equivalent of the MM/OW dynamic where the MM is the poor, besotted husband who wants to be reasonable and settle the divorce by talking but the cruel ex-wife insists that they settling things in court through their lawyers (which is a wise decision, BTW). I’m not saying that she is always reasonable, but there is a feeling of competition between the two of you - insisting that she is not over him - which is common in these kind of relationship where there are two women involved with the same man at the same time. 

Something is definitely going on with him if he chose to jump from one difficult relationship to another, very serious and very complicated relationship. The fact that he did not take any time to himself, to establish himself and his family in a new normal shows a certain codependent y that speaks, as was said above, to not the best emotional awareness. The fact that you failed to heed all the warning signs, pushing forward into this relationship to meet your own emotional needs, speaks to your own issues… Yes, you need to take some time and distance, get some counselling (individual, couples, eventually maybe family counselling), and really assess whether this is the partner/relationship for you. This is not an easy or quick fix, it will take years for things to settle here. Are you prepared for that? Because, everything you’ve shared so far says that you want things to be happy and settled now! 

I do not feel at all threatened by the ex wife or have any worries that he wishes or will go back to her. As to whether she's cruel or not is not for me to say. She does seem quite unreasonable in regards to many things. Just this weekend his youngest was having a meltdown at drop off that she doesn't get enough time with daddy and didn't want to go back yet. The kids clearly seem to be suffering from her insistance that she doesn't want to agree to shared parenting, and her motivations to do so are very clearly financial. 

As for me, of course I have my own issues! I do have an impatient personality, and would like for things to be settled and happy. That doesn't mean that I can't accept that things aren't happening right away. I do think that he's the right partner for me, I'm just having difficulties dealing with this boundary of his. 

[glows]

As it seems he’s made up his mind about the sleeping arrangement I’d be respectful of that and mindful he needs more sleep. If he is pulling away at all while there may be pain have the strength or confidence to get through it should this not work out. 

I do understand you’re upset and boy do I empathize with you on sleeping arrangements with a spouse/partner. It sure takes getting used to and change can be upsetting and disruptive. Coming from the other side I also empathize with your partner as my partner at one point did not respect my need for better sleep and fought tooth and nail to be in the same bed. It shot itself in the foot. We divorced among other issues. I’m sorry you’re going through this and feeling unsure. I’d approach this with a wait and see. Six months is not long in the grand scheme. It does help when you do trust your partner. If you can’t trust this man it’s already as good as over. 

Edited September 26, 2022 by glows

[MomInHer40s]

10 hours ago, Acacia98 said:

It doesn't sound like either of you was being realistic about his situation when you decided to introduce your kids to each other and ultimately move in together. He is not done tying up the loose ends of his marriage. And the fact that he didn't give himself time and space to do so first suggests that he does not have the greatest relationship skills and emotional intelligence. So it shouldn't come as a surprise that he's come up with a solution to your current problem that involves avoiding the elephant in the room for 6 months. You're not making the best decisions in the world either. It was a mistake to let him move in so soon. You should have just dated him and taken the time to assess him and your relationship and figure out whether he would make a good long-term partner without the complication of your living together making it difficult to see things objectively. I think you should give him the space he's asking for. And if things don't work out, then they aren't meant to work out and you shouldn't be together. Remember, you're supposed to be assessing this relationship objectively and determining whether you're compatible. So, ideally, you should be okay with the relationship ending if it turns out you're not a good match.

What makes you think that he didn't give himself time and space after his mariage ended? He was living alone and rebuilding his life for over a year, and decided that we wasn't ready right away for the next long term relationship. That is more time than most men I went on dates with! He also started therapy shortly after his separation and is still seeing a therapist as a follow-up once a month. So, not to say that he'd get an A+ on emotional intelligence (I don't think that more than 1% of people would get that), but he's made more of an effort than most separated men I think. My ex husband certainly never gone through that trouble! 

As for kids, we waited over a year before introducing the kids. I really don't think that was too fast. As for moving in, we don't really live together. If there hadn't been the option of two apartments I wouldn't have agreed to it. 

And yes, I agree that if at some point we come to the conclusion that we're not a good match, I will be okay with the relationship ending. I've learned my lesson trying to hold on to a relationship (with my ex husband) that hadn't been working for year frankly because of fear: fear of being a single mom, fear of never meeting anyone again, fear of financial consequences, fear of how this will impact my kids. I have learned that the hard way, and have acted on it since my separation. I have been in a few shorter term relationships since my separation: one one-year relationship, a few ranging between 2 and 5 months. All of these were not a good match and I ended things when I realized that. 

[MomInHer40s]

9 minutes ago, glows said:

As it seems he’s made up his mind about the sleeping arrangement I’d be respectful of that and mindful he needs more sleep. If he is pulling away at all while there may be pain have the strength or confidence to get through it should this not work out. 

