Why do I feel this way when I already have the perfect BF?

[mark clemson]

I disagree that you've hurt your BF in anything but the most abstract and tangential way.

If someone takes a walk alone, did they hurt their partner? If they talk to a friend on that walk, did they hurt their partner?

If they go crazy and build a bomb intended to kill their partner, but they never actually set it off and the partner never sees it/finds out about it, did they HURT their partner?

I would say no. Maybe they tried to, but they didn't.

What WILL hurt your partner will be finding out about this (if he does) and/or you leaving him (if you do that). Those things will actually be hurting him.

One could complain that what you're doing may lead you to leave him, but in reality if you leave him without the involvement of a new partner he'll almost certainly be very hurt anyhow. But people decide to leave their partners, and don't tell them/lie by omission about it ALL the time.

Some people may have a huge problem with what you're doing. But in reality it's not very different from what anyone doing something their partner wouldn't like (such as exploring a new religion if your partner "forbids" it) or what someone detaching from their partner does. You just have a third person involved.

That isn't advice to continue your "friendship"/emotional cheating, nor does it make it "right." However, comparisons to more "socially acceptable" behaviors (because ethical considerations due a new romantic partner aren't involved) that "hurt" your partner in similar ways, gives you a reasonable perspective on your "activities".

Edited December 14, 2022 by mark clemson

[introverted1]

12 minutes ago, Avayarna said:

Do I take a chance with a guy I just met, or do the "right" thing and stay with a man who I know loves me more than anything?

I think you have this is the wrong frame.

The fact that you are this confused suggests that your relationship with your bf has run its course. It's not about whether Dave will be the right guy for you (unlikely), but that your attraction to Dave is a symptom of you falling out of love with your bf.  Yes, it's still possible you love your bf, but you are not in love with him. 

Staying with your bf out of fear is not the "right" thing.  The right thing is to let your bf be free to find someone who loves him as he deserves to be loved.  And then you can play the field until you are actually ready to settle down with someone and be faithful to them.

[Beachead]

@Avayarna

It's very simple OP.  If you are unwilling to squash this thing with Dave, then you're not invested in your relationship.   That's all there is to it. 

It's true that we can't help who we are attracted to, but we can stop those feelings and the situation from escalating.  You just have to rationalize the situation and put distance from the  source of what's triggering you, before they get worse.  This is why I asked you if you saw a future with your bf and planned for it, even if it was just you thinking about it.  Because if you had been, that would have been the basis for you rationalizing things out.   You wouldn't have been here on LS seeing advice.  You would have just squashed it and put your energy into your relationship.  

Instead, you let him in.  You allowed things to progress.  You allowed things to escalate.  And you have kept it all from your bf.   He's not hurt YET because he's unaware right now and he's out there right now, with plans in his head for the both of you for the future, because he believes he has a strong, stable relationship with you.  Meanwhile, you're here, thinking about this.   Your confusion reveals how you feel about your relationship. Your actions choices reveal how you feel about your relationship.  

And I bet Dave knows this himself.   Given the way you two will start, Dave will never trust you fully, because of how you conducted yourself with your boyfriend.  Who's to say you won't do the same to him?  This might not seem problematic at first, while this is all hot and secret, after your boyfriend is out of the picture, and the focus is on you and Dave, it will.   Not to mention, you're going to feel the loss of your relationship while you're with Dave, and all those grieving feelings are going to get in the way, because you never gave yourself the sufficient time to heal..which is why I'm almost certain, it's not going to work out with Dave either.

Regarding Breaks..

Breaks have no boundaries.   Nobody can define what they mean.   Does he shut you out of his life and move on or does he hold on and wait?  If he waits, how long?  How many times a day or per week should he talk to you and should he start those conversations or should he let you start them?  How long should the conversations be?  What is appropriate and inappropriate?  These are all questions he would have which you would have no answers to nor would you want to, because it requires commitment, which is exactly what you don't want.   So, he won't get any answer, will float around conflicted about what he should do, and his life and emotions will be put on hold for you.  Hence, why it is selfish and self-serving.

