Compatibility.

[basil67]

I think I've worked out why you're getting confused between compatibility and attraction.  I think you've objectified pretty women to the point where they are nothing more than their appearance.  You're simply not seeing the personality behind the appearance and so you judge them by the stereotype of how they look and how they appear in a social situation.  

You've previously said that these high flying, beautiful women only value fancy cars, money and prestige but not who a man is inside (paraphrasing).  Yes, while it is true that some high flyers do live this lifestyle (while other high flyers are regular people who you'd hang with at the pub), how do you know that these women value nothing other than what money can buy?   

[ZA Dater]

13 hours ago, basil67 said:

@ZA Dater you've got this whole thread asking about compatibility.  We've all taken the time to explain that compatibility is gauged as a couple gets to know each other better.   But you're still arguing that compatibility can be based on a person's looks.   Do you think we're all wrong, or do you not understand how compatibility works?

When it comes to a beautiful woman, unless you have a full understanding of who she is, what she enjoys doing and the inner workings of her mind, you have NO IDEA who she'd be compatible with.  For all you know, she could be a completely insecure pain in the arse who most guys would dump when they get to know her. Or she may be an introvert who drags herself to parties but craves an evening with Netflix and a hot chocolate.   She may be a kindergarten teacher who all the little kids adore because she's very kind.  She may be an academic.  Or she may moonlight at a sex worker.   This business of judging a person based on nothing more than how they present at an event is beyond shallow.

As an aside, now that you've given a better description of these events you attend, they sound like they are curated... and as such they do not reflect how average humans operate in a social setting.  What is your experience of going to, say, the 40th birthday party of a regular friend (not someone from this manufactured environment)?

Exactly the same as described.

I'll admit I am wrong about compatibility.  My entire view point on this is based on experience and the terrible ones I have had where I simply get treated like a second class citizen, you know how difficult it is for someone with no confidence to try and have a cold conversation and then get looked down at and dismissed in a rude way. If this happened to you over and over and over again you may feel the same way I do and rather not bother. I am awkward, I try hide it but its never really possible to hide it completely, its a major disadvantage and probably one of the reasons why I do am not compatible with many.

For me and yes its wrong I do not believe I have any chance with anyone attractive in a setting where choices abound, thus am socially incompatible if that makes sense.

[ZA Dater]

17 hours ago, BaileyB said:

You can not look at a person and know whether you will/will not be compatible with that person. 

I can if my lifestyle is fundamentally different to theirs.  I don not enjoy trance parties so it would be completely pointless to date someone who does, that is one example with springs to mind.

Edited December 20, 2022 by ZA Dater

[ZA Dater]

16 hours ago, NuevoYorko said:

Ugh. The above was cringeworthy to read.  Why do you have such an ugly opinion of this woman simply because she has a nice body?   

In any case, you have no idea who she is as a person, you just attributed a boatload of bad qualities to her because she has a great build.  Of course you will never find out whether you'd be compatible with her or pretty much anyone else, since you have applied massive judgements on everyone around you without bothering to interact with them or understand who they are beyond what everyone can see.

Are you aware that you function on a profoundly superficial level where other people are concerned?   You tend to put them all down because you think THEY (women) are all superficial and only attracted to "expensive lunches, fast cars and glitzy events" and / or (for men) stellar beauty.

That's you projecting.  Sure there are plenty  other people as superficial as you are, or close - but it's not the norm.  

Ok, I am not compatible with most because I am fundamentally not a social person, there you go, that should explain most of the above. I have tried to make conversation with attractive people, heck I tried to make them laugh, some happy go lucky guy arrives and well I am never going to win the intelligence over fun factor, she wants to laugh and have fun, I am not fun and I am not funny. Why would I possibly be compatible? 

Massive judgements are applied to me and this has always been pretty obvious, "do you want a drink" "no thanks I am cycling tomorrow morning I I would prefer to stick to water", massive judgement already passed on me. In the society I live in drinking is seen as being social.

