Not making friends, not for lack of trying.

[Cute-Frog339]

16 minutes ago, Elswyth said:

Well, if you want to, you can always start participating on those male-dominated activities...

I do.

12 minutes ago, Weezy1973 said:

This actually sounds pretty typical for guys. Usually there’s an “organizer” and if they stop organizing nobody really takes over. It just fades. If you’re the organizer you have to keep it up or things will just fade.

But then I just see everyone else connecting much deeper than with me, and it makes me wonder if I should even bother with those individuals.

[Weezy1973]

13 minutes ago, Cute-Frog339 said:

But then I just see everyone else connecting much deeper than with me, and it makes me wonder if I should even bother with those individuals.

Are you pretty guarded? I don’t mean shy or reserved, but just afraid of getting hurt or rejected so you don’t open up much? Usually deep connections happen over time with slowly increased sharing of personal things. And after a long time - like years - sharing things you’re embarrassed about, fears, triumphs etc. But sharing that stuff too soon will often push people away. It’s tricky.

[basil67]

1 hour ago, Cute-Frog339 said:

Also, there's a difference between shooting an idea down, and telling you that I've tried it and it doesn't work. This was often a point of contention on this forum years ago, as people thought I was either trolling or not trying. I genuinely am doing the latter.

In all honestly, you already know that the advice given on forums such as this doesn't work for you, so what do you hope to gain by posting further?   

[stillafool]

1 hour ago, Cute-Frog339 said:

I do.

But then I just see everyone else connecting much deeper than with me, and it makes me wonder if I should even bother with those individuals.

Do you play any sports?

[Cute-Frog339]

1 hour ago, Weezy1973 said:

Are you pretty guarded? I don’t mean shy or reserved, but just afraid of getting hurt or rejected so you don’t open up much? Usually deep connections happen over time with slowly increased sharing of personal things. And after a long time - like years - sharing things you’re embarrassed about, fears, triumphs etc. But sharing that stuff too soon will often push people away. It’s tricky.

I am more-so than when I started this journey, namely due to the lame experiences I've had, but I wouldn't say I'm a closed book. I don't generally confide in anyone or share anything too personal.

The problem is, I haven't known anyone long enough to do so.

52 minutes ago, basil67 said:

In all honestly, you already know that the advice given on forums such as this doesn't work for you, so what do you hope to gain by posting further?   

Some company? A bit of human connection? Anything to actually talk with another soul.

Just now, stillafool said:

Do you play any sports?

I've never been the sporty type. My fitness / outdoor activity involve dance, gym and hiking.

I wouldn't say no to taking up a class, but I won't be doing so in my area. That'll have to wait until I move.

[stillafool]

What about joining hiking groups?  There was a woman on this board who belonged to about 3 of them and fell for one of the guys in 1 of her groups.

[Cute-Frog339]

36 minutes ago, stillafool said:

What about joining hiking groups?  There was a woman on this board who belonged to about 3 of them and fell for one of the guys in 1 of her groups.

I was part of one for a long while. I'm not opposed to doing it again, as I enjoy hiking. I doubt it's going to help though, judging by past experience.

[Foxhall]

Male friendships tend to develop when there is something in it for both sides- i.e one is probably exploiting the other to a  certain degree while the other party is then "happy to have a seemingly good pal"

Your probably a little unlucky in that you have not come across another guy who is at a loose end so to speak,

My first post here was about a male friendship- it is funny I had one good male friendship back in my 20s - but have struggled to replicate that since,

have got to the stage where I dont care any more really- I tend to be quite busy with various activities and probably have more women friends nowadays which can be problematic too!

as the others mention, male friendships are healthier probably based on an activity, be it a sport or whatever, we like our space too - dont want to feel bombarded  by someone.

I agree with you in principle however all the same- its not too much to ask for to have a close friend that you can call on for an evening,

like everything else its about finding the right balance.

 

 

[mark clemson]

7 hours ago, Cute-Frog339 said:

I don't even have anyone to hang out with once a week, and that would be fine with me if that were the case.

C) They don't make efforts to stay in touch (social media, a text etc).