Never ask for a break.  Show the person the respect they deserve by breaking it off, cleanly.  Remove eachother from social media.  Don't talk anymore.  Don't engage even if he contacts you.

- Feather

[stillafool]

I think it's time to let your bf go whether Dave is in the picture or not.  If you've gotten to the point that you're going over to your bf's sister's house to see this guy that says everything about how you feel about your bf.  You've basically gone so far as to put yourself in a position to get caught just so you can be around Dave.  Even if this thing with Dave doesn't work out you will do this again with the next pretty face who shows you attention and repeat.  It's probably because you guys got together and too serious, too young.

[Avayarna]

2 hours ago, mark clemson said:

One could complain that what you're doing may lead you to leave him, but in reality if you leave him without the involvement of a new partner he'll almost certainly be very hurt anyhow. But people decide to leave their partners, and don't tell them/lie by omission about it ALL the time.

Some people may have a huge problem with what you're doing. But in reality it's not very different from what anyone doing something their partner wouldn't like (such as exploring a new religion if your partner "forbids" it) or what someone detaching from their partner does. You just have a third person involved.

That isn't advice to continue your "friendship"/emotional cheating, nor does it make it "right." However, comparisons to more "socially acceptable" behaviors (because ethical considerations due a new romantic partner aren't involved) that "hurt" your partner in similar ways, gives you a reasonable perspective on your "activities".

Thanks, Mark.  I needed that.  :)    

Yeah, I was a little taken aback by everyone saying I'm hurting my bf, when I haven't really even told him anything yet.  I can't really see how he could be "hurt" at this point.  But I want to make sure that if I do end up breaking it off, that I do it in the right way.

2 hours ago, introverted1 said:

I think you have this is the wrong frame.

The fact that you are this confused suggests that your relationship with your bf has run its course. It's not about whether Dave will be the right guy for you (unlikely), but that your attraction to Dave is a symptom of you falling out of love with your bf.  Yes, it's still possible you love your bf, but you are not in love with him. 

You know, that's exactly how I put it to a friend of mine the other day.  I told her I know I love my bf, and I always will, but am I still in love with him?  And the answer is honestly I don't know.  I was sure of myself just a few months ago, and then this happened.  

But are relationships really about being in love, or just loving the other person regardless?  I've had people tell me that relationships are about still loving someone even after the initial passion fades.  After all, being "in love" sounds a lot to me like what they call 'puppy love' or infatuation.  Aren't relationships supposed to be more than that?

52 minutes ago, MisterFeather said:

Never ask for a break.  Show the person the respect they deserve by breaking it off, cleanly.  Remove eachother from social media.  Don't talk anymore.  Don't engage even if he contacts you.

Well, like I said, given the advice I got here I have already decided against a break.  But if we did go on a break, there is no way I could cut off all contact.  After 5 years we have grown so close, we know each other so well, I could never not speak to him again.  We have too much history together.  I would always want to be friends, even if that's not possible or a bad idea.

[ShyViolet]

2 minutes ago, Avayarna said:

But I want to make sure that if I do end up breaking it off, that I do it in the right way.

The fact that you're even saying this shows that your heart is not in this relationship anymore.  This relationship is on its way towards coming to an end.  Whether you face that now, or you delay the inevitable and waste another year or more of your life, that's up to you.

[mark clemson]

1 minute ago, Avayarna said:

Yeah, I was a little taken aback by everyone saying I'm hurting my bf, when I haven't really even told him anything yet.  I can't really see how he could be "hurt" at this point.  But I want to make sure that if I do end up breaking it off, that I do it in the right way.

YW. Keep in mind that he COULD indeed be hurt if he finds out or if you leave him.