I do understand you’re upset and boy do I empathize with you on sleeping arrangements with a spouse/partner. It sure takes getting used to and change can be upsetting and disruptive. Coming from the other side I also empathize with your partner as my partner at one point did not respect my need for better sleep and fought tooth and nail to be in the same bed. It shot itself in the foot. We divorced among other issues. I’m sorry you’re going through this and feeling unsure. I’d approach this with a wait and see. Six months is not long in the grand scheme. It does help when you do trust your partner. If you can’t trust this man it’s already as good as over. 

We actually had a long conversation about this yesterday evening. He said "if I'm going to loose you in the process of trying to get better sleep, the sleep is not worth it". And he was mentioning that once his custody battle is over, and the kids have spent enough time together that they feel like family, that we convert the house back into a townhouse, and only have one bedroom. He acknowledged my kids' need for proximity which hids kids, although similar ages, don't have. And said that they could have bedrooms on the same floor as ours, and his kids could sleep on another floor. I don't think this would happen before at least another year, which would mean this sleeping arrangment will have to last that long. 

If I have to choose between this arrangment or ending the relationship, I'll obviously choose this arrangment. I just really miss the connection and am having difficulties accepting it. 

[glows]

1 minute ago, MomInHer40s said:

We actually had a long conversation about this yesterday evening. He said "if I'm going to loose you in the process of trying to get better sleep, the sleep is not worth it". And he was mentioning that once his custody battle is over, and the kids have spent enough time together that they feel like family, that we convert the house back into a townhouse, and only have one bedroom. He acknowledged my kids' need for proximity which hids kids, although similar ages, don't have. And said that they could have bedrooms on the same floor as ours, and his kids could sleep on another floor. I don't think this would happen before at least another year, which would mean this sleeping arrangment will have to last that long. 

If I have to choose between this arrangment or ending the relationship, I'll obviously choose this arrangment. I just really miss the connection and am having difficulties accepting it. 

That’s understandable and feeling for you here. The part about “if I'm going to loose you in the process of trying to get better sleep, the sleep is not worth it” sounds like he’s conflicted as well but let’s be honest here. Long term sleep deprivation changes people, a form of torture, even with the best of intentions. Things seem unsettled now but give it more of a chance to unfold without forcing that closeness if now isn’t the right time. I do hugely empathize with this. It wasn’t easy getting used to sleeping with someone, it wasn’t easy separating and sleeping alone again but it can be done. Give him the benefit of the doubt. You both have come this far. 

I also empathize with your frustration as well that he made this decision without discussion. I’d personally take that as a warning or caution that he may be at the end of his rope where it concerns uninterrupted sleep. He didn’t feel he needed to discuss it at length at the time because the need is exactly that - a need and not a want. Something needed out of pure necessity.

[MomInHer40s]

On 9/24/2022 at 11:46 AM, Ami1uwant said:

Why do  you think she’s not over him? She’s hoping he comes back?  

have you talked about why/ reason for this divorce.

 

have you ever talked about parenting style and your differences?

She has pretty much said that he's welcome to come back if he wants this custody nightmare to go away. She seems partly motivated by financial reasons and partly trying to make his life as hellish as possible so that he'll crack and go back to her. That's my impression based on their communications (he shows me all the messages that she sends him - I never asked him to do that. That was his idea. He wants to be completely transparent with me he said).

We have talked about their reason for divorce. They met when they were 17, and over time realized that they had very different values and those differences caused a lot of tension in their marriage. There were a series of incidents that made him decide to leave, and as he moved out she was so upset that she refused to give him access to the kids. He had to get an emergency court order to get some access back. It was very messy.

And yes, we talked about different parenting style. We agree that my parenting style makes for happier kids but more rambunctious ones which can definitely be a pain in the ass and get them in trouble. His kids, in return, are very well-behaved but don't quite have that spark that mine do. He acknowledges that. 

[MomInHer40s]

4 minutes ago, glows said:

That’s understandable and feeling for you here. The part about “if I'm going to loose you in the process of trying to get better sleep, the sleep is not worth it” sounds like he’s conflicted as well but let’s be honest here. Long term sleep deprivation changes people, a form of torture, even with the best of intentions. Things seem unsettled now but give it more of a chance to unfold without forcing that closeness if now isn’t the right time. I do hugely empathize with this. It wasn’t easy getting used to sleeping with someone, it wasn’t easy separating and sleeping alone again but it can be done. Give him the benefit of the doubt. You both have come this far. 

I also empathize with your frustration as well that he made this decision without discussion. I’d personally take that as a warning or caution that he may be at the end of his rope where it concerns uninterrupted sleep. He didn’t feel he needed to discuss it at length at the time because the need is exactly that - a need and not a want. Something needed out of pure necessity.

Thanks for this comment. I see your point of him having a need not a want. He has been under a lot of pressure lately between his court date approaching and work piling up. It causes him a lot of anxiety and he's been sleeping poorly, waking up at 4 am every night. Often he'll get some work done at 4 am, then goes back to bed at 6 and sleeps till 9. I feel for his exhaustion! If only he had communicated things in that manner though. I really felt very hurt by the way he made a unilateral decision that affects both of us without consulting with me or brainstorming with me. 