You are right I do operate on a superficial level, I own that but so does an app like Tinder, Bumble, you name it they all operate on superficial and nothing else. You can write whatever profile it does not matter, you cannot pretend people are not fundamentally superficial. I always believed this to not be the case until I started with dating app, 15 years later I stand firm in this assertion. Heck go and catfish and see how people respond, that alone tells me a great deal about people. 

Sorry but when I go to a party and there are beautiful ladies I know they are not going to be interested in me so why bother trying. You were the one told me to own all this and I do each day, for that I am thankful as odd as it may sound.

 

[NuevoYorko]

2 hours ago, ZA Dater said:

Ok, I am not compatible with most because I am fundamentally not a social person, there you go, that should explain most of the above. 

 

Again, you are making a far reaching value judgement on an observation you've made in one moment in time. Someone is at a party. YOU'RE at the freaking party.  Do you think people are determining that they'd be incompatible with you because you are at the party ... that they're at as well?   Probably not.  Again, your superficiality is outstanding.  The ironic part is how bitter you are due to your projection of this extreme superficiality of yours onto everyone you meet.  It's a dead end.

I'm tired of this circular and frankly ridiculous argument about "compatibility."  You are stuck in your ways and you are only here to get people to commiserate with you, not to actually explore anything or, heaven forbid, learn something that might improve aspects of your life.  

[SoulCat]

2 hours ago, ZA Dater said:

I can if my lifestyle is fundamentally different to theirs.  I don not enjoy trance parties so it would be completely pointless to date someone who does, that is one example with springs to mind.

And that's a rubbish example to counter the point that @BaileyB was trying to make. And it shows that you're either not really taking in anyone's advice, or you're still not understanding the concepts. Or you are being deliberately obtuse.

The point is, you would not know - just by looking at someone - if they were into trans parties or ska concerts, chamber music or entire military tattoo parades. 

And unless that trans party lovin' person is knee deep into the scene, you could very well date them if aside from that, you were otherwise compatible. 

I'm dating a guy who loves amateur boxing. Now, I don't really get the appeal of two people beating lumps out of eachother for fun, so I generally leave him to enjoy that part of his life with people who do share that interest.

Also, it's almost 2023; are trans parties still really a regular thing?

 

[BaileyB]

6 minutes ago, NuevoYorko said:

Again, you are making a far reaching value judgement on an observation you've made in one moment in time. Someone is at a party. YOU'RE at the freaking party. 

I’m sorry, but this literally made me laugh out loud. 

7 minutes ago, NuevoYorko said:

I'm tired of this circular and frankly ridiculous argument

Agree. I’m tired of discussing the same debunked arguments about why you will never be able to find a woman to date… The fact is, you found a woman to date and you would think that would have changed your perspective in some way… but when you return to the same old talking points, it’s clear where you stand. 

[Lotsgoingon]

Actually one of the sweet joys of life is letting myself be surprised by how much I can connect with someone who has a quality that I assumed was a deal breaker. 

Happens all the time with colleagues and friends and young people at my job and dating prospects. I assume that one quality they have means I won't like them--or the opposite. I might assume one great quality they have means I will deeply like them. Not the case at all--either way. 

You got to be willing to allow the world to surprise you in good ways. By the way, the person in trance dancing, really you don't know how important that is to the person. Might be something they do a lot but they don't require a love partner to have that interest. Might be they're in the midst of shifting interests. 

 

 

 

[basil67]

9 hours ago, ZA Dater said:

Exactly the same as described.

I'll admit I am wrong about compatibility.  My entire view point on this is based on experience and the terrible ones I have had where I simply get treated like a second class citizen, you know how difficult it is for someone with no confidence to try and have a cold conversation and then get looked down at and dismissed in a rude way. If this happened to you over and over and over again you may feel the same way I do and rather not bother. I am awkward, I try hide it but its never really possible to hide it completely, its a major disadvantage and probably one of the reasons why I do am not compatible with many.

For me and yes its wrong I do not believe I have any chance with anyone attractive in a setting where choices abound, thus am socially incompatible if that makes sense.

The topic was that you objectify beautiful women and this is why you're getting confused about compatibility.   

There are many shy people around or those who don't have the gift of the gab.  There is no reason why you couldn't be compatible with them.  Or do you not bother with anyone who's not beautiful?