Realistically with 6 billion people in the world, people do all sorts of things that would upset their partner if they knew about it all the time. And certainly people break up, often leaving a partner quite distraught, all the time. So none of this is particularly unusual. However, IF you actually genuinely want to keep your BF, you are most certainly taking a big risk.

This is JMO, but I suspect that neither your BF or your potential new one are "fully right" for you at this point in your life. If they were I doubt this would be happening. That said, there is such a thing as "settling for pretty good" that for better or worse often leads to LTRs. And I would point out that as attracted as you are, you don't seem to consider the new guy "LTR material".

I'm not sure how many break ups you've been through, but staying friends after one can be quite tricky and will depend a lot on how much resentment there may/may not be and the emotional maturity of both. Some people start to think of only the negatives of their former partner as a psychological defense mechanism, some have genuine psychological issues that get triggered, and some simply have no interest in it. So the % who carry on a friendship isn't huge.

[flitzanu]

just to add since it doesn't seem to be being expressed, there is no such thing as a "break"

trying to say it is a "break" and not a "break up" is just how someone avoids saying "break up" because it is literally the same thing and needs to be treated as the same thing.  there is no temporary breakup, it is or it isn't.  

who knows though, if you try "a break" your boyfriend might meet a new girl during that break time and make this easier.

[ExpatInItaly]

1 hour ago, Avayarna said:

I can't really see how he could be "hurt" at this point

Then you are being willfully blind. 

You have been inappropriately communicating with another man, and trying to spend time with him. I can't think of any man I know who would not be hurt  to hear his girlfriend is behaving this way behind his back.

If you don't think this would hurt him, tell him what you have been up to and show him the messages you and Dave exchange. 

[Beachead]

@Avayarna

 

Quote

Yeah, I was a little taken aback by everyone saying I'm hurting my bf, when I haven't really even told him anything yet.  I can't really see how he could be "hurt" at this point.

OP, while he's out and about, thinking his relationship is all good and well, making plans for you and him for the future, you're out here fantasizing about someone else and figuring out the best way to break up with him.   A relationship is a team effort but you're looking out for you now.    He doesn't know because you don't want him to because if he did, he'd get to decide what's best for him as well and then you'd probably lose something and you'd feel like crap.   So you'd rather keep him in the dark and have him go about his day believing that his relationship is fine when it's not. And once he finds out you've been thinking all this stuff and kept it from him, it'll hurt him even more.   All this time, energy and resources he's giving to you, he could have been giving himself to face reality, to heal and recover. It's going all to you.  You're basically a girlfriend, halfheartedly in it and who's best reasons for staying in the relationship is because she's scared and feels guilty. 

Your bf is living a lie right now.   How wouldn't that hurt him? 

 

Edited December 14, 2022 by MisterFeather

[stillafool]

3 hours ago, Avayarna said:

But if we did go on a break, there is no way I could cut off all contact.  After 5 years we have grown so close, we know each other so well, I could never not speak to him again. 

This is again you only thinking about you without taking his feelings into account.  What makes you think he will want to be your friend?  Not because he hates you; but because that is what's best for him in order to heal from this and move forward.

[Avayarna]

So you all are saying that I should tell my bf about my feelings for Dave, even if I end up staying with him?

But why?  Why does he need to know?

I'm trying to put myself in my bf's shoes, and I know I would rather not hear about any other girls he might be attracted to.  If he were to cheat, then I would want to know.  But if he stays true to me, I'd rather not even know.  It would hurt me to hear that from him.

I guess I'm taking the view that what he doesn't know won't hurt him.  I know that sounds selfish, but that's how I feel.  What would hurt him is breaking up with him.  Or not breaking up but confessing that I want to be with another man.  That would break his heart.

Actually, tho, it doesn't matter, because I think I'm going to just stop seeing Dave and focus on what's wrong in our relationship, as some people here suggested.  It's just not worth it.  He has the apt to himself this weekend and I think Friday I'm going to go over there and tell him we can't see each other anymore.  I thought of just texting him, but that would be low.  Plus, I left some stuff over there I need to get.  