D) Eventually, I stop hearing from them.

Fair enough. I'm not sure what may be putting them off (IF something is and it's not just happenstance) but that's unfortunate.

[Atwood]

Have you considered that every time you talk about making connections with others, everything revolves around you getting validation and support? Trying groups and activities is framed as a means to meet people who will befriend or engage with you in some way and if that doesn’t seem like a likely possibility you seem to almost give up on it because “it won’t help”. People can sense these things.

Many people experience a strong need for a supply for validation, difficulty being alone, and as we established in the last thread, difficulty also taking on board any criticism you don’t agree lines up with who you think you are. Is this something you’ve explored in therapy? 
 

The overarching theme is that you are confused about why people are shunning you because in your view you’re a great guy. It’s very unlikely that all these people just can’t see how great you are and aren’t giving you a chance. It’s more likely you have a blind spot about your own behaviour that’s preventing people from engaging with you. Another thing I would explore with your therapist. 

[Cute-Frog339]

3 hours ago, Atwood said:

Have you considered that every time you talk about making connections with others, everything revolves around you getting validation and support? Trying groups and activities is framed as a means to meet people who will befriend or engage with you in some way and if that doesn’t seem like a likely possibility you seem to almost give up on it because “it won’t help”.

The whole purpose of this discussion is to find out why I can't make friends. It's got nothing to do with validation.

Please stop making this into some psychological analysis. It's perfectly natural and human to want to have people in my life.

3 hours ago, Atwood said:

The overarching theme is that you are confused about why people are shunning you because in your view you’re a great guy. It’s very unlikely that all these people just can’t see how great you are and aren’t giving you a chance. It’s more likely you have a blind spot about your own behaviour that’s preventing people from engaging with you. Another thing I would explore with your therapist. 

This is why I feel that some of you aren't reading what I have to say, because all I've done is convey to you what other people have told me. The most I've ever said about myself is that I would -like- to think I'm a good person.

 

 

[Beachead]

@Cute-Frog339

Loneliness is an old friend of mine who visits me from time to time, so I know him well.

I think your struggles may be rooted from 3 possible circumstances both external and personal:

1. Your past and your general environment marginalizing you.  You've been through a lot and most people won't understand who you are or why you became that way no matter how much you try to explain.  So you may find it difficult to be yourself because yourself is accompanied by certain attributes most people can't connect with. 

2.  Most people develop their best friendships in childhood or in College/Uni.  Making long-lasting friendships thereafter is generally so much more difficult as an adult. Ego's grow with age and people's lives are influenced by their experiences, their adversity, motivations, feelings/thoughts etc.  and these elements take them away from some people and towards others along their own path.  That's why so many people come and go in life.  That's why you can't accomplish friendships/relationships like any other goal and that's why it's not a good idea to rely on seeking these things for completion.

3. Even the most antisocial, introverted of us need companionship but I also know that this need can become overwhelming if you feel unfulfilled in your life.  You think you've done it all but clearly what you've been doing thus far hasn't been working for you OP.  You might to ask yourself once again, what your real motivations are for choosing the things you did; job, the volunteer you do, other activities.   It matters.    If you're doing things you love and/or you're very good at it, then you're confident, you're passionate, you're knowledgeable and that brings you a lot of energy which people will gravitate towards.  It's how people are.  When they see something they use for whatever reason, they'll want a piece of it; even if it's just your good spirit.   If you're not doing the things you love, you will lack this.

I felt this way for most of my life but crossing into my 30's and now being 36, I've since moved passed it (For the most part).  It wasn't an easy thing to do.  I had to admit and accept some tough truths about myself and about my life and then make some difficult adjustments.  You have to be emotionally herded towards that point where you feel like the only 2 options you have is to reframe the way you deal with your life or probably spend the rest of it, feeling the way you do now.  

I think you did a good thing for yourself reaching out and I hope the responses here don't deter you away but encourage you open up and share. 

 

Edited December 24, 2022 by MisterFeather

[Cute-Frog339]

3 hours ago, MisterFeather said:

@Cute-Frog339

Loneliness is an old friend of mine who visits me from time to time, so I know him well.