9 hours ago, ZA Dater said:

I can if my lifestyle is fundamentally different to theirs.  I don not enjoy trance parties so it would be completely pointless to date someone who does, that is one example with springs to mind.

This is ludicrous.  From the start, I knew that my husband loves sports.  Playing, watching, discussing....but I don't enjoy it at all.  And I love domestic arts and he's not into that.   And despite not being into domestic arts, he just helped me create a sewing room and built a cutting table for me.   These differences have made not one jot of difference to us.  

If you're ruling out all potential dates due to one incompatibility, then it's your own fault that you find nobody.

8 hours ago, ZA Dater said:

Ok, I am not compatible with most because I am fundamentally not a social person, there you go, that should explain most of the above. I have tried to make conversation with attractive people

What the heck?   Why focus on talking to "attractive people"?  There are all kinds at an event but you seem to only have interest in the beautiful ones.  

8 hours ago, ZA Dater said:

Massive judgements are applied to me and this has always been pretty obvious, "do you want a drink" "no thanks I am cycling tomorrow morning I I would prefer to stick to water", massive judgement already passed on me. In the society I live in drinking is seen as being social.

You're imagining this.  If someone said to me that they aren't drinking because they are cycling tomorrow morning, it would open up a whole discussion topic....particularly as I know nothing about cycling.   Do you train with a group?  How far do you ride? How often?  Tell me about your bike?  Did you watch Tour de France?  

The only weird part is your oddly formal way of declining a drink.  "Thanks, but I have to cycle tomorrow" is more than sufficient.  

8 hours ago, ZA Dater said:

You are right I do operate on a superficial level, I own that but so does an app like Tinder, Bumble, you name it they all operate on superficial and nothing else. You can write whatever profile it does not matter, you cannot pretend people are not fundamentally superficial. I always believed this to not be the case until I started with dating app, 15 years later I stand firm in this assertion. 

I agree that Tinder, Bumble etc all operate on a superficial level.  Which is why, if I was single, I'd prefer to meet guys in a social setting.  Either through friends or a singles group.  And I do believe that not everyone is fundamentally superficial.  You're just using this as an excuse for your own superficiality.  

8 hours ago, ZA Dater said:

Sorry but when I go to a party and there are beautiful ladies I know they are not going to be interested in me so why bother trying. 

Why would they be interested when you objectify them as you do?  

[NuevoYorko]

3 hours ago, basil67 said:

  Why would they be interested when you objectify them as you do?  

And why would OP be interested in the beautiful ladies when he already "knows" that all they want to do is "slurp down expensive meals" and ride around in fast cars???  Sounds pretty gross to hang around with beautiful ladies.  

[ZA Dater]

12 hours ago, basil67 said:

The topic was that you objectify beautiful women and this is why you're getting confused about compatibility.   

There are many shy people around or those who don't have the gift of the gab.  There is no reason why you couldn't be compatible with them.  Or do you not bother with anyone who's not beautiful?

This is ludicrous.  From the start, I knew that my husband loves sports.  Playing, watching, discussing....but I don't enjoy it at all.  And I love domestic arts and he's not into that.   And despite not being into domestic arts, he just helped me create a sewing room and built a cutting table for me.   These differences have made not one jot of difference to us.  

What the heck?   Why focus on talking to "attractive people"?  There are all kinds at an event but you seem to only have interest in the beautiful ones.  

I agree that Tinder, Bumble etc all operate on a superficial level.  Which is why, if I was single, I'd prefer to meet guys in a social setting.  Either through friends or a singles group.  And I do believe that not everyone is fundamentally superficial.  You're just using this as an excuse for your own superficiality.  

Why would they be interested when you objectify them as you do?  

I think having some mutual interests and outlooks can help with compatibility but maybe I am wrong about that. Must be truthful and say I do not really bother with people I do not find attractive again this is how OLD works. I am not going to swipe right on people I do not find attractive and at a social setting I do not blame people for not talking to me, why would they if they would not swipe right.  Yes, sure I think a social setting is different but in my view the fundamentals still remain the same, people do not in my opinion anyway gravitate toward people they do not find attractive on some level in the dating sense.