Anyways, wish me luck.  This is going to be really hard.

[NuevoYorko]

3 hours ago, Avayarna said:

 

Actually, tho, it doesn't matter, because I think I'm going to just stop seeing Dave and focus on what's wrong in our relationship, as some people here suggested.  It's just not worth it.  He has the apt to himself this weekend and I think Friday I'm going to go over there and tell him we can't see each other anymore.  I thought of just texting him, but that would be low.  Plus, I left some stuff over there I need to get.  

 

LOW:   Going to an apartment where you will be alone this weekend with a man with whom you've been conducting an emotional affair.  The next installment of this romantic tale is very predictable.  Have a blast.

[glows]

3 hours ago, Avayarna said:

  If he were to cheat, then I would want to know. 

Therein lies your argument with yourself.. unfortunately you’ve been emotionally cheating and physically meeting with another man this whole time. According to your rationale wouldn’t or shouldn’t your boyfriend know or be aware? 

I wouldn’t meet with Dave. Both of you have not shown any restraint or respect for your relationship. The priority might be your relationship with the man whom you keep calling your boyfriend. You’re making this a lot harder and more complicated than it has to be. 

[ExpatInItaly]

5 hours ago, Avayarna said:

He has the apt to himself this weekend and I think Friday I'm going to go over there and tell him we can't see each other anymore.  I thought of just texting him, but that would be low.

You can't be serious with this. 

Come on, OP. 

[Wiseman2]

7 hours ago, Avayarna said:

.He has the apt to himself this weekend and I think Friday I'm going to go over there 

It seems like you know this is a recipe for trouble. Do you have a place to live in the event your BF ends things? 

[JTSW]

17 hours ago, Avayarna said:

The problem is that I seem to be really really attracted to this guy.  The other day my body was still tingling like 2 hours after he hugged me goodbye!  

Then stay away from him.

Don't go over there.

Keep a distance.

Delete his damn number already

[JTSW]

9 hours ago, Avayarna said:

Friday I'm going to go over there and tell him we can't see each other anymore.  I thought of just texting him, but that would be low.  Plus, I left some stuff over there I need to get.  

What stuff?

What part of 'stay away from this guy' is hard to understand?

Do not go over there.

Text him that you can't be in contact with him anymore and that you will get someone to pick up your stuff (baffled as to why you would have stuff there in the first place).

You are just looking for excuses to go over there and see him which is a really bad idea.

Get a grip OP and start considering your BFs feelings.

Your BF doesn't need to know about any of it if you are truly serious about being with him.

You just need to cut Dave out completely.

The fact that you want to go over there again is telling me you are not serious about your BF and just using it as an excuse to see Dave.

You are being emotionally unfaithful and your BF doesn't deserve that.

He and his family have done so much for you and this is how you repay them.

[Beachead]

@Avayarna

13 hours ago, Avayarna said:

Actually, tho, it doesn't matter, because I think I'm going to just stop seeing Dave and focus on what's wrong in our relationship, as some people here suggested.  It's just not worth it.  He has the apt to himself this weekend and I think Friday I'm going to go over there and tell him we can't see each other anymore.  I thought of just texting him, but that would be low.  Plus, I left some stuff over there I need to get.  

My sympathies to your boyfriend.

Goodluck

 

Edited December 15, 2022 by MisterFeather

[introverted1]

13 hours ago, Avayarna said:

He has the apt to himself this weekend and I think Friday I'm going to go over there and tell him we can't see each other anymore. 

🤣🤣🤣🤣

The end result of this is totally predictable.  It's funny how naive you think we all are.

 

13 hours ago, Avayarna said:

I thought of just texting him, but that would be low. 

What's low is how you are treating your bf. 

Clearly, from what you said here, you're entangled enough with Dave that you need to tell him in person (read: see him again) that you are breaking up (read: having sex).

 

[stillafool]

13 hours ago, Avayarna said:

He has the apt to himself this weekend and I think Friday I'm going to go over there and tell him we can't see each other anymore.

There's absolutely no good reason to go over to his house to tell him you can't see him again.  What are you looking for, one last make out session?  Why are you leaving things at his house as if he's your bf?  What does your bf's sister think of you hanging with Dave and leaving your stuff there?  Even if you break it off with Dave your bf is still going to find out what you've been up to behind his back.  The fact that you have to see this guy in order to not see him is very telling about your feelings for him and it's doubtful you're going to stop no matter what you say.

[mark clemson]

15 hours ago, Avayarna said:

So you all are saying that I should tell my bf about my feelings for Dave, even if I end up staying with him?

Different people have different opinions about things. No one is forcing you to follow any advice, it's up to you to sort out what makes sense for you to do, in your own opinion, while considering the many perspectives people generally can present to you.

So, essentially, you need to decide if you're going to follow your own common sense or someone else's common sense WRT telling your BF about your feelings and/or how you wish to frame this conversation (or not have it at all).

If you are wondering whether certain approaches make sense (for you) - consider: would you follow a vegan's advice about how to plan your Thanksgiving dinner? (Assuming you're not already one.)

Edited December 15, 2022 by mark clemson

[mortensorchid]

Your situation sounds like what I went through with my first boyfriend in high school.  We ended up being together for 4 years - most of the time we were together was with him away at college much of the time, then eventually me.  I was 15 and in the 10th grade when we started going out and he was 18 and in 12th grade.  And I didn't feel so "attracted" to him after a while.  Why?  With an LTR the chemical reactions last only so long.  The first 6-10 months you are with someone is infatuation, and that is going to wear off.  When it does, you better like that person that you are with - not love, just like them.  Because if you don't, you're in trouble because you are stuck with that person and they with you.  Eventually in LTRs the couple starts to feel more like friends / siblings than lovers.  This is what you are feeling for your boyfriend.

As for this guy Dave?  Don't go there with him.  You are asking for trouble and things will get real bad, real quick if you go there.

[Avayarna]

8 hours ago, mortensorchid said:

Your situation sounds like what I went through with my first boyfriend in high school.  We ended up being together for 4 years - most of the time we were together was with him away at college much of the time, then eventually me.  I was 15 and in the 10th grade when we started going out and he was 18 and in 12th grade.  And I didn't feel so "attracted" to him after a while.  Why?  With an LTR the chemical reactions last only so long.  The first 6-10 months you are with someone is infatuation, and that is going to wear off.  When it does, you better like that person that you are with - not love, just like them.  Because if you don't, you're in trouble because you are stuck with that person and they with you.  Eventually in LTRs the couple starts to feel more like friends / siblings than lovers.  This is what you are feeling for your boyfriend.

As for this guy Dave?  Don't go there with him.  You are asking for trouble and things will get real bad, real quick if you go there.

Thanks, Morten.  Yeah, I think I understand this now.  Like you say, the chemical reactions fade, and you start wondering if something's wrong.  You quit thinking about sex as much.  Even though your love has only grown stronger.  But it's a normal part of a LTR.  My bf says we can get that back.  The question is:  can you?  Can the relationship get that initial excitement back.  Or is that just something that fades with time, even tho you know you love the person more than anything in the world?

When Dave came around, those chemical reactions came back, and I found myself thinking about having sex with another man, instead of with the one I love!  Those reactions are powerful, and I was blinded for awhile.  But now I know that chemical reactions come and go, but love can go on.  With or without them.

 

[Alpacalia]

The issue was brought up in a different thread six months ago (estimate)?

It can be difficult to take advice when it is painfully obvious that this arrangement suits you just fine.

Edited December 16, 2022 by Alpacalia