I think your struggles may be rooted from 3 possible circumstances both external and personal:

1. Your past and your general environment marginalizing you.  You've been through a lot and most people won't understand who you are or why you became that way no matter how much you try to explain.  So you may find it difficult to be yourself because yourself is accompanied by certain attributes most people can't connect with. 

2.  Most people develop their best friendships in childhood or in College/Uni.  Making long-lasting friendships thereafter is generally so much more difficult as an adult. Ego's grow with age and people's lives are influenced by their experiences, their adversity, motivations, feelings/thoughts etc.  and these elements take them away from some people and towards others along their own path.  That's why so many people come and go in life.  That's why you can't accomplish friendships/relationships like any other goal and that's why it's not a good idea to rely on seeking these things for completion.

3. Even the most antisocial, introverted of us need companionship but I also know that this need can become overwhelming if you feel unfulfilled in your life.  You think you've done it all but clearly what you've been doing thus far hasn't been working for you OP.  You might to ask yourself once again, what your real motivations are for choosing the things you did; job, the volunteer you do, other activities.   It matters.    If you're doing things you love and/or you're very good at it, then you're confident, you're passionate, you're knowledgeable and that brings you a lot of energy which people will gravitate towards.  It's how people are.  When they see something they use for whatever reason, they'll want a piece of it; even if it's just your good spirit.   If you're not doing the things you love, you will lack this.

I felt this way for most of my life but crossing into my 30's and now being 36, I've since moved passed it (For the most part).  It wasn't an easy thing to do.  I had to admit and accept some tough truths about myself and about my life and then make some difficult adjustments.  You have to be emotionally herded towards that point where you feel like the only 2 options you have is to reframe the way you deal with your life or probably spend the rest of it, feeling the way you do now.  

I think you did a good thing for yourself reaching out and I hope the responses here don't deter you away but encourage you open up and share. 

 

Thank you for a rather insightful post.

I think it's a combination of all three.

1. I had a rough childhood, and experiences since then have only served to wound me further. I won't go into the details, but some of these experiences have been particularly taxing, and ones which the average person would not have to deal with; to come out the other side in a positive way is not only a Godsend, but a testament to my character. If any of you had "met" me at twenty years of age, you'd be astounded by how far I've come, and whilst I haven't always had the best therapists, I took responsibility for my mental health the moment I identified it as an issue. I've made some great strides in the last few years, and I genuinely am a success story in many respects. However, as shared in the previous thread, this has sometimes meant I've attracted the emotionally unhealthy into my life, which has been another challenge to deal with. I can only continue with my current therapist, who is REALLY good, in the hope of becoming even better of a human being.

2. This certainly a contributing factor, albeit there's not much I can see about that.

3. This point is certainly a catch-22. I'm educated, financially stable for the most part, work a career that I absolutely love and am good at, and am always looking to develop new skills. I keep myself busy as much as I can, and I enjoy the things that I do. But I'm tired of going through life like a ghost. I'm tired of going to concerts or pubs and seeing groups of friends enjoying themselves. I'm tired of going to meetup groups, only to watch everyone else connect around me whilst I simply remain as an "attendee". I've missed out on things like a friends holiday, dating, sex, and all manner of other activities that we often do socially. And it's frustrating, because as the thread title suggests, it's not for lack of trying.

I'm absolutely not perfect. Never have been, or will be. However, I am a genuinely good man with positive characteristics, physical attributes and a general sense of "put togetherness". When is it my turn to have a dating / social life?

[Beachead]

@Cute-Frog339

Quote

When is it my turn to have a dating / social life?

You may have to make peace with the likelihood that right now you don't have it and as far as you know, you may never.   You may also have to make peace with the fact that there are going to be people out there that will have things that you won't for all kinds of exogenous circumstances.  They may never learn the depths of the loneliness you feel in your heart in the very same way there will be people who look at you and feel the same.   It's not fair but it's the truth and no matter how much you break down over it, this is your hand.