Put it like this, I can sit and have a conversation with most people, doing does not mean either I or them find anything attractive, even if fundamentally a lot of these conversations are very awkward for a multitude of reasons.

Do you think its possible for a person to make themselves more universally compatible? 

I still largely see a lot of dating is being some sort of inherent competition, then again almost all the people I know can pretty much date the people they find attractive and none really want for attention, none are particularly interested in long term relationships either. Maybe compatibility for a FWB is different to someone you intend to spend the rest of your life with?

I'll relax my rigid point of view and say I think how successful or not one is at dating is purely subjective, there are people here who seem to live happy lives with their partners and are loved and that means they are compatible with those people and happy. For me I do not consider myself successful at dating at all, there are no days where I sit and think I did really well and after being summarily dumped most days I just feel totally useless and inept. A few years ago there was a very attractive lady who was interested in me but I could see our beliefs and lifestyle would not be compatible but I felt good about the conversation and the fact she showed some interest.

 

[ZA Dater]

9 hours ago, NuevoYorko said:

And why would OP be interested in the beautiful ladies when he already "knows" that all they want to do is "slurp down expensive meals" and ride around in fast cars???  Sounds pretty gross to hang around with beautiful ladies.  

Because its feels quite good to walk around with someone beautiful and its equally nice if you can have an engaging conversation with them. That attention does feel good and in my case is a massive confidence booster, in fact its one of only two ways which I can boost my confidence. 

I'd sacrifice all the physical parts of a relationship to have someone like that in my life. For obvious reason such an idea would never work for a whole multitude of reasons.

[BrinnM]

1 hour ago, ZA Dater said:

sacrifice all the physical parts of a relationship to have someone like that in my life

Just for clarification, as I’m not sure I’m understanding this correctly: Would you actually officially date somebody who you find beautiful & accept a no-sex relationship, just for the sake of having somebody you find beautiful? Would you then have sex with somebody else, and the beautiful girlfriend would have sex with somebody else as well? 
It’s quite rare for a man to have a relationship without expecting physical intimacy. Hence my question. Thanks!

[ZA Dater]

54 minutes ago, BrinnM said:

Just for clarification, as I’m not sure I’m understanding this correctly: Would you actually officially date somebody who you find beautiful & accept a no-sex relationship, just for the sake of having somebody you find beautiful? Would you then have sex with somebody else, and the beautiful girlfriend would have sex with somebody else as well? 
It’s quite rare for a man to have a relationship without expecting physical intimacy. Hence my question. Thanks!

This is exactly my point, it's impractical and frankly impossible. I have always found people who have all the attributes I like but to be honest I will never appeal to those people. I have learnt this year that I am useless at relationships so yea the company of someone really nice would be the best I could really hope to accomplish.

No confidence and poor compatibility is a poor combination.

Its about needs versus wants.

[Weezy1973]

3 hours ago, ZA Dater said:

Because its feels quite good to walk around with someone beautiful and its equally nice if you can have an engaging conversation with them.

Pretty sure you can get this by paying for it. Just companionship without sex? And not really care if the two of you get along or will develop a real relationship? Sure that’s something you can buy. 
 

It’s clear that you still really don’t understand compatibility. You’re mistaking it for attractiveness. While you can work to make yourself more universally attractive (within certain limits), not only can’t you become more universally compatible - it’s pretty much the opposite of what you want to do if you want a meaningful relationship (and a meaningful life). You want to get to a point where you really don’t care what others think of you and you can just openly be yourself. Not shy away in the corner. Actually talk to people and not worry about whether or not they’ll like you. That’s the core of confidence. 

[BrinnM]

Yes, agree with @Weezy1973 - you could pay for an escort. That’s one option. That way, you can select certain physical attributes (which seems to be one of the most important things for you), and get some sex thrown in as well on occasion, if that’s what you want.

Generally speaking, you seem to be a decent looking guy, healthy, sporty & fit, and halfway successful in your career with a secure/decent income. You’re already ahead of many guys, believe it or not. Sure there will be richer ones, and there will be more handsome ones, but trust me, you’re probably good in that department.