[Will am I]

It sounds like you both want this relationship and just have some problems communicating your respective needs. If you keep the conversation open, you will be fine.

[Ami1uwant]

1 hour ago, MomInHer40s said:

What makes you think that he didn't give himself time and space after his mariage ended? He was living alone and rebuilding his life for over a year, and decided that we wasn't ready right away for the next long term relationship. That is more time than most men I went on dates with! He also started therapy shortly after his separation and is still seeing a therapist as a follow-up once a month. So, not to say that he'd get an A+ on emotional intelligence (I don't think that more than 1% of people would get that), but he's made more of an effort than most separated men I think. My ex husband certainly never gone through that trouble! 

As for kids, we waited over a year before introducing the kids. I really don't think that was too fast. As for moving in, we don't really live together. If there hadn't been the option of two apartments I wouldn't have agreed to it. 

And yes, I agree that if at some point we come to the conclusion that we're not a good match, I will be okay with the relationship ending. I've learned my lesson trying to hold on to a relationship (with my ex husband) that hadn't been working for year frankly because of fear: fear of being a single mom, fear of never meeting anyone again, fear of financial consequences, fear of how this will impact my kids. I have learned that the hard way, and have acted on it since my separation. I have been in a few shorter term relationships since my separation: one one-year relationship, a few ranging between 2 and 5 months. All of these were not a good match and I ended things when I realized that. 

What is the therapy about?  He said he decided to leave her?

[Wiseman2]

1 hour ago, MomInHer40s said:

And we did discuss before he moved in what would happen if we broke up. He would then start looking for something else

Unfortunately he seems to be slowly easing toward that by not sleeping over. He seems like the type to tiptoe out of relationships slowly, just like he is still married and claims it was drawn out due to custody issues. He is distancing himself and at some level you know this. That is why you're upset, anxious and can't sleep.

[stillafool]

2 hours ago, MomInHer40s said:

Quote

On the topic of divorce: I know everyone feels differently about this, and there is no wrong or right answer as this is a matter of values. For me, I don't really care about mariage (and therefore divorce). I think that mariage is an antiquated social construct that doesn't really make sense in our society today anymore. I was married in the past, but that happened because my ex-husband was a student in Canada and would have had to go back to the US at the end of his studies if we didn't marry. So mariage was necessary. Of course, mariage (and divorce) is accompanied by some legal constraints. That being said, I do agree that it's important for people to take sufficient time to go through the grieving process post separation, reflect on what went wrong and what their part in it was, then rebuild a life by themselves before moving on to a new relationship.

My point was he is legally tied to another woman and hasn't even divorced and got custody of his children in place, yet you're talking about putting his name on your home title.  This has to do with legalities not whether either of you values marriage.  There is an adjustment period for him as well as his kids when/if it gets done.

Quote

My guy definitely did all of these things and would have been divorced already when we met if the process hadn't been slowed down by their custody disagreements. 

This too makes no sense because what court keeps a good father away from his kids?  Also if she wanted him back why keep the kids from him and constantly fight with him?  She would be using other methods to get him back because constantly making him angry isn't going to make him want to go back.

Quote

And we did discuss before he moved in what would happen if we broke up. He would then start looking for something else, but make sure that the move out isn't at an inconvenient time of year, and delay it if necessary so that I can re-rent without issues. 

So are you saying if you break up and he meets another woman he wants to date, even though he is paying you rent he has agreed to move out of his upstairs apartment before bring her there?

 

[stillafool]

2 hours ago, MomInHer40s said:

He said "if I'm going to loose you in the process of trying to get better sleep, the sleep is not worth it".

So does this mean he's not going to make you wait 6 months anymore?

[glows]

3 hours ago, MomInHer40s said:

Thanks for this comment. I see your point of him having a need not a want. He has been under a lot of pressure lately between his court date approaching and work piling up. It causes him a lot of anxiety and he's been sleeping poorly, waking up at 4 am every night. Often he'll get some work done at 4 am, then goes back to bed at 6 and sleeps till 9. I feel for his exhaustion! If only he had communicated things in that manner though. I really felt very hurt by the way he made a unilateral decision that affects both of us without consulting with me or brainstorming with me. 

You both can interpret this in a number of ways. You have a relationship with someone who more or less lives with you under the same roof. He isn’t breaking up with you. He is suggesting a change in sleeping arrangements. Will you ever be comfortable at all with anything having to do with him? There seem to be constant issues and one after another in a seemingly continuous uphill battle. Him pulling away, you pushing him away. It all appears the same to me. Neither of you are understanding each other/not compatible or this isn’t the right time to pursue a relationship. 

Why live in constant disappointment and feeling upset? At some point make this less about him and the crappy way he made that unilateral decision. Decide whether any of this is worth the hassle at all.

[MomInHer40s]

17 hours ago, Ami1uwant said:

What is the therapy about?  He said he decided to leave her?

They had a very toxic relationship and there was a lot of harm done (from both sides). He wanted to do therapy to reflect back on his mariage, to better understand what happened and how to avoid this going forward.