Fact is, life owes us nothing and we are entitled to nothing.  Friends, relationships, marriages, great job, food, clean water, our health etc. whatever it is, we're not entitled to it.  If we have atleast one of those things, then maybe we're actually not the worst off.   One morning your body could just fail on you for whatever reason and there goes that health you had your whole life, which you never really thought about all that much which now because the one thing you are hyper-aware of because whatever is ailing you, caused you pain, doctors appointments/tests, anxiety about your life etc.   We don't know what we have until it gets taken away from us.

So just in the same way you ditched that toxic crowd of people in your life despite your impending loneliness, you're going to have to take care of yourself once again and perhaps make peace with with an outcome largely out of your control, contingent on variables that have little to do with how hard you work and how great of a person you are. 

It's possible all your struggle is pushing you towards a particular future that you will realize.

My process

I could have probably written what you wrote 8 years ago, word for word but I got to a certain age (Around 30) where I knew I was getting older and it was a question of, can I afford to continue being upset over this thing I clearly can't control?  Despite my best efforts, I had nothing to show for it.  Spent most my days alone anyway.  Naturally, something switched off and I was able to accept that as life as I knew it right now, was this and I decided to move forward with my life based on that knowledge.  I put my focus on me.

Healing from questions like the above quote came from self-love. For me, that was through a lot of personal journaling (To vent, to organize the mess in my head), through focus on music, nature, photography, career focus etc.

I started practicing photograph and spent time outside photographing and videoing nature, wildlife etc.  Realized the relaxing sound of leaves rustling in the wind.  The sound of my boots on the winter snow.  The beauty in the lightly falling snowflakes.  The colors.   Seeing the birds engage in their activities.  Hearing their songs.  That led to reading about botany and gardening and ornithology and all kinds of subjects. Eventually, the lifestyle change led me to join a Wildlife Rehab Centre as a Volunteer and for some time now I've been working with animals and doing hands-on work.  Being in it thus far as only made me think about career possibilities. 

Music was something else I had in my tool-bag from years of practice.   I wanted to make a career out of it as a Composer for Nature Documentaries but I had to let that go for particular reasons.  Still, to some capacity, I kept it close to me and I continued to immerse myself in it whether it was just learning Theory/Orchestration, Composing film music, practicing Piano/Guitar or just listening to music.  I've even taught it.

These aren't just aimless hobbies I use to numb the pain.  There's something very specific I want to accomplish before my time is up and these things I do, I selected to help me get there.  That end goal is so important to me, I'm unwilling to allow anyone into my life that may be a distraction.   I just couldn't be bothered giving these pursuits up, to please others and that means I don't really care that much about companionship anymore. 

I think you get the point.  I had to face harsh truth and I healed through self-investment, self-care or self-love.   

Does that mean I won't find a great friend or one day have a relationship?  I might but I don't worry about it anymore, because I'm focused on myself now.

For someone who needed people like water for 30 years of his life, I haven't thought that much about it in 6 years so it goes to show me, I went about this the right way.

One of my favorite quotes came from the writing of Sylvester Stallone for his character, Rocky Balboa:

"I don't care how tough you are it will beat you to your knees and keep you there permanently if you let it. You, me, or nobody is gonna hit as hard as life. But it ain't about how hard ya hit. It's about how hard you can get hit and keep moving forward. How much you can take and keep moving forward. That's how winning is done!”

And I have found that quote only to be true for my life.

Summary/Closing

Accept what you know right now and going forward, base all the decision you make on that knowledge, and genuinely take care of yourself, for you.   People told me to do this when I asked for advice about this stuff, back when I was 20.   It took me 10 years so to realize they were right and that it was time to listen.  So I hope you consider the message in my writing with an open mind and I hope it serves you well for 2023. 

It's the best I got.  

- Feather

Edited December 26, 2022 by MisterFeather

[Cute-Frog339]

Thanks for sharing your story, @MisterFeather.

It would seem I have no other option but to accept my fate, wherever it may take me.

To anyone else reading this; next time you spend time with your friends or loved ones, take a moment to appreciate what you have. You are fortunate. :)