No need to hide in a corner. If you’re shy, practice in uncomfortable situations. Confidence can be practiced. But there are also those people who deep down inside really don’t want a relationship, for whatever reason, and they’re not even aware of it, so they try every excuse in the book to stay away from relationships and complain about things that can’t be changed. I think this might be you. 

 

[NuevoYorko]

4 hours ago, ZA Dater said:

Because its feels quite good to walk around with someone beautiful and its equally nice if you can have an engaging conversation with them. That attention does feel good and in my case is a massive confidence booster, in fact its one of only two ways which I can boost my confidence. 

I'd sacrifice all the physical parts of a relationship to have someone like that in my life. For obvious reason such an idea would never work for a whole multitude of reasons.

In order to have have "arm candy" that looks beautiful, you would not only forego any type of physical affection / sex, but also be fine with her narrow focus on slurping expensive meals and fast cars?

To boost your self confidence?

Real self confidence comes from something within us that we feel good about - not accessories and status symbols.

This is an extremely succinct example of your pure objectification of women. 

Nobody exists on this earth in order to boost someone's confidence.  Why would someone  choose a relationship where this was their only role?  What's in it for them?

Just pay somebody by the hour.   Escorts and women who work in clubs are generally very socially adept and good looking.

 

Edited December 21, 2022 by NuevoYorko

[PotatoHead]

To second what others have said, you cannot only focus on women who you immediately find physically attractive.  This will rule out a majority of those who you might actually have high compatibility with.  This is why I believe OLD to be setting yourself up for failure, especially when taking this approach.  Been there, done that.

The woman I am with for going on 3 years and plan to spend the rest of my life with, I was not attracted to at first.  We did meet in an online setting, I was intrigued by her because of her wit and charm.  Then the more we talked, the more the attraction grew over a course of months.  We found out how highly compatible we were.  When we finally got together in person the chemistry continued to grow.  Nobody is perfect but now when I look at her I am fully attracted and in love with every fiber of her being, we accept each others flaws as part of who we are.

You have to give more women a chance and base it on compatibility of personalities, interests, character, etc.  and not physical traits if you want to find true happiness.

[Alpacalia]

I am curious to know how you manage to remain enthusiastic about talking about the same thing over and over again without getting tired of it.

[ZA Dater]

19 minutes ago, NuevoYorko said:

Real self confidence comes from something within us that we feel good about 

Just pay somebody by the hour.   Escorts and women who work in clubs are generally very socially adept and good looking.

 

Not prepared to go down that road again, been there done that it does not work at all, it's simply contrived.

Never said my idea was practical I am saying I was generally better off in the friend zone with people I liked but apparently I am no good at that either.

Feel good about, frankly I cannot think of one thing about me to feel good about.

I have sat in many places observed many social interactions and it's always amazing how good some guys are, you can see they click immediately, engage and get positive results from that. I try engage and 99.9% get the cold shoulder. My fault.

[ZA Dater]

1 hour ago, Weezy1973 said:

Pretty sure you can get this by paying for it. Just companionship without sex? And not really care if the two of you get along or will develop a real relationship? Sure that’s something you can buy. 
 

It’s clear that you still really don’t understand compatibility. You’re mistaking it for attractiveness. While you can work to make yourself more universally attractive (within certain limits), not only can’t you become more universally compatible - it’s pretty much the opposite of what you want to do if you want a meaningful relationship (and a meaningful life). You want to get to a point where you really don’t care what others think of you and you can just openly be yourself. Not shy away in the corner. Actually talk to people and not worry about whether or not they’ll like you. That’s the core of confidence. 

I walked around for years being myself, wearing clothes I liked, wearing my hair as I liked and I was ok with that. 

Just never helped me at all so had to try reinvent as something else.

For me confidence is a by product of a feeling of being successful. No success means no confidence.

[ZA Dater]

26 minutes ago, PotatoHead said:

To second what others have said, you cannot only focus on women who you immediately find physically attractive.  This will rule out a majority of those who you might actually have high compatibility with.  This is why I believe OLD to be setting yourself up for failure, especially when taking this approach.  Been there, done that.

The woman I am with for going on 3 years and plan to spend the rest of my life with, I was not attracted to at first.  We did meet in an online setting, I was intrigued by her because of her wit and charm.  Then the more we talked, the more the attraction grew over a course of months.  We found out how highly compatible we were.  When we finally got together in person the chemistry continued to grow.  Nobody is perfect but now when I look at her I am fully attracted and in love with every fiber of her being, we accept each others flaws as part of who we are.

You have to give more women a chance and base it on compatibility of personalities, interests, character, etc.  and not physical traits if you want to find true happiness.

Firstly well done on finding mutual love. Huge respect for people who do find this.

I suppose my problem is simply I am not prepared to grant leeway that I am not granted. Why is the same not granted to me on OLD, many times I have gone on dates with people I did not find attractive, sadly after spending time I never found them anymore attractive than when I saw their pic.

I'll spend this festive season alone reading about the best ways to give up on ever finding someone.

[ZA Dater]

1 hour ago, BrinnM said:

Yes, agree with @Weezy1973 - you could pay for an escort. That’s one option. That way, you can select certain physical attributes (which seems to be one of the most important things for you), and get some sex thrown in as well on occasion, if that’s what you want.

Generally speaking, you seem to be a decent looking guy, healthy, sporty & fit, and halfway successful in your career with a secure/decent income. You’re already ahead of many guys, believe it or not. Sure there will be richer ones, and there will be more handsome ones, but trust me, you’re probably good in that department.

No need to hide in a corner. If you’re shy, practice in uncomfortable situations. Confidence can be practiced. But there are also those people who deep down inside really don’t want a relationship, for whatever reason, and they’re not even aware of it, so they try every excuse in the book to stay away from relationships and complain about things that can’t be changed. I think this might be you. 

 

That commercial idea does not appeal to me. At all 

I can happily stand up and give impromptu speeches to 70 people, no issues with that so my confidence in certain things is not bad. 

It's just frustrating that every single time I find someone I like it's rejection so I have spent 25 years observing why I get rejected and why other's are more successful.This is where compatibility queries come from.

For years I went to clubs to try fit in, I never did. Even house parties birthday parties never worked always the outsider. With that in mind I started reading about compatibility and thought maybe how I speak makes me incompatible or my interests. 

 

[PotatoHead]

36 minutes ago, ZA Dater said:

Firstly well done on finding mutual love. Huge respect for people who do find this.

I suppose my problem is simply I am not prepared to grant leeway that I am not granted. Why is the same not granted to me on OLD, many times I have gone on dates with people I did not find attractive, sadly after spending time I never found them anymore attractive than when I saw their pic.

I'll spend this festive season alone reading about the best ways to give up on ever finding someone.

Maybe the problem is that you are spending too much time and energy focusing on finding someone to complete your life.  Instead you should be focusing time and energy on building the life that you want for yourself, becoming the person that you want to be.  Whether that be investing time in hobbies, or working on those characteristics that you see in others and wish you could have yourself.  Learn to love yourself for who you are.  Counseling could be helpful in that aspect.

It is my opinion that you cannot truly love someone else until you love yourself.  You are not ready for a relationship or to find love.  And when you are, it will come to you.

[Weezy1973]

14 hours ago, ZA Dater said:

I walked around for years being myself, wearing clothes I liked, wearing my hair as I liked and I was ok with that. 

Seriously go back and read my post this response is to. It was literally about how while you can adjust the way you look to be more attractive, you can’t and shouldn’t change yourself to be more compatible with someone. Clothes and hair have absolutely nothing to do with compatibility.

 

14 hours ago, ZA Dater said:

For me confidence is a by product of a feeling of being successful. No success means no confidence.

 You just were in a relationship with a woman you found attractive. That was something you swore could never happen, but then it did. You were wrong. And you found some success. You insist on framing everything negatively. Acknowledging that yes indeed you did successfully date someone attractive and therefore it can happen again would be helpful self talk. If you actually want help